Why is this? I was looking at some mid 2000's gonzo(glory days) and the sex was much more aggressive. Every scene had facefucking, and at mostly every movie had an anal, dp, or mmf in it. Is this due to brazzers takeover of porn? They've taken a decidedly non aggresive approach to porn since they've started. Can you imagine if guys like Brian Surewood, Johnny Thrust, Otto Bauer, etc were still working? Those guys would have culture shock! So, has the brazzerification of porn tamed the acts, or are girls genuinely not into the acts we believed they were into in the 2000s?
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fanman44 Deactivated User
474 Posts 1/13
Posted - Jan 3 2014 : 6:17PM
Any ideas?
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LeeKingsboro Deactivated User
Best For Business 526 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 3 2014 : 7:05PM
I don't get it either. It's like companies are afraid to push the envelope.
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LeeKingsboro Deactivated User
Best For Business 526 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 3 2014 : 7:08PM
Btw, Brazzers is good but I wouldn't at all say they've taken over porn. They aint all that.
A couple folks were indicted for obscenity by the federal government. Not the only reason, but definitely played a role. Edited by - savoy on 1/3/2014 7:39:45 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 4 2014 : 9:56PM
Anal and double penetration are both regularly present in Brazzers updates. Face fucking less so, but I'd argue that all three categories are still well represented in current porn. In fact, what you described is the sort of porn I watch on a daily basis. I wonder if you're subscribing to the wrong websites or buying the wrong dvds?
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fanman44 Deactivated User
474 Posts 1/13
Posted - Jan 5 2014 : 1:40AM
Probably what companies are you watching that still have the old diabolic and anabolic extreme stuff
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 5 2014 : 5:55PM
While I certainly haven't abandoned the old stuff (I spent far too much money on videos and DVDs to no longer watch them), most of the porn I watch online is new. If you're trying to say that the female performers aren't manhandled as heavily and consistently as they used to be, that I agree with. I share your disappointment. However, I really don't know where you're getting the idea that anal, etc. are somehow rare or taboo in current porn. If that were the case, I'd give up on paying for porn like no shortage of other viewers already have.
Yup, a couple of users hit it right on the head.. It's the combination of federal indictments for obscenity and online piracy. I would also add the recent HIV scares have contributed to less safe acts being less commonplace. E.g. Evil Angel doesn't even do anal creampies anymore. I don't attribute it to Brazzers, but I will agree that their brand of porn has grown extremely tired and formulaic. When they pulled the plug on their Pornstar Punishment site, it was a true sign of the times.
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fanman44 Deactivated User
474 Posts 1/13
Posted - Jan 5 2014 : 9:33PM
yeah the atmosphere is a lot less aggresive. i dont know if thats because performers were fed up, or if prosecution had something to do with it
I think that American pornstars are more tame than they were but European pornstars are still down for really hard, aggressive, nasty scenes. Edited by - bumblaster on 1/5/2014 10:22:00 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 6 2014 : 12:24AM
I'm inclined to agree with Savoy that it was fear of obscenity charges and worse that caused a general toning down in the industry. Like he said, it wasn't the only reason, but a desire to avoid fines and/or prison was certainly a powerful motivating factor. For example, the fact that Brazzer not only discontinued Pornstars Punishment but also took the drastic step of removing the entire line of Pornstars Punishment videos from its website is a strong indicator that legal worries were a primary concern. I don't think that the willingness of female performers to engage in particularly rough, unpredictable sex is much of an issue. If one says no, another will say yes. What I wonder is if American performers, as bumblaster suggests, are more reticent to film very rough scenes than their European counterparts. For instance, I can't help but notice that Kink's Hardcore Gangbang site has featured an unusually high number of European women being gangbanged. I'm fine with that, but it does make me wonder...
