CrAZY, WHEN I read the original post, I am thinking, hmmmm, this is a very experimental person, then all of a sudden her partner turns into a whack job after 9 years because she gets preggo? Blames it on porn??? I can see an act or two, pushing the limit, but to go balls out crazy like never before after 9 years? I fail to see how porn has any influence on his decisions, for real. I can understand and even feel compassion, but this seems to be a zero to 60 mph turn around. I recall when my wife was preggo, she had a fairly high sex drive, we actually rented "preggo porn" because she didn't feel sexy, and there was nothing we could find that was entertaining to us. We didn't need any kind of porn, my wife just wanted some kind of feeling that preggo women were sexy and I was all for it. She didn't feel sexy. We watched a lot of porn, and we watched it together, but when she was preggo, she just felt like maybe I wanted something else or a girl who wasn't preggo and that wasn't the case. She became very self conscious, insecure and jealous, it was kind of crazy. I never once felt the need to abuse her or degrade her even though I watched a lot of porn.
I am the OP to this thread. I updated the original post today. I am copying the updated portion of my original post here in case anyone new to this thread wanted to respond to the original question... I'm hoping this will save them time and give me answers that are more relevant based on new facts. What I wrote before is not as relevant to my situation as what I've written below but I left up the text from the original complaint for continuity. Like it says below, advice is appreciated. You occasionally read about situations like this and hypothetically, it's easy to say what you'd do if it was you. Now that it's me, I'm dumbfounded. :( Thanks everyone, Indigo
“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09
Posted - Aug 17 2012 : 6:29AM
^ 1). This guy is a grade a asshole. Don't feel guilty, this guy is not a man doing all this shit with a baby on the way. He's a fucking jackhole. 2). Are you older or on the younger side (you sound younger). 3). Are you family members or friends an options (moving in with them)? I know it's not that ideal, but many women do this. 4). I would say dump this asshole and leave, but not sure what best way is with extra factor of kid/pregnancy (I"m a guy). I'd ask Lindi, Kimi (and other wise women here) or the other women here that can offer good advice on this front. Just don't feel bad. It's all this guy's fault. Luckily you found it in time before finding years later (trust me). You sound like a solid girl, so there are many guys who would love dating women with kids or not. P.S. If this guy has already demonstrated he's abusive (to you), dishonest, financially irresponsible, I"m not sure he'd be (or the potential of this) a good idea around a baby. Edited by - BYOB_Kenobi on 8/17/2012 6:33:57 AM
First thoughts off the top of my head (and please keep coming back, because we here mull things over and think of additional things, and we care)-- I know this is hard, but don't confront him just yet. You need a strategy and a place to go. I would suggest that you and your children stay, and he goes. For this, you need to seek legal advice. There should be some free legal advice for people without money or people in your legal situation. (You don't have to go into lurid details if you don't want to). The best time to spring it is probably when you have a newborn. Who will back him saying it's you who should leave? Call Legal Aid if they are in your phone book. Call local, state, and county offices and ask where to get free legal help. When I was in Arizona, the law there provided for free couples counseling for people who were divorcing, and it was MANDATORY for couples who had kids. You need to find out what is out there. If there is free counseling, there may be free legal through the courts. There is a network of organizations who can refer you around for financial help, etc. without moving into a shelter. Whatever evidence you found, get screen shots and mail to yourself, photocopy, etc. Even in a no-fault state, you may find it useful for something. Get a safe deposit box. You don't know what you might need it for--maybe just something like required counseling, so they don't hold you to more sessions when you emphatically tell them it's over. Maybe helpful in a financial settlement when he claims he can't provide for his kids, but you show he has an unlimited budget for smut. It's not going to be a relationship problem right now, it's going to be a practical problem and a legal problem. So, you need a competent, real lawyer, because your future is YOU in your house and him paying support.
Oh, yeah, and snoop some more. You want to make sure this guy is okay to have around children. Tell him the doctor said no sex until the baby is born, but you'd be happy to shit in his mouth.
