When I watched Mason's Dirty Trixxx, I was expecting to find beatings, or something that would make me not want to watch it. (I have stated a few times that I am not a fan of rough sex, I'll watch it, most I won't like, but I do like some.) Your DVD was among the rough sex type DVDs that I can say I truly enjoyed. But... In my opinion, the DVD wasn't that rough. Sure there were moments of roughness, all in all it was mildly rough. The roughest scene being Michelle's scene...

Though I know that Michelle Raven's scene was consensual, as you said so, I still can't get over how she "likes" to be treated. But hey different strokes for different folks.

It's nice to see a long answer that addresses most every concern. I have seen both of your DVDs Mason, both are good, with some scenes being great to very hot. Dirty Trixx wasn't as rough as Max Hardcore, and yet people on this board love him, praise him, while I don't.

Hope to see you post more often.

Same here.

---BIGmike, over & out!---

Edited by - bigmike on Aug 29 2002

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Anyway, here is my libertarian 2 cents:

Mason: If these are consensual acts, who has the right to judge if they are right or wrong? It is nobody's business! Each of the actresses can decide for herself whether she chooses to participate!

To those who object to these types of flix: Your vote counts! Just don't buy these movies - and don't watch them.

There you have it. We are all participants on a board that celebrates a topic that many "mainstreamers" object to on a daily basis. What right do any of us have to judge the morality (or rightness, or degardading nature of, or...) of what consensual adults choose to produce in a free society!

Whew - glad I got that off my chest

Go ahead - I'm ready for flames now

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Thanks for your thought out response. Most of the responses in the poll were answering the general question about the portrayal of degradation and rough sex. I, like many posters, have not seen your movies. While I think it's worthwhile to take the responses to heart, at the same time most are not directed at you personally or your movies.

I have seen some really gross stuff. I question how people can produce it with a good conscience. I definitely do not think the government should interfere. But I do think everyone, me included, should think about how their work affects its audience. Believe me, I think about the effects of adt all the time.

Absolutely there are more pervasive elements of our culture that degrade women. Women's magazines drive me up a wall. Apparantly, all we should care about is our weight and pleasing our men.

But I do think porn has a powerful influence even if that influence is only felt by a minority.

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"What right do any of us have to judge the morality (or rightness, or degardading nature of, or...) of what consensual adults choose to produce in a free society!"

Everybody has the right to their opinion in a free society, and morality is judged all the time. We certainly have the right when asked the question in a poll about the portrayal of degradation and rough sex. lol

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Just thought that I saw way too many judgemental remarks in the 2 threads.

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"What right do any of us have to judge the morality (or rightness, or degardading nature of, or...) of what consensual adults choose to produce in a free society! "

No flames I just think you're missing the point of the question that was ASKED OF US. You apparently thought that questions asked of Mason were no one's business, or there were too many judgements? That's what opinions ARE.

We not only have the right, but in some cases, the obligation to question these things, so please don't make it sound like the Salem Witch Trials. I can assure you that Mason is not a victim here.

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Cyberchicken

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StephDunn wrote:
While I think it's worthwhile to take the responses to heart, at the same time most are not directed at you personally or your movies.

dubmblonde wrote:
. . . don't make it sound like the Salem Witch Trials. I can assure you that Mason is not a victim here.

Dumblonde is right. I am not a victim and I'm trying to figure out how so many of you interpreted my statements as feeling victimized, ganged up on. I am so delited by the passionate responses my question provoked. I would love to continue with the discussion if anyone is game. I can take the heat, and I'm surprised that my words were interpreted otherwise.

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Here is the original thread, it now runs 6 pages. click here.

DenverDon

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Edited by - GattMan on Aug 30 2002

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1. It's a very dangerous kink, and people have died from it. Didn't a famous porn star die under similar circumstances? Why give people bad ideas, and yes, porn is in someways very educational, so why depict something as dangerous as Asphyxiation?

2. Why give ammunition to the pro censorship crowd?

3. We've all heard the term "jaded porn fan", because to a certain extent, that's true. The industry has to push the limit in order to satisfy porn fans who are bored with regular fucking. Sex in porn has become more nasty and even more rough, and I'm starting to worry where this might lead. The idea of someone getting off on rough sex, and then getting bored with it. I mean where does he go from there? Let's put it this way, I would not want to live next door to someone who gets off on women getting choked.

Let's face facts though. In the US, controvery sells, and I'm sure there are people in your business who would love to be the Eminem of porn.

