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| kinkybrotha05 New Member 4 Posts 12/08 |  Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 2:21AMhttp://www.cumbang.com It makes me wonder where interracial porn is headed, especially since porn is becoming more daring in playing with racial stereotypes. Though the Hush Hush crew has made pretty ample use of the "n" word, I haven't seen white men use it toward black women in porn yet, but it will probably happen soon. It kind of makes me wonder though, why has it been acceptable and even erotic for white women to use the "n" word toward black men, but not white men toward black women. Even Gangland White Boy Stomp and Ghetto Gaggers managed to stay away from the "n" word, even though there were obvious racial stereotypes being acted out and offensive language being used. And on this site, Gangbanged by Rednecks, it's in this white man's revenge vain, and they are wearing confederate flags, but it's not explicitly racist, and they sort of make it seem like it's the black girls idea, etc. [Link] |
| Thunderbird Member 96 Posts 10/07 | Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 3:20AM [Link] |
| pornlaw Member 578 Posts 10/05 | Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 10:01AM If in the word "nigger" or "nigga" was used as freely in mainstream movies as much as it is used in adult, Rev. Sharpton would have already marched on Universal, Warner Bros and Dreamworks. The reason why it isnt used towards african-american women, is that most black female performers would not stand for it. Black male performers dont seem to care that they are being racially stereotyped. At one point in Vanessa's career she was asked to perform in an interracial scene where the producer wanted fried chicken and watermelons in the shot. She refused to perform until those items were removed from the scene. Until all african-american performers choose not to be referred to as "niggas" or "niggers" this will continue and be accepted by public as a part of the "fantasty" of porn. This also seems to be a uniquely American fantasy. I do not believe that Euro companies use racial slurs. The other interesting difference between Euro and American performers is that many American white female performers charge more for interracial, while this rarely occurs with Euro performers. And black female performers are never allowed to charge more for interracial. I know of a black female performer that attempted to charge more for white guys and was laughed at by her agent. Racism is alive and well in this industry.... unfortunately. Michael www.AdultBizLaw.com Edited by - pornlaw on 3/20/2009 10:03:27 AM [Link] |
| Mr Springer Member You don't do more with less, you do less with less. 61 Posts 1/09 | Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 12:01PM Well said. [Link] |
| Thunderbird Member 96 Posts 10/07 | Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 1:28PM Problem is that not all black pornstars have the same opinion about the use of these words. Shane Diesel and his mob (Mann and Boz) have no problem with porn companies using the N-word on the movie set and on porn movie titles. Lex Steel and Slayer on the other hand are strongly opposed to this behavior. The rest fall somewhere in between. Porn studios are takin advantage of this divided and inconsistent stance. Edited by - Thunderbird on 3/20/2009 1:52:29 PM [Link] |
| lenscap Member everywhere 185 Posts 10/05 | Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 3:11PM [Link] |
| ntfighter Member 645 Posts 7/07 | Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 3:50PM |
| Tinybee Member 40 Posts 2/09 | Posted - Mar 20 2009 : 4:37PM Another one of the reasons I believe that it's accepted for a male to be called 'nigger' in a scene is the male/female dominance factor. The male is generally seen as the 'fucker', while the female is 'fucked'. The male is technically using the female for his pleasure and downgrading her, while the female is always the receiver. With a white male/black female setup, you'd have both the factors playing against her, the fact that she's being racially looked down on as well as being a woman, thus being the one that is 'used'. I know I personally would find it really awkward to see a black female stereotyped this way in a scene, but have less (I still don't particularly see the allure) problems with it when it's a male. [Link] |
| Thunderbird Member 96 Posts 10/07 | Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 8:49AM [Link] |
| Derek117 Senior Member 1605 Posts 1/06 | Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 11:11AM [Link] |