I don't think this is really the case OP. I just think that the amount of guys shooting porn in their rooms has deteriorated. I actually found some of the harder stuff a while back disturbing. I actually think that the oral sex has improved a lot over the years. Porn stars now in general seem better at blowjobs (for the most part). You still have a choice of really hard and wild girls who you know are gonna get DP'd and/or facefucked. I actually think that some of the hotter porn stars are going really hard now. Did you see Capri Cavanni's latest mmf? I never ever expected her to do such a wild scene with the throating and facefucking but she did. Look at Chanel Preston, a goddess by all accounts and she gets facefucked DP'd and roughed up all the time. I'm on the other side of the fence with this argument, I actually feel that we have a better selection of wild girls now in terms of looks. I remember a few years ago the really hot babes like Jenaveve Jolie and Dylan Ryder did vanilla only. Now the hotties are taking it up the ass and getting facefucked.
Actually it's the market going elsewhere , the success of parodies, movies for couples , romances, sites like X-art , Joymii , Babes , Tonight girlfriends , and the new course at JJV where even the gangbangs are actually meant to please (take a look at Lisa Ann's Black Out last scene) rather than exploit. The market is changing and rough and very rough sex is not as greatly in demand as it was. The usual suspect Jules Jordan understood this long ago he pioneered the hard sex in his early movies especially with Aurora Snow and her doubles anal and vaginal and combination with three and Gauge but not exclusively. Even Belladonna/Aiden Riley is way less rough than it was , the successful Raw series of Manuel Ferrara is also exemplary In Dogfart the most rated flicks are the less rough. Rocco himself is going less wild especially in his POV series. The complaint received , the signals from customers made Brazzers decide to shut their Pornstars Punishment site and throwing away thousands of dollars worth of material they already had shot The market is changing, the stars don't need to go rough to make a name for themselves also almost all has already been done , so they will only be another number in an already long list of rough performers. Last but not least there are those who actually like it rough but they almost aren't booked , I couldn't understand why, until I got that them really enjoying it might be a turn off for some , what's the point of punishing if the punished gets off by that? Edited by - LCF on 1/6/2014 5:54:48 AM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 6 2014 : 2:14PM
Not to go OT, but are you talking about her Brazzers scene from a month back?If you're correct and it's actually the subscribers who got Pornstars Punishment shut down, I'm sickened. I've never been big on leaving feedback on the various Brazzers shoots. If I had known that there was a customer backlash against Pornstars Punishment, I would have written in favor of the site. I LOVED most of those scenes. Edited by - misspornUSA on 1/6/2014 2:33:19 PM Edited by - misspornUSA on 1/6/2014 2:33:42 PM
^ A subscriber not only rates scenes but also download them, if you have say 100 subscribers and only one of them downloads from a site is a signal even if he doesn't say anything. If those rating say it's like a rape and something like that , then you may get unwanted attention from authorities or moralists.It was in the air , James Deen saw that coming so he made a public statement about refusing to do such scenes because he felt uncomfortable with such fake rape , it was of course a market strategy he has an image so wanted to point out he wasn't a bad guy and that didn't realize what it was at first. Of course he sees nothing wrong when he fucks a tied girl at kink often up the ass There was a debate even on this board a month or two prior of this Edited by - LCF on 1/6/2014 2:31:51 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 6 2014 : 2:44PM
I really should pay more attention. I've always been a fan of Deen's work and had no idea he sold Pornstars Punishment out like that. Very disappointing.
^^ I don't think he did , just went out in time , maybe Brazzers canceled all his scheduled shoots and when he asked they said him why , so he just saved his ass. I don't know the whole story , it's a guess Edited by - LCF on 1/6/2014 3:29:21 PM
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fanman44 Deactivated User
474 Posts 1/13
Posted - Jan 6 2014 : 9:37PM
Yeah deen's golden era gonzo work 2004-2008 was extremely violent, and it wasn't with studios that have strict safety rules like kink. Those studios thrived on misogyny and deen was a willing participant in those acts with Surewood and others, in scenes that were far worse than pornstar punishment
You didn't actually believe that the performers just a decade ago were into getting slapped around, having dicks roughly shoved down their throats and treated like shit by male performers. They did it because that was the only paycheck they could get but I'm pretty sure they would have been a lot happier to shoot a standard b/g scene that didn't involve anything more than gentle oral sex, a variety of vaginal positions maybe some normal anal and a cum shot finish somewhere on their body. Kink's hardcore gangbang still does most of what you are talking about and they still get a bunch of performers willing to do those scenes but the girls do it for the same reason I mentioned above and they would also prefer doing a more tame type scene if they could.
