My drunken rant

Author	Post
Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 1:59AM Ok, so maybe the responsible thing would be to wait until morning to evaluate whether or not to mindlessly rant but then again, I've been known to down a couple of Bloody Marys before 10am on occasion (Bloody Ceasars actually, for any Canadians who might be reading this) so there's really no specific time when I might be free of booze. That being said..... I'm sure other directors can relate to the following scenario... Girl begins scene and almost right away it is apparent that there is absolutely no rythym and no chemistry. She doesn't look like her pictures and she appears to be counting the moments until she can leave. The scene progresses and you're thinking to yourself "This f*&king sucks!! I can't possibly put this scene in a movie" while at the same time you're hoping that some spark happens and the scene suddenly becomes watchable. Half way through the scene you're finally forced to make a decision to put a halt to this erotic farce. But then, how do you do it? Do you come right out and say "Honey, you're a big, fat pig and you've exhibited nothing resembling a pulse. You should never be without clothing" or do you do what I ended up doing: lie and then pay the girl $400 to put her clothes back on and go home. Somehow without looking like a complete asshole I would like to issue a press release that states... if I hire you for a scene and you completely suck, I'm not paying you a "kill" fee. I'm simply going to hand you the tape and thank you for your time. In the past week I have paid 3 different girls to go home. I'm tired of it. I pay your rate. I don't nickel and dime you and I have you in and out within 3 hours. Can't you return the favor? Don't tell me that you're "sore" from a previous scene. I am paying you the same exhorbitant rate as the guy that shot you before me and I deserve the same performance. As a matter of fact, don't give me any fucking excuses. If you don't feel like working, be honest and tell me up front. I will happilly reschedule and I will hold you in much higher regard for being honest. And guys, don't blame your sub-par performance on anything other than yourself. Everyone has a bad day. Your ego will survive. Just cop to it and I will happily book you again and write off your flacid performance to bad luck. The bottom line is that I'm tired of spending my boss's money on bullshit. We are one of those companies who NEVER try to bargain on rates. We pay what you ask. In return we expect our money's worth. I shot Jenna Haze this morning and paid her a small fortune. Do you know what I got in return? A mindblowing performance. She was involved every step of the way. "Do you need more of this? Is this okay? Does this look good?" All new girls should look to her to see what they should aspire to. If you don't like sex, don't get into porn. We all know you're in it for the money (we all are) but you should try your best to make it seem like money is the last thing on your mind. If you want to phone in a scene, give me a discount so that I can put the scene in a comp or tell me ahead of time that you hate sex, males, and porn so that I may make an educated decision to send you packing. So I guess my rant is really directed at the "kill fee" aspect of the pornographic production processs. If you suck, it's not my fault. Don't expect money for your half-assed effort. I'm too inebriated to contine typing. Hopefully I made a point of some kind. Ok Bye End of rant. My apologies in advance. Edited by - Mike Quasar on Aug 18 2006 [Link]
Twizted6 Senior Member Good & Evil is merely a matter of perspective, I perfer to call myself... Determined 1229 Posts 7/05	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:10AM Maybe you should tell them... If I have to pay you the kill fee, I'm going to post your name on ADT. Glad to hear you shot that $2500 ass again. Great job on GTA9! [Link]
MASAMUNE Senior Member 1452 Posts 12/04	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:15AM You can try pornstarperformance.com [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14594 Posts 3/02	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:25AM What you should do is give performers this rant before you negotiate for their services. I'm sure you have enough credibility with the talent agents that they'll know you aren't just trying to stiff the performers. Unfortunately, I'm not sure that no other shooter would try stiffing them, so taking away the kill fee is probably a bad idea. [Link]
Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:33AM Hardware wrote: What you should do is give performers this rant before you negotiate for their services. I'm sure you have enough credibility with the talent agents that they'll know you aren't just trying to stiff the performers. Unfortunately, I'm not sure that no other shooter would try stiffing them, so taking away the kill fee is probably a bad idea. Click to expand That's a good idea but I'm drunk and agitated right NOW :) [Link]

Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14594 Posts 3/02	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:39AM Just don't climb into the dryer - you'll be fine in the morning. [Link]
Twiki Member bidibidibidibidi 99 Posts 5/06	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 4:13AM Mike Quasar wrote: Girl begins scene and almost right away it is apparent that there is absolutely no rythym and no chemistry. She doesn't look like her pictures and she appears to be counting the moments until she can leave. The scene progresses and you're thinking to yourself "This f&king sucks!! I can't possibly put this scene in a movie" while at the same time you're hoping that some spark happens and the scene suddenly becomes watchable. Half way through the scene you're finally forced to make a decision to put a halt to this erotic farce. But then, how do you do it? Do you come right out and say "Honey, you're a big, fat pig and you've exhibited nothing resembling a pulse. You should never be without clothing" or do you do what I ended up doing: lie and then pay the girl $400 to put her clothes back on and go home. Click to expand Isn't it possible to direct* a scene? I've seen many lame scenes where a little intervention might have done the trick. [Link]
Twiki Member bidibidibidibidi 99 Posts 5/06	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 4:15AM Mike Quasar wrote: I shot Jenna Haze this morning and paid her a small fortune. Do you know what I got in return? A mindblowing performance. Click to expand Gems like this are the reason I keep reading ADT. [Link]
croy Platinum Member Discovry 4574 Posts 3/04	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:10AM I would have thought that the many had not been through the grind of a 9-5 and thus had a lot of exposure to professionalism. [Link]
pinc_noiz Deactivated User 758 Posts 6/05	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:18AM Mike Quasar wrote: My apologies in advance. Click to expand Why ? You didn't hurt anyone, and it's your honest feeling ... p_n [Link]
Ejac Deactivated User 851 Posts 9/04	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 8:10AM Reading this reminds me of how fortunate I am to be able to have free unhibited sex without pressure (I'd never make a good porn stud), and still be able to pick something up off of the shelf at a whim. Tough racket (like a lot of others), but I'm thankful that it exists. [Link]
BigBobxxx Senior Member 2681 Posts 5/04	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 8:42AM Quaze, If performers can't pull it together to work with you and the Zero Tolerance/3rd Degree family, they're just not taking this business seriously. You and your associates reputations in this industry are stellar. You are more than justified in insisting on talent putting forth their best. [Link]
BlueUnit Member 72 Posts 6/06	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:29AM Nice rant Q. Labor problems huh..join the club! When you get it figured out..let me know. [Link]
babby Senior Member 1283 Posts 2/04	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:40AM I have an idea for you guys. Hire older porn girls. when is the last time you guys tried to hire a woman like nicole sheridan or Lisa Ann? these women seem to love their work. [Link]
picman Senior Member Nothing says I love you so much as a tongue in the ass. 2884 Posts 1/03	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:58AM I feel your pain Quaze. I know it must be tempting to just post something on pornstarperformance.com and trash the girl, but I don't think that would be very productive or classy. I do think you need to make your feelings known to the agents repping these girls, letting them know you don't feel like you're getting what's advertised, nor appreciate getting the back end of a double booking. Maybe it'll get you a rebate, future consideration for the hottest starlets, or just better disclosure from the agency. It also might get the agent to put his client on notice without a public embarrassment. Everybody wants to make as much money as fast as possible. Sometimes they need to slow things down to maintain some semblance of quality. [Link]

