I love most of Evil angels stuff, but a lot of the directors/performers are just not skilled enough to light and shoot. I cant stand the constant camera moves,overexposed lighting, and the cameraman hitting the mic 200 times per scene. Dont get me wrong the scenes are good enough, but I would love to see a more skilled director working at Evil Angel.
What would you consider"outside the box"? I just watched Big Wet Asses and there was 1 minute of tease on a white backdrop and immediately into the sex scene.
While Evil Angel is my favorite company, it's mostly due to they're the only company doing hardcore anal and ATM (my particular fetishes) and Belladonna doing her lesbian stuff. However, a disturbing trend I see is that they seem to be gradually moving more towards the abuse and away from any little eroticism that existed. They're basically becoming a cheap production gonzo company who happens to still be able to get beautiful women, but the movies are rapidly losing their appeal to me. As you pointed out, now the directors are talking through the movies, they have their hands in the frames. Too many are becoming something like this: 1) Fade in on sleazy dressed girl 2) slap her 3) spit on her 4) hit her some more 5) simulate drowning or choking. 6) Oh, almost forgot there needs to be some sex, so jam something huge in her mouth to make her gag and nearly puke and cause tears to run down her face, then jam something huge in her to make her gape for the camera. 7) slap her around and spit on her some more. 8) Oh been awhile since we choked her. Do that again. 9) fade out. 10) next scene So yeah, while Evil Angel is still my favorite company, they're going downhill rapidly. Even directors I once liked are going downhill rapidly in an effort to "out-abuse" the other guys. Take Belladonna's newer stuff...much more violent than her earlier stuff. Take Bitchcraft 3 and 4 (and I've pointed this out in the JM appreciation thread)....they are completely different than Bitchcraft 1 and 2. While 1 and 2 were focused on somewhat erotic lesbian sex, the last two are basically focused on abuse, with a little sex thrown in. I feel like I'm watching snuff movies rather than porn a lot of the time nowadays...and it's not a good feeling. I wish they'd go back to hot sex and lose the abuse. At least Christoph Clark still seems to be about the same as always. Despite him talking to the girls in some scenes, he still is creating some sexy work. That's my opinion...probably not worth anything. Edited by - evilmonkey on 8/25/2008 9:15:24 PM
[/quote] Big Wet Asses is from Elegant Angel. [/quote] I thought they were owned by Evil Angel. I feel this way about Manuel, Belladonna,Nacho, and Jay Sin. I have never seen the other directors work.
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Aug 25 2008 : 11:19PM
Nope. Elegant Angel is a different company. So in your last post, are you saying that you also think that Manuel, Bella, Nacho and Jay Sin shoot in the style of what you saw in Big Wet Asses?
[Link]
Tobin Deactivated User
450 Posts 11/07
Posted - Aug 25 2008 : 11:34PM
Man, I miss the days of Angela Summers. Pretty girls smiling and having fun. Weird that I would like that kinda stuff.
No, the only reason I brought it up was because I saw it yesterday and I thought the company's were related. Again, I like Evil Angels stuff.I would just like to see a more skilled director shoot some movies in the company's style.
Evil Angel has an all-star lineup of directors IMO. There's a reason they can charge a little more for their movies than other studios, and that reason can be described in one word. QUALITY
I totally agree on the lighting part. Especially Manuel Ferrera's scenes suffer from this.
[Link]
Taylor Von Bailey Deactivated User
2116 Posts 8/06
Posted - Aug 26 2008 : 12:32PM
I totally disagree with the OP and think Evil Angel has the best and most skilled directors out of everybody. Darkko is probably the best in terms of lighting and makeup and getting the best shots. Probably the best director in all of porn but he doesn't always shoot what I want to see the most - blowbangs. He does have his short-lived Wet Food series that is hot though. Jake Malone is an awesome director and Christoph Clark and Joey Silvera are pretty good too. I have no problem with their directors just wish they'd shoot more blowbangs! I love the rough sex that they produce with slapping and spitting and degradation...as long as the girls having fun and getting paid well what's wrong with it? Keep up the good work Evil Angel!
