There was one scene I remember, though, in Prague Rising, where Jon Eric and some super hunky euro stud were fooling around. At then end, they laid side by side on the bed, and jerked each other off to climax. It was so freakin hot!
Here's a little [ invalid url ].

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I won't be so foolish as to boycott these scenes, though. I'm afraid my facial boycott fell flat on it's splooge-covered face, leaving me little porn to watch.

That reminds me Joe, I've been saving up some nice DP screenshots for you, from the 'straight' titles I've viewed, I know how much you like those.

Speelie,
While I wouldn't mind seeing more of Hakan, I find Rocco to be even more of a turn off, so I don't think that's the answer for me, but thanks.
I can see why some men would enjoy his movies - he seems to constantly have his dick in some girl's throat and another sucking on his ass, but why would most females?

So, Herschel Savage is it?

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You're probably right about the guys working too often. These days, guys performing little other than assembly-line sex scenes (IMHO merely videotaped physical labor -- not real, loving, caring sex), and who-knows-how-many scenes a day, many of them are lucky to be able to get halfway hard, much less come, without intense physical support from their hand! The old, telltale cutaway to some guy's face, pretending like he's just about to come, probably bridges the gap of who-knows-how-many minutes it's taken him to jerk himself off to the point of being able to unload a few drops!

Herschel Savage is most definitely not the only one -- he's just a holdover from an earlier breed of porn performer who's still going strong! Don't know how you feel about them in general, but I'd suggest a trip down memory lane -- getting in touch with some of the classics! True, the older titles may have less sex per minute of running time, but at least they're not wall-to-wall full of "Hi! Let's fuck!" scenes, with the obligatory five or six positions, gaping whatevers and obviously faked orgasms. Instead, there are actual set-ups, some attempts at character, motivation and plot, and many more instances of people looking like they're (1) really enjoying what they're doing and (2) getting off on each other !

You want an extreme example of a guy in a sex scene who doesn't need his hand to get off? Try Platinum Paradise, from 1980. There's a scene in this one where Vanessa Del Rio uses only a feather to get Eric Edwards erect, then gets him off with her mouth without even touching him -- she literally talks him into an orgasm! How's that for concentration and control!

Seriously, try some of Edwin Brown/Durell's stuff, like "Every Woman Has a Fantasy 1 & 2," "Dreamgirls," "Naughty Girls (Need Love, Too)" and "1001 Erotic Nights, Parts 1 & 2." Real eroticism and excellent, realistic sex!

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On the "working too much front", absolutely - and I mention no names but E. Everhard knows who I mean - these guys are getting conditioned by the process.

Personally I kind of prefer to see facials, but to create at least the illusion of spontaneity and excitement some variety is preferable.

If we are gonna get icky and sticky over technical detail, the pop shot is often very much stage managed with the guy in control(of course things can go awry quite readily even with this set-up too!)to make sure it goes where it's supposed to, say for a facial. This of course leads to those endless shots of a guy tediously pounding till he pops - and I mention no names but M. Davis knows who I mean - which could readily be alleviated with smarter editing, and I DON'T mean showing the guys "come face". Just cut it, show the girls, anything is preferable to a straining harrassed stud.

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You've got to be into rough sex and/or D&S, at least as something that sometimes turns you on, to like Rocco as a female I'd guess. But I think a lot of women who actually like gonzo porn DO like those things sometimes.

As far as your pud pulling climax complaint goes, I haven't focused on exactly that side of it much, but a related one.

I'm sick of all the external cumshots. Yeah, I would be real bumed if there weren't quite a few of them, but I want LOT's of internals also!! Internal vag, internal ass, and internal mouth. Then lets see it ooze out, cream pies, and all that. YEAH!! Because you see I want to see the guy COMING IN THE WOMAN. Which I think is pretty related to what you're saying.

I'd MUCH rather see the guy coming in a woman's mouth, and her either swallowing it or oozing it around, her lips and face, than have it splatter by his own hand job for the last few moments onto her face. As Speelie says, Rocco does do lots of this. But so do most of the Euros.

It always seems to be REAL hard to find internal vag and ass cum shots though. That's a real "specialty item". Go figure.

What I'd also like to see a whole lot more of is hot possessive kissing while deep into fucking. That's another true rarity.