Re: 2) I am much younger than him actually (don't judge) I should mention, I'm Canadian where 16 is more than old enough to consent but that's when we met. We've been together 9 years and he's 8 1/2 years older than I am. I'm 26 and he's 34. Yes, I was a teen mom but a good one... I suppose except for my naivety when I was younger in choosing him as my man. Re: 3) Unfortunately, I have no family that I could just up and go to. My parents are both deceased, my sister is across the country and recently relapsed from her addiction to cocaine, (nice huh?) so no help there. As an aside, she's actually never met my son, due to her addiction/criminal behavior. My nearest and dearest relative lives on the other side of my province, she's my great Aunt, but if you want to get specific, my Great Uncle's ex wife (as another aside, he cheated on her and when my mom died, she had the grace of being my surrogate mom even though my Uncle betrayed her and he abandoned his own children. She's offered her home to me when I called in tears this morning, after my baby is born but I am really torn about uprooting my son from his family here (Uncles, Grandparents, Aunts, Cousins) as he's very close to all of them. I don't know that we should both suffer for his father's mistakes. Re: 4) I definitely won't stick around to be treated like this but I definitely need to figure a way out. I am planning on confronting him with all of it but want to be rational here and also organize my evidence on him before I do so - and also in the event we have a nasty legal battle ahead. I'm in no shape to move at the moment so I'm going to try my best to stay calm as I'm currently as big as a house and broke. As of now, my plan of action is to come up with a plan of action... that and to get checked for STD's at my next OB/GYN appointment. Re: P.S.) Believe it or not, he is actually a good dad. He's very hands on when it comes to parenting and actually teaching our son pretty wholesome Christian values <--- LOL! (sorry but I've been up all night and I'm exhausted and as upset as I am, I am laughing at the moment at how ridiculous this is). He's proven himself to be a real Jekyl and Hyde here. Nonetheless, I can't critique his parenting. He's been very good at hiding his demons from our son and is ironically, very strict about the kind of content our son sees and hears and is very loving/attentive, protective and involved in his upbringing. As much of a mess he's proven to be on the inside, he does a good job at holding that together in front of our son, although he definitely lacks integrity when doing so. :( Outside of the bedroom, he's never hurt me or even hinted at the threat of domestic violence when we've argued in the past. The more I think about it however, he is very manipulative with me emotionally in ways that differ from name calling/verbal abuse. I don't want to go as far as calling him abusive but he's definitely lacking in respect, lies a lot and hides things, apparently cheats, and often invalidates my thoughts and feelings when when we have serious talks about relationship issues. Another funny thing is he's accused/suspected me of cheating or flirting with other men consistently over the years. I suppose the more frequent they accuse, the more likely they abuse. Edited by - indigoviolets on 8/17/2012 12:27:07 PM
I know a bit about Family Law here (I'm actually a law clerk by trade) and worked at a law firm, sometimes in our Family Law department until the spring of last year but I think I am looking at some trouble ahead when it comes to finding immediate housing. The house we currently live in is rented and owned by none other but my father-in-law (also a cheater lol), like father, like son. He's also a total enabler, hence us living in this house despite me and my mother in law's efforts to convince my husband to buy a house. In the event of a divorce, I might actually end up very glad that my husband didn't grow up fully and stand on his own two feet. One less property issue to deal with in the courts if/when we get there. I think your advice about waiting to confront him is a wise one. I managed to pretend everything was dandy when he came home today to get ready for work. He brought home a crib so my focus turned to baby and the son I already have, is helping me set it up so that's helping. At the risk of sounding sneaky and vindictive, I am definitely going to try and sleuth for more evidence of his extra-marital activity. So far I've counted five online dating profiles to different sites, all created on or after April of this year. I am willing to bet that my husband's family will turn against me when we split up. I am the only significant other who has not been banished/dis-communicated and I have seen how quickly their loyalty to outsiders turns when blood ties are involved. Two life-long family (30+) years friends of theirs for example, were tossed out like yesterday's garbage over conflicts that would otherwise be easily solved and forgiven because in my mother-in-law's words, "Nobody hurts my kids and gets away with it!" I feel loved in his family but I know it's not without conditions and I know where the loyalty lies. There is a real imbalance of power on his side of things because I'm without family or a strong social network outside of my friends who are only capable of emotional support. While not rich himself, he has a tight-knit, well-to-do family that will side with him and he will no doubt lie and somehow come out the victim. One of his profiles even says I cheated on him and he feels like this is the only way he can move past it before ending our "kink-free, sex-free marriage." I've never so much as danced with another man in nine years and I didn't get pregnant by myself!!! In fact, if I ever do go out, (I'm 100% hetero BTW), my girlfriends and I go to gay karaoke bars! I should also mention my father-in-law, is a millionaire jack-of-all-trades, entrepreneur and spent many years working as a paralegal so has much more connections and legal know-how than I. He's also pretty shady in his business dealings (nothing illegal, just grey-area/loophole rule bending) so I don't think he's the best person to have against me either.
Unfortunately, from the videos I've seen, he's more apt to want to piss and shit in mine, and then stick his dick in it to give it a good stir. :O He's right, I am not freaky enough for him! I took screen snippets/recordings of everything. I think I already have enough evidence to call him on his cheating and sex addiction but I will continue to collect more until I confront him so long as I can remain in this state of shock/emotional numbness that I am currently feeling. I cried this morning to my Aunt on the phone. Now I'm all business and sitting outside of myself. Thank goodness because my son is home and I couldn't imagine feeling what I felt last night or this morning with him here and having to hide it.
Oh, sweetie... I'm awfully sorry to hear all that you've discovered. He is not a good guy... Get him out of your life, ASAP! The others have given you some EXCELLENT advice. They're more knowledgable than I on these matters, but I will say that you do have options. You mentioned the family member (Great Aunt?) who has offered to take you and your children into her home. I think you need to take her up on the offer. It will be a big change and will have downsides, but it will be a safe, loving environment. That's what you and your children will require in the months to come. A loving, secure person who has your best interests at heart. Not to mention it will be far, far away from your shitheel husband! I promise you that things will turn out for the best. Keep being strong. Don't give in to this nasty, insane husband. Gather all that evidence. Find legal counsel. Try to get child support worked out. If it's applicable and would help your case, inform your legal people of the fear, humiliation, and pain he's subjected you to. That is ABUSE. This will get worked out. For the time being, do you have ANY girlfriends who can let you crash at their place? Or do they know anyone who could give you shelter? If not, are you on good terms with any neighbors? Help is generally there for people who ask for it, you might need to ask the most unlikely of people. Much love and keep us informed!