I like my porn nasty, no doubt about it, and I like to think of Bukkake/DP/Gang Bangs as a form of sexual olympics, but choking goes beyond kinky, or nasty, and I'd love to see it banned from porn tomorrow.

Cyberchicken

Edited by - Cyberchicken on Aug 30 2002

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There are a lot of things that I don't much care for in porn today that were unheard of when I first started watching so many years ago but what scares me most is our apparent willingness to censor ourselves in the name of expediance.

There is a reason our fore fathers wrote the constitution the way they did. They realized no one man could decide for all what should and should not be seen heard or said. I don't know about any of you but I certainly know I am not wise enough for that role.

If we don't like something we can choose not to watch it. If you feel strongly enough about it then write the company but we all know the mighty dollar is what will decide if Mason's movies keep getting made. And I hate to say it but that is the way it should be. As long as no one is hurt making them, everyone is a consenting adult and people want to buy/rent her movies then by the values this country is founded on she has every right to make them.

Even under the worst possible scenerio Mason's movies are still no worse (and I am not saying they are even in the same ball park) then the man who preaches hate and violence to a bunch of kids at a white supremist rally. While I may find that man's actions reprehensible and against everything I believe I will not move to silence him if all he does is talk. That is his right and I for one swore an oath to defend that right at all costs.

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Cyberchicken

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That´s negative to society?

Nope.

What´s negative to society is some organizations that condone censorship and refuse to accept the fact that, in 99% of the cases, a fucking movie is only a fucking movie, DAMMIT!!!

.....
I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.

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I was curious about “choking” when speculations in the mainstream press were made in regards to the death of a singer in a famous band. I tried it, didn’t like it one bit (made me nauseous, and never did it again). If something bad had happened to me, my curiosity would be solely to blame. Yes? No?

You guys have a point though, and just recently I cut out a choking sequence because it was way over the top (although done to a woman who loved it!). In fact I may just eliminate the practice from all future productions. However, I still maintain that a little throat play is harmless, whereby the “choking” is simulated but no one is or appears to black out.

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Well, I'm NOT one for censorship, and you shouldn't betray your vision... and you've pointed out already that all the performers had fun while doing these scenes. So if they enjoy it and want to do it, then don't go and eliminate it, betraying your vision, just to be more acceptable.

---BIGmike, over & out!---

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Fact: German S/M porn is and has always been far more violent than anything you'll ever see produced in America.

Fact: The number of reported incidents of violent sexual crime in Germany is far lower per capita than in America.

Fact: The number of reported incidents for spousal abuse is far lower per capita than in America.

My point is obvious. If there was a correlation between what people watch and how they actually treat each other, it would show up in the numbers.

It doesn't . . . because there isn't.

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My approach to depicting sexuality in movies is different, but it doesn't mean that I have to condemn directors who choose to follow a different path. There is a niche for everybody, and, as long as freedom of choice is respected, I don't see anything wrong with it.

Some people are in this business for the money, some for passion, some just because they are true perverts. And as long as they sell tapes, every one of them is doing it for the right reason.

Nice forum. To find people that are able to talk about porn in an interesting and stimulating way is not easy. Good Job!

Axel Braun
www.axelbraun.com

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Secondly, movie violence CAN influence real-life violence. But that´s an exception , not a rule. Blaming movies for violence and rape is stupid. Natural Born Cyko´s don´t need lessons to do their dirty deeds.

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I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.

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quote Parker Schurman:

"Fact: The number of reported incidents of violent sexual crime in Germany is far lower per capita than in America."

"Fact: The number of reported incidents for spousal abuse is far lower per capita than in America."

There's too many culteral differences, including reporting behavior, to make a good cross cultural comparison, but there are a few major ones.

1) German law excludes offenses within marriage in both cases of rape and sexual assault.

2) OVER reporting of sexual violent crime is more prevalent in U.S. statistics. There are more institutions, such as rape hotlines or rape crisis centers, in the U.S. than Germany, that actively engage in the cultural construction of sexual violence.

Most people agree that the main reason for the disparity however, is this:

3) Merger of sexual-erotic and coercive-deviant categories in U.S. culture indicates the lack of a distinct borderline between sentiments of sexuality and violence

So, I wish it were true that "it's just a fantasy", but unfortunately in this country anyway, there's too many who can't make the separation.

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First, if DOES produce and/or release a large number of movies, games, comics etc. that do nothing more than glorify/glamourize violence. Pow, bang and that´s all, folks!

Movie violence causes real life violence? It can but, as I said before, that´s rare. Psychos do what they do because they´re exactly that: psychos. They can claim everything. They can claim the colored rainbow from a shiny CD inspired ´em to go on a murder spree. The can claim the devil, or at least a talking dog, made ´em do it. They´re NUTS!