| pornlaw Member 578 Posts 10/05 | Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 12:42PM You can never hold the title of a DVD or movie against the performer in the scene. Most if not all of the time, the performers have no idea of what the title of the movie will be when they shoot the scene. So if the company owner uses the title "My Niece Takes Nigga Cock in the Ass" for the most part the performers wont know that when they accept the job. However being called a "nigger" or "nigga" or any other racial stereotype during the filming... well thats a different story. Tinybee makes a good point about the dominance factor - but using your example, if I was just robbed and beaten by an african-american man, does that give me the right to call him a "nigger?" No one so far has had a problem with AVN referring to the racial slurs in pornography as "Black Humor ?" Further, no one has even stated an opinion about the disparity in talent rates in regards to interracial scenes. I am curious what people think about white female performers charging more to do a scene with a black male performer then a white male performer. Or why a black female performer cannot charge more for working with a white male performer ? Dont say it's because of the size of the cock either. Many white male performers are as big or bigger and some white male performers have been known to cause injuries to female performers. Take it out of the porn genre and it doesnt make sense. If I had an african american attorney working for me and I was hiring a white secretary to work with that lawyer, should she get paid more to work for an african-american ? Legally should she be able to say "black attorneys are lazy and I will be doing more work for him" and therefore she needs more pay ? How would the white secretaries who work for white lawyers feel about being paid less ?Actually if racism from the buying side of porn didnt exsist, then these movies wouldnt sell. Isnt it really the consumers that are driving this market. If consumers didnt bless this behavior with their money would anyone make porn with racial slurs and stereotypes ? [Link] |
| picman Senior Member Nothing says I love you so much as a tongue in the ass. 2884 Posts 1/03 | Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 3:08PM I do have to say this, though: I think it's anybody's right to produce it, and I can almost understand why some people are titillated by it. What I hate is when the girls are browbeaten into doing it. One example would be a scene Trina Michaels did with Boz. Now Trina was an enthusiastic and willing performer with black men from the gitgo. Boz and his director kept at her to use a racial slur she clearly was uncomfortable with, finally achieving their aim to their utter delight, like a couple of idiot schoolboys. Congratulations to them, but the scene sucked, as Trina was clearly taken out of her game. They made it worse by falling in love with her gapes, and stopping the fucking every few seconds to admire Boz's handiwork. No chemistry. No flow. But I'm sure there are fools out there that think it was the performance of her career. That's their market and they're welcome to it. [Link] |
| jrv Senior Member 1266 Posts 2/03 | Posted - Mar 21 2009 : 8:03PM There are plenty of disturbing aspects to porn viewers you can discern from the types of porn that gets made. What was behind the fascination for the over-the-top, blow-out-her-ass trend a few years ago? [Link] |
| lenscap Member everywhere 185 Posts 10/05 | Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 10:45AM [Link] |
fu_q  All-Star Member Marv Montag (@PornOfYore) 2506 Posts 2/09 | Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 1:55PM [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 4:26PM These girls are performers. They're getting paid to play a part. All of the women who do MILF titles aren't MILFs. The girls who play secretaries probably never typed or took shorthand for a living. If a girl walks on a set and all the black guys on set (and the very people who are supposed to be most offended) are throwing out the word every five minutes and seem to be using it in a way that doesn't seem to negative to them, I can understand why she would go along with using it. She may not like using the word but I think she does it thinking the audience is smart enough to see and know she's playing a part and doesn't mean she's racist or uses that word in her personal life. Unfortunately this site and some of it's members proves that theory wrong. Despite what some people think not everyone or every black person sees that word in the same negative light. Should she not go along with it because some people will be more upset by it than others? Clearly, there's a segment of the audience who doesn't mind it or actually likes it. Why is it so bad to do a scene that indulges their fetish/fantasy?You have a right to call anyone anything. You just need to understand that sometimes there will be consquences to your actions...sometimes not.No. Because some people like Shane or whover aren't bothered by the word and probably see it as humorous that some people are so upset by it. Also I think in some instances the director or company is making an attempt at humor with some of their titles. It's just that clearly not everyone thinks the joke is funny.Women don't get into porn as a public service. If they can get more money for something of course they will. If a director wants a girl to do an IR scen and she doesn't want to do it for whatever reason and the director comes up with a price that makes her agree to the scene what in the world is wrong with that? If a girls doesn't really want to do anal, creampies, DP, gangbangs or Ron Jeremy at the standard porn rate and offering her more money will get her to do it