BigBobxxx Senior Member 2681 Posts 5/04	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 10:37AM How about a new line, "Out-takes: Scenes from the Cutting-Room Floor"? "Think it only happens to you? See professional porn stars having a very bad-hair day. Trust us, these scenes are real, and the performers were actually paid." At least make a blooper-reel for the parties at AVN Las Vegas [Link]
darkside762000 Member United Kingdom 91 Posts 3/06	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 10:45AM You call that a drunken rant, Quaze? Not once in your drunken diatribe did you blame the jews for this problem and all other problems in the world, nor did you refer to Steph as 'Sugar Tits' or claim to 'own Malibu'. Frankly, I'm disappointed....must try harder next time!!! [Link]
lindi Senior Member 12345 3205 Posts 9/02	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:24AM Girl begins scene and almost right away it is apparent that there is absolutely no rythym and no chemistry. She doesn't look like her pictures and she appears to be counting the moments until she can leave. The scene progresses and you're thinking to yourself "This f*&king sucks!! ...while at the same time you're hoping that some spark happens and the scene suddenly becomes watchable. Half way through the scene you're finally forced to make a decision to put a halt to this erotic farce. Click to expand Some directors do put those scenes in the movie. Change a few words, and the viewer is thinking the exact same thing. [Link]
TonyC Comstock Films 2523 Posts 8/03	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:32AM Mike Quasar wrote: The bottom line is that I'm tired of spending my boss's money on bullshit. Click to expand Didn't you say in a post last year you yourself are making six figures? Isn't ZT making money hand over first? Even if you had two a week, that's only like $100K tops. Like paying outstanding talent higher rates, isn't the cost of flakage, etc already factored in? All in the game, yo. [Link]
Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:50AM TonyC wrote: Mike Quasar wrote: The bottom line is that I'm tired of spending my boss's money on bullshit. Click to expand Didn't you say in a post last year you yourself are making six figures? Isn't ZT making money hand over first? Even if you had two a week, that's only like $100K tops. Like paying outstanding talent higher rates, isn't the cost of flakage, etc already factored in? All in the game, yo. Click to expand C'mon Tony. I don't recall ever making any attempt to boast about how much money I personally may or may not make and as far as the company goes, our annual revenue is irrelevant. I'm sure Bill Gates doesn't like to waste money any more than a homeless guy living on a freeway offramp. Wasted money is wasted money. In the fog of the morning light my rant doesn't seem as offensive as I feared it might have been. But I agree, I should have thrown in something about the jews :) [Link]
bono-ONE All-Star Member SAMCRO 8570 Posts 8/00	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:53AM Sugar Tits, that's a good one! [Link]
Kimi Lixx Senior Member 2012 Posts 6/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:56AM The one scene I shot for Quaze has been one of my most consistantly well-reviewed scenes. I think he's a fine director - if he can't get what he wants out of the talent, it's definitely the talent's fault. That being said, I wonder if there is a tactful way for talent to say, "I can't get into this scene, this guy is abusive, repulsive, and I think he's stoned. I would love to work for you, but not here, not now. I showed up with every intention of doing my best for you, and I can't." without being blackballed, without being granted diva status, without being dropped to the bottom of the do-not-call list. Yes, talent is supposed to be professional and overcome personal feelings during a shoot, but it just isn't always possible to overcome when the talent you're supposed to be working with is working against you. [Link]
Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:09PM Kimi Lixx wrote: The one scene I shot for Quaze has been one of my most consistantly well-reviewed scenes. I think he's a fine director - if he can't get what he wants out of the talent, it's definitely the talent's fault. That being said, I wonder if there is a tactful way for talent to say, "I can't get into this scene, this guy is abusive, repulsive, and I think he's stoned. I would love to work for you, but not here, not now. I showed up with every intention of doing my best for you, and I can't." without being blackballed, without being granted diva status, without being dropped to the bottom of the do-not-call list. Yes, talent is supposed to be professional and overcome personal feelings during a shoot, but it just isn't always possible to overcome when the talent you're supposed to be working with is working against you. Click to expand Kimi, if a girl ever said that to me I would be overjoyed and she would be at the top of my list for a future shoot. Telling a director up front that you don't feel well, you don't like the guy, you're having an allergic reaction to paxil and ecstasy, whatever, gives the director the option of rescheduling and not wasting anyone's time or money that day. I gotta say that I'm a little disappointed that a drunken Chico Wang hasn't put in his 2 cents. [Link]
TonyC Comstock Films 2523 Posts 8/03	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:10PM Mike Quasar wrote: But I agree, I should have thrown in something about the jews :) Click to expand Yes, you should have thrown something in about the jews. [Link]
Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:13PM TonyC wrote: Mike Quasar wrote: But I agree, I should have thrown in something about the jews :) Click to expand Yes, you should have thrown something in about the jews. Click to expand You're right Tony. I'm an arrogant bastard rolling around in piles of money. I believe I used the term "6 figure income" to illustrate that a high school dropout with a bad liver can do well in porn, not to brag about the six figure income. [Link]