But you, americans, always run in search of something to blame. You blame the media, blame video games, blame extreme music. Basically, you blame everything except poor parenting, a complete lack of discipline practices, and a social set-up that encourages the alienation and persecution of any student who is different, smart, or in any way quirky and deviant from the rigid status quo.

While you went on and on about violence video games and movies, you completely fail to address the obvious roots of the problem because it required you to point the finger squarely at yourselves. That's something you've never been very good at doing.

I would not sit here and try to tell anyone that violent entertainment does not trigger violent behavior in certain people. It's obvious that it does, just as The Holy Bible has triggered extreme violence in masses of people throughout the centuries. The question you should be asking is not why we have these violent movies or video games. The question is simply why are people today so monumentally stupid that they can't grasp something as basic as the difference between real and make-believe?

I grew up watching screwy movies, stuff far more twisted and violent than today´s kids ever saw. Horror, kung-fu, crime, by the age of twelve I'd seen more shockingly violent fare than most people do their entire lives. I listened to heavy metal and angry punk rock. And you know what? Not once did I ever entertain the thought of walking into a classroom and offing the kids who fucked with me in school. Not once did I ever think it was okay to piledrive my younger sister or try to fly by jumping out of a tree. Not once did I ever think anything I saw in a movie wa anything other than just what it was: an image in a movie. Not real life. Not how you are supposed to behave.

I'm not particularly smart, but I'm also not a complete idiot. Even a simpleton should be able to comprehend the simple concept of what you see in a movie not being an example of what you do in real life. So what is it then, what is it we're doing differently, that is causing kids and adults both to behave like brainless twits who cannot conceive of the fact that you should not drop a flying elbow off the couch onto a two year old child?

A big part of the problem is what I think of as new-age parenting. You live in a society that is so terrified of punishing a kid for being a rotten, spoiled asshole than we've ended up with a whole population of rotten, spoiled assholes. Parents who attempt to discipline their children are chastised and live in constant fear of some bleeding heart guidance counselor from school turning them in for child abuse.

Likewise, teachers are shackled, forced to operate with bound hands and attempt to instruct children who have basically been allowed to run wild and develop not the faintest sense of responsibility or consideration for others. To make matters worse, teachers who dare to flunk a student who deserves to be flunked are punished either for making the child feel bad about themselves or for making the school lose face by having failing students. As a result, you have a population that is now not only meaner and completely devoid of any sense of responsibility regarding their own actions, you also have a population that is just plain dumb as toast.

Unable to understand that their actions have consequences, and too stupid to realize that what they see in movies and video games is not real, you end up with students who lack any sort of coping skills, who freak out and can't think of anything to do other than respond with violence and screaming. And as adults, rather than analyze our failure as elders, you simply blame the movies, even though countless other people saw the same movie and didn't interpret it as an okay to gun down classmates or co-workers.

In this environment, it's no wonder people would be gun-shy about a film like, say, the japanese gorefest "Battle Royale", a movie about recent middle school graduates who are rounded up and transported to a remote island where they are forced to hunt one another down for the amusement of adults. The film pulls no punches in depicting the brutality of adults toward children as well as from one child to another.

Well, this movie requires an audience to understand the difference between reality and fantasy. It requires the audience to think about why the violence on screen is occuring, to analyze the actions of the people on screen, to think about why they have been driven to do what they are doing. It also requires a basic understanding of satire and social commentary. None of these are things the average American youth has been taught how to do by either parents or school.

In fact, kids today are taught, by MTV and movies, that holding a gun sideways looks cool, and that´s all.

Sad indeed.

(BTW, holding a gun sideways just makes it harded to aim and easier for the pistol to jam after a few rounds. So, these kids aren´t even learning how to SHOOT properly!)

.....
I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.

Edited by - Planet Sex on Sep 3 2002

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"3) Merger of sexual-erotic and coercive-deviant categories in U.S. culture indicates the lack of a distinct borderline between sentiments of sexuality and violence"

Actually DB I think there are plenty in this country who can make the distinction we have just gotten so wishy washy in our legal system that we let people get away with too much crap using lame excuses. i.e. the pack mentality, the twinkee defense, etc.

If you rape or aduse a woman in any way I don't give a flying f*ck how you were raised what you were doing before hand what she was wearing or what she said to you it is your fault.

The same goes for the kids who walk into schools with guns. It is not the guys fault for having guns in his house for you to break in and steal it is not the kids fault for picking on you. It is your own plain and simple and I don't care if you are 10 or 40 you still knew it was wrong when you did it.