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Joe Mayo Deactivated User
Sure Thing, Joe Mayo. 533 Posts 10/13
Posted - Jan 8 2014 : 1:06PM
^ Also, let's face it, some pornstars just aren't hot enough to be choosy about what kind of scenes they do if they want to call porn their career. There's some with only D-list looks and have to resort to demeaning bottom-feeding shit like facialabuse.
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LeeKingsboro Deactivated User
Best For Business 526 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 8 2014 : 1:23PM
^ lol they do usually bring in scrubs, but there's been some big name hotties there too
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Joe Mayo Deactivated User
Sure Thing, Joe Mayo. 533 Posts 10/13
Posted - Jan 8 2014 : 2:30PM
^ One of the true hotties (IMO) to do FA was Alexis Malone, one of my all-time faves. Personally, I was glad to see they took it relatively easy on her.
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LeeKingsboro Deactivated User
Best For Business 526 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 8 2014 : 2:40PM
^ They took it easy on her? Shame on them lol I've never seen em go easy on a girl, cept for maybe in the very beginning of the site's existence. I'll hafta check dat scene out when I get home
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Jan 8 2014 : 3:20PM
Thanks. The trailer didn't look very promising and I didn't initially intend to watch it. However, after reading your description I thought that I'd give it a chance, but I wanted to make sure that it was the right scene.
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euellgong Deactivated User
...look at me... 77 Posts 1/14
Posted - Jan 8 2014 : 6:17PM
Brazzers is good but I wouldn't at all say they've taken over porn....
^ You kidding , the owner of Brazzers Manwin Ltd owns a great amounts of sites and some porn companies such as Digital Playground for example among others plus many other things
Members didn't get Pornstar Punishment taken down. The Brazzers members loved that site, for the most part. If you read the threads here and on their forum, the site got taken down because credit card processors started to get tougher on what you were and weren't allowed to put on your site when it came to consent and sex in scenes. For example, it's why Bound Gangbangs became Hardcore Gangbangs (apparently being tied up was too much), why sleeping porn scenes have pretty much gone away, and why you can't pay for a hypnosis boy/girl sex scene with a credit card at all anymore. From what I heard, they also cracked down on pretending someone was drunk in scenes as well.
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Joe Mayo Deactivated User
Sure Thing, Joe Mayo. 533 Posts 10/13
Posted - Jan 8 2014 : 8:53PM
^ I never knew that but it makes sense. Sleep Creep was one of those sites that I can't believe lasted as long as it did.