Crucifixio_Jones Senior Member Arrogant & Obnoxious Narcissist 4727 Posts 10/03	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:28PM Re: Jenna Haze's mindblowing performances. This is all I've heard and seen since her return to b/g. I never thought that after her JKP veggie days that I'd be saying this about her, but like Quaze mentioned, she's one girl a lot of current performers could stand to look up to. Re: Kill Fees It's a concept I never quite understood. Let me rephrase that: if talent shows up to my set and I have to send them home for some reason of MINE, then yes, I understand paying them a small fee to compensate them for their time. They showed up ready to work, expected to be working and because of some of my own, they weren't able to. Fine. Here's some money, sorry for wasting your time. On the other hand, if the reason the scene doesn't go down is because of the performer, why should I pay YOU? Be it because you show up looking like crap, don't really feel like working, aren't vibing with your partner, etc. if it's on you, then I'm not paying you in addition to that. There are girls working right now who know they look nothing like the pictures their agent floats around anymore, yet they'll still show up to set after set, collecting kill fee after kill fee with no intention of actually earning their wage. Why should a girl be allowed to get sent home from three or four sets in a row ON SIGHT and STILL get paid just for showing up even if the problem is clearly HER and ONLY HER? I understand Mike's frustration. You almost feel as though you're the one being ripped off and taken advantage of. [Link]
Pagoda Senior Member Thread Killer 1747 Posts 10/05	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:02PM You're probably hungover now, but here's a suggestion. Hire veteran talent exclusively. No newbies allowed. And pair partners that have worked together and shown chemistry in the past. That'll improve your odds. [Link]
Beaver Member 137 Posts 11/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:28PM Prior to every scene you shoot just spell out to each performer what you expect and that if they don't live up to your expectations they aren't going to get shit (maybe make them sign a waiver if you have to). One of two things will happen. 1) They will agree and do the best they can to live up to your standards. 2) They tell you to fuck off and you're too picky. Either way you win b/c you'll either produce a solid scene or not waste your time. [Link]
phatbasey Senior Member 1390 Posts 1/05	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 3:22PM I think the ever growing demand for fresh faces puts him in a tough spot. As "joe consumer" why buy a $29 ZT tittle if it stars say Kira Kenner when you can buy a Vivid/Raw disc for $4.99. Therefore some of the unprofessonalism is to be expected the best thing you could do is print out or augment the rant and let them read before you sign up. At least then you did all you could do. Edited by - phatbasey on 8/18/2006 3:23:07 PM [Link]
G_Jacobson Member Los Angeles 24 Posts 3/06	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:22PM Kimi Lixx wrote: That being said, I wonder if there is a tactful way for talent to say, "I can't get into this scene, this guy is abusive, repulsive, and I think he's stoned. Click to expand What's wrong with fucking someone who is stoned? Am I missing something? LOL [Link]
Eric381 Deactivated User What are you looking at? It 2452 Posts 3/05	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:57PM Booze, it's what's for breakfast! I thought this was hilarious, Quaze, regardless how serious t'was intended. This fly on the wall just yearns to know...(in my best Lewis Black voice) "who"?? lol Mike Quasar wrote: In the fog of the morning light my rant doesn't seem as offensive as I feared it might have been. Click to expand Edited by - Eric381 on 8/18/2006 5:58:29 PM [Link]
Janitor Retired Porno movies, sexy videos, xxx. Adult DVD Talk at your service. 6409 Posts 11/99	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 6:23PM quaze - the rampant unprofessionalism in porn is the reason that those who display the smallest amount of professionalism are able to make an easy living. rant away, but know the competition for solid directors like you would be a lot greater if porn weren't full of bullshit. that's what i tell myself every time we get ripped off. (coming from the person who was ready to give up a couple weeks ago...) [Link]
jimmyd simplyjimmyd.com 58 Posts 2/03	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 7:20PM Nice rant, Q. So, what else is new? This is a new problem? Don't hire chicks you haven't actually seen, i.e., in person. If you do, and she doesn't look remotely like her pic on some agent's site, send her home without the kill fee. If she has a problem with that tell her to take it up with her handlers. They're the ones who put up the bullshit picture. If she ain't giving at least 80% to the scene, tell her you're gonna call off the scene and see if that wakes her up. If it doesn't, send her packing. And don't give her the kill-fee on the set. Have a talk with her agent first and negotiate the kill-fee... Since when did $400 become the standard kill-fee? Someone mentioned pornstarperformance. fuck that. that site has no credibility unless you happen to know who wrote whatever and you think they have some credibility. I'm not telling yu your business. Like me, you've done this long enough and you know the score. But here's the deal, it ain't like there's a shortage of talent. Let's make the agents guarantee a little something more out of their clients then she'll simply be on the set on time. I mean, c'mon, who's paying who here? [Link]
christianx Senior Member 1883 Posts 9/04	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 8:21PM quaze, once again, i felt really badly about that. i hope there is no hard feelings. believe me, i wish i could have continued with the scene! i guess we will try again next time! lol [Link]
ma meeshka Iconoclastic Member 3939 Posts 4/06	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:48PM quality rant. [Link]

Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:52PM christianx wrote: quaze, once again, i felt really badly about that. i hope there is no hard feelings. believe me, i wish i could have continued with the scene! i guess we will try again next time! lol Click to expand I wasn't specifically talking about you dude. It's not your fault the broad smelled like a carp. Did I mention that it's been a long time since I've consumed vodka. Back to red wine. Less anger and less blood poisoning. [Link]
cobalt60 Knuckle Dragger 2046 Posts 2/03	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 10:03PM Newcastle! hic God, but it give me the gout. But it's fucking delicious. [Link]
Tyler Knight Member 139 Posts 3/05	Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:03PM Tyler Knight wrote: G_Jacobson wrote: Kimi Lixx wrote: That being said, I wonder if there is a tactful way for talent to say, "I can't get into this scene, this guy is abusive, repulsive, and I think he's stoned. Click to expand What's wrong with fucking someone who is stoned? Am I missing something? LOL Click to expand If it affects the quality of the scene, a lot. Every vocation requires a certain degree of professionalism, and pride. Kimi, I think that pulling the director aside and expressing your feelings the way you wrote it here is not a bad idea. Only a moron would'nt respect you for your honesty, and at least would try to talk to your scene parnter. He'd be shooting himself in the foot if he didn't. I've done it more times than I would have liked for various reason. Hygene, un identifyable sores, belligerant/ uncooperative scene partner, ect., but I don't regret doing so. Interestingly enough, when I first met you Q, we knew right off the bat that I was going to have an off day before we got too far into it (certainly not the girls fault, she was great), and you asked me straight up if I thought I was gonna struggle. I said yes, and we canned the scene. Saved us all a lot of time, as well as having to put our names on a lack luster scene. I respected that. A lot of shooters would try to force it to work. Edited by - tyler knight on 8/18/2006 11:27:08 PM [Link]
realtip Deactivated User 2301 Posts 6/04	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 12:43AM From reading this thread, I'm just wondering where the responsibility of the director comes in to actually direct the scene in direction he wants it to go. If the director feels that the girl is giving a subpar performance, why not just tell her what he expects her to do instead of just getting frustrated and cancelling the entire scene because he doesn't like what he's filming? Does the girl actually complain all the time and say she doesn't want to be there, or does the director just assume this? The example provided of Jenna Haze is a fine example of an involved and proactive performer. However, the job of the porn actor/actress is to perform. They should not be expected to have to do the director's job too. If that's the case, what's the point of having a director in the first place? Might as well just let the girl direct the scene since she is obviously the one who is expected to not only fuck, but to also make sure the scene is outstanding from every other standpoint as well. Having said that, I do believe that girls should be provided a kill fee, but not just for showing up. Directors should not have to pay a kill fee for a girl just walking through the door. However, if she gives a scene, but the scene is not complete because the director decided to cancel it (which is basically what the opening post of this thread says), then she should indeed be compensated for whatever work she has already done toward the scene. It is true that porn performers should not show up on set if they don't want to have sex. Likewise, directors should not take up the duty of directing if they expect the performers to be able to read their minds rather than just acknowledging them of what is expected in the scene. As in all other professions, I'm sure communication in porn also works both ways. [Link]
Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 12:59AM realtip wrote: From reading this thread, I'm just wondering where the responsibility of the director comes in to actually direct the scene in direction he wants it to go. If the director feels that the girl is giving a subpar performance, why not just tell her what he expects her to do instead of just getting frustrated and cancelling the entire scene because he doesn't like what he's filming? Does the girl actually complain all the time and say she doesn't want to be there, or does the director just assume this? The example provided of Jenna Haze is a fine example of an involved and proactive performer. However, the job of the porn actor/actress is to perform. They should not be expected to have to do the director's job too. If that's the case, what's the point of having a director in the first place? Might as well just let the girl direct the scene since she is obviously the one who is expected to not only fuck, but to also make sure the scene is outstanding from every other standpoint as well. Having said that, I do believe that girls should be provided a kill fee, but not just for showing up. Directors should not have to pay a kill fee for a girl just walking through the door. However, if she gives a scene, but the scene is not complete because the director decided to cancel it (which is basically what the opening post of this thread says), then she should indeed be compensated for whatever work she has already done toward the scene. It is true that porn performers should not show up on set if they don't want to have sex. Likewise, directors should not take up the duty of directing if they expect the performers to be able to read their minds rather than just acknowledging them of what is expected in the scene. As in all other professions, I'm sure communication in porn also works both ways. Click to expand I find your presumptuousness amusing. Sex performance, particularly in the "gonzo" genre, requires a great deal of personality from the performers. There is no script. They are not playing characters. It is impossible to create a sexual personality for a performer who would rather be knitting a quilt. I can not "direct" someone to have a pulse other than to say things like "a little more enthusiasm... pretend your enjoying yourself....please don't make that face like you're smelling something bad..." Perhaps I should incorporate a taser into my repertoire. The bottom line is William Shatner will never be Robert Deniro and some girls presently working in porn should stay home and knit quilts. I'm sure you would do it much better than all of us if given the opportunity [Link]
Eric381 Deactivated User What are you looking at? It 2452 Posts 3/05	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 1:03AM Fuckin' Khrighst....don't say that??!! What would all us fanboys do without the great host & hostess of ADT? Quaze...a carp? OUCH!! Eric (who's getting his drink on at the midnight hour)...Sambuca, Quaze, Sambuca...goes down like Twizlers! Tyler, nothing wrong with that. It would SUCK to wake up a week later with a dick that looked like a Christmas cactus all because you thought that "questionable sore" looked suspicous. Good for you, man! Quaze -v- Realtip = battle of the minds, I'll go to PPV to watch this and even put bets on who wins. Steph wrote: (coming from the person who was ready to give up a couple weeks ago...) Click to expand Edited by - Eric381 on 8/19/2006 1:11:23 AM [Link]
realtip Deactivated User 2301 Posts 6/04	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 2:13AM Mike Quasar wrote I find your presumptuousness amusing. Sex performance, particularly in the "gonzo" genre, requires a great deal of personality from the performers. There is no script. They are not playing characters. It is impossible to create a sexual personality for a performer who would rather be knitting a quilt. Click to expand Dude, don't be so sensitive. I meant nothing personal against you. My comments were not aimed specifically toward you or any one particular director, but was just about porn directors in general. It just so happens that you are the one who started this "drunken rant," so I was kinda speaking to you rather than about you. Anyway, I'm just failing to see what makes a girl "unprofessional" simply because she doesn't sport a fake grin all through the scene or repeatedly holler those obnoxious fake moans that I just always love hearing. You say that the performers "are not playing characters," but it seems like that's kinda what you want them to do. I remember on the first job I ever had, my boss called me in his office for my evaluation. It was a stellar evaluation with only one problem. Not my attendance. Not my job performance. Not any lack of skills or job knowledge. It was none of those things at all. Instead, the only complaint he had for me was that I didn't smile enough. Yes, that was his only complaint. He told me that I needed to look "more happy" about my work. So everytime he walked past me, I would have to wear a stupid fake grin on my face. Otherwise, he would scream, "Smile! Smile!" It was damn annoying. This is exactly what the situation you describe reminds me of. Personally, I much rather see genuine reactions in porn. I am tired of all this fake "enthusiasm" that girls are always expected to have. It's one thing if the girl is undependable; she fails to show up on time or doesn't show up at all; she relentlessly complains; she looks a hot damn mess; she pulls stupid antics on set (such as throwing a tantrum or locking herself in a closet); she plain won't follow directions, etc. With all that, I can understand cancelling the scene and having issues with paying a kill fee. But to cancel a whole scene because the girl is not "pretending" to enjoy herself enough just seems crazy to me. Maybe she wants to hurry up and get the scene over with because she has her grocery shopping to do that day. Maybe she just wants to do her job, but is not really in the mood to put on a fake happy act. Who knows? As long as she shows up on set and does her job, why does she have to also "pretend" to enjoy herself about it too, especially if she's really not? I'm sure you would do it much better than all of us if given the opportunity Click to expand As much as I want to, no comment on that remark. [Link]
Loraine Senior Member 1559 Posts 3/04	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 6:26AM realtip wrote Maybe she just wants to do her job, but is not really in the mood to put on a fake happy act. Who knows? As long as she shows up on set and does her job, why does she have to also "pretend" to enjoy herself about it too, especially if she's really not? Click to expand I think that in this case pretending to be enjoying yourself is the job. [Link]
TonyC Comstock Films 2523 Posts 8/03	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 7:07AM Mike Quasar wrote: The bottom line is William Shatner will never be Robert Deniro Click to expand Automatic disqualification to ever hold a camera, or even be within 200 yards of anything referred to as a "set". [Link]
Brandon Iron BrandonIron.com 3832 Posts 3/02	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 7:18AM Ah, I long for the days back at Extreme Associates where the term "kill fee" had some teeth! I mean, either the girl performed or.... (Just kidding.) [Link]
Crucifixio_Jones Senior Member Arrogant & Obnoxious Narcissist 4727 Posts 10/03	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 7:52AM Brandon Iron wrote: Ah, I long for the days back at Extreme Associates where the term "kill fee" had some teeth! I mean, either the girl performed or.... (Just kidding.) Click to expand I always thought that Alek James Hidell and his Slap Happy series would've made a perfect fit over there... Wait a minute. [Link]
Drew Black broken crankshaft 8009 Posts 9/99	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 8:39AM Mike Quasar wrote: I shot Jenna Haze this morning and paid her a small fortune. Do you know what I got in return? A mindblowing performance. She was involved every step of the way. "Do you need more of this? Is this okay? Does this look good?" All new girls should look to her to see what they should aspire to. Click to expand I read this and thought about how I miss the old Mike Quasarrants.com site. I remember the good old days when Jenna was just a girl getting into the business and dating your assistant Snoopy (or Spanky or whatever his name was). How things have changed. [Link]
Drew Black broken crankshaft 8009 Posts 9/99	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 9:39AM It was Scooby. [Link]
katsirk Member Crush on Greg....mmm 812 Posts 7/06	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 10:00AM Drew Black wrote: It was Scooby. Click to expand C'mon Scooby Doo, I see you, we got some work to do now..." [Link]
Mike Quasar Zero Tolerance Reluctant pornographer 1765 Posts 7/01	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 10:40AM Drew Black wrote: I read this and thought about how I miss the old Mike Quasarrants.com site. I remember the good old days when Jenna was just a girl getting into the business and dating your assistant Snoopy (or Spanky or whatever his name was). How things have changed. Click to expand She reminded about that. She remembers very clearly that I referred to her as the "Vixen of Violence" and the "Diva of Destruction" and also that she was going to sue me for something called "depliction" of character. Apparently she's forgiven me :) [Link]
BustdownGal Member 539 Posts 7/06	Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 11:18AM Pornstarperformance is a very interesting website They're allowed to name names there. [Link]