We can blame this on a lot of things but in the end we are all to blame because we have lost our sense of personal responsibility.

It is the cigarette companies fault for selling them.
It is the bars fault for letting him drink.
It is the laws fault for making it easy for them to get a gun.
It is porns fault for showing people have "devient" sex.
It is the medias fault for being to violent.

The list can go on and on. It has gotten to the point that I am not willing to admit to even a casual connection between things because too many people will try to use that as an excuse.

My god we even took to word of a convicted serial killer that "porn made me do it". How pathetic have we become.

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Your right "we have lost our sense of personal responsibility". I think that peolpe in gerneral need to step up and start taking more responsability for their own action, especially in the American culture. However just because you are responsible for your own behaviour, that does not relieve others their share of responabilty, however minor or small it might be.

"It is the cigarette companies fault for selling them?"

Are the cigarette companies acting in a manner, you would consider responsible?

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But the thing that bugs me the most is the digital erasing of the WTC from every Hollywood movie or TV series. I know some people can have bad memories by seeing the Twin Towers in some movie or TV show, but since when ERASING HISTORY helps??? Using the same logic, then you should also demolish the Pearl Harbor port and put a beach there, or level the Alamo and build a theme park instead.

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What was, was .

What is, is .

Shouldn't be erased.

DenverDon

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Even if there is no proof that movies influence actions, does that mean that movie producers should not think about the influence their work has on the viewers?

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You see, you go to a rental store and you find movies clearly marked as "horror", "x-rated" and so on, roit?

Well, when I rent a movie called "Chainsaw Massacre at the Shaolin Convent of the Lesbian Biker Nuns From Hell", it´s because I WANT to see a chainsaw, a massacre, a shaolin convent, some lesbian biker nuns and a bonafide Hell. And when I rent "Disney´s Happy World of Smiling Cuddly Singing Fluffy Jolly Creatures", I´m not expecting to see eye-gouging or asian homeless kids butt-fucked with spiky avocados.

So, when you cut the gore out of a gore movie, that´s as objectionable, wrong and stupid as inserting subliminar porn imagens in THE RESCUERS. Each horse one stance, etc.

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I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.

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I agree 100%. Nothing in what I stated had anything to do with trying to blame anyone else, it's just that I've heard these comparisons to Germany before, and they don't wash.

Apparently Germans (perhaps most Europeans) are better able to make the distinction. I don't know the reason Americans are not as adept, but those are the facts. Given that, is it really a good idea to blur the sexual/violence line even MORE? I don't think so. I mean come on, we're not about 'artistic vision', it's jack-off material for Christssakes.

Edited by - dumblonde on Sep 3 2002

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But the way some people see it, it´s like a movie actually has the power to brainwash entire audiences and leave ´em walking on the streets like zombies, chanting "Im-Ho-Tep" or something like that...

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I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.

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Also, Mason made the comment that women were "left to raise the kids." That's a completely screwed up view of society. There is NOTHING more important than raising the kids. I could give you a rant worthy of Endo, but I think (hope)I'd be preaching to the choir here.

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Can you elaborate on that a bit. I'm not following you at all.

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Me, I´ve read your comment as you saying that society thinks the only role for a woman is to raise the kids, and that they´re unable to do anything else.

Or maybe I´m utterly fucking wrong.

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I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.

Edited by - Planet Sex on Sep 3 2002

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But if we are raising our children to be influenced by such things then we need to examine how we raise our kids not change what they are exposed to.

Limiting contact does not make a person stronger in their convictions or morals it merely makes them have a false sense of security.

Are cigarette companies honest? They are in their goals and that is to sell cigarettes. If you know that and understand then the rest is just noise.

Steph said

"But does that make it ok to be a part of a marketing team that devises ways to get kids hooked on smoking? Does that make it ok to serve someone beer who's one step away from a stomach pump?"

So where do we draw the line. An ad campaign by it's very nature will reach everyone if it is successful so does that mean we have to outlaw advertising smoking because it is bad for you? Lots of thing are medically proven to be bad for us but we don't blame the people who make them for our use of them.

So you stop the guy on his 10th beer and he still kills someone. Next time it is the 7th same thing happens and so on and so on. When do you stop and say that the bartenders responsibility has ended? When he doesn't serve anything to anyone out of fear?

That is my problem with the whole "connection" argument. It is a very slippery slope we are on and the only place to go from here is down.

As far as the children are concerned parents these days seem even more willing to blame their children's behavior on outside influences instead of taking a hard look at their child and themselves first.

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