Latin Psycho was a fun movie (and a great dvd), but there were some great scenes filmed that never made the disc.
For those who have seen the film will notice the out-takes at the end of the film ( 10 seconds worth ), contain an awesome double penatration (in some crazy positions) that don't appear in the film.
I understand that for one reason or another, certain footage is not used, but this particular scene REALLY SHOULD have been on the DVD as EXTRA FOOTAGE.
Stuff like this doesn't usually bother me but when the out-takes look better than the actual scene, one has to wonder what else is not used.
Sadly dps are being edited or cut too frequently in Rocco and nacho DVDs lately,in Animal Trainer #8 Dora Venter is shown taking a cowgirl dp, ..well you will not see it in the DVD,same thing with Gessica Masaro's double pussy penetration in revers cowgirl position in Super Moto Hard, ....Tricia PLEASE! let Rocco know that he can edit anything out of the sex footage but for the love of GOD!,tell him not to touch dps segments just to save time. there are some Evil Angel fans (like myself) that want to see euro babes taking all the double penetrations they can take (one dp position is not always enough)
I completely agree with you Wally and Hardz. Why on earth would they even edit out a double penetration scene when they are such an integral and important part of any hardcore fuck flick, and especially one from the legendary Rocco?! Stop this practice now EVIL ANGEL!!!
Poor Turkey running for her life with Christmas Hat 3713 Posts 9/01
Posted - Apr 6 2002 : 7:18PM
I too agree that EA should not edit out any dpp, dap, or dp scenes from the video or the DVD. In Animal Trainer 5, there is a still picture of a dp of Janice in both the back cover and the special features, but that whole dp scene is cut from the DVD. There is no dp of Janice and a very short dap scene (which also seems to have been somewhat butchered). Why do they edit out the best scenes and leave the rest? Some of the remaining scenes in AT5 could be cut IMHO.
I too want to see Dora's dp in AT8.
Please EA, do not join Anabolic/Diabolic in making the horrible mistake of bad edits. Both Anabolic/Diabolic and EA make great releases, which should not be ruined by bad editing decisions. Keep everything, especially daps, dpps, and dps. If anything has to go, get rid of some of the tease sequence (although that is also a bad editing decision as the tease scenes are fun to watch).
I just want to make this clear Dora Venter gets a revers cowgirl dp in AT 8 BUT on the DVD case she is shown taking a cowgirl dp too and that dp is nowhere to be found in the DVD,that is why I said one dp is no always enough. (we want lots of lengthy dps,please)
LOL! But I know what you mean Wally, I also wish the double penetration scenes were a hell of alot longer. If I had my way in these movies, I'd have them do a cowgirl DP for at least 5 to 8 solid minutes and shot from all angles, and then a reverse cowgirl DP for the same amount of time. Of course, that could also include double vaginal/anal as well - depending on how receptive the participants are...hehe
I think the trick is that often the still photos are shot separately from the continuous-action sex. So the performers may briefly get in a certain position, hold it for a moment while a photo is shot, and then untangle themselves. Check out the extra footage on Beautiful Girls 4. In the behind the scenes portion, you can observe many of the still photos being shot, moments which make it to the cover but are not part of the movie itself.
DP's are okay but I wouldn't call them "integral and important" to "any" hardcore movie. I can think of a dozen reasons why they edited the stuff out-time being way down the list as it's from Evil Angel. Maybe the few seconds of footage you saw was the only hot part-maybe she vomited right after. In any case, given the overall quality of EA's releases, wouldn't it make more sense to assume that Rocco (or whomever was editing that day) cut the footage that didn't work right, lacked heat, etc.? The act itself isn't what makes it hot, it's the chemistry between the performers that does that...