Edited by - dexplorer on Sep 24 2001

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greybeard,
I have tried some of the older titles for the reasons you say, and I would agree that they are much more to my liking.(except for the hairy pussies..which I know is weird, especially since I didn't start shaving mine until about 4 years ago)
Although I usually don't care much for plot, I've found the sex on its own to be much hotter. That Platinum Paradise sounds fascinating, my god..are you sure there were no cuts or anything? That's amazing! I occasionally have one in my sleep..you know, I wake up with my hands underneath my pillow, but to actually have one while you're being filmed no less, is astounding. Either that, or she is one heck of a dirty talker, lol. thank you for the suggestions!

Gabriel Nine,
"Nooo don't look at Herschel!!!!!!"
LOL! Believe me, I'd rather not - so I WILL check out Christoph Clark, thanks a lot.

dexplorer,
"Quite a few of the more gonzo type females do like him I think dumblonde."

That's cool - that's why I said 'most', it's just not my cup of tea, but I agree wholeheartedly with the rest of your statement, and I think you hit the nail on the head - we just need some more VARIETY, damnit!

quote: "What I'd also like to see a whole lot more of is hot possessive kissing while deep into fucking. That's another true rarity"

Tell me about it! Woo hoo!! It's just weird. Simple stuff, is now considered an oddity.

Well, I was hoping Mike Quasar, when he's through shooting today, might come by as well, and shed some light on this 'festering' problem in American porn today.
Mike Quasar, are you out there? Are you working these guys 'too hard'? lol

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Then I started to figure it out.

What I want are plot devices, without plot complications. I want a mood, a setup. I want the sex to be full of mind games, and not just body games. I have no interest in porno in anything other than sex, ultimately. But I want the sex to involve the mind.

A series that has the plot, or plot setup thing down right, as far as I'm concerned is the Buttman series. It's almost never just plain unintroduced fucking. There's some introduction to the girls, and some supposed way they end up being penetrated by (often) Rocco's dick. There's some mind stimulation, usually about them being easy pickups, involved. I want much, much more of this!!! I don't mean always the Buttman sort of setup, I mean mind games or setups with the fucking, but forget plot twists and turns!

For example, in a porno about cheating, I want the guy who is sleeping with someone else's wife to be playing with that in her head. "You never get enough at home, do you?" Or, I'm better than him, aren't I. I know you love him, but you love fucking me MORE, don't you?" And she agrees. Or … "Do you feel guilty? You do, don't you? You nasty whore. You have to do this don't you? What a bitch you are. I love that in you, filthy bitch." Or "You like this? You want this again? You want to see me again? You're going to come to me as soon as I call you aren't you? Yes? Yes? I mean you'll drop whatever you're doing? Make some excuse? If you're eating dinner with your husband and I call you on your cell, you'll come to me? Right away? Oh yeah, nasty woman. Nasty. You're hot."

Like that. Or whatever. I don't care about any particular formula, let them be creative.

I want VASTLY more hot talking. PLAYING WITH EMOTIONS WHILE FUCKING.

Edited by - dexplorer on Sep 24 2001

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Along with the Edwin Brown/Durell (first one name, then switched to the other) flix (some still only on VHS,sorry) I mentioned to Dumblonde, I've got three directors for you to check out -- Henry Paris/Radley Metzger (of course), Alex de Renzy and Anthony Spinelli.

De Renzy's series of "loops" in titles like "Ball Busters," "Wild Things 1 & 2," "Passions" and "Girlfriends" are just what you're looking for! 10 to 15 minutes per sequence, 5 or 6 sequences per tape, complete with setup, situation and hot, well-shot sex! If you can get copies, also try "Hot Pink 1 & 2," each is a "greatest hits" comp for de Renzy.

Anthony Spinnelli was one of the best directors of character-driven, plotted porn. He did the original "Talk Dirty to Me" and its first sequel, "Nothing to Hide." His stuff with Jesie St. James ("Easy" and "Vista Valley PTA") is excellent, as is an early one of his, "Portrait of Seduction."

Another director suggestion would be Howard Ziehm, another "king of the loops." Only problem is that none of his stuff is available on DVD, and somewhat hard to find on VHS. Plus, what there is suffers from less-than-adequate transfers. Some of Jim Holliday's comps ("Top 25 Porn Stars," "Only the Best" etc.) feature Ziehm's best scenes. Classic stuff!