I think the difference between now and before is that porn studs don't appear to be hungry for sex anymore. They are still doing the same sex acts as before, but now they are taking a lot longer with foreplay. And now they are doing their sex acts in a more leisurely and less hurried way. You can tell this even from the length of the scenes. Assman #1 from 1997 is 140 minutes long. Which gives about 23 minutes for guys to do everything with their lady in each of the 6 scenes. While American Anal Sluts from 2010 is 353 minutes long. Which gives one guy 71 minutes to do everything with his ladies in each of the 5 scenes. There is no way a guy can appear to be full of lust hard and fast for 71 minutes straight. The guy needs to pace himself in this kind of a situation and take it easy with the lady. I think the reason for this change is a changed relationship between female porn stars and their male porn studs. In old films like Assman #1, guys often couldn't even speak with their lady, because they didn't speak the same language. These guys had to relate to their lady in a primal, non-verbal way, with their dicks between her cheeks. And that's why they came at her gang-bang style to anal and DP her, before she knew what hit her. Their inability to speak the same language turned off their civilized thoughts and brought out the primal cave-men and cave-women in them. They fucked the way people did 200,000 years ago, with animalistic grunts and groans, rather than thought-provoking-words. But in today's films, guys and their lady speak the same language. Which brings into play their cultural norms and habits of being ladies and gentleman. Porn studs no longer feel free to jump on a pretty lady like on a slut and bang her quickly and efficiently just the way they want. They need to show her some respect, kiss her ass first, and be nice with her like civilized gentlemen. Which makes their sex less hot to watch. Civilized sex is playful sex rather than lustful sex. And that's what we have now in porn. Edited by - Dan on 1/9/2014 7:32:58 AM
It was said complaints were received ,but that is true, CC companies are affecting the market heavily , it's another leverage to shut down porn , little by little they are limiting every choice. They begun with bestiality , and as much as I may agree with the general purpose I said here it was a dangerous precedent, in fact they continued extending their range to Japanese porn and had pushed out of the market even comics not necessarily depicting bestiality. I mean comics , nothing real , not even acted, no real person in there , ink and paper. Whatever some guys in there deem to be obscene or they just don't like they can force it to shut down without even a trial. Edited by - LCF on 1/9/2014 8:33:01 AM
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fanman44 Deactivated User
474 Posts 1/13
Posted - Jan 10 2014 : 1:15PM
Dan I actually agree. I think today there is too much emphasis on female foreplay. In the old days they would shove dick in, and it would be more of a suprise to the lady. It was kind of a test to see how aroused she was, and if she wasn't aroused she had better get aroused fast because the dick was inside her. It was a different approach to sex, but one I preferred.
You picked the wrong movies for your comparison. It's true that both of them have a similar theme and the same number of scenes but one stars all European performers and the other is all US. Of course there isn't any dialogue in the first one since it would have been in pretty badly broken English or in a Foreign language and therefore that rarely happened. I also don't think that Assman is more aggressive because the guys can't speak English since all of the gangbang series from Anabolic were just as aggressive and they mostly starred US performers. I'd also like to point out that the length of the more recent movie may have less to do with the director wanting each scene to be longer and more to do with his laziness in regards to editing it to a decent time or possibly his inability to do so.Nothing has changed in regards to language except that more European performers have learned to speak a passable English so now it's more common to hear them speak it in the movie but you still have plenty of movies starring European performers with little to any dialogue because the performers do not speak English. If the male treat the women with more respect now then it's because the women make it clear that being treated like shit won't fly with them. Mind you I haven't really seen a significant change in that regard except that there are now so few studios shooting porn that the ones who survived up until now are those that tented to shoot a more couple friendly type of porn and therefore those misogynistic behaviors were not in their movies to begin with.
Actually this is all a fantasy of yours , they do speak a common language most of the times, but since it's not English they keep silent and just moan and grunt, but believe me if something was wrong or not accepted they would howl in their language and stop the scene. this is actually why I do prefer American or even Japanese porn ,they talk I can understand English, Italian, French, Spanish and part of sexual German (very few words , Schwanz, geil, arsh , fick and so on) and I believe part of sexual Japanese but I don't know how to write it. No Czech, no Russian, no Hungarian you know why? They don't say a word , you may be aroused by 140 minutes of grunting and nothing else , not plot of any sort , nothing. After a dozen movies as such you will say , OK I'm done with this, I have seen more talkative dogs. Some movies from Holland had English subtitles , and now some Russian sites have them too
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Feb 8 2014 : 4:00PM
Oddly enough, I see that a scene that Shyla Stylez for Pornstars Punishment is listed as "Upcoming" on Brazzers. Perhaps Brazzers' bosses have decided to cycle back in some PP shoots? I wonder if the scene's been recut.
^ Maybe , or maybe they just dubbed or shoot again the set up , so that it's not portrayed like a punishment any more , after all the material they have is worth some hundred thousand if not a million
Chloe Temple Interview
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