I have to agree with HD here, for me it is the chemistry between the performers that makes porn successful That's why I get so much enjoyment out of all these Nacho and Ribas movies I have been reviewing. The guys and girls tend to be really enjoying each other's company. An example of "chemistry" having nothing to do with couple's porn is to look at LeCastel's movies. Many of the older Assman and Debauchery volumes feature women (and men!) who aren't especially good looking, and who clearly don't really want to be there once they are getting analled and DP. They have a look of, "Please God, let this be over..." on their face. But in later volumes of the series, you get women who are better looking and more into the acts. The men are a bit better too, so everyone is more arroused. This results in scenes such as the last one in Assman 16, with Isabella getting DPed by Lexington Steele and Pascal St. James. She is having fun with them, and laughing and trading jokes with cameraman LeCastel, and the scene works well. I enjoyed it in a way I simply could not enjoy many of his earlier scenes. Simply having a DP doesn't make or break a scene, and Nacho, for example, has many very hot scenes with no anal at all. And I suspect that people who enjoy Vivid or Wicked movies wouldn't consider the Killer Pussy anal-free scenes to be "couples" at all, because the material I consider to be for couples has soft lighting, editing tricks, more of a set-up, and most of the sheer animal lust replaced by supposed romance.
Poor Turkey running for her life with Christmas Hat 3713 Posts 9/01
Posted - Apr 7 2002 : 2:21PM
I agree with Hardz that the sex act is everything. We are talking about gonzo porn here and not couple's porn. Often with Rocco's video/DVD, there is a lot of tease play before the sexual act. Now the tease play is fun, but I usually fast forward through the tease play, and anyway, seeing it once is enough. It is for the sex acts that I am buying the video/DVD. I want interesting sex acts instead of plain vanilla boring stuff. Seeing new girls is interesting, but seeing dp's, seeing dpp's and especially seeing dap's are the most important things, at least to me. So I would want all dp, dpp, and especially dap scenes kept, even the dap scenes that are marginally successful.
Still photos that do not reflect the actual sex act should never be used in the cover or in the extra stills in DVD's (or if used are clearly depicted to be stills). A still of a solo model in a pose is different as is shows the star, but a still of a sex act that is in the cover and NOT in the release is downright misleading. We are talking about a very high quality company, EA, and not one of the sleazeball fly-by-night porn companies that make compilations with covers that do not reflect the content at all. All sex acts on the cover must be in the release. If I see a reverse cowgirl dap of Ms XXX in a particular costume being serviced by stud YYY and ZZZ in the cover, I expect to see the exact same scene with the exact same talents and the exact same costume. The cover must be a true and completely accurate representation of the release. That way, I can buy the title and be sure I am getting what I expect. Many porn companies (not EA) have a bad reputation because of the sleazy tactics used on the cover. I usually avoid buying releases from those companies as a matter of habit. EA does not intentionally make misleading representations, but having stills on the cover and not in the release is somewhat misleading.
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Apr 7 2002 : 6:49PM
John Stagliano was one of the first directors to put LOTS of pictures of sex on the back of the boxcover. This was to show the viewers what was in the movie, and get them excited and wanting to rent/buy it. So we understand how bad it is to have a picture on the boxcover that isn't represented in the video/DVD. The final problem comes when the actual still pictures get picked. The person who picks these is NEVER the VHS editor, and often not the director or the DVD producer. Speelie and HoustonDon both gave a few of the reasons why the pictures might not match.
As for why the specific act is not in the movie, that depends on the editor/director. Some of the directors edit their own movies, but only John Stagliano's and Christoph Clark's movies get edited by John or within the Evil Angel offices. John has encouraged the other directors to be slightly more lenient about the quality of something like a DP or DAP. However, it is considerably less quality, he has asked them to consider putting it in the DVD extra footage. If we start putting lots of bad quality stuff in our movies, we will no longer be the quality company that many of you agree that we try to be. I understand that a lot of you believe that if it's different or outrageous, it's worth seeing, but we try to put a standard on our quality. As for it going into the extra footage, I agree that there's no reason it can't be there, and we've asked the directors/editors to also consider it.