how is that a horrible thing? Isn't that kinda how the world works?Very simple. Because they can. Why do lawyers charge what many would consider outragous rates? Because they supply a service that many people feel they need to have and are willing or have to pay for those services. Black female performers don't have the clout at this time to make such demands overall. Perhaps some do and don't use their power to...or maybe they do and we don't hear about it. I don't see it as good or bad but simply the way it is. Supply and demand. There was a time when "older" women in porn didn't have much clout or options. The whole MILF thing changed the playing field. Perhaps black performers will at some point have their day.Cock size does plays a role. There was a well known pornstar who used to do IR all the time at one point in her career that said the reason she stopped doing IR was that most of the guys she worked with were so big (for her) she'd have to take 3 days off to recover. She said she stopped doing it because it wasn't worth it. It's very possible this girl avoids doing huge white guys theses days (I don't care enough to check). She does more higher end stuff so maybe she's getting paid more in general and it's worth it to put up with the huge white guys (if she does). It would seem that a lot of the black guys in the business are big. I believe that's mostly why they get the job. Maybe the girls are like some of the posters here and don't like the idea of appearing in what they see as racist scenes. Maybe they willing to take on a big white cock because it's a higher end movie.You can't take it out of the porn genre and compare it to a corprate job because a totally different set of rules apply to porn. It's like comparing a Pizza maker to what you do. They're totally different and the rules to one don't apply to the other. In corporate America there isn't a demand for white women with big butts as receptionists. If there were those big butt women could charge more for their services if they were in high demand. In corporate America an exec could face charges if they only hired white secretaries and it was proven. In porn the people in charge are hiring the epople that they believe their audience most wants to see. They're willing to pay girls to do the acts their audience most wants to see. If the company is willing to pay more for what they want and the girls accept that's simply the way porn works.Of course the consumer drive the market. It's their fantasy or fetish and they deserve to be able to buy it just like any other fanasy or fetish as long as it isn't against the law or hurting anyone. There are movies being made where girls are choked, fucked anally to the point of sometimes tearing, gagged to the point of throwing up, eating semen from their butts that clearly has feces mixed with it and plenty of things some people may find horrible. Compared to some of that stuff I'd think saying the "N" word in a scene isn't so bad. There was a guy on the radio a few months ago who owned a phone sex service. He said that a very large number of both black and white callers use and want to hear the girls say "nigger". He says he tells the girls upfront that if they have problems saying the word they can't work there or if they work there and don't se the word they won't make much money. Like I said...I'm black and I don't use the word and don't particularly like it. I think it's wrong that black people have a word some of them use freely and constantly that some blacks don't want to hear white people use. If it were the other way around some black people would lose their minds at the thought of them not being able to say a certain word. Some blacks use the word and don't see it as a big deal. I believe the word has as much power as you choose to give it. If a person doesn't like what they see or hear in a porn movie they shouldn't buy it or support the product. If enough people do the same it'll go away. Even if it doesn't no one is forcing it on you. Spend money of the stuff you like. [Link] |
| pornlaw Member 578 Posts 10/05 | Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 9:26PM If your position is that white female performers have the right to ask for more money for working with a black male performer, then a director/producer has the right to pay you less for being a black male performer. What the white female performer is saying is that you, a black man, is less desirable to perform with than a white man. Therefore, it should follow that the director can under pay you and take the money saved and give it to the white female performer in order to induce her to perform with you. Would that be fair, if in fact that position was adopted by the producers in the industry ? Further, the attitude that these are just performances and that those watching these movies will not be influenced by them is somewhat myopic. Porn and what's in it does make its way into American culture. For example, breast augmentation, the brazilian bikini wax or even the sexual positions illustrated in porn. Kids are now making their own cell phone movies and sharing them with friends. It would be irresponsible to think that racial slurs so freely used by whites against