Well now that I've got everyone's attention with the misleading subject header... sorry, NO, Cytherea still has not done anal. Not that I know of anyway. But I was a bit shocked and somewhat disturbed after listening to her being interviewed in the bonus section of Suze Randall's "The Young and the Raunchy" DVD that I recently purchased.
Cytherea talked candidly about the first scene (I've Never Done That Before 14) she had done where she worked with a sweat-soaked Tyce Bune. While she mentioned that "It was good until I saw how it was edited afterward. I wasn't too happy about that one". She also said that because she was new to the business that Bune tried to "take advantage (of her)" by attempting to do anal a few times even though she TOLD him "NO ".
As much as I love porn and try to keep up on what goes on in the industry, I guess I know absolutely nothing about what really goes on BTS (behind the scenes).
I always ass-u-me-d that the women in the business, whether they're new and fresh off the bus from Utah or whether they have the stature of a Jenna Jameson, agree to what they will or will not do BEFORE shooting a scene and that the Director/Producer and the men she's working with would comply with her wishes.
Someone please tell me that this was just an isolated incident, that women who are new to the business are not pressured or taken advantage of. I'd like to know, after Cytherea repeatedly told him "no", why she didn't just turn around and punch Bune right in the fucking balls. Would the director have threatened her with "You'll never work in this town again sweetheart!"?
Maybe I'm making too much of this because Cytherea is my favorite porn star right now. She was even laughing a little bit during that part of the interview. But anyone who's seen this DVD can tell she looked a bit uncomfortable talking about it. And maybe Bune had shit in his ears (he was sweating so profusely, perhaps some of his persperation rolled into his ears, causing his brain to melt) and he couldn't hear her.
But if this is indeed a common occurance, if women in the business are taken advantage of sometimes, then I'm sad to say I've lost some respect for the porn industry. And after watching porn all these years I can't believe how naive I've been.
I'm the first to admit that I don't know shit, but I really believe that it depends greatly on the company in question as to how far the producers push the girls to do anal.
I wish the fans would lay off about it a little too... but that's not going to happen.
The thing is, I can see that to a certain degree, there might be discussions happening where producers do try to convince girls to do anal. It's the nature of the business. I mean, it's just like anything else. You can't fault a high school football coach for teaching his kids the conditioning and toughness required in order to get a college football scholarship. And with regard to moving into the anal arena for porn girls, there has to be a point when the girls TRY it, and that attempt isn't necessarily going to be comfortable for them. Talking can only take you so far.
On the other hand, I totally agree with you that all this should be worked out BEFORE the scene is in progress. If she says "no" she says "no". That should be it. If it isn't, it crosses this really ugly line into coercian and just makes the industry look bad. I mean. I don't know. In my concern for the backstage machinery of how the porn industry works, I really don't want to the girls (or the guys) to be forced or coerced into doing something they didn't agree to. The mere thought of it makes my stomach turn. But on the other hand, pushing limits and exploring new territory is something that I totally understand has to be at least encouraged in the industry. Like most other things, it isn't a black and white issue.
Cytherea said "no." And ultimately her wishes won the day. If what she described is true, I think Tyce is a fucking unprofessional moron, but ultimately Cytherea did what she needed to do. She said "no". The responsibility is hers as much as it is Tyce's, and in that case, the system worked.
The problem is that it's guys like Tyce (if the story is true) that just disuade girls like Cytherea or Tiana Lynn from wanting to do anal at all. And hell... I don't blame them.
There's ethics involved. And at the same time it's a business. The girls who give in to this pressure without regard to what they really want are as much to blame for the problem as Tyce is. I say good for Cytherea. There need to be more girls like her in the industry, and fewer guys like Tyce.
But again... I'm on the outside looking in. I don't know shit.
But I as a producer would never force anyone to do anything. I meet all the girls up front and ask them how comfortable they are with certain things. Including sex acts, aggressiveness, and even dire dark scenes or situations. Whatever they want to do it what they do.
Tyce has done this on film at least once. The scene is "famous" in my mind because the actress in question, April Flowers, had never done anal before that scene, and took several more years before she actually went through with it.
