Reviewers Recommend Best of Forbidden Scenes 27, The - review by Captain Jack Starring: Steve Holmes, Tommy Pistol, Donny Sins, Violet Starr, Avi Love, Riley Star, Jane Wilde, Dante Colle, Paige Owens, Zac Wild, Jay Romero. Read review
I have a high art, I hurt with cruelty those who would damage me. 225 Posts 4/04
Posted - May 21 2005 : 10:21PM
I am sorry .............that I am a mod AND like JM products, I didn't realize they were supposed to be mutually exclusive. Believe me I get no brownie points for kissing ass and if you were to check up on it I also "kiss" brandon's ass over THERE even though not many others over THERE care for him. I speak how I feel on the subject wherever I am posting.
You know what? As down as I might be on the JM worldview, I really don't judge ANYBODY strictly on what they jerk off to. But when somebody is so snarky & juvenile as to take the "My, you're looking beautiful today, Mrs. Cleaver" approach as in "Hey guys, first post .... etc" as opposed to seeking an honest discussion, then I'm forced to roll my eyes & believe it's not just a question of what they jerk off to, but that their immaturity level carries over into their personality in general, & that thus a true debate or exchange of opinions with 'em would be fruitless ...
I have no intention of spending waay too much time or bandwidth carrying this facet of the thread any farther, so I hope Hardware doesn't consider this last remark on the issue to be further "feeding of the trolls."
Are you pointing out that porn actresses aren't "real models" then, or are you unaware that on more than half the sets out there the talent is required to sign releases BEFORE the performance but does not get handed their money until at the very least right after -- though sometimes with the magic of "uh, we pay on payroll" it can take weeks & months for them to get their money?
I call it hate porn, because I think the guys who get off on it have serious issues with women. It should be labeled losers only, because that seems to be it's intended market.
Spitting, choking, and asking the girl degrading questions, while she's being fucked are all symptoms of an inadequate male ego.
But the more you humiliate a woman, the less of a man you really are, and that goes double for the insecure little boys who get off watching this junk.
Please don't confuse this with nasty sex. It's all about how it's presented, and no so much the act itself.
No, that's wrong. "I don't find it funny" would be correct.
There is no such thing as a universally objective standard of humor. You can find people who will laugh at almost anything. You could get into semantics about “the majority don’t find it funny” but take care to consider that “humor by majority vote” isn’t likely to be very interesting... Indeed as best I can tell most mainstream comics have been moving away from “popular humor” and towards edgy humor for some time.
It would be more useful for you to actually point out what is disagreeable in any such post rather than just say “I don’t care what he says he’s wrong just because!”
I see nothing problematic with either of the two posts you reference. Both discuss the topic at hand and address the original post. Neither agree with your viewpoint but that is not automatically a bad thing.
OK, I thought we had a climate of acceptance and tolerance on this board. I guess that has gone out the window. Because I like hard dominance/submission pornography ("hate porn") I'm a "loser" with "issues"? I'll admit that I own some JM product and other stuff that, while lacking the terrible cover blurbs and juvenile writing, could be considered harder and more degrading to the female participants.
Sign me up for the loser brigade. I'm glad you have my inner psychology pegged so precisely. It must make you feel good to be a "regular" fan of -hardcore pornography-, not one of those ewww... "losers" or degenerates who like that icky hate porn.
Really? What if the woman is terribly turned on by such treatment? Don't tell me that such people don't exist.So no women are turned on by humiliation. And those who are, don't deserve to have their fantasies fulfilled because the guys who do it are losers and have fragile egos?
And..... I'm even betting that some females out there, however crazy it may seem, watch this type of product, and actually like it. Hell, some probably even buy it. Even JM. Not everyone who owns a DVD with degradation or slapping or throat-gagging in it is a mental "little boy" or a degenerate loser.
No confusion here. All rough, degrading sex is necessarily nasty, but not all nasty sex is necessarily degrading.
Take a scene where a girl is getting fucked hard in the ass, and then the director zooms the camera in and ask "how do you think your mother feels about you doing porn?", or asking "does your father know you like getting fucked for money", or asking "do all your friends from school know you do this?".
It's not enough to just fuck the girl, they've got to humiliate her and hurt her feelings.
Semantics and pedantry are a sure sign of a healthy sense of humour ! Let it go . My blanket statement was meant to be a subtle twist on those "hilarious" descriptions from your very own JM productions . BTW mainstream comedians are by definition using mainstream humour , though they may claim for various reasons that they're edgy or alternative . That's a trick which has been used since before even radio began . Check out music hall acts for signs of just how little distance modern comedians have really traveled .Where did I say that ! It just struck me as funny (in contrast to the pathetic ad copy drivel) that virtually the only support in this thread for JM's stuff was coming from their own mods . That doesn't mean they're wrong to support it . But some people taking a cursory glance might like to know a few possible motivations behind their praise .