Also, it's your business, but I don't believe you need to confront him at any time. Continue gathering evidence, get things in order, find a place you can go, and just LEAVE. It's generally never, ever a good idea to confront a man like this about something this serious. Never confront people (or threaten). Just do what you were going to do to begin with, and he won't know what hit him. It's not only about safety, but making sure he won't have too much time to cause trouble or counteract you.
Don't worry about sneaky. This is self preservation time. Nobody expects you to forget the last 9 years, but set it aside the best you can. This is for your kids. You need to get set up in the best situation you can. If you were without kids, you could blow it off, get a job at Walmart, and scrape by in a low-rent dive until things come together. Well, with two kids, that won't cut it, and it would set them up in a situation very hard to get ahead in. If your father-in-law is the landlord, how long can you stay in his house before getting evicted? In many locales, if you pay no rent, it could take months to get an order to get you out. Meanwhile, there might be a court order for your husband to pay, and they'd have to go after him for it. To me, this is a plus. And, how great does it look turning your grandkids out in the street? Your husband needs to fork out the rent for this the same as he would for rent on any other digs. You need to dig in on it like you would in any other place, owned or rented. You need all kinds of legal advice now--and as much info as you can gather on food stamps and other aid. Don't be shy--dig deep on your rights. My mom went easy on her divorce, and her kids paid the price for it. Know everything you can about your position. Be calm and factual and as unemotional as possible before you bring this up with your husband, as matter-of-fact and non-confrontational as possible. Everything you have on him should be in a safe deposit box, with backups at a friend's house. You should be square on your feet when you do this. Solid as a rock. You do not need to rile him or do anything in vengeance. Well-thought out solutions already in place to protect your kids.
Sunshowers said (posted while I was posting):That is best if he or his parents might turn out to be actually violent. But, two things. In the U.S. now, most courts will not let you leave the county that your husband lives in. And, since he owns no house himself, he is mobile, and could easily follow you. It's a critical question here whether he might be violent. If he's not, I'd be a squatter in that house. Don't give that up without a great reason. Scraping by is no great life for the kids.
***** I AM CANADIAN!!! ***** Sorry, couldn't resist, it was in a beer commercial up here for the longest time. I just thought I'd add that. U.S. Family Law Rules are not the same as here but the general legal advice is mostly good. Here the Divorce Act is Federal/Nationwide so different State advice may or may not help. I definitely do know I need to think about contacting a lawyer. Having worked with them, I might just go to my old coworker for general advice before pursuing anything. Unfortunately, I don't have friends I can stay with. There are no rooms available in any of their Inns, as many of them are still younger and unmarried, without kids. The married ones with kids have cramped enough houses of their own to deal with. I could be wrong but from memory, I believe you have to give a tenant sixty days (though it could be thirty) if evicting them for non-payment of rent where I live. I don't see my FIL, forcing me out immediately but I do see my husband refusing to leave. His thinking is, "My dad's house, I'm the only one paying the rent right now so you go somewhere else." We almost separated a few years earlier (which I see now are probably related to my reasons for leaving now) and he had that attitude then. I don't think he's changed any since in that regard. I feel like a fool for not having the strength then to heed his advice. Instead, we reconcilled and our marriage seemed to be really good, until recently when I wrote in the first time.
------------------------------------------- Just as I finished that last sentence, speak of the devil, my father-in-law called and was in my driveway to pick my son up (not expected) for a weekend visit/trip to the fair with the rest of my in laws. I was doing good holding my composure in front of my son but now that I don't have to, I don't know if I can pretend tonight. The first thing that crossed my mind while packing my son's clothes is that I could talk to him since our son won't be here for at least a few days. I'm not religious (unlike my cheating husband who's Catholic), but if there is a deity, I could really use some strength right now to not get loose lipped tonight. I know people are saying not to confront him (either indefinitely or just for now) and it's probably the wisest thing to do but knowing me when I get really emotional about something, things get said. I really, really, really hope I don't lose my cool. I'm so angry and sad at the moment that I don't want to give this baby his last name, nor have him in the delivery room with me. Not because I want to alienate him but because I really don't want him there supporting me and pretending to be a good husband. I'd rather be alone because that's exactly how I feel. Anyway, he doesn't come home from work until about 8:30 pm so that leaves me about 4-5 hours to play detective some more. I'm not sure if I wrote this already but he gets off work at 8:00 pm. It's only a 10 minute drive to our house from his work. If he comes straight home, he's always here at 8:15 pm - 8:30 pm if he stops and gets gas. One thing that set me off on my snooping escapade is that the day before I found the car seats reclined for no reason, he came home at 10:00 pm from work. He did buy groceries and a board game for our son after work that night. I don't know what made me look when I was putting the food away but I checked the time on the receipts and the store he bought the game from's check-out time only read 8:10 p.m. and the grocery store receipt read 8:29 p.m. That meant he was off doing something else for about an hour-and-a-half. Coming home late combined with the reclined seats made me think that every time he comes home late at night with groceries, it's just a cover for something much less domestically inclined.