Author

Post

Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 1:59AM

Ok, so maybe the responsible thing would be to wait until morning to evaluate whether or not to mindlessly rant but then again, I've been known to down a couple of Bloody Marys before 10am on occasion (Bloody Ceasars actually, for any Canadians who might be reading this) so there's really no specific time when I might be free of booze. That being said.....

I'm sure other directors can relate to the following scenario...

Girl begins scene and almost right away it is apparent that there is absolutely no rythym and no chemistry. She doesn't look like her pictures and she appears to be counting the moments until she can leave. The scene progresses and you're thinking to yourself "This f*&king sucks!! I can't possibly put this scene in a movie" while at the same time you're hoping that some spark happens and the scene suddenly becomes watchable. Half way through the scene you're finally forced to make a decision to put a halt to this erotic farce. But then, how do you do it? Do you come right out and say "Honey, you're a big, fat pig and you've exhibited nothing resembling a pulse. You should never be without clothing" or do you do what I ended up doing: lie and then pay the girl $400 to put her clothes back on and go home.

Somehow without looking like a complete asshole I would like to issue a press release that states... if I hire you for a scene and you completely suck, I'm not paying you a "kill" fee. I'm simply going to hand you the tape and thank you for your time. In the past week I have paid 3 different girls to go home. I'm tired of it. I pay your rate. I don't nickel and dime you and I have you in and out within 3 hours. Can't you return the favor? Don't tell me that you're "sore" from a previous scene. I am paying you the same exhorbitant rate as the guy that shot you before me and I deserve the same performance. As a matter of fact, don't give me any fucking excuses. If you don't feel like working, be honest and tell me up front. I will happilly reschedule and I will hold you in much higher regard for being honest. And guys, don't blame your sub-par performance on anything other than yourself. Everyone has a bad day. Your ego will survive. Just cop to it and I will happily book you again and write off your flacid performance to bad luck.

The bottom line is that I'm tired of spending my boss's money on bullshit. We are one of those companies who NEVER try to bargain on rates. We pay what you ask. In return we expect our money's worth. I shot Jenna Haze this morning and paid her a small fortune. Do you know what I got in return? A mindblowing performance. She was involved every step of the way. "Do you need more of this? Is this okay? Does this look good?" All new girls should look to her to see what they should aspire to. If you don't like sex, don't get into porn. We all know you're in it for the money (we all are) but you should try your best to make it seem like money is the last thing on your mind. If you want to phone in a scene, give me a discount so that I can put the scene in a comp or tell me ahead of time that you hate sex, males, and porn so that I may make an educated decision to send you packing.

So I guess my rant is really directed at the "kill fee" aspect of the pornographic production processs. If you suck, it's not my fault. Don't expect money for your half-assed effort.

I'm too inebriated to contine typing. Hopefully I made a point of some kind.

Ok Bye

End of rant. My apologies in advance.

Edited by - Mike Quasar on Aug 18 2006

[Link]

Twizted6
Senior Member

Good & Evil is merely a matter of perspective, I perfer to call myself... Determined
1229 Posts
7/05

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:10AM

Maybe you should tell them...

If I have to pay you the kill fee, I'm going to post your name on ADT.

Glad to hear you shot that $2500 ass again.

Great job on GTA9!

[Link]

MASAMUNE
Senior Member

1452 Posts
12/04

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:15AM

You can try pornstarperformance.com

[Link]

Hardware

All-Star Member

Your other left
14594 Posts
3/02

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:25AM

What you should do is give performers this rant before you negotiate for their services.

I'm sure you have enough credibility with the talent agents that they'll know you aren't just trying to stiff the performers. Unfortunately, I'm not sure that no other shooter would try stiffing them, so taking away the kill fee is probably a bad idea.

[Link]

Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:33AM

That's a good idea but I'm drunk and agitated right NOW :)

[Link]

Hardware

All-Star Member

Your other left
14594 Posts
3/02

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:39AM

Just don't climb into the dryer - you'll be fine in the morning.

[Link]

Twiki
Member

bidibidibidibidi
99 Posts
5/06

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 4:13AM

Mike Quasar wrote:
Girl begins scene and almost right away it is apparent that there is absolutely no rythym and no chemistry. She doesn't look like her pictures and she appears to be counting the moments until she can leave. The scene progresses and you're thinking to yourself "This f*&king sucks!! I can't possibly put this scene in a movie" while at the same time you're hoping that some spark happens and the scene suddenly becomes watchable. Half way through the scene you're finally forced to make a decision to put a halt to this erotic farce. But then, how do you do it? Do you come right out and say "Honey, you're a big, fat pig and you've exhibited nothing resembling a pulse. You should never be without clothing" or do you do what I ended up doing: lie and then pay the girl $400 to put her clothes back on and go home.
Click to expand

Isn't it possible to direct a scene? I've seen many lame scenes where a little intervention might have done the trick.

[Link]

Twiki
Member

bidibidibidibidi
99 Posts
5/06

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 4:15AM

Gems like this are the reason I keep reading ADT.

[Link]

croy
Platinum Member

Discovry
4574 Posts
3/04

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:10AM

I would have thought that the many had not been through the grind of a 9-5 and thus had a lot of exposure to professionalism.