The scene is from Extreme Teen 5. They are fucking RC on a couch and the scene cuts to April on her side and Tyce behind her lining up with her ass. The dialog goes something like:
<Tyce repeatedly pushes against her asshole> April: "Wrong hole. <wispers>That's the wrong hole." Tyce: <mutters something> <April repositions, probably hoping to help Tyce line up with her pussy> <Tyce goes straight back to her asshole and starts pushing again> April: "Not in my ass. ...No. I said not in my ass." <Tyce keeps pushing repeatedly anyway> April: "No!" <Shoves him away by his waist> "Not in my <SHOVE> Ass!"
He finally relents and pushes into her pussy for a second, then pulls out, and starts sweeping it over her ass again. April is ready though with a quick "Uh, Uh. No." and he goes back to her pussy.
It's obvious that Tyce wanted to push the envelope and get her to do anal. She clearly didn't want it and told him so. It just sucks that it was more than maybe some playful asking and pushing and got to the point where she was a little angry. I can understand wanting to fuck her ass: It's perfect and beautiful. I'd probably try myself, but I'd stop after she said no the first time.
Who knows how many times Tyce has "gotten away" with this and actually ass fucked a girl who didn't want it.
Max Hardcore is pretty notorious for this. In Hollywood Hardcore 5, it looks like Charmane Star is taken off-guard when he tried to fuck her ass, but she eventually relents.
I hope when Bune tries to force anal on the next unfortunate girl he might be working with that she quickly whips out a 10" dildo and shoves it up his ass. I wonder how he'd like that.
Thankfully, not as common as it could be. But this isn't an isolated incident. It isn't just one actor, or Cytheria or one director. It happens.
And as to your question about what a woman who says no would hear, FF? Yeah - the conversation as I've heard it has gone something like, "I'll give you money if you do it. If you don't then I don't pay," and "If you're going to be difficult there's at least a million other whores out there that won't be."
I Have heard many reports on this about how directors and actors alike try to push the limits and such
it's not a isolated incident at all sadly But nowadays Girls in the "Biz" are growing Balls and Taking Charge .
Some By Stopping seens Some By Walking off sets altogether "GOOD FOR THEM" !
I Think it's High time that the Males of this "Industry" Learn there Place and yes it's dead last For If Not For The Females in the "BIZ" these Males would be nowhere !
Don't believe what i am saying ?
Let all the girls of the "industry" go on strike tomorrow and see how fast the Males go from eating steak to eating Top-Raman Noodles Overnight !
It's About time the Females in this "Industry" Are Treated with the respect they deserve !
A strike in the adult business only works if everyone is part of it (Union anyone?), and we all know that will never happen. If performers are willing to break the HIV-rules like last year, they will also be willing to break a strike.
I dont know if the incident in 'Extreme Teen 5' was real or staged (sometimes people stage this kind of thing, after all shocking scenes sell...unfortunately), but if that really happened i seriously wonder why producers still give him work. News spread rather fast in this industry, so if an incident like this happens i imagine that everyone in LA knows about it, yet they still give him work?
I am afraid that if a girl just walks off the set that the producer/performers immediatly spread rumors about her, saying she is unreliable to work with, so in the end the girl will always ends up being on the loosing side :(
I think in the end the only people who can turn these incidents are the customer. When i buy a dvd i always check who is in it, if Jamie Gillis or Jay Ashley are in it I automaticly avoid the movie (maybe i add Tyce as well). My 2 favorite male performers are Sean Michaels and Steve Holmes because their scenes always have a very good chemistry with their female partners, for me that is 10 hex more important that seeing rough anal sex. (and I might be wrong but I think i once read that Sean/Steve are known to be gentlemen when it comes to dealing with women, which might be the main reason their scenes always have a good chemistry with the women).
So...If you see a male performer do something you don't like, just stop buying his movies. In the end the only way to show your disgust is to hit the producer/performer through his wallet!
Paying trib-ute to SinncentVanSage 1412 Posts 12/04
Posted - Mar 5 2005 : 10:24AM
That sounds really awful. Okay, I don't think it's wrong asking a girl about doing anal beforehands but as long as she keeps saying "no" it has to be accepted, that must be taken for granted. I don't get it why it is considered as a downgrade if a girl is not willing to do anal anyway. There are so many other girls who do it and quite a few guys (including myself) who don't dig it that much so what's the problem when some girls don't do it? Just take a look at Cytherea's and Tiana's performances. It's so obvious they enjoy what they do and I think that's because they "have the balls" to say what the don't want to do. The day I see a girl doing anal with that much pleasure and energy these girls do other sex acts I'll really get into it, I suppose.