To go back to the still pictures/video issue, we are trying VERY hard to not mess up. But even when the DVD producer (often the only one in the EA offices who has seen the entire movie at that early point) is the one who picks the pictures for the box, it is still VERY difficult to remember every position that was or wasn't in the movie. To remember that a girl did a DP is one thing, but to remember what position, on what couch, or other specifics is often very difficult, especially when we are trying to be reasonably efficient with our time.
I totally understand that it is upsetting for all of you to think you're going to see something that you aren't, and we're trying our best to not let these mixups happen.
Bravo, Ron! I couldn't have said it better myself and I holeheartlly agree with you. I'm into gonzo, extreme-type porn and nothing else. If it doesn't have intense anal, DP and gangbang action, it is a waste of my time and money and I'll throw it in the trash. Who cares if the sex is clinical or mechanical? Hello! This is pornography we're talking about here! But hey, its fine if others want to see boring couple's porn - thats their choice. But as for me, I want to see the nastiest, most hardcore sex scenes with beautiful young women getting all their holes used and abused and then swimming in semen. Thats why there are righteous babes such as Monica Sweetheart and Jenna Haze in this line of work: cuz they luv to fuck and like getting paid for it. And I'll gladly spend whatever it takes to see these gorgeous hotties in action, cuz thats exactly what I wanna see and nothing will ever change that!
Edited by - Asmodeus on Apr 7 2002
[Link]
Steve K. Deactivated User
840 Posts 11/01
Posted - Apr 7 2002 : 7:43PM
Good Job Asmodeus - I couldn't of said it better myself. Jenna Haze was one of the best US porn ladies who used her abilities to the fullest.
Thanx Steve, but I'm just one of many here who feel the same way when it comes to what we all like in erotica. Like I said before, I have no problem with those who like so-called "vanilla" porn. If they want to see that, thats thier business. I, on the other hand, prefer the most radical and extreme porn there is and thats all I will ever watch. That is why I stick only to the producers I know and trust to give me what I crave, such as Anabolic/Diabolic and Evil Angel to name a few. I really don't mind spending a fortune on this stuff, cuz its what turns me on and as long as there are customers like myself willing to spend the money I'm sure they will continue to crank out the product! And of course, as long as there are delicious babes like Jenna or Monica willing to do what ever it takes in front of the cameras, thats all that really matters...hehe
About HoustonDon comments that dps are not an integral and important part of any harcore movie, ..well I think they are,as soon as they are shown on the DVD case,I can watch a girl getting fucked with no anal once or twice (if she is really beautiful) but after that I need to see the euro girl taking some dp action,if she will not do it for me well all I say is NEXT! ..and about the act itself isn't what makes it hot,it's the chemistry between the performers that does that, ..well I would like to be the judge of that by watching the complete dp scene,maybe the chemistry is there and the editor didn't see it,(maybe he needs glasses : )
Speelie, some people just don't get it. They view acts and heat as mutually exclusive factors in a porn movie. They are, quite simply, wrong. Thanks for explaining it to them in more detail than time allowed me this afternoon. Maybe if we explained it in terms of animal lust they'd clue in (but I doubt it).
I wonder what acts will be needed once you've seen your fill of the listed acts. I suppose I should direct you to gay porn where the circus acts you like so much would be considered boring old vanilla sex. I actually agree with John Stagliano about the tease stuff too-it makes a good scene great! I do understand that you like the acts more than the performers but some acts don't make the finished product and it's unlikely to be a censorship thing.I agree with you (shudder) that the pictures should reflect what is on the dvd. I accept Tricia's explanation at face value as she has always been honest with us.
Tricia, you know that I'm not a fair weather friend like some here seem to be. Stick with quality over "different" every time, it's what your long term business is based on. I agree with putting weaker footage in as a extra but at some point, the really weak footage needs to be left on the cutting room floor (I know it's a digital medium but the concept is the same). Thanks for maintaining the high quality at Evil angel that has made people happy long before some of these guys were legally able to watch porn.
Ok, this may be off topic a bit, but HD, I doubt you've seen enough gay porn to make such an broad statement as this. Sure, there are a few titles that go overboard into "circus acts", but the majority of gay studios are putting out stuff that is decidedly vanilla.