Well, EA works in the same industry as everyone else does. There are similarities between all porn but I've always found Evil to be a cut above. Everybody makes a few duds. Generally, the EA directors are where they are because they're capable of turning out stuff that is very hard to find. As long as I've been watching porn, an Evil Angel logo on a movie was always reassuring to me even if the box left some doubt. I have noticed problems with color and overexposure in all porn for as long as I've been watching porn. This is in no way limited to Evil Angel. If you haven't noticed it from other directors you must not be paying attention. This is not to say Evil couldn't step up the quality. Improvement is always possible. Just that I'm not sure it's fair to single them out when most studios are worse.
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Aug 26 2008 : 12:52PM
FB- Check out some of the trailers for Jonni Darkko, Raul Christian and Christoph Clark if you'd like on www.evilangel.com. The trailer for Jonni's next one, Pound Pussy, is listed on the right hand side.
Is there a way to get rid of this BritneyStares troll? I personally wish we would see more big butt BM/WF titles from Evil Angel. Those are lacking in my opinion and I have to go to West Coast Productions and Evasive Angeles mostly for those now.
I can't stand Jonni Darkko. Never saw anything from Harmony, Raul Cristian, Jay Sin, Gregory Dark nor Manuel Ferrara. How Brian Pumper got to be a director at EA, I can't understand it. I saw the trailer for "Juicy Latin Coochie" and you see him rapping, trying to look good in front of the camera more than you see the ladies/sex scenes. That is a shame. I know Santino Lee doesn't direct as much as he used to anymore, but I would have loved to see him direct for Evil Angel. Especially considering his "Waxxxin' Phat Asses" series; Santino Lee is like the "Black Buttman"! You have to see this series to see what I mean!
That's why I still don't understand why Evil Angel signed this guy since he obviously would rather stand behind a mirror instead of a camera!
[Link]
MikeSouth Deactivated User
511 Posts 11/02
Posted - Aug 26 2008 : 4:41PM
The fundamental problem with gonzo is the fact that the so called directors never really understood direction to begin with, now they have to shoot with HiDef Cameras and in 16x9 format and that multiplies their inadequacies by orders of magnitude. HD Cameras dont work that well on auto mode and 90% of these guys have no clue how to use it manually, 16x9 and larger consumer screens multiply the camera movement and the whole roving camera/dutch angle thing got old years ago but apparently nobody told the guys shooting in porn valley. Then you toss in the fact that nobody is doing anything erotic anymore, its not erotica its anger, aggression or at best going through the motions. As my friend Goddess noted Its either watching gay guys pretending to be straight or old guys pretending to be young. I used to enjoy porn, not anymore...these days its almost anti-erotic to me its a circus of dangerous or just plain idiotic acts. And yes I agree with the original poster. In the original Buttman movies it was obvious they were having fun...you dont see that amymore, nobody has fun, quite the opposite they are more likely to appear not to be having fun. Combine all this with lack of any real talent and or craftsmanship and well....this is what you get.
I never meant this to be an attack on Evil Angel. I used them as an example because I mostly watch there stuff. I LIKE IT. When I watch it I sometimes wish the skin tones would be correct or at least close, the camera would hold still for a full minute when its good, and the camera guy would stop hitting the fucking mic over and over again. I looked at Darkko's trailer for Pound Pussy and it looks good so I will try it out.
I absolutely agree. There are a lot of directors/companies whose picture quality has been turned to garbage. Evil Angel is still one of the best around. Also, if anyone is having color issues with Manuel's stuff, I find it actually comes out pretty good as long as you make some basic picture adjustments to your dvd player's settings. Color issues I can usually fix, but if shoots a movie with bad camera settings and everything comes out blurry, I can only take it out and pop in the next movie.