[Link]

pinc_noiz
Deactivated User

758 Posts
6/05

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:18AM

Why ? You didn't hurt anyone, and it's your honest feeling ...

p_n

[Link]

Ejac
Deactivated User

851 Posts
9/04

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 8:10AM

Reading this reminds me of how fortunate I am to be able to have free unhibited sex without pressure (I'd never make a good porn stud), and still be able to pick something up off of the shelf at a whim.

Tough racket (like a lot of others), but I'm thankful that it exists.

[Link]

BigBobxxx
Senior Member

2681 Posts
5/04

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 8:42AM

Quaze,

If performers can't pull it together to work with you and the Zero Tolerance/3rd Degree family, they're just not taking this business seriously.

You and your associates reputations in this industry are stellar. You are more than justified in insisting on talent putting forth their best.

[Link]

BlueUnit
Member

72 Posts
6/06

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:29AM

Nice rant Q.

Labor problems huh..join the club! When you get it figured out..let me know.

[Link]

babby
Senior Member

1283 Posts
2/04

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:40AM

I have an idea for you guys. Hire older porn girls. when is the last time you guys tried to hire a woman like nicole sheridan or Lisa Ann? these women seem to love their work.

[Link]

picman
Senior Member

Nothing says I love you so much as a tongue in the ass.
2884 Posts
1/03

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:58AM

I feel your pain Quaze. I know it must be tempting to just post something on pornstarperformance.com and trash the girl, but I don't think that would be very productive or classy. I do think you need to make your feelings known to the agents repping these girls, letting them know you don't feel like you're getting what's advertised, nor appreciate getting the back end of a double booking. Maybe it'll get you a rebate, future consideration for the hottest starlets, or just better disclosure from the agency. It also might get the agent to put his client on notice without a public embarrassment. Everybody wants to make as much money as fast as possible. Sometimes they need to slow things down to maintain some semblance of quality.

[Link]

BigBobxxx
Senior Member

2681 Posts
5/04

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 10:37AM

How about a new line, "Out-takes: Scenes from the Cutting-Room Floor"?

"Think it only happens to you? See professional porn stars having a very bad-hair day. Trust us, these scenes are real, and the performers were actually paid."

At least make a blooper-reel for the parties at AVN Las Vegas

[Link]

darkside762000
Member

United Kingdom
91 Posts
3/06

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 10:45AM

You call that a drunken rant, Quaze? Not once in your drunken diatribe did you blame the jews for this problem and all other problems in the world, nor did you refer to Steph as 'Sugar Tits' or claim to 'own Malibu'.

Frankly, I'm disappointed....must try harder next time!!!

[Link]

lindi
Senior Member

12345
3205 Posts
9/02

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:24AM

Some directors do put those scenes in the movie. Change a few words, and the viewer is thinking the exact same thing.

[Link]

TonyC
Comstock Films

2523 Posts
8/03

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:32AM

Didn't you say in a post last year you yourself are making six figures? Isn't ZT making money hand over first? Even if you had two a week, that's only like $100K tops. Like paying outstanding talent higher rates, isn't the cost of flakage, etc already factored in? All in the game, yo.

[Link]

Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:50AM

C'mon Tony. I don't recall ever making any attempt to boast about how much money I personally may or may not make and as far as the company goes, our annual revenue is irrelevant. I'm sure Bill Gates doesn't like to waste money any more than a homeless guy living on a freeway offramp. Wasted money is wasted money.

In the fog of the morning light my rant doesn't seem as offensive as I feared it might have been.

But I agree, I should have thrown in something about the jews :)

[Link]

bono-ONE

All-Star Member

SAMCRO
8570 Posts
8/00

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:53AM

Sugar Tits, that's a good one!

[Link]

Kimi Lixx
Senior Member

2012 Posts
6/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:56AM

The one scene I shot for Quaze has been one of my most consistantly well-reviewed scenes. I think he's a fine director - if he can't get what he wants out of the talent, it's definitely the talent's fault.

That being said, I wonder if there is a tactful way for talent to say, "I can't get into this scene, this guy is abusive, repulsive, and I think he's stoned. I would love to work for you, but not here, not now. I showed up with every intention of doing my best for you, and I can't." without being blackballed, without being granted diva status, without being dropped to the bottom of the do-not-call list. Yes, talent is supposed to be professional and overcome personal feelings during a shoot, but it just isn't always possible to overcome when the talent you're supposed to be working with is working against you.

[Link]

Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:09PM

Kimi Lixx wrote:
The one scene I shot for Quaze has been one of my most consistantly well-reviewed scenes. I think he's a fine director - if he can't get what he wants out of the talent, it's definitely the talent's fault.
That being said, I wonder if there is a tactful way for talent to say, "I can't get into this scene, this guy is abusive, repulsive, and I think he's stoned. I would love to work for you, but not here, not now. I showed up with every intention of doing my best for you, and I can't." without being blackballed, without being granted diva status, without being dropped to the bottom of the do-not-call list. Yes, talent is supposed to be professional and overcome personal feelings during a shoot, but it just isn't always possible to overcome when the talent you're supposed to be working with is working against you.
Click to expand

Kimi, if a girl ever said that to me I would be overjoyed and she would be at the top of my list for a future shoot. Telling a director up front that you don't feel well, you don't like the guy, you're having an allergic reaction to paxil and ecstasy, whatever, gives the director the option of rescheduling and not wasting anyone's time or money that day.

I gotta say that I'm a little disappointed that a drunken Chico Wang hasn't put in his 2 cents.

[Link]

TonyC
Comstock Films

2523 Posts
8/03

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:10PM

Yes, you should have thrown something in about the jews.

[Link]

Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:13PM

You're right Tony. I'm an arrogant bastard rolling around in piles of money.

I believe I used the term "6 figure income" to illustrate that a high school dropout with a bad liver can do well in porn, not to brag about the six figure income.

[Link]

Crucifixio_Jones
Senior Member

Arrogant & Obnoxious Narcissist
4727 Posts
10/03

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 12:28PM

Re: Jenna Haze's mindblowing performances.

This is all I've heard and seen since her return to b/g. I never thought that after her JKP veggie days that I'd be saying this about her, but like Quaze mentioned, she's one girl a lot of current performers could stand to look up to.

Re: Kill Fees

It's a concept I never quite understood. Let me rephrase that: if talent shows up to my set and I have to send them home for some reason of MINE, then yes, I understand paying them a small fee to compensate them for their time. They showed up ready to work, expected to be working and because of some of my own, they weren't able to. Fine. Here's some money, sorry for wasting your time.

On the other hand, if the reason the scene doesn't go down is because of the performer, why should *I* pay YOU? Be it because you show up looking like crap, don't really feel like working, aren't vibing with your partner, etc. if it's on you, then I'm not paying you in addition to that. There are girls working right now who know they look nothing like the pictures their agent floats around anymore, yet they'll still show up to set after set, collecting kill fee after kill fee with no intention of actually earning their wage. Why should a girl be allowed to get sent home from three or four sets in a row ON SIGHT and STILL get paid just for showing up even if the problem is clearly HER and ONLY HER?

