Good book. One thing Jay stresses in it is that no one should be so irresponsible as to perform anything that could result in permanent physical damage. It not only hurts individuals, it hurts everyone in the scene. Putting it on dvd and selling it to mainstream porn fans without so much as a disclaimer that "this could fucking kill you, folks, please don't try it at home unless you are willing to go to JAIL" is .. *sigh*.
I'll try again when I feel glib. My brow's too furrowed to be helpful right now.
I can't follow any post wordier than about 10 lines anymore ...
Unless of course someone uses that special Sportswami/TLTycoon Style line break thing Where words are capitalized for no reason and strange line breaks occur as if the person typing were gripped With the sense that they Are some kind of poet or something Who is bending mere Language to some kind of experimental purpose, or at least want to complicate Any reading of their treatise on Asslicking or Pimping Out little Susie Gonzalez from Home depot, y'know?
You've been playing around with breath play, haven't you?
I'm with jimn on this one - I think including the post text is worthwhile.
I also think Cobalt's point about what happens on screen is interesting. Porn seems to exaggerate every act to pantomime level, you know "make it big so the folks up the back can see it" in an attempt to make more "intense" or perhaps more "fantastical", but unlike pantomime, when people are having sex on screen, what is pretend or performance sometimes becomes difficult for me to distinguish clearly. The subtle but firm hand at the back of the neck becomes someone's head being shoved down a toilet, the same hand lovingly establishing who is in control becomes the grip of death...all without context and for me, pretty much all without eroticism.
This "stubbornly ignorant pornographer" has already read that article, as well as every other relevant article on the first ten pages of my google search. I still have not found evidence of one serious injury or death as a result of the type of behaviors in my films. Even in the example you gave, the writer says he won't say no one should ever do it. (not the exact wording). This article, does not come to any conclusion other than to say that it is possible to die by choking. In another article here you'll see a more in depth look at the risk and safety precautions one might take. Nice to know that you consider "public stoning" as something the public does not have the "enlightenment" to do. It truely presents you as someone who should be arguing against the BRUTAL act of choking someone who likes to be choked.
Good Game!! edited a million times because I couldn't get my link to work. Edited by - coffeeron on 9/18/2005 9:25:28 PM
Jay Wiseman I have two of his books and they're utter crap though i haven't seen any better alternatives. The man is far too cautious over everything so i couldn't learn much from him. What do do if your doing sm and your partner dies? When doing sm remember there could be an earthquake are just a couple i chuckled over.
in fairness, i haven't seen your films and i doubt every director knows what the guard is, let alone how to choke someone. nor do they have any interest in exploring what's physically happening and why, they just know it sold for redlight or whoever and they've gotta get a release to editing soon. the fact is, people are getting close enough to losing consciousness and some supposedly have crossed that line-you keep flirting with that line and someone's dead. i see little difference in the nuts and bolts between some of the porn choking and the deaths that do happen from accidental strangulation(cops, for instance) which don't end up listed as sex-play gone wrong. they don't keep data as precise as "naked choking without the intent to permanently injure gone wrong", it just ends up as some form of strangulation, be it accidental or homicide.
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bumlover Deactivated User
Manchester 68 Posts 9/05
Posted - Sep 19 2005 : 7:23AM
Was this an attempt to see how many patronising and negative stereotypes of porn people you could fit into one sentence?
Maybe we should have referees(medical professionals?) who can stop the fight, er scene, if there are too many unanswered punc . . . well slaps with a cock.
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I love Bandit Deactivated User
12 Posts 9/05
Posted - Sep 19 2005 : 8:11PM
so what happened on the Anabolic set was worse than a girl getting her face bashed in?
I was not there...I was with the director last week when this story hit, and I know from the discussions that followed that the story was so inflated it's ridiculous.
If I tripped over your foot, fell, and sprained my wrist. Someone reporting that you "threw me down to the ground so hard that my arm was broken in 5 places and I may not ever use it again" would be about the same exaggeration as that story.
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bumlover Deactivated User
Manchester 68 Posts 9/05
Posted - Sep 19 2005 : 8:57PM
Considering the fact that the performer and the director in question are both participants in this forum, perhaps we should wait for their version of events?
Porno movies, sexy videos, xxx. Adult DVD Talk at your service. 6409 Posts 11/99
Posted - Sep 20 2005 : 10:18AM
Please stop treating luke ford rumors as fact. He may be willing to take the libel risk. ADT is not. Please feel free to continue the discussion without making unfounded accusations.
Will it make any difference? I fear regardless of what performer says, some of you will claim she's been paid to not tell the truth. People believe what they want to believe.
It's really sad to see that some of you are willing to take tabloid crap as a fact.
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bumlover Deactivated User
Manchester 68 Posts 9/05
Posted - Sep 20 2005 : 3:16PM
I just think that if I was either performer or director, I would be straight on the case to say "This is complete bullshit, none of this happened.", rather than letting the rumor perpetuate.
All rumors I dont know of anyhow aside, put bluntly Extreme Associates (with lines like Forced Entry or Slap Happy) are pretty much the scum of the industry, Rob Black and Romano are right down there with other bastards like Khan tusion.