But in fact unlike many others I was not happy reading about Tiana doing anal again in this thread .* I fear maybe she finally did it because she was talked into it. (Don't take that for certain... I don't know what goes on in the indstry either, and that's where my fears come from.)
*If you read that sentence as "Tiana doing anal in this thread" I have to disappoint you... it's just my questionable syntax.
Just to add a little counterpoint , don't forget that some of the girls are probably no angels themselves . How about a girl who leans over and whispers "don't even think of trying to kiss me you ugly freak" just before the camera's start rolling ? Then there must be the girls who try and change the rules of the shoot themselves mid-scene ... Perhaps a few more shades of grey (and possibly brown) than some folks are considering so far .
As for Tyce Bune , well he looks a bit like one of my Dad's friends so there's no way I can enjoy watching him sweat ! But he must be doing something right or he wouldn't have been called back so often by the contract girls at Vivid who can choose who they work with . Kira Kener never struck me as a wilting violet and she worked with him plenty of times , if there'd been a problem you'd have thought he'd have been scratched off the list , wouldn't you ?
*Edit* Sounds like Bune has a reputation for taking advantage of girls who are new to the business. I would imagine if he ever tried that shit with one of the Vivid girls then they probably would punch him in the balls. But from what's been said so far, he shouldn't be singled out.
Anyway, now it makes total sense (to me) why so many women try to get under contract with a company. Of course I'm not that naive. I mean I could always understand why they would want to do it from a financial standpoint. And most contract girls can usually pick and choose who they want to work with and what they're willing to do. But I didn't realize how much of a potential sleaze factor was invovled.
I've been as guilty as anyone complaining in the past here by saying things like "One of my favorite porn stars just signed a contract with X Company and now she's gonna end up doing a bunch of lame ass videos the rest of her career." And a while back someone wrote to a pornstar member here saying something like "I won't be a fan of yours until you do interracial". Needless to say, she didn't bother posting here again for months.
I now find myself watching porn in a different way. Last night I was watching "Ass Man 26" where a Euro girl was taking double anal . Instead of getting aroused as I normally would, the first thing I thought was "Boy, that's gotta hurt. Is she really enjoying this?? It's almost laughable when I hear a director/cameraman say something like "look into the camera and smile." Maybe the girl really does enjoy it. Or maybe she's thinking "Dude, I've got two dicks in my ass. You try smiling!
Under no circumstances do I ever want to see a girl performing any sexual act because I want to see her do it. I want to see her doing it because she wants to do it and enjoys doing it!!
All I know is that I'll never look at porn the same way again.
I know this is an old topic but I just happened to see it now. I don't know about Tyce Bune's supposed reputation for pushing the envelop but I'm surprised that none of the porn guru's out there (or even Tyce Bune himself) hasn't pointed out that the male performer in the "famous scene" with April Flowers in Extreme Teen 5 was Brick Majors...NOT Tyce Bune. At least in that specific case all you sactimonious white knights laid a bad rap on the dude.
As far as taking control and going on strike... yeah, I think the female porn performers should definitely do that... I'm sure Burger King has plenty of openings for girls with their qualifications (not very many pornie girls have the IQ of Asia Carrera or the marketing ability of a Jenna Jameson).
As far as being pushed to do things they don't want to... regardless of gender, no one should let themselves be manipulated into doing something they will later regret. That being said, these are all legal adults, capable of making binding decisions and should be held responsible and accountable for those decisions. All young people make bad decisions from time to time... regardless of their occupation. Living with the consequences of those decisions is how young people gain experience and maturity.
While I'm sure there have been many instances of naive people being taken advantage of in the porn industry, some of this kind of dialog is deliberate as a way of creating hype and self righteous indignity. As they say, there's no such thing as bad publicity.
how long did you have to dig to find a place to put your little speech?