^ If he had intercourse in the car then it should either smell like sex or strongly of air freshener. Of course, a lack of either odor doesn't rule out a blow job, or just fooling around.
That's why I specified U.S. laws. Because I don't know if they are similar in Canada. Also, nothing I say is legal advice--just a little info. The advice is, you need to see a lawyer. Edited by - lindi on 8/17/2012 5:30:28 PM
Please, please get legal advice BEFORE you 'confront' the husband. Just because he tells you to leave, doesn't mean that you have to. Talk to the Residential Tenancy Branch for your province (I don't know where you are). Once you occupy a residence, you are a tenant, probably even if your name is not on the lease. You need to ask. Again, I don't know your province, but CALL THEM. They are very nice in B.C. If the rent is paid (and assuming you are not in violation of the laws or bylaws), you cannot be evicted in B.C. for any reason other than the landlord is moving in a first degree relative of his, or the landlord is selling the property. If you have a court order for your husband to leave, and for him to pay the rent, then the husband would leave, and HE would be the one in default on the rent. At this point, by law, he may have no more right to be there than you do. You are both tenants. You must ask. Please call. Once you leave the premises to establish a residence anywhere else (even a temporary stay in a hotel may qualify if your intent was to leave), you are no longer a current resident of the property and you lose any rights that you had. Even if a landlord gives you 60 days notice on unpaid rent, if you stay, it may take months to proceed on an eviction after the 60 days, and you have time to get an order for your husband to pay. You buy time. Do not give up any of your options. You must know what they are. Mistakes are costly. It is vital not to proceed with your husband until you have a fair footing, and know what your situation is, with all your options. If you have friends in family law, this is the time to call in all your favors.
“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09
Posted - Aug 17 2012 : 6:09PM
After reading most of the posts since mine. Here's my take and suggestions. Caveat: It's in Canada, I don't know systems, laws or anything. If my grandmother still had a residence near Canada I'd let you there, but I had to bury her (cause my scumbag father refused to do this) so I can't help you . I will recommend this. 1). Whenever there is a a destitute person, esp. clean/okay, I've heard of many churches helping out people in crisis like this temporarily even longer. I recommend you just go to some churches and ask head (priest) for help (shelter). I know there are shelters run by churches in US exactly for this stuff, so I'm sure there's some in Canada (culture different but religion tenants same). The heavier populated areas the better, more churches, more resources. If you find one near in a bigger pop, and priest/charity agrees to take you on, just move to this place. Also, look for charities who help in these things. Look for government help too. 2). Collect evidence. I've taken forensic toxicology and you can't have enough evidence an never know what thing will help. I'd be stealthy as possible, but if you have a key point of evidence you need and can't be stealthy, get it but use social engineering tactics (it works, hackers have perfected it). 3). Do simple CI (Counter Intelligence) like clearing your web history, cookies... Last thing you need for him to know what you are up to. Don't go crazy, just major computer, browser stuff, and hide evidence you collect in a safe place (like suggest above - safe deposit box with 2 people required to open (bank employee and you have keys). Dont' let him know about your safe box or where you are going (i.e., churches). 4). This is a time to be smart and suppress emotions. The smarter you are, the best outcome out (which might not be high, but most optimal) will happen. Don't let him know, continue to collect evidence. 5). Make sure he's not endangering your kid or you and draw a line if it happens (abuse). I grew up in verbal and physical violence parents/house and still have PTSD. It's a lot of responsibility and work, but there is hope, my mom made it and only reason why her kids (me and sibs) are somewhat psychologically functional. All this is not ideal and even if you make mistakes, just remember the goal, stick to your plans. Your solid and there is hope and many in same situation who did it, you just have to do the hard part and do it. PS If any questions, just post here and ppl will give you advice. Edited by - BYOB_Kenobi on 8/18/2012 8:10:20 AM
Just leave him and take him to the cleaners. I don't suggest keeping his kid from him though. That's worst for the child in the long run. Unless he'll hurt the kid of course!
To the OP: I want to do some degrading things to you too. Not as bad as your hubby, stuff that you are ok with is fine, I love pregnant girls. I can't get you pregnant and I can drink your milk
I wasn't trying to be facetious Lindi, so I hope you weren't offended but I was feeling silly at the time and also like that commercial lol. Today has been such an emotional roller coaster and I haven't slept a wink since Wednesday night so there's that too, and am still running on yesterday's granola breakfast because when upset, I don't eat. I feel like I'm going crazy. I've laughed at dumb shit and made dumb jokes, cried and wanted to throw things, felt numb, felt angry, felt sad and now I'm back to numb. Earlier, I printed off one of his profiles with the emotionally-driven intent of leaving it on his desk along with a letter but writing the letter was therapeutic enough to prevent me from doing so. I am back to thinking more rationally for now and have gathered a bit more dirt on him and I feel nothing at the moment so I think I'll be able to keep my mouth shut for at least one more day. You've given me much appreciated suggestions and I'm thankful for your support! I live in Ontario and will definitely look into what applies here that is similar to BC. My pride is against going on welfare. Even during my lay off, (since last year), I worked (under the table) doing any kind of work until I was six months pregnant whilst looking for a job. If I only had enough hours through legitimate work, during my pregnancy, I'd qualify for maternity leave benefits and wouldn't be in such a conundrum. Still, I called Ontario Works (our welfare agency) and they told me that I don't qualify for any benefits so long as he and I are cohabiting together due to welfare fraud cases where women claim to be single mothers (makes sense but sucks for people like me). I am also really considering, if possible moving across the province to be with my Aunt. I don't want to uproot my son but I also have no real means of support outside of that or staying and being cheated on and really giving my husband the sexless marriage that he's claimed. I definitely do expect a full on battle for custody if I pursue this though. My lawyer buddy isn't at the office again until Mid September (when I'm due) but I will contact him as soon as he's back and hopefully he'll be of some assistance to me. Thanks again for your support. The idea to stow away the evidence is a smart one for sure. I don't know about the safety deposit box but I'm going to scan or save what I can in a new email account and send other documents to my Aunt for safe-keeping. What I need to get a hold of is more of his financial information. I have a feeling that he'd understate his income to the courts when we get there in order to minimize his payments. Given his line of work (sales and real estate) he could definitely lie about his commissions. Also, I found another credit card I didn't know about and it's nearly maxed out. Scary stuff!