No matter how much credit big adult features like Pirates will get, no matter how many funds will be raised by Club Jenna for some good cause, all your dreams of more mainstream acceptance burst like a soap bubble thanks to the misanthropic output of some few sick-minded. Also the inability or unwillingness of other producers to dissociate themselves from these failures of society is likely to ultimately lead to a situation worse for everyone involved in American adult entertainment.
As an aside, to display fictional rapes and murders of people in pornographically context (for the whack of purposes of some mentally deranged pornfans) is against the law in many European countries. Not only the distribution but the ownership alone is declared illegal. In countries like France and Germany (and soon CZ and Poland) it just needs some upset citizen who points the authorities at such imported product to get it confiscated and the (european) distributor doing time.
I believe that sooner or later the majority of American public will no longer tolerate children being able to watch such sickness (like these meatholes trailers) by a simple click. I think mandatory age verification sytems will come in America as they are already obligated by law in many European countries. This will affect video on demand sites hosted in America as much as simple message boards like ADT. On a personal note, I have no problems with a fourteen year old watching pictures or movies of naked people having NONVIOLENT sex, but since there are always some producers who have lost any common sense and are full of shit their doings might well backfire on the entire American sex industry.
As for Coffee Ron´s Slap Happy series. Its sick misogynist hateshit shot by losers for a loser audience. This series is clearly made in a way to make the viewer think it is not consensual (unlike a SM scene which puts pain as sexual stimuli in another context). The viewers connect their sexual arousal with the display of violence against women (as seen in hard slaps in the face, apathetic choking or head stomping), such a connection of violence and sex in media is against the law where I live (putting all abundant "but it is consensual!" cries aside), and right so.
You got it? It is no excuse that there is (always?) consent it remains illegal to distribute this unwanted fictitious(?) display of violence and sex and no judge here will refer to rights such as liberty, privacy and speech like it happened in America. Even if you fail to understand that none of these rights can be given limitless but each must be balanced against each other doesnt change a damn thing about the fact that we deal here with conscienceless assholes rather than good people as some posters want to make you believe. Just as an aside over here you can sell pissing and fisting and whatever fetish you are into (except animal porn) but you can not sell movies displaying rape and sexual violence in pornographic settings (and thats apart from the problem that it would be difficult to judge if everything is acted anyway.) For me it makes perfect sense and I hope they will make these laws obligatory in the whole European Union. (Especially for Italy) So you can keep your shit where it belongs and drown.
What takes the cookie is when performers post here about NON ACTED mistreatment they had to endure and get prejudged as blubberer by some weirdo pornfans who have to fulfill their set visit quota, while other producers who should remain silent as a grave shake hands with their loser buddies behind their backs. It gets interesting or should I say scary? when producers try to exculpates themselves in advance. Hey, I saw it here at ADT. Its also alarming to just read some reviews posted here when it comes to a scene displaying violence or roughness in non consensual looking ways. If mentioned at all the jaded reviewer will very likely say something as it is rough stuff and not for everyone (to emphasize the right of the viewer to watch it without wasting a single thought about the message) or make wishful assumptions like "she/he did not look pleased but I guess s/he´s really into such treatment." From time to time a producer will join the discussion and tell you its all consensual tears and bruises and some messed up kid taken in tow will back that up.
Listen, if you can not shot, act or sell EROTIC tension in movies without having to rely on violence because you are either untalented, unimaginative, careless and ugly or all at the same time, do yourself and the world a favor and get another job.
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bumlover Deactivated User
Manchester 68 Posts 9/05
Posted - Sep 20 2005 : 7:40PM
But declining to comment is read by many as an indication of having something to hide. I can understand people not wanting to get drawn into defending themselves against unsubstantiated rumors, but personally I would make a public statement, even if it was short but sweet, eg. "This did not happen, and that's my final comment on the matter."
Or you can decline to dignify anonymous slander with a comment.
see, the thing is luke's right more than he's wrong and when he's wrong he puts up corrections. he's rarely, if ever, dead wrong-there's usually fire somewhere around luke's smoke and without him marc wallice would have kept working and infecting people. when he's running something on safety, you shouldn't dismiss it. where else are you going to find any news about the industry that's not ridiculously-biased? gene and south will put rumors up, but gene's for sale to the highest-bidding kerkove and south protects his buddies and goes overboard on his enemies, luke's never been out to ruin or hype anyone, he's just putting up what he hears and he's pretty good if it doesn't involve his mob-obsession. i have no idea why you don't like him other than he'll print mean stuff about your porn-friends or the gonzo-journalist credibility of an austrialian convert to judiasm with cfs writing porn gossip and about the jewish la media somehow threatens you(congrats on the reviews of da book, btw)
There's already a line, and it's called The Law. If these girls really do think more's happened to them than they signed up for, let them take the directors to court. If not, why don't the fans stop interfering with the talent's free choice?
Chloe Temple Interview
Posted - Sep 18 2005 : 7:46PM