Raincoater stuff is aimed at men. I think most men like the idea of a girl who is in her physical prime and is unsullied from the ravages of too many successful male advances. There is a part in most men that would like to think they could still attract a 16-20 year old; this is not suggesting they would always like a relationship with someone so much younger, just that they haven't lost the old charms.

There is a certain kudos attached to an older man who can attract younger women, and I propose it is this factor, above all else, that determines why men like viewing girls and their wives prefer them to view women.

Sir Noel.

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A mature woman will approach sex, engage herself it in, be a fuller participant perhaps, than the newbies that may be still learning the ropes.

DenverDon

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I think your point is true but it hardly answers Walters' question. I'm quite sure there are plenty of twenty and thirty year old women who would happily do gonzo and late teens to early twenty year olds who would love to do couples stuff.

Look at all the releases with '18' in the title - none of these are couples fodder they're all created for men to 'enjoy' on their own.

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2) Some very good points have been made already. Moving away from the content and execution side, I thought I might suggest a potentially relevant factor in the production side.

Namely, that the structure, operation and employment appeal/contract system of feature film studios (or at least of the "feature film departments" of studios) tends to be geared towards performers in the higher age group.

Perhaps feature film depts/studios prefer older, more experienced girls because of name recognition and the probability they have a better work ethic, and are thus only willing to cut a contract with that in hand.

I haven't thought about the matter in great depth (it's not a strength of mine ) but I'd add that if that is the case, I am not sure why it emerged (because it suits the producers or because it suits the market?) and/or why it continues.

Edited by - rieekan333 on 3/11/2003 5:46:04 PM

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It didn't cross his mind to consider 18 year olds. I asked him why and he said he didn't think they were into it, in general. It's related to what DenverDon was saying.

Blondie mentions their 'willingness,' but willingness is not the same thing as enthusiasm.

Asking him just now to choose between 20 and 30 year olds, he said he would rather see confident and experienced women, so it would be 30.

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Just see if you can spot the deliberate mistake:

30 & Confused, 30 & Nasty, 30 & Asian, 30 & Eager to Please, 30 & Anal, 30 Year Old fresh Meat, 30 Young and Tight, Always 30, Barely 30, British and Barely 30, Finally 30, Just 30, My 30th Birthday, Only 30, Purely 30, Sweet Lil' 30, Just over Thirty, Thirty and Anal, thirty n' Interracial, Thirty and DP'ed, Thirty and Easy, Thirty and Awesome puff pant enough!
I spared myself listing all the titles with teen in them.

In total on lasersedge there were nearly 200 titles with teen or teenage in them on top of the 200 with 18 or eighteen; they stock not one title with 30 or thirty in it( excluding those that are number #30 in a series of course).

I humbly suggest that the proof of this pudding is very much in the eating.

Edited by - Sir Noel Plum on 3/11/2003 6:07:07 PM

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Why age would ever matter more than the above is beyond me. FWIW, IMO ripoffs abound in both gonzo and features. Maybe there'd be less if more women did gonzo and more girls did features. Who knows?

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I like to masturbate to porn but it's also great to watch and NOT masturbate (hard sometimes) to build up the internal horniness levels ready for when my gf comes round.

If I can keep my hands off my penis watching a porno (especially without fast forwarding) I can end up as rampant as a dog for a good 24 hours afterwards. I've not used Viagra but it can't be any better than this!!!

I happen to agree with you that a lot of these so called couples titles are still aimed predominantly at men. I feel though that these titles probably appeal more to the casual porn viewer, but have a very wide scope in terms of their target groups.
This may well explain why Vivid/Wicked type stuff, which is very successful in the marketplace, is little talked about here in comparison to the raincoater stuff: one would expect the porn enthusiast to be overrepresented here relative to the casual buyer (and the enthusiast is not the casual purchaser).

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Only one? I see three that could be deliberate.

30 Year Old Fresh Meat

30 Young and Tight

Sweet Lil' 30

Regardless of what figures your search provided, what do you expect or want to crawl into your bed in real life? (Oh oh, I actually said that! ) It is a fantasy being created/promoted in mainstream and porn. Do I expect to go to the mall and see the Terminator 2 actually morph before my eyes? No, but it gets the mind going when watching the movie. Do I expect to have an 18 year old crawl in bed and know it all for 'fullfillment'? No, but it certainly is eye candy to watch and gets the mind going.

Fullfillment is quite different than just getting your rocks off, and that usually comes with a certain amount of maturity. I've been through the training/learning process and prefer the 'end product', i.e. the "woman".

Walter, I hope we haven't detoured your thread too badly.

DenverDon

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I can't believe you buy into this 'we just buy what they sell us' argument. Companies do work and increase certain markets but I fail to be convinced that all these 18/teen titles are bought purely because that is what the companies want to sell. You can see with shaving, double anal and gapes that the market responds to demand - it is a process of natural selection; the consumer decides which series are successes and which are failures.

I wholly agree with your assessment that the 18 year old is eye candy but perhaps not what is likely to fulfill in real life (although i would think some of these porno girls are exceptions to the rule, in bed I mean) but I must point out that I inferred this point myself when I said 'this is not suggesting they would always like a relationship with someone so much younger'.

I do feel though that these truisms are not answering Walters question: they are answering your own. The original question was not about the worthiness of relationships between people of different ages and whether they fulfill, it was concerned with why porn, aimed solely at the man viewing on his own, is predilicted in favour of teenage girls.

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Oops. Didn't think I was falling into 'we just buy what they sell us' thing. The producers make what they perceive the market demands. I certainly have my share of Barely Legal and 18 whatever... .

I also agree that some of the porn starlets may very well be the exception to the rule.

I also think I've derailed Walter's thread enough.

DenverDon

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So, in order to make an effective couples movie (which, generally speaking, means well performed in terms of acting ability) more mature performers are required. It just wouldn't work as well with the younger generation. (For the most part, remember that I'm generalising here.)

The reverse of this, of course, is that more mature performers will have likely grown tired of the straight sex they would have engaged in earlier on and are looking to appear in more artistic / plot driven fare.

While pure physical age in terms of appeal to the audience (in terms of the genre they're watching) may have something to do with it (it's not negligable) I believe that, in this respect anyway, it's more about performers taking roles, and roles suited to performer's acting ability, than anything else.

And, just to comment on pure physical age, one aspect of the attraction of the cast in erotica is that there's more of an identification with what's going on in terms of it's "reality" than there is in gonzo. Nobody cares anything about character development in gonzo, in erotica it's what adds to the excitement (all of the background details that go into projecting the viewer into what they're watching and making it believable). Unless the setting for the piece of erotica is in a high school, it's quite likely that teens in the cast (or at least a cast of nothing but teens) would be out of place.

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I said it was a generalization that men prefer very young girls. I stand by that.

My husband said he would rather see 30 year old women than 20 year old women in porn. I'll stand by that statement as well.

He also said he'd prefer to see 30 rather than 40. (My husband and I are 45 and 46). Make of it what you will!

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Agreed, but if you search for pornos featuring fat women you will find many titles. I'm sure you would agree with me that the archetypal female porn star is not fat and similarly for every series featuring the more mature woman their are half a dozen featuring teens and early twenty year olds.

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