Therefore you must have ordered fisting, peeing or other extreme releases.

Any normal hardcore porn including GGG titles without peeing will pass through with no problems.

Thanks Lazenby

Extreme Anal Pounding Movie Lover

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But I can't argue that we are treated like children. It would be good to know what titles you had seized so other people know what is likely to be grabbed.

People always post on here that they've had goods seized but rarely specify which titles, hence there's a lack of hard evidence - Lazenby rightly says "they can only confiscate porn that isn`t allowed under BBFC rules." But, and there's always a but, the lovely people of HMCE are well known to be a law unto themselves (and a gross waster of taxpayers money, but that's another story or ten) and it would be good to know if they are sticking to the rules or taking it on themselves to seize material that should be allowed into the country.

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Edit: As you mention they listed to you what is legal, can you tell us what they said?

It's unfortunate they want to brow beat you too, shame you can't manage to take them on in court - HMCE don't always do well in court.

This also broadly goes against the advice on their own website...quoting from Notice 1 - A Guide for Travellers Entering the UK, under prohibited and restricted goods and smuggling...

"Prohibited goods (that is, goods which are banned completely):
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-Indecent and obscene material featuring children, such as books, magazines, films, videotapes, laser discs and software.
-Pornographic material other than that which depicts the type of consensual sexual activity between adults which can be legally purchased in the UK."

This doesn't specify that products should be bought in the UK, it only refers to the type of sexual activity, hence by extension any sex action which is within the BBFC guidelines should be OK.

I'll leave it up to our readers whether GGG is within the guidelines - available under R18 at the BBFC Website - which constitute what is and isn't suitable to be "legally purchased in the UK." The advice for shopping on the Internet also refers only to import duty, not the kind of goods you buy. I don't know if the rules for travellers = the rules for internet shoppers...

I am sure this vagueness is deliberate so they can change policy as they see fit. I have yet to read anything official from HMCE to say that buying adult movies by mail order is OUTRIGHT illegal as they said to you. Personally, I'd definitely seek more clarification about this.

Edited to add question marked above.

Edited by - Gabriel Nine on 6/5/2003 2:51:42 PM

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I buy titles from LE and EroDVD, none of which are BBFC classified, so I accept that I am taking a risk with this. If they were seized by customs, I wouldn't expect HMCE to let me have them and I don't think I'd have much basis for demanding they allow the importation either.

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For example, I have had Private titles from EroDVD opened and sent on to me okay, but now this poster is telling us that he's been told that ANY imported porn is a no-no. Yet the customs website, as I quoted would suggest that any sexual activity of the sort that could be depicted in UK-certificated movies is OK. So you can see where the grey area is! Then there's the fact that many movies like Service Animals or Fashionistas, for example, are passed by the BBFC with extensive cuts, which could potentially make the imported versions illegal.

Again, I stress that on one hand THEY (HMCE) are telling us what SHOULD be acceptable for import, and on the other they appear to be doing something different in reality. What I wanted to get across, and clearly failed, is that there is no absolute guarantee that your porn will make it through Custom's grasp, despite what they say!

Of course, the ironic thing is that many many orders have gone through since I last had anything examined, never mind seized.

Edited by - Gabriel Nine on 6/6/2003 11:48:25 AM

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One package did though get a seizure notice, that was one of the erodvd cheap packages of 4 dvds. At the time I ordered I did not think it contained any obscene material. The delivery was very slow, and I think the package was changed to a harder package by the time it was sent out. When I looked back at the website it had been replaced with a fisting and pissing package. The Customs Officer wrote that the fisting and urination was the reason for the seizure.

Paraglider

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Given that we know the law is quite clear on the matter of buying R18s via mail-order (i.e. it's not allowed) then I find the HMCE website statement (importing non-BBFC-but-could-be material is OK) is almost too good to be true - it makes a mockery of the law on buying R18s.

What I wanted to cast doubt on was people's generous interpretation of these guidelines to mean "hey, it's OK to import any porn you like, even if it hasn't got a BBFC certificate, subject to a couple of taboo topics". The fact that this is a guideline, with some vagueness (as you say in your earlier post) means that officers can, and obviously are, interpreting it in different ways.

I also agree that we need some definitive clarification of the rules, so that we'd at least have some justification for when officers have been too harsh. Whether the rules are actually going to be followed is another matter

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the colonel

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it is illegal for a UK supplier to send XXX R18 videos or their equivalent via the UK postal system.

The main reason for this is that the government wants us to only buy XXX through a licensed sex shop and NOT the shady under the counter types that you can find in Soho etc.

Once a package is in the postal system as long as it only contains material that would be passed by the BBFC i.e no fisting, pissing etc then it is perfectly legal.

If it was the case that this was illegal then all imports of DVD's and videos without a BBFC classification would also be illegal.

Thanks Lazenby

Extreme Anal Pounding Movie Lover

Edited by - lazenby on 6/7/2003 6:06:41 AM

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As Timotei has been saying, I think there's a danger for customers in making the kind of assumptions you're making when you say "Once a package is in the postal system as long as it only contains material that would be passed by the BBFC i.e no fisting, pissing etc then it is perfectly legal"

We need to base discussion on hard facts - and given the guidelines the BBFC use to classify R18, it's clear that there's a lot more that will be cut, not just pissing, fisting - I note your use of "etc" but I think we've got to try to be exact when dealing with this if we want to give would-be customers a clear indication of what is likely to happen.

To throw a little more confusion into the mix, I believe that it is an offence to send "obscene" material through the Royal Mail. What is obscene is open to the interpretation of a jury or a magistrate. So I don't feel we can be blase and assume we can make cast iron judgements about what is OK - clearly consumers are at the mercy of subjective decision making by individual customs officers, prosecutors, and, if it comes to it, magistrates or jurors.

I agree 100% with Timotei - we need clarification. I suspect this may not be forthcoming, but we shall see.

Edited by - Gabriel Nine on 6/7/2003 7:29:13 AM

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What was all that about "open government"?

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They told me that dvds which had content that would pass the BBFC tests is allowed to be imported even if the BBFC have not seen them. Although they could not give me a yes/ no on the two DVDs (because they had not seen them), they did say that in their experience that sort of stuff was generally OK, but that to be sure I should buy R18. I thought that they were genuinely frank and helpful - the guy who responded said he was from their head office.

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