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Christoph does seem to vary the pop shots, anyway, and if it's him in the scene he'll sometimes just have the girl jack him off.

As to some of the other points, I do agree so much - whatever is in a movie, I want to see passion, excitement, variety. Hot kissing is an under rated commodity in porn. To me it just adds that edge, especially to a girl-girl scene where all too often they do that tongue flicking which is so unnatural.

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Thanks so much for your suggestions.

As it happens, I have Anthony Spinelli's Vista Valley PTA on my self (as part of a sizeable bushel of DVD's recently arrived). Easy was already part of my next bulk order list. Talk Dirty to Me also looks real interesting.

I just found out about Alex DeRenzy recently. I think I'm going to get Pretty Peaches and maybe Babyface on VHS from Alpha Blue Archives. Since it seems like it's likely to be a mighty long time before they see DVDs, given their somewhat incorrect few scenes, I gather. What do you think? I don't know whether I'll get his Femmes de Sade, also available at ABA, or not. That one looks really over the top. I doubt I'd really enjoy it, at least in an erotic sort of way. But it might be interesting. Well, I think not right away. Thoughts? (

In the area of his 80's "loops", under that other name he was using, your suggestions seem really interesting. Ball Busters, Wild Things 2 and Girlfriends all are available on DVD at good prices. (Weirdly, Wild Things 1 seems not to be on DVD yet.) Passions isn't on DVD, but is available for about $10 on tape. I wonder if that one is coming over? Well, I guess pass on that for now. An 80's deRenzy that I just read was supposed to be real good (at the SF Spectator) is Slave to Love. Have you seen that one? So far it seems to only be available as an expensive tape -- although it is rentable over the net at Blue Door. I couldn't find his "best of" comp tapes Hot Pink 1&2, anywhere.

As for Henry Paris, well, I've got The Opening of Misty Beethoven in my bushel of unseen new arrivals, and Barbara Broadcast is on my next buy list. That's about it on DVD isn't it?

As for Edwin Durrell -- it looks like only Every Woman Has a Fantasy 1&2 is on DVD. Do you think that's likely to be up my alley, or more up Blondie's? (Not that we don't significantly overlap, so far as I can tell!) <gg>

Thanks again.

Edited by - dexplorer on Sep 25 2001

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The three Spinelli titles you mentioned are all excellent, IMHO. I'm sure you'll enjoy them! (Remember, in these, as in almost all the real "classics," you'll find untrimmed bushes, or, as the French would say, pussy "au naturale" -- be prepared!

Pretty Peaches and Baby Face (in their undedited form) are worth having in anyone's collection -- they're both undisputed classics! You're probably right about "Femmes De Sade" -- it gets pretty rough, and there's lots of "mistreatment" of both males and females! If that's your thing, fine. If, like me, it isn't, I'd avoid it.

De Renzy's "loop" pictures, like "Ball Busters," "Passions," etc. were the first things I thought of in response to your initial post about plots, setups and dialog. I think "Wild Things 1" had not only some pretty rough B&D and Dominance stuff in one scene, it also had a scene featuring pre-18 Traci Lords. Take both of those out and you've got a real skimpy running time. Maybe that's why is hasn't shown up on DVD yet. I'm puzzled by your using the phrase "that other name" in relation to these "loop" features. I believe they were always known as being done by de Renzy, under his BluPix label. I really don't know when he started using Rex Borsky for some of his stuff -- I always thought it was when he started doing the anal series for Rosebud. I could be wrong.

Don't know anything about/have never seen "Slave to Love," so I'm of no help there. (Anybody else??) Sorry you couldn't find the "Hot Pink" titles -- maybe try again, looking for "The Best of Alex de Renzy 1 & 2."

As far Henry Paris/Radley Metzger, his first hardcore feature, "The Private Afternoons of Pamela Mann" has just been released on DVD by VCA. See if XRentDVD is still having their VCA sale -- better (and easier) yet, use ADT's Price Search! That makes three of his classics out on DVD, with, I'm told, "Naked Came the Stranger" in the works. Keep a lookout for any of his stuff -- you can't go wrong!