Imagine if you will, Straight Vanilla sex, take out all the oral cumshots, and put condoms everywhere... that's how damn vanilla most gay porn is. Double Anal penetrations are actually pretty rare.
Wally, I agree that anything shown on the dvd case should be on the dvd. I suppose I'm wondering what the next "hot, hardcore" act will be for some of you once you have seen the 1000th DAP. What will it take to trip your trigger in a few years? I suppose the logical conclusion would be barnyard animals or gay porn where fisting is considered old hat. No matter-enjoy the acts you like. As far as the editing goes, especially at Evil Angel, I'm under the belief that the star-Rocco, for example, edits or has creative input into the editing. If the guy that was there thinks an act didn't cut it, I'm going to believe that he doesn't "need glasses" since he, unlike you or I, is being paid to provide what works on video. Stars like John Stagliano and Rocco have proven over the years that they know what's good and what sucks-by virtue of a profitable company if nothing else. If they think the footage you so desperately desire sucked, I'm with them, not you, on the matter.
Maybe Evil should release a series called, "Shit quality circus acts for those who hate high quality". That way, they would distance the better stuff from it and not upset their long time fan base to satisfy a vocal few "the act is more important than anything else" people.
Hi Joe! I have a number of friends that are gay, male and female, and while I don't regularly watch their stuff with them, I have seen a number of tapes (not dvd) where a rubber ARM was inserted up a performer's rectum. My comments were only in regards to the circus act watchers who think particular acts translate into good sex. Such acts as DAP are still fairly rare in mainstream porn too. No offense meant.
Houston,body! take it easy,looks like you are going to have a heart attack or something, ..nobody is attacking EVIL ANGEL,Tricia already explained why stuff like missing dps happens and that is good enough for me,at least they show they care,(one of the reasons I like Tricia so much!)
Poor Turkey running for her life with Christmas Hat 3713 Posts 9/01
Posted - Apr 8 2002 : 12:39AM
HD wrote that chemistry is important in the sexual act between the talents and nobody denies that chemistry is important. Chemistry on top of interesting sexual acts make the release great, while interesting sexual scenes without chemistry only makes the release good. However, if given the choice of great chemistry but strictly vaginal sex versus no-chemistry but a long hard pounding double anal, I will pick the double anal every time. I have not reached the 1000th double anal scene yet, but I am into the several hundred range and would hopefully reach the 1000th soon if the producers will cooperate and make more dap releases. My only caveat is that the female (and to a lesser degree male) talents are attractive. I will pass on great dap with great chemistry between dog ugly talents. I have seen other more extreme porn but have not found them all that exciting. I have not and have zero interest in gay porn so that is not an option for me. The few transsexual porn that I saw mixed in with straight porn were in the extreme fast forward mode.
We all have different tastes and I respect the taste of others. To each his/her own.
I also take Tricia's word that any misleading covers are accidental. In fact, I have clearly stated that EA is a very high quality company and not a sleazeball porn company, knowing how hard they try to produce quality products. Any mistakes are accidental. I do know that mistakes happen sometimes with the best of intentions. About the editing decisions, I am not so sure if the director always knows best. Some directors are clueless and others are just sloppy. I have seen many mistakes made by Anabolic/Diabolic that I think they were just due to careless editing. To a lesser extent, I believe that Rocco has also made some careless editing decisions. He tries to create excitement with rapid edits but sometimes misses important segments that add continuity and coherence into the release. Good editing is a very laborious process with the editor having to review everything many many many times to see which sequence makes the best possible product and I seriously doubt if any porn editor actually does that. I would go so far as to say that most mainstream films do not take all the time necessary to make the optimal edit. That said, carelessness is still not preferred in the editing process if it detracts from the viewer having full enjoyment of the release.