Jonnie Darkko's casting and his use of lighting as well as music has to be some of the best on the market. It seems as though we are moving into a much "softer" era of porn with the dominance of reality sites and whilst this is great it's also nice to see Evil staying true to their roots as hardcore pornographers. Although hardcore doesn't always have to envolve degradation and extreme dominance. If it's only technical issues you have with Evil directors check out Jules Jordan Video, their directors shoot similar content and have a decent idea how to use a camera.
Surely a generational gap, but I think this paints broad strokes over many different talents and contributors to the realm of modern porn. To the assertion noone seems to be having fun, or just going through the motions, I do not see. I understand many couplings, starlets, and production lines miss the mark and produce tepid, lazy product; yet I can't help but feel many directors, companies, and stars do nothing but add intensity, and a good deal of eroticism. This is truly harsh... who do you esteem? Do you have an opinion of a hyped up gal or director/cameraman? Something, please, to answer other than to have people take a blatant generalizarion to heart. We all have opinions, but I feel as though you've just criticised everything I may choose to enjoy. Not that it will stop me, but you cannot indict everything - really! My As always, opinions Edited by - MythMaker on 8/26/2008 10:45:46 PM
Half the people working in this business don't even use lighting when they shoot. A skylight or a nearby window is sufficient. I like to think of myself as technically superior to a lot of people out there but I also recognize that people don't jack off to HMI's and ellipsoidal patterns. Guys like Manuel shoot porn. It may be technically rough around the edges but it's better than 90% of everything else out there and last time I checked, this was the porn business. It's not supposed to look like Hollywood. Just my two cents.
And I've always been under the impression that "Big Wet Asses" was sort of shot like it is on purpose. Can't remember who started that line right now, but I do believe they shoot other stuff too.
Nice to see you reply Mike. I'm huge on F/F, but like a short setup and more hardcore eroticism than abuse. Hence I find myself consistently going back to Girlvana 2 (disc 2: The Bad Girls). Yes, I know you've made tons more movies, but that film pretty much fits my fetishes perfectly, and you're one of the few directors who seem to actually know what they're doing. Keep up the good work.[/brownnose]
In my view, Evil Angel is to pr0n what Cambridge University Press is to academic publishing. The only 'bad' titles in the Evil Angel catalog are those that don't appeal to my specific tastes. My only disappointment with the Evil Angel is that its sets such a high standard for excellence that not every scene in every title can match. (But, by gum, it is fun to watch the effort being made.) I believe that denigrating remarks about the directors and the talent tells us more about the commentator than about those being disparaged. Wait! I do have a second source of dissatisfaction with Evil Angel: bring back Service Animals!
[Link]
luvinIt912 Deactivated User
250 Posts 3/07
Posted - Aug 27 2008 : 8:53PM
After Evil Anal signed Jay Sin and Brian Pumper, I really question their taste. Elegant Angel has been running circles around them lately. Edited by - luvinit912 on 8/27/2008 8:54:01 PM
First off, while I respect everyone's right to like what they like,who ever said that you should like every release or director from a company. I've said it to Tricia and also here in the past, I think Evil Angel represents the platinum standard, not gold, platinum, for the industry. I may not like everything they do, but I think time has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that John Stagliano has exceptional taste and a real eye for talent. Directors seem to really step up their game at EA and it shows. They put out edgy, intelligent work and there is something for almost everyone. The technical values are generally very high and when I see the Evil Empire header, I never doubt the quality which would explain why I own more of their product than any other company. As for Jay Sin and Brian Pumper, the Jay Sin I saw was excellent and I just rented Juicy Latin Coochie which is my first Pumper video to see and there is a lot to like in it. I've really what I've seen so far.
We're gonna take it outside and I'm gonna show you what it's like! 1660 Posts 2/06
Posted - Aug 28 2008 : 11:18AM
Fingerbangger, to be fair you're criticizing the company for not signing directors you consider skilled yet you haven't seen the product of half their directors. From what I've seen there is no "company style" every director has a pretty distinctive style of their own.