"Every Woman Has a Fantasy 1 & 2," while excellent "couples" pictures, are also extremely well done and extremely HOT. In the first one, John Leslie and Rachel Ashley are outstanding playing a couple who has sex naturally, openly and with obviously real affection for one another. Both pictures definitely have strokeable material! Be forewarned about some editing in #1 -- they had to cut out Kristara Barrington completely -- an underage thing -- so there are some jumps and also some enlarged scenes so they could remove her from the frame. If you can find an unedited VHS, you'll enjoy it even more!

Hope all this helps!

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Wild Things #1 and Wild Things #2 are both out on dvd (released by Nutech), and have been for quite some time.
I rented #1 and the only thing I noticed being edited out was Traci Lords (if she appeared in the original, I never saw the original so I can't really say). I'm pretty sure everything else was left intact. There is a scene at the beginning where 2 chicks from prison break out and force a dude to fuck them, this scene is intact on the disc. As for anything else being edited out, I could not really tell you because as I said earlier, I did not see the original.

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Check out the Seymore and Shane series (mid 90's). Shane (and others) regularly do it to Seymore, sans any auto stimulation. We can always count on the adorable Shane doing this for Seymore though. (She's WAY different in this series than in her own Shane's World. And way better (as a performer) if you ask me. I guess that's probably incorrect, but I find it unavoidable!)

E.g., in Seymore and Shane Mount Tiffany, in the first scene Shane does a delicious and affectionate BJ while the pair are leaving LA enroute to Vegas, for a porn awards ceremony.

BTW, mounting Tiffany Towers would not normally be my exact fantasy (to say the least), but on recommedations I gave this one a try and it's GREAT. So actually is Tiffany. She is really pretty, and really expressive, sexy, despite the cartoon world she has made of her chest. It's actually so extreme that one can view it as a phenomenon. Which is rather the Seymore and Shane approach, beneath the just overhwelming and attractive friendliness which permeates this series.
It's both hands on the wheel ALL the way blondie!!!

You'll be chuffed to hear!

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"It's been as much a priority in my life to avoid Herschel Savage as it has been to avoid an IRS audit so I'll have to take your word for it that he is capable of "hands-free" orgasm. You are correct about the "Euro-studs". Not only can many of them ejaculate without manual manipulation but they can do it while lying on a bed of rusty nails immersed in carbolic acid.Their American counterparts are not nearly as adept in the ways of sexual performance. My first instinct is to suggest that perhaps excess consumption of Viagra deadens the penile tissue making it necessary for the performer to "finish himself off" but your example of Herschel Savage earlier shoots this theory out of the water. It is also possible that due to the enormous amounts of THC coursing through the corpuscles of the average American male porn performer that the penis itself is too stoned to function as God intended it to. I honestly have no real answer for you. In all fairness, there may actually be some performers out there who are capable of orgasm directly from sex but Directors and camera people such as myself are on a tight schedule and we simply can't wait around to find out."

Thanks Mike Quasar, but I just don't know how much longer people will put up with this before demanding something be done, or risk losing much of the viewership to the Euro-studs. Or am I making too much of this? It seems to be worse than I originally thought, and perhaps my eyes were deceiving me about Herschel as well. I'm not advocating the elimination of anyone, but how about finding some new THC free talent, just for something different?

dexplorer, cool, I'll check that out

Ridin' down the highway
Goin' to a show
Stop in all the byways
Playin' rock 'n' roll

IT'S A LONG WAY TO THE TOP
(if you wanna rock and roll)
AC/DC

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It's been my experience that the director and the female talent (in most cases) share the blame in this. I can't count the number of times the director will tell the man I'm doing to jack off on my- insert body part here-, and when I speak up and say that I'd like to make the guy cum (cause I love to do just that), the answer is almost always we don't have time, or it'll be easier this way. I have been on sets where the female talent thinks it's not their job to get the guy off... with that kind of attitude, it's a wonder the boys can even get it up! BTW, Herschel and I have done several scenes together and in each and every one I was the one doing the jacking

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Well, as I've said above, I wish it didn't always or nearly always have to be an external cum shot at all. Instead do a closeup of the cum oozing out of her cooze!! Or her gape! Or her lips. A good part of the time anyway.

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