[Link]
major sharp Deactivated User
246 Posts 2/04
Posted - Nov 26 2006 : 12:26PM
I checked over at Iafd and it seems Tyce is doing more work behind the camera now a days. Maybe he's tired of taking the little blue pill he's almost 50 if his bio is correct.
johny wrote:Another arrogant hater. How rare!You left out the part that no one should knowingly manipulate someone else into doing almost anything, but especially not something that the manipulator suspects the other person may regret. This standard of conduct requires little things that I like to call kindness, humanity, and ethics.I note the use of the word "legal" and the term "binding decisions". Kindness, humanity, and ethics should never be confused with contract law.And they make more of them when people who know better encourage them to do so.So you're suggesting that experienced people who aid inexperienced people in making bad decisions are actually benevolent life-mentors?I'm guessing you're intimately aware of such instances.An excellent justification for a manipulator's sloughing off of responsibility. I congratulate you on the deftness of your rhetorical craft.
I'll let you others fight out the issues here, but I will say the scene in question is epic in its shittiness.
How shitty is it? Let me disqualify each of you from having to endure this heap of steaming shit.
Anal Fans- Don't bother, it's just the tip of Bune's smallish dick and about half of his attempts look like zero penetration.
Squirt fans- As I remember she manages one while Bune fingers her. This being the first scene in which I'd seen her squirt I remember thinking, that's nothing special. Needless to say, it didn't take long for me to realize she was a squirting legend upon watching a number of other Cytherea titles.
Sexual Chemistry fans- NONE! Cytherea seems pretty disinterested most of the time. I was shocked she even mustered up a single orgasm.
Creampie fans- Reminiscent of Randy West's dribble jobs...and it's hard to disappoint me with a decent creampie, but this one certainly did.
Novelty fans- You know the guys who like "the first" and "the only" time a girl did this or that. Count me in as one of these guys and I couldn't care less about this scene. I don't count a barely anal as an anal and I'd hardly call this a genuine anal scene.
Sexual Heat fans- The only heat in this scene is from the minimal lighting, as Bune is sweating like a whore in church. His sweat glands are working overtime, but at least something manages to get dripping wet. It certainly wasn't Cytherea's lovely pussy.
Quality Production fans- As mentioned above, the lighting is pretty dim and crappy. It's as though they forgot to bring lights once their buddy ok'd the use of his dingy living room for the shoot.
Cytherea fans- Since they probably spent about $4 on the production, it appears a make-up artist was left of the list of needs. Cytherea looks ok, but not nearly as cute as a multitude of other scenes I've seen her in. She was pretty new, so she's pretty much just going thru the motions. She looks like she's just waiting for the ink on the check to dry and get the fuck out of that pit.
Older guy, younger girl fans- Not hard to find in a Biz where the guys just don't ever seem to quit and I'll guarantee 99.9% of her other scenes with older guys are hotter. Not to mention she's got over 200 titles in release, so it's pretty simple to find her doing a 40+ year old guy.
Degradation fans- Cytherea isn't a screaming, tortured fool when he's trying to poke her in the ass, though admittedly it almost wakes her up from complete disinterest. ________________________________________
So why am I so adamant about this? A couple of reasons. First, this was one of the most disappointing flicks I've ever seen. When I watched it Cytherea was the hot new thing and I was wondering what all the fuss was after this train wreck. I can't recover the time I spent watching this pile of shit, but I can try to help my brothers and sisters avoid the same mistake. Consider yourself warned.
Secondly, I don't think we should reward anybody monitirily for pulling a dirty little trick on a newbie by purchasing/renting this movie. That's the kind of thing that runs the young hottie talent right out of the business and by God I like the prime talent to stick around awhile.
Finally, there are so many great Cytherea titles out there, but I'll just throw out a couple of my faves. First is Peter North's POV #3. Squirt fans will LOVE this one as Cytherea is an absolute geyser! Watch the hilarious closing titles as they give a BTS look as she gives Peter North swimmer's ear and they show the wall (which is 8-10 feet away) just drenched. Peter ends up filming the rest of the scene with a towel over his face. A good facial finishes off a great scene. By the way if you want the quintessential Peter North/Cytherea facial get Deep Throat This 19...he just covers her with an epic pop shot.
Her scene with Mandingo in Chasing the Big Ones #25 is also great (especially for IR fans). Cytherea looks great and obviously Mandingo would agree as he launches the biggest load I've ever seen him work up (unfortunately)over her head.