Suppressing my emotions is definitely going to be one of my hardest challenges... even more than re-establishing myself but you are absolutely right! All of the sleuthing/evidence gathering, I'm surprisingly good at. It turns out, I know my way around a computer more than I thought. Suppress emotions, remember the goal, stick to my plans shall be my new mantra. Thanks very much for replying to me, every answer has been very valuable and is helping me to focus. When on task, I feel like Uma Thurman in Kill Bill, just much, much less stabby! :D When emotions are high, I think I'm more like Taz from the Looney Tunes. I've been a combination of both today. Luckily for me, I have my own laptop. The only thing I needed to do is change my password because unlike him, I was open about that too. I found all of the stuff on his, it took some reading, downloading, installing and hacking work, but I got his password to his laptop and then the rest via his Internet history and saved passwords in his browser. It turns out he uses pretty much the same password for everything. As long as I am stealthy, I'm pretty sure he'll keep his passwords the same which in turn will make it easier to keep tabs on his infidelity. Everything I've saved to my computer is zipped, encrypted, hidden and inconspicuously named. I picked that tip up last night via Google, so I'm confident he won't get to it if he does hack my computer. The man's not savvy enough to clear his own cache, I don't think he has an ice cube's chance of finding what I have on him. I am locking up all the hard-copy stuff in my filing cabinet for now until I can get it to either my Aunt's or a friend's. He doesn't have the key to it but then again I've never had a reason to lock it so I am a little worried that it may make him suspicious and plan to get it out of the house as soon as I have it organized. My son is observant enough to notice if I'm going through his dad's things so all of my detective work must be done when both are out of the house. Edited by - indigoviolets on 8/17/2012 8:14:40 PM
“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09
Posted - Aug 17 2012 : 9:01PM
To sum up my responses. 1). Although we all admire pride and no accepting help, everyone needs help from time to time. If my mother didn't get help from certain programs, we wouldn't have gotten essential things and outcome would probably be worse. Accepting help thru churches, charities, groups, gov... isn't a bad thing or nothing to be ashamed of and often can help down the road result in a shitty outcome or good outcome. 2). Although you have it encrypted (great job I commend you, no), you need to create a backup of all the stuff and put it in a different place. Preferably safety deposit box (these are good cause no one can force you under direct threat to cause both you and bank teller have to open the box together). Also having a backup in a different safe box, can add a layer of deniability (rubberhose type) - if he finds the first, you just act/say that's all you have. How can he know you have another? When you are talking about legal evidence, being I won't say arrogant, but not diligent (backup or really safe-box) is risking everything, including verdict and outcomes. The 2nd needs to be stored not at your current place or any place you will be living. Another reason a bank deposit is a great idea. 3). To me (I could be wrong), ideally you want everything in place, so when the time is right (not let him in on it til then) tell him (not about evidence). Make sure when you final reveal, you are in a public place or have people around in case he flips out. Don't tell him you have evidence (he will look for it and do other things, he might even blackmail you for it) until you are in legal process, have a lawyer and preferably about to go to court or in court. This is just my advise, it's your path, but I've had some experience.
I didn't take offense at all. BYOB has some good points. People pay taxes all their lives--apply for whatever aid you can. That's what the rest of us pay it for, too. Think of it as taking care of your kids. A safe deposit box can be had for around $45 a year. That is a very good investment against your laptop being destroyed or any other mishap, and against him doing anything to get at the evidence. He just can't get at it, and that's that. Consider a burner phone if you can't clear out the record of numbers you called, or call from a friend's house. He shouldn't be able to find out that you are calling legal aid and so forth. Having other people with you when you confront him is good. Do not tell him what evidence you have. Stay calm. Don't go for getting him angry. Keep him calm, and present solutions for how to make this work out well for him, you, and your kids. Meanwhile, as much as possible, have some distractions while your son is gone so you can minimize the time alone with the husband while you are not ready to proceed with this. Have a night out with your friends, or have friends over. Feel sick and go to sleep. Take an evening seminar on how to cook his favorite dish. Have someone call on the phone with a big problem and keep you tied up. If you have reasons to go out for the night, he might even welcome it as a chance to fool around while you are gone. Stay arm's length from him as much as possible, so you can get in a mode of being able to stay cool and wait. Edited by - lindi on 8/17/2012 9:32:56 PM
Do you have anything resembling a heart? Or a sense of gentlemanly concern? I understand you're a red-blooded, horny male, but you're talking to a pregnant woman in a dire, scary position.