Well HoustonDon, it may be wrong in YOUR mind but certainly NOT mine, so please don't tell me my business. I have my likes in porn, you have yours. Like I said before, I'll spend my entire life savings on all the hardcore porn I want from the studios I want, but I will NEVER spend a single penny on that typical couple's crap that you keep raving about. Just why the hell do you think Rocco is the world's famous porn stud that he is?! From working with Vivid or Wicked? Fuck no! Its from working with one of the best porn companies in existence: EVIL ANGEL...'nuff said!
RonK & Asmodeus were right on the Money, haha. Chemistry is Important of Course, BUT if that's all there is, I'm not going to really Care for it. I want to See something only Gorgeous Porn Sluts can Do, Even it takes 3 to 4 People. That's why Private always gets The Bottomline, They pride in the Raunch, But Keep it Classy as Hell.
I just thought I'd butt in for a sec at this point:Now while I realise you're being facetious here, I could well reply just as tongue-in-cheek that your Wicked movies will have you watching only softcore lez DVDs where all the girls wear pasties on their nipples and gstrings that never come off in a few years. Or perhaps that you'll go from watching porn at all to a steady diet of MTV-dancing girls. Or perhaps even The Bold and the Beautiful.
Not quite the same level of insulting as insinuating as DAP leads to "all-gay-all-fisting" or "animal farm" but you get the idea. Surely you of all people can argue a point better than that.
(not that there's anything wrong with guys who play for that team..)
I think RonK made a good point:
Here Ron tells us that while he thinks chemistry is important, it's not the most important thing for -him-.
And, considering the company we're in here, with people who have watched literally hundreds to thousands of porn releases, I believe that all of us can be fooled without too much difficulty if we're seeing what we've trained ourselves to want to see.. the hallmark of a good performer in many ways ;)
What it comes down to is just relax and watch what you like and let these guys do the same. As we know, opinions are like assholes (in more ways than one) so I don't see a need to get all morally-superior or snide based on what you like to see in porn versus what some other guys like to see in porn..
Scipio, I'm a facetious type of guy, ya know? My comments were in response to what the vocal minority were saying. That it escalated into a "my genre's better than your genre" argument is indicative of how the handful of preachers have been here lately. I agreed with them that the sex act on the cover should've been on the dvd but also pointed out that Evil Angel is known for quality more than anything else. If they cut it, there was likely a good reason. My comment about chemistry drew almost as much fire as my belief regarding particular sex acts not being, as one of them put it, "integral and important" to "any hardcore" movie. Had the person used a qualifier, such as "for my enjoyment, I need..." but he didn't. But much of the time, no one noticed that my inial posting was a defense of Evil Angel, their beloved dvd producer, than anything else. They don't know why the company edited a sex act out but whined endlessly over it. Had they asked what happened, to Tricia for example, they may have found out what happened. It's enough for me that most of them started backtracking their original comments regarding chemistry. No matter, the thread is worn out and everyone had a say. I started a new poll about it and others, including the most powerful person at ADT, seems to agree that the "our likes are better than your likes" stuff is going to stop-one way or another. I can live with that.
Well said scipio! Unfortunately, there's been quite a few attacks, which I do believe were started by more of the extreme crowd than the couples crowd, that have generated down to borderline personal attacks. It's nice to see that some of that crowd does have a brain in their head.
I have to admit to being a little surprised. The act is the only thing important? If anal sex is all that's important, I'm sure people such as GaySatyr (not meaning to pick on you GaySatyr, but since you're one of the most frequent gay posters throughout all the forums you got chosen) would be more than interested in initiating you into a brand new lifestyle. Also, how many people would rather watch Ed Powers and Ron Jeremy DAP'ing a girl over Rocco or Nacho in a vaginal scene only? If the acts all that's important, and not chemistry, then it looks like your choice is clear.
Porno movies, sexy videos, xxx. Adult DVD Talk at your service. 6409 Posts 11/99
Posted - Apr 9 2002 : 10:12AM
If someone wants to continue discussing chemistry versus the sex acts then start a new thread. This thread is ridden with personal attacks. I'm closing it.
Introducing Lady LorReign
Posted - Apr 6 2002 : 4:40PM