I understand Mike's frustration. You almost feel as though you're the one being ripped off and taken advantage of.

[Link]

Pagoda
Senior Member

Thread Killer
1747 Posts
10/05

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:02PM

You're probably hungover now, but here's a suggestion. Hire veteran talent exclusively. No newbies allowed. And pair partners that have worked together and shown chemistry in the past. That'll improve your odds.

[Link]

Beaver
Member

137 Posts
11/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 2:28PM

Prior to every scene you shoot just spell out to each performer what you expect and that if they don't live up to your expectations they aren't going to get shit (maybe make them sign a waiver if you have to).

One of two things will happen.

1) They will agree and do the best they can to live up to your standards.

2) They tell you to fuck off and you're too picky.

Either way you win b/c you'll either produce a solid scene or not waste your time.

[Link]

phatbasey
Senior Member

1390 Posts
1/05

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 3:22PM

I think the ever growing demand for fresh faces puts him in a tough spot. As "joe consumer" why buy a $29 ZT tittle if it stars say Kira Kenner when you can buy a Vivid/Raw disc for $4.99. Therefore some of the unprofessonalism is to be expected the best thing you could do is print out or augment the rant and let them read before you sign up. At least then you did all you could do.

Edited by - phatbasey on 8/18/2006 3:23:07 PM

[Link]

G_Jacobson
Member

Los Angeles
24 Posts
3/06

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:22PM

What's wrong with fucking someone who is stoned? Am I missing something? LOL

[Link]

Eric381
Deactivated User

What are you looking at? It
2452 Posts
3/05

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 5:57PM

Booze, it's what's for breakfast!

I thought this was hilarious, Quaze, regardless how serious t'was intended.

This fly on the wall just yearns to know...(in my best Lewis Black voice) "who"?? lol

Edited by - Eric381 on 8/18/2006 5:58:29 PM

[Link]

Janitor
Retired

Porno movies, sexy videos, xxx. Adult DVD Talk at your service.
6409 Posts
11/99

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 6:23PM

quaze - the rampant unprofessionalism in porn is the reason that those who display the smallest amount of professionalism are able to make an easy living. rant away, but know the competition for solid directors like you would be a lot greater if porn weren't full of bullshit.

that's what i tell myself every time we get ripped off.

(coming from the person who was ready to give up a couple weeks ago...)

[Link]

jimmyd
simplyjimmyd.com

58 Posts
2/03

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 7:20PM

Nice rant, Q.

So, what else is new? This is a new problem? Don't hire chicks you haven't actually seen, i.e., in person. If you do, and she doesn't look remotely like her pic on some agent's site, send her home without the kill fee. If she has a problem with that tell her to take it up with her handlers. They're the ones who put up the bullshit picture.

If she ain't giving at least 80% to the scene, tell her you're gonna call off the scene and see if that wakes her up. If it doesn't, send her packing. And don't give her the kill-fee on the set. Have a talk with her agent first and negotiate the kill-fee... Since when did $400 become the standard kill-fee?

Someone mentioned pornstarperformance. fuck that. that site has no credibility unless you happen to know who wrote whatever and you think they have some credibility.

I'm not telling yu your business. Like me, you've done this long enough and you know the score. But here's the deal, it ain't like there's a shortage of talent. Let's make the agents guarantee a little something more out of their clients then she'll simply be on the set on time. I mean, c'mon, who's paying who here?

[Link]

christianx
Senior Member

1883 Posts
9/04

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 8:21PM

quaze, once again, i felt really badly about that. i hope there is no hard feelings. believe me, i wish i could have continued with the scene! i guess we will try again next time! lol

[Link]

ma meeshka
Iconoclastic Member

3939 Posts
4/06

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:48PM

quality rant.

[Link]

Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 9:52PM

I wasn't specifically talking about you dude. It's not your fault the broad smelled like a carp.

Did I mention that it's been a long time since I've consumed vodka. Back to red wine. Less anger and less blood poisoning.

[Link]

cobalt60
Knuckle Dragger

2046 Posts
2/03

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 10:03PM

Newcastle!

*hic*

God, but it give me the gout. But it's fucking delicious.

[Link]

Tyler Knight
Member

139 Posts
3/05

Posted - Aug 18 2006 : 11:03PM

Tyler Knight wrote:
G_Jacobson wrote:
Kimi Lixx wrote:
That being said, I wonder if there is a tactful way for talent to say, "I can't get into this scene, this guy is abusive, repulsive, and I think he's stoned.
Click to expand
What's wrong with fucking someone who is stoned? Am I missing something? LOL
Click to expand
If it affects the quality of the scene, a lot. Every vocation requires a certain degree of professionalism, and pride. Kimi, I think that pulling the director aside and expressing your feelings the way you wrote it here is not a bad idea. Only a moron would'nt respect you for your honesty, and at least would try to talk to your scene parnter. He'd be shooting himself in the foot if he didn't. I've done it more times than I would have liked for various reason. Hygene, un identifyable sores, belligerant/ uncooperative scene partner, ect., but I don't regret doing so. Interestingly enough, when I first met you Q, we knew right off the bat that I was going to have an off day before we got too far into it (certainly not the girls fault, she was great), and you asked me straight up if I thought I was gonna struggle. I said yes, and we canned the scene. Saved us all a lot of time, as well as having to put our names on a lack luster scene. I respected that. A lot of shooters would try to force it to work.

Edited by - tyler knight on 8/18/2006 11:27:08 PM

[Link]

realtip
Deactivated User

2301 Posts
6/04

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 12:43AM

From reading this thread, I'm just wondering where the responsibility of the director comes in to actually direct the scene in direction he wants it to go. If the director feels that the girl is giving a subpar performance, why not just tell her what he expects her to do instead of just getting frustrated and cancelling the entire scene because he doesn't like what he's filming? Does the girl actually complain all the time and say she doesn't want to be there, or does the director just assume this? The example provided of Jenna Haze is a fine example of an involved and proactive performer. However, the job of the porn actor/actress is to perform. They should not be expected to have to do the director's job too. If that's the case, what's the point of having a director in the first place? Might as well just let the girl direct the scene since she is obviously the one who is expected to not only fuck, but to also make sure the scene is outstanding from every other standpoint as well.

Having said that, I do believe that girls should be provided a kill fee, but not just for showing up. Directors should not have to pay a kill fee for a girl just walking through the door. However, if she gives a scene, but the scene is not complete because the director decided to cancel it (which is basically what the opening post of this thread says), then she should indeed be compensated for whatever work she has already done toward the scene. It is true that porn performers should not show up on set if they don't want to have sex. Likewise, directors should not take up the duty of directing if they expect the performers to be able to read their minds rather than just acknowledging them of what is expected in the scene. As in all other professions, I'm sure communication in porn also works both ways.