Wait! SunShowers this was me having a heart: Posted - Aug 17 2012 : 07:28:07 PM Just leave him and take him to the cleaners. I don't suggest keeping his kid from him though. That's worst for the child in the long run. Unless he'll hurt the kid of course! Maybe you missed this post?
“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09
Posted - Aug 18 2012 : 8:31AM
Excellent point. Try and work with him and make it amiable. Remember you are doing all this for your kids and your future. Don't worry about setbacks, nothings perfect. There is hope, many women have been in similar scenarios and outcome has worked out. That being said, this guy sounds a little like a wild card and definitely not trusted. Just make sure you don't allow any abuse to you or kids, and don't think you know him. For example, I said be in public place or around people (someone for witnesses, but more important protection - have a guy there at least), cause when you do final reveal, you cannot predict what a person will do (even many passive, nonviolent guys/ppl during final reveals have turned violent (even lethal) or abusive - many cases). He's already proven he's different than who you thought he was and you don't really know him. You really need to make a backup of your evidence if you are going to take him for court. As they say, if you only have one copy/source of digital files/evidence, you have 0 copies. Safe deposit box are for these things (many women use these to store evidence of cheating for husbands), cause 1). it's in a safe environment 2). you make an agreement with the bank listing who can access it (has a key) anyone else than you specify cannot get anywhere near them 3). having a bank teller (2 key system - see in movies) is great, cause it adds another layer, they will put key in you put yours in and turn then given box. No one can steal your key and your license and impersonate you and access it (banks aren't great at thoroughly checking IDs). I'll say it one more time to but from my story. Don't think it's shameful or you don't have pride if you ask/seek help from churches, charities, programs, or gov. Me and my siblings are proof. We would have not turned out anywhere near what we are today, solely because what she did to get help. I probably wouldn't have gone to college. I wouldn't have gotten free $100,000s of medical work, have food during rough times (pantries)... Remember you are doing it for your kids future. I know this is a lot and feel for you. You can do it and be hopeful, many women have successfully done this with great outcome. Just don't be naive and play it smart. Edited by - BYOB_Kenobi on 8/18/2012 9:35:03 AM
Actually, I thought this was the PERFECT place to seek help when my problems with my husband were just porn related. Being told that you are not overreacting about your husband's attitude's and treatment towards you sexually or his use of porn on a porn forum is pretty darn vindicating. I've been amazed and impressed with the high number of quality answers, support, advocacy and insight that I've gotten here. Who to better speak to about porn issues (when that was my main issue) than porn users? If they tell me he's taking it too far, I'm a heck of a lot more apt to believe them than if users of some religious or non-sex related website told me the same. You might think it's weird that I asked a question here but I think I came to the right place, have gotten a lot of good answers and have found many of the responses to be immensely helpful. Edited by - indigoviolets on 8/22/2012 1:26:34 AM
OKAY HERE'S ANOTHER UPDATE. It's going to be a long one. I am afraid to say that I couldn't follow the plan. I really wanted to but I couldn't control myself and I did end up confronting him. First though, I took my laptop to my friend's house and downloaded the files I created on him to her hard drive and left her the hard-copies of everything I had printed off in a filing cabinet at her house as well. I have found even more stuff that proves substance abuse and copies of nasty emails he's sent me in the past and I copied those have since sent those to her house as well. He doesn't know I did this so I am pretty sure it's all safe. She knows what's going on and I trust her completely to keep this safe. I fully plan on getting a safety deposit box but in truth - didn't have more than $5.00 on me to be able to do so at the time so this was/is the next best thing. To make a long story short (and what's happened since Friday makes for a long story), I confronted him a couple of hours after he came from work. I recorded our conversation and also had my Aunt on the speaker phone whenever we talked (it came in waves because he kept dodging, at first and storming off). When he came home on Friday, our son was already with the grandparents. He seemed to be in a good mood and was talking about how things are better for us/going to be easier this time around when we have a baby, we're in a better place now in our lives etc. etc. That's basically what set me off because I'm pregnant and emotional and know the truth and couldn't sit there for a second with his lies. Anyway, he went downstairs, I called him back upstairs and had one of his four profiles sitting on the coffee table all printed out. He spent a good hour denying and calling me crazy but I stood firm. Eventually (and this is the abridged version) he admitted to cheating online (but of course not in person) so confessed to having an emotional affair. He balled his eyes out and was apologetic at first and at one point even suggested couple's therapy to work through this. Later on in the evening though, he told me to shut up, he's sick of hearing about this and "that's it, I take it back. I'm not fixing shit!" and he stormed off and locked our bedroom door. I was through chasing him so we both went to bed alone. On Saturday (he had to work that day), I woke up to the sounds of him running in and out of the house, back and forth to the garage. I don't have a key to the garage. Basically, he took almost all of his personal effects out of the house (documents, computer, hard-drives, DVDs etc.) and locked them up, before driving to work. When he came home that night, he went back to our bedroom and began doing renovations. I may be naive but I'm not an idiot. I know that the reno was an excuse/cover to remove everything of his from the bedroom (which also doubles as his office). I have had laminate flooring stored under our stairs and