blacks would not follow suit. And your point about giving the racial slurs more power than they deserve is a position I agree with. Thats exactly why I used the word "nigger" as opposed to referring to it as the "n" word. Unfortunately, you and I may agree but for the most part, the rest of society - white and black, do not like those words and see them as decisive and harmful. Many in the mainstream black press and media and tried for years to eradicate those terms from movies and music. Porn seems to be the last frontier of overt white on black racism in entertainment.Careful in your analysis, your definition of clout can also be read as extortion. Sometimes, just because you can, doesnt mean you should.Not true. There are no asterisks on laws that say "*doesnt apply to the adult industry." I think most in the industry are waking up to that fact. There are also demands on mainstream companies to hire attractive receptionists, as well as waitresses and cocktail servers not to mention any job that may require interaction with the general public. Granted entertainment companies are given certain latitude in casting for roles, this doesnt mean that all bets are off though. First Amendment issues weigh in, but I am not talking about restricting speech from a governmental perspective, just from a moralistic one. If my clients, as a whole, didnt care for blacks, can I and should I be able to deny a job to a black man or woman because of my clients' preferences ? I would love to see what the perspective of a black female performer would be. With all due respect to Draxxx, black men are not usually the ones without clout in the industry. However, that may soon change. Once the cuckold/interracial content demand cools so will work for the black male performer. Michael www.AdultBizLaw.com www.2257Safe.com [Link] |
| mug_glazer Member 304 Posts 10/07 | Posted - Mar 22 2009 : 11:20PM [Link] |
| Thunderbird Member 96 Posts 10/07 | Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 10:12AM [Link] |
| map47 Member 92 Posts 1/09 | Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 2:57PM I am a black canadian male,this is one hell of a topic.racism is an unfortunate part of life,but i really do not enjoy stereotyping of any kind and in porn there is alot of it,i try to avoid it,i am there to watch good sex between humans of all types and the less unnecessary bullshit the better! i suppose there are no simple answers and i guess we individually decide what is acceptable.just my 2 cents,regards map47 [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 9:54PM Tory Lane recently said she held off doing IR it because of money. I don't think she's racist in the least. She's in porn to make money and she's thinking like a businesswoman. There's a segment of the audience that wants to see her do IR and there were directors/studios who wanted them to do it for them and were willing to pay her more to do it. She did an IR movie that she says she owns the rights to or gets a cut or whatever. She didn't not do IR before because she was racist or found blacks "less desirable" but I think she saw it as an "event" fans wanted, something someone was willing to pay her more for and something she could cash in on. Supply and Demand. Performers in porn routinely get paid more and less money for any number of reasons. To each his/her own but I don't see this one as particularly bad. It's a business. I don't spend any time worrying that a girl got paid more or less for a particular scene. Knowing the girl got paid more for it doesn't make the scene better or worse for me.Oh please....LOL!!! Totally disagree with you but it's one of those things neither of us can prove conclusively. I think mainstream Hollywood has a much, much much bigger impact on society when it comes to breast implants, bikini waxes and things of that nature. But I'd imagine it all comes down to what you and I define as "porn". For the sake of this conversation I'd prefer to stick to actual porn movies. And... stick to the actual topic at hand: Race, pay wages and the use of the "N" word. I don't think a person who finds the "N" word offense will have a sudden change of heart and start using it because they hear Shane Diesel use it in a porn movie. How often do you figure people change their moral stances on such things based on porn movies? I'd think the people who like such things liked it before they saw/heard it in porn. I see movies with guys making women gag, women getting choked, two guys stuffing their dicks into a woman's ass from time to time and amazingly I have no desire to do any of those things. If you took a poll right now of the people here who've started yelling out the "N" word during sex or more in public because of watching porn movies, how many names do you think you'll end up with ithe "YES" column?Your examples would carry much more weight if kids were supposed to be watching porn in the first place. If kids are seeing porn there's a long list more important issues to be concerned with than them hearing the "N" word. Then there's the fact that rap music and some black comedians have far, far more influence and is far, far accessible with kids and people hearing that word than porn will