[Link]

Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 12:59AM

realtip wrote:
From reading this thread, I'm just wondering where the responsibility of the director comes in to actually direct the scene in direction he wants it to go. If the director feels that the girl is giving a subpar performance, why not just tell her what he expects her to do instead of just getting frustrated and cancelling the entire scene because he doesn't like what he's filming? Does the girl actually complain all the time and say she doesn't want to be there, or does the director just assume this? The example provided of Jenna Haze is a fine example of an involved and proactive performer. However, the job of the porn actor/actress is to perform. They should not be expected to have to do the director's job too. If that's the case, what's the point of having a director in the first place? Might as well just let the girl direct the scene since she is obviously the one who is expected to not only fuck, but to also make sure the scene is outstanding from every other standpoint as well.
Having said that, I do believe that girls should be provided a kill fee, but not just for showing up. Directors should not have to pay a kill fee for a girl just walking through the door. However, if she gives a scene, but the scene is not complete because the director decided to cancel it (which is basically what the opening post of this thread says), then she should indeed be compensated for whatever work she has already done toward the scene. It is true that porn performers should not show up on set if they don't want to have sex. Likewise, directors should not take up the duty of directing if they expect the performers to be able to read their minds rather than just acknowledging them of what is expected in the scene. As in all other professions, I'm sure communication in porn also works both ways.
Click to expand

I find your presumptuousness amusing. Sex performance, particularly in the "gonzo" genre, requires a great deal of personality from the performers. There is no script. They are not playing characters. It is impossible to create a sexual personality for a performer who would rather be knitting a quilt. I can not "direct" someone to have a pulse other than to say things like "a little more enthusiasm... pretend your enjoying yourself....please don't make that face like you're smelling something bad..." Perhaps I should incorporate a taser into my repertoire. The bottom line is William Shatner will never be Robert Deniro and some girls presently working in porn should stay home and knit quilts.
I'm sure you would do it much better than all of us if given the opportunity

[Link]

Eric381
Deactivated User

What are you looking at? It
2452 Posts
3/05

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 1:03AM

Fuckin' Khrighst....don't say that??!! What would all us fanboys do without the great host & hostess of ADT?

Quaze...a carp? OUCH!!

Eric (who's getting his drink on at the midnight hour)...Sambuca, Quaze, Sambuca...goes down like Twizlers!

Tyler, nothing wrong with that. It would SUCK to wake up a week later with a dick that looked like a Christmas cactus all because you thought that "questionable sore" looked suspicous. Good for you, man!

Quaze -v- Realtip = battle of the minds, I'll go to PPV to watch this and even put bets on who wins.

Edited by - Eric381 on 8/19/2006 1:11:23 AM

[Link]

realtip
Deactivated User

2301 Posts
6/04

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 2:13AM

Mike Quasar wrote

Dude, don't be so sensitive. I meant nothing personal against you. My comments were not aimed specifically toward you or any one particular director, but was just about porn directors in general. It just so happens that you are the one who started this "drunken rant," so I was kinda speaking to you rather than about you.

Anyway, I'm just failing to see what makes a girl "unprofessional" simply because she doesn't sport a fake grin all through the scene or repeatedly holler those obnoxious fake moans that I just always love hearing. You say that the performers "are not playing characters," but it seems like that's kinda what you want them to do.

I remember on the first job I ever had, my boss called me in his office for my evaluation. It was a stellar evaluation with only one problem. Not my attendance. Not my job performance. Not any lack of skills or job knowledge. It was none of those things at all. Instead, the only complaint he had for me was that I didn't smile enough. Yes, that was his only complaint. He told me that I needed to look "more happy" about my work. So everytime he walked past me, I would have to wear a stupid fake grin on my face. Otherwise, he would scream, "Smile! Smile!" It was damn annoying. This is exactly what the situation you describe reminds me of.

Personally, I much rather see genuine reactions in porn. I am tired of all this fake "enthusiasm" that girls are always expected to have. It's one thing if the girl is undependable; she fails to show up on time or doesn't show up at all; she relentlessly complains; she looks a hot damn mess; she pulls stupid antics on set (such as throwing a tantrum or locking herself in a closet); she plain won't follow directions, etc. With all that, I can understand cancelling the scene and having issues with paying a kill fee. But to cancel a whole scene because the girl is not "pretending" to enjoy herself enough just seems crazy to me. Maybe she wants to hurry up and get the scene over with because she has her grocery shopping to do that day. Maybe she just wants to do her job, but is not really in the mood to put on a fake happy act. Who knows? As long as she shows up on set and does her job, why does she have to also "pretend" to enjoy herself about it too, especially if she's really not?

As much as I want to, no comment on that remark.

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Loraine
Senior Member

1559 Posts
3/04

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 6:26AM

realtip wrote

I think that in this case pretending to be enjoying yourself is the job.

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TonyC
Comstock Films

2523 Posts
8/03

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 7:07AM

Automatic disqualification to ever hold a camera, or even be within 200 yards of anything referred to as a "set".

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Brandon Iron
BrandonIron.com

3832 Posts
3/02

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 7:18AM

Ah, I long for the days back at Extreme Associates where the term "kill fee" had some teeth! I mean, either the girl performed or....

(Just kidding.)

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Crucifixio_Jones
Senior Member

Arrogant & Obnoxious Narcissist
4727 Posts
10/03

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 7:52AM

I always thought that Alek James Hidell and his Slap Happy series would've made a perfect fit over there...

Wait a minute.

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Drew Black
broken crankshaft

8009 Posts
9/99

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 8:39AM

I read this and thought about how I miss the old Mike Quasarrants.com site. I remember the good old days when Jenna was just a girl getting into the business and dating your assistant Snoopy (or Spanky or whatever his name was). How things have changed.

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Drew Black
broken crankshaft

8009 Posts
9/99

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 9:39AM

It was Scooby.

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katsirk
Member

Crush on Greg....mmm
812 Posts
7/06

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 10:00AM

C'mon Scooby Doo, I see you, we got some work to do now..."

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Mike Quasar
Zero Tolerance

Reluctant pornographer
1765 Posts
7/01

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 10:40AM

She reminded about that. She remembers very clearly that I referred to her as the "Vixen of Violence" and the "Diva of Destruction" and also that she was going to sue me for something called "depliction" of character. Apparently she's forgiven me :)

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BustdownGal
Member

539 Posts
7/06

Posted - Aug 19 2006 : 11:18AM

Pornstarperformance is a very interesting website

They're allowed to name names there.

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