sub-flooring in my living room since September 2009 that he hasn't put down and all of a sudden he got the urge to redecorate? Please! He gave me the silent treatment the rest of the night. He had work early on Sunday morning so I was still asleep when he left. When he came home on Sunday, I had been calling women's shelters and was still on the phone. Our provider is the magic jack ($10/year voip phone). We leave the jack plugged into the desktop PC (not his porn/cheating computer) at all times in order to have phone service. He and I both know that if you do anything else on that computer the magic jack cuts out/phone stops working. Anyway, I was talking to a woman at the shelter and all of a sudden the phone cut out. It turns out he plugged in his cellphone to listen to the radio while he knew I was on the phone. I got scared/paranoid because of the situation (he knew I was talking to someone about leaving and cut the phone off - damn right I felt scared! Even still, I confronted him about it. He told me he was leaving the phone off the hook, that all he had to do around here was listen to the radio from his cell now that he'd been hacked into by me so it's too bad if I want to use the phone. I completely lost my sh!t at this point. I don't think he's ever seen me as firm/strong and assertive to his face (inside I was scared that he was trying to prevent me from using the phone - that was bizarre IMO). I demanded he plug it back in. I told him he was preventing me from protecting myself and getting the resources I need and if he didn't plug it in, I was marching my ass next door and calling the cops. So he finally listened but then he started packing his clothes, got dressed and got ready to leave the house. I got on the phone with my Aunt at that time and told her what just happened because honestly, I don't know who the hell he is anymore and maybe it's paranoia but I am letting others know what's going on so they can have my back. Before he left, he came up to me with a wad of money in hand. He said he would give it to me but only with the condition that I signed his ridiculous contract, saying that he gave me money. I wasn't about to sign anything for him so I refused and he left without giving me a dime (no cab fare for an emergency or transportation to leave) BTW. I wrote his parents on Sunday night/Monday morning and let him know what he was doing. I didn't go into details but I told them enough. That I caught him with messed up porn, I caught him cheating and that he left me here without transportation or cash to get by for the next few days. I am not going to let him be the victim here. On Monday night before he got off work, he called and asked if I wanted to talk. I agreed. When he came home, he started blaming me for everything again. He was denying everything, the cheating, fights, sexual problems etc. So I had enough and I told him to leave. I have so much evidence on his ass right now (I didn't tell him that) and I can't sit here and be lied to/disrespected or talked down to anymore. As far as I'm concerned, we're done. I have gotten a lot of good advice from you guys and on a marriage advice forum, and I'm not letting him push me around anymore. He gave me money this time(no contract needed) before leaving though so that was good.
UPDATE PART TWO: His parents wrote me back - his brother did too. They believe some of what he says and some of what I say. Anyway, the parts that they believe me about are enough for them to do right by me. They all know I don't want him back - definitely not now without him seeing the light and getting help. I don't think he's abusive but the man's got issues and he's definitely hurtful to me in bed and emotionally. He's addicted to porn, and weird porn at that, has anxiety issues, is a dry drunk and is using other weird herbs... anyway, I'm going off topic. The man's got issues and is in denial about the issues. I'm not a shrink or going to label him but I don't need to stay with him either. I'll leave it at that and I'm not sticking around anymore. They've agreed to let him live with them so I can live alone and in peace. Better still, I can live here rent free until I have our baby and get on my own two feet. On Thursday, I have an appointment to get legal advice. On Friday, both fortunately/unfortunately I have an appointment with the intake person at the Ontario Works (welfare office). As far as I can tell, things look like they'll be okay. Not great, I am pregnant and my husband's a cheating sack of... and I'm very sad but really, if this is who he really is, I don't want him. I really do think I could use some counseling though. I don't think I'm normal for choosing someone like this in a mate... I'll get help, I hope he does too whether we're together or not. I am really grateful for all of the support/advice I've gotten on this board. Now I'm going to focus on this baby. It's supposed to be here by the 12th of next month. :O and on just picking up the pieces. I do hope to move into my own apartment, separate from him and his family. His family are good people but I don't think it's wise to live under the control of your soon-to-be-ex's family. Unfortunately, I'll probably live here until November 1st though so I can get first/last month's rent together for a nice place across town as well as furniture/other items. Also heal after having a baby (6-8 weeks recovery time).
Yeah, I kinda feared it would be impossible to keep quiet until you had everything lined up. You'd have to be superhuman. Anyway, it's good that he left and you are in the house. Also very good that his family is more or less on board with the plan. That keeps you somewhat stable, and his family knowing about things probably keeps you safer from your husband's possible retribution. I know you want to get a place of your own asap, but for now, that house is stable for you and your son, as long as your husband and in-laws treat it as your place, not theirs, and get permission before coming over. They may by far prefer to have you there, to having you take your son and go far away to your aunt's. If the dust settles and things get calm, it may be a good place to settle for a little while, if you can set up an amicable agreement with your husband. If you can all be very calm, it might be the best for some time. (With a new baby, you probably won't be having a serious relationship with another guy for a while, and that's when it would be a good idea to move elsewhere).