probably ever be. You're talking about nich porn vs thousands of songs by vey well known and popular artists on thousands of listening devices. If porn movies stopped with the racial slurs tommorrow it wouldn't have any real affect at all on kids or society.And in many cases those who can, do so and don't think twice about it.Well then, if I were you I'd round up a few male performers and go after all the companies who don't pay male talent as much as the female talent gets. Isn't some sort of sexism? Companies in mainstream corporate America couldn't get anyway with that. You know, with the "no astrisks" thing happening. You should wake up the industry. Take this all the way to Capital Hill.I'm sure they'll do just fine. I'd imagine there'll still be black on black porn and don't think we'll ever see IR scenes go away completely. They've been around almost from the beginning. Plus with more and more black male performers having director status, their own lines and more control over content as compared to years ago when it was just a few studios I'm not sure the black male performer drought you seem to think is coming will have the affect you think it has. Some people watch those guys because they like how they perform regardless of the girls so they won't drop them because they're doing fewer white women. [Link] |
| pornlaw Member 578 Posts 10/05 | Posted - Mar 23 2009 : 10:39PM All that I can say is that if you find something disturbing in porn, dont continue to buy that type of product. If it doesnt sell, no one will continue to make it. Michael www.AdultBizLaw.com www.2257Safe.com [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Mar 24 2009 : 10:37PM I think your stance is a noble one. It would be a great thing if some performers didn't toss out that word so much and have/make their co-stars say it also. But there's a part of me that thinks that adults should be allowed to express themselves however they choose as long as it's legal, not hurting anyone and it's not being forced on people who don't have the abilty to avoid it. I've always thought that freedom is more important than just giving me what I like personally. If this type of stuff was standard in the industry I'd say we have more of a problem but since it seems contained to just a few performers and companies and it's easily avoided if a person chooses not to see/hear it. Right now as it stands this is hardly an epidemic. I don't think it'll ever get to that point because there are too many people who'll refuse to let that happen. The whole pay scale in porn may be unfair in many ways but I think it's merely a reflection of how supply and demand tends to work. It would be nice if all things were equal but it's just not how business works. I tend to think it's all for the best. I think the most talented and most in demand should get more...otherwise, why should they bother? [Link] |
| mrputitbackin Member 51 Posts 12/09 | Posted - Jan 31 2010 : 5:14PM [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Feb 1 2010 : 12:52AM If you watch the BTS footage of many of black or IR themed movies you'll hear the black guys using the word "nigga/nigger" all the time. They don't see the word as bad or disrespectful because it's all about context. Some see it as funny having a white girl call them that, others see it as just being shocking, and others seeing it as empowering making a white woman say that "forbidden" word. I think it's wrong to want to see any sort of porn stop or go away just because some people are bothered by it. Fantasies and fetishes are supposed to be equally liked by everyone. If someone likes to see women pee or get hog-tied and the women doing it don't mind or get hurt, let them do it. That type of stuff you have to go out of your way to see and no one's forcing it on anyone. The guys doing scenes with women using the "n" word aren't the norm and they're easily avoided if anyone really wants to. It's basically a few guys at a couple of studios. [Link] |
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| Zaer Deactivated User 249 Posts 10/07 | Posted - Mar 15 2010 : 7:56PM They just see it as just another scene with another person and they can do them without a problem. Edited by - Zaer on 3/15/2010 7:56:36 PM [Link] |
| ntfighter Member 645 Posts 7/07 | Posted - Mar 17 2010 : 7:57PM An irrational white person will conclude that black dudes are after our women because they don't like theirs. Your daughters, how much for the little white girls drool, drool. Edited by - ntfighter on 3/17/2010 8:04:31 PM [Link] |
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| AsianAnalPantyhoserGuy Deactivated User Ass fucking/ foot fetish/ pantyhose= insanity! 465 Posts 3/10 | Posted - Apr 12 2010 : 7:36PM You want to give me something erotic? Show me black girl feet in sheer tan pantyhose getting RCA pumped by big black or white circumcised cock. Mark Ashley, Tom Byron, Brandon Irons, Brian Pumper, Mr. Marcus, Nathan Threat...please fill the void. [Link] |
| lenecplusultra Deactivated User L'enfer, c'est les autres 59 Posts 3/10 | Posted - Apr 12 2010 : 10:56PM Edited by - lenecplusultra on 4/12/2010 11:06:42 PM [Link] |
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