Evil Angel is still the elite company in the Adult film industry and as long as both Johns,Joey,Rocco,Christoph and Jake continue directing for them they will get the majority of my business when it comes to purchasing dvds.
Evil Angel together with Jules Jordan are my favorite companies. I also agree that Evil Angel can improve the quality of the technical side of the porn but their movies as whole are very good. About Jay Sin I think in gaping genre currently he is number 1.
Skilled.......... what skill !? 1 - I truly love what I know and have on DVD from Darkko : castings are great, scenes, the long time cooperation with Mark Ashley.... great stuff, just waiting for the next Alphabetical Serie volume. 2 - Because of my Homeland I have been following Christoph Clark's work first as an actor, then in many europrods in the 90's, and now as a director for EA. It rocks, castings are not good enough everytime, but this guy has a true SENSE for perversion. Good School he went to. Thinking back of his Obsession movie, or anything older including Nikki Anderson...... waow, stop me. 3 - Last one that suits me is John Leslie. Much Respect. If only he could consider an exotic beauties special serie... great talented director. 4 - Siffredi stuff : too many releases, Belladona and Silvera, never seen any, And I am not into She-males, Toesucking, or ....Interracial = SORRY ! For all others : Ferrara, Cristian, Malone = sorry but I think I'll ever have any excitation watching these spitting, faceslapping, Gagging, cumfarting ( my god ). come on, why not animal sex on top of all that sh*t !!?? why not choking then gangbanging dead octopussies ?? exciting ?? Pools of Blood, and Vomit please. Final point : Watching his trailers on the site, maybe someone like Jay Sin will release a top-casting movie ( and bizarre too ) movie I'll buy one day. Who knows. And I forgot to mention I like Harmony stuff, what I have on DVD I can't stop watching. Good directors. The FUCK ME serie is top quality to me. That's it.
And again, there you have it, different people with different tastes. You like the softer stuff and have found the directors you like. Someone else likes it harder and there they have directors for them too. There is room for it all, imho.
I've been thinking about Michael Ninn... Remember when hard edge met film style production? Sex... Latex.... Shock... That was 94? 5? Then Jenna and Wicked were hard edge with production values... Now we have Corruption, Pirates, and Fashionistas. While I do care about lighting that does not detract or sounds that distract from ambient setups... I like gonzo for what it is. Gorgeous women, great outfits, nice tease, attentive (not mechanical) male talent, and a progression toward hard edge. I think may companies use these elements in creative ways, thanks to the directors they hire! Porn is diversifying in ways we aren't acknowledging just yet... especially tastes in women, the need for intimacy with ultra-hardcore, settings, and plot driven productions. As I've mentioned, a good deal is formulaic, but take a look at who sells, who tops the charts, who consistently commands respect in these forums for their directors, choice of talent, themes, series... Stagnation, repetition, boring, technically lacking, whatever... The industry is growing, not just in sales, but in variety of expression. God bless this industry!
I like to think of myself as "technically INFERIOR" to a lot of people but I agree that the question should be, " Can you crank to it?". Mike John saved my job at Red Light District once when a production manager wanted to fire me for shooting what would become "Cum Fart Cocktails". I was even more technically challenged then than I am now. He said something like, " I could teach a monkey to run one of these cameras, but Jake is a truly perverted individual. True perverts shoot the best porn, and you can't teach or learn that." I will be forever grateful to Mike for having my back during those crazy days at RLD, and I do think his viewpoint has a ring of truth. And yes, Manuel shoots PORN, just as God intended it to be.
M. Quasar, I totally forgot to post this when this thread was new, but the HMI and ellipsoidal pattern line was the funniest thing I have heard in a long, long time. Hilarious.
I completely agree. But what I keep wondering is how the fuck it's even possible to be male and not be a pervert. I gather that it happens. I'm just at a loss to explain it.
Audrey Madison Interview
Posted - Aug 25 2008 : 8:18PM
As always, opinions