“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09
Posted - Aug 22 2012 : 3:54AM
Sorry to hear indigo about the news, but it was inevitable. You did a great job. Who knows I probably would go ape shit too if I found my SO cheating. Now get the evidence in a safe storage (Safe deposit box) and start the lawyer/legal proceedings. You did a really good job under all your stress and circumstances and the parents seem reasonable, so stay at the house and raise the baby. Since you'll be doing this on your own (?), you need financial, medical, psychological, logistical, gov, help please use it. We all know Canadian taxes are extremely high so they have to have some services to help you (lindi's quote). Look for charities, churches, and other groups for help in all areas. You probably do need counseling or psychological eval and treatment (don't be ashamed, I've had it). Doesn't the Canadian gov provide that free (from taxes)? I fully recommend you tell your primary care doc and then go for the psychiatrist and/or psychologist. Finally, if you only take/do 1 thing in this post from me, get the evidence in safe-box. Not sure about Canada laws, but it could be your entire future, custody, alimony, divorce outcomes. It's not secure at your aunt's house (not talking about your husband). Good luck. We support you.
Yeah, I had the same dismay about the lack of safe deposit box. But she said she only had $5 on her. Call around banks and credit unions and see how much they are. They seem to be a little expensive in Canada, but in the US one can be had for $15 a year (and it only takes about 15 minutes and a piece of i.d. to open one). Maybe the legal aid office or women's shelter has some set aside or something. Your evidence is not safe at someone's house, and you musn't make your friend unsafe by revealing where it is. You must also have backup copies of everything, even for what is in the safe deposit. (The bank tells you that the box is "fireproof" and it is--a fire cannot get in. What they don't tell you is that the box is not heatproof, and it is possible for the boxes to get hot enough for the papers inside to be destroyed). If you can keep a minimum of contact with the family members, and very peaceful, until everyone cools down, you can approach the conversation about the future calmly. Five years from now, ten years from now, where will you be? It is in the best interests of your kids, your in-laws and husband if you and the kids are secure and near them. If you can all envision five years out, you can see that none of you will want relationship drama, and you can all set that aside and find a way to create a secure environment for the kids to grow up.
I don't know if the OP still watching this topic or not, but I'll go ahead and see if I might be able to shed some light on why your husband (or ex-husband, at this point) is acting this way. First off, such a sudden, drastic change in sexual behavior is not at all a common occurence, even in adulterers. You were on to something with the sex addiction hypothesis, but something like that is a gradual process of progressively worsening behavior, not an abrupt 180 like you have described. I have three guesses: he is either abusing psychostimulants, or is in the earlier stages of bipolar, or both. Psychostimulants are notorious for fueling dangerous, often violent, sexual behavior, and this is even more so the case in someone with underlying psychological problems. These drugs also disrupt impulse control, which is why so many coke-heads are also gambling addicts. One problem some addicts face, though, is that stimulants are also notorious for causing impotence, which may explain the sudden interest in such extreme sexual acts - he may be trying frantically just to keep it up so he can continue to get himself off. With some addicts you see a shift from them desiring to have sex for intimacy or stress-relief to just another means to getting higher as they finally hit the drug's effect ceiling. The sexual aggression could also be the result of overproduction of cortisol brought on by chronic abuse. If this were the case, though, he would be aggressive in general with everyone around him. Finally, he would be having major sleeping and eating difficulties. While he could mask the sleeping problem with downers, it is very difficult to force yourself to eat if your on stimulants. If he has lost a significant amount of weight, that is a pretty clear indicator of stimulant abuse. The early stages of bipolar mania are very similar to what I describe above. One difference, however, is that stim-users only feel good when they're high, while manics are high all the time. There are exceptions of course, but I would need more information on how he is on an average daily basis. Regardless of the cause, I am really sorry that this has happened to you. I went through something similar with my father (except for the porn thing) who had a psychotic break after abusing adderall, which he obtained legitimately from a doctor who turned out to be a pill-miller that eventually got arrested. My dad was and is good person, but these drugs can really turn you into a monster that destroys everything around them, even the ones they love. Edited by - bandini21 on 11/29/2012 10:22:30 PM
I am very sorry what you are going through, but you can't seriously blame porn for what happened to you can you? Throat gaggers I am unaware of, but the title says the jist, Max Hardcore (seriously vanilla porn in my opinion), also never heard of motherless flicks. As a guy who enjoys watching Max Hardcore films, I don't think that they turn me into a sadistic cheating asshole who treats women like shit.
What is it that makes you like Max Hardcore? I'm a woman who watches porn, but Max really is a cut above on the mysogynist asshole stakes. His stuff is really about abusing women. About power, domination and degredation without informed consent. And yes, I do know what informed consent is.
I would suggest a new husband, he seems like a complete douche and you deserve better! A lot of abusive relationships start in the bedroom and you never know what it could escalate to...I think ending the marriage is the best idea but do so when you feel you and your children are safe, you can always find a new husband and in-law family but you cannot replace your own life or childrens lives.