Oh and just so it's clear , I have no hatred for anyone just because they post at other message forums . That sort of thing is safest left to ADT's resident dog catcher and whatever mirror versions of him might exist on other boards . The issue was a matter of transparency and possibly borderline spamming/shilling . That , and just plain old amusement .
i don't own a JM movie and i challenge anyone to find evidence that i've ever called anyone a "dumb whore/slut/cock-socket/etc." but it's easy enough to tune out. it's just a schtick which probably attracts some fans who have issues with women, there's exactly the same undercurrent here dressed up with some insidious civility. i don't see evidence that JM's actual behavior is any more morally repulsive than RLD/PXP's inability to avoid bi-annual accuasations of sexual assault or quietly dumping HIV+ directors after they've gotten all the good PR they could. Rocco deciding it's a great idea to cut a condom up on the sly. wasn't the classiest thing i've heard of either.
JM's offensive to a lot of people, no more mean-spirited than "o-ring blowout" and they've had some decently funny press-releases. i'm probably of above-average intelligence and i find the monkey cage hilarious because it's a mix of smart people being incredibly juvenile and some total borderline personalities/misanthrops in the same place. JM isn't the reason someone insulted or offended you, there's no "typical" poster out of the assholes in terms of porn tastes.
honestly, as someone with no allegiance to the brand and definetly not of the genre, i think this has everything to do with hurt feelings and war between internet tree-forts rather than having any substantial roots. if jeff steward couldn't turn on a computer, dac never read nasty things said about himself, simp had a girlfriend and xpt didn't exist i don't think we'd be discussing this.
This is again an issue of taste. There are men who love this type of porn. There are women who truly enjoy humiliation, degradation, slapping, gagging, spitting, watersports etc. The products of JM, Piss Mops, Meat Holes etc. are just providing a product to a market niche. The question I suppose is if the women who do these scenes enjoy and want to do it. Is it disrespect, well YES. It is however consensual and if the performers like it and the public buys it then really it is just varying modes of sexual preference.
You just mentioned a couple of reasons why I won't buy anything from RLD and PXP, but you may well have a point about JM staff's behaviour when actually shooting their movies.
Whether degradation is more than a passing element in American Bukkake or not (and I think it is), at least there's some up front honesty about what's going to be happening.
I shouldn't think any girl is coerced into doing a Bukkake or a Gag Factor, and there shouldn't be any surprise that there's going to be lots of cum and gagging in those movies. And I can't recall (though that may just be down to bad memory) having heard about the girls being subjected to unpleasantness beyond what the specific fetish calls for.
In contrast I could well imagine some girls being very surprised at the general level of roughness they encounter in standard fare from RLD and similar companies.
That said, whether JM behind the scenes is all flowers and respect, I still personally detest the public image JM is projecting and will under no circumstances support them financially as a result.
Totally agreed. As I believe I've said before: The next time that schmuck tries anything like that again, I hope the tip of his condom is cut with garden shears with his wiener inside!
i do find some of the degradation stuff repellant, but i just don't see JM being substantively more disturbing than a number of companies-they're so over-the-top with some of the stuff it's hard to take as not being tongue-in-cheek and although i don't find much value or novelty in the "whore" shit i'm much more offended by the reports of uncle vinny, rocco and company doing horrible things to people in reality.
it's porn, it's sleazy, maybe none of them are particuarly great people but this just reeks of personal vendettas.
More than half isn't enough. I am saying that like in any business, you establish the amount and terms of payment ahead of time so there can be ramifications if it doesn't happen.
Couldn't have said it better myself. I'm in the same boat.
Except for the moderator part.
Lee O, I would not be so quick to assume that everyone over there posts the party line for brownie points. Brownie points are handed out over there by being at least halfway clever and funny. That's why James is so beloved there. His posts are entertaining. There is herd instinct everywhere, but I will honestly say that this thread doesn't exemplify it in that regard.
In all areas of my life I'm almost obsessive about not "following the crowd" if I don't agree with it. See my non-participation in the Brandon Iron roasting.
I like some of JM's product a great deal. But even more than that I maniacally despise people who think they should be allowed to decide what consenting adults do privately to get themselves off. That's just me. I'm actually very gentle, honest.
I'll quote the old mantra, if you don't like rough porn, don't buy it, or perform in it.
Sounds good, but forgive me if I don't believe you. Your posts, on most any subject, consist mainly of rancor and ad hominem, which clouds any actual point of fact substance so that it's effectively absent. You're rather intelligent, obviously, and I would much rather read germane comments from you rather than top shelf sniping.
We're still in agreement there. But if Dr. Beer's original quotes are correct, I still think that's out of line, and no longer just over-the-top hilarity by any stretch of my imagination.
That doesn't mean that I think your examples aren't worse (uh, double negative, cardinal sin). They are. But Vince and Rocco being in dire need of several swift kicks to the nuts, doesn't excuse JM's crap either.
i don't disagree with you. my issue was with the moral-superiority of the rest of the industry relative to them we're supposed to accept as a basis for a crusade. thing is, the crusade looks eerily similar to a witchunt, and we know those weren't personally-motivated.
You must have missed the huge thread devoted to Vince Voyeur's inner beauty , then . He's had his day in the sun . Ditto for the sniped Rocco Sifredi . There's no special witchhunt for JM or Meatholes or Max Hardcore , or Leisure Time , or Sunshine , or any of the other crap at the bottom of the pile . They all get my moralising attention eventually !
I realise it's probably early in the morning after a hard night out , but the old "xxxxxxx is just as bad" defense is beneath your smarts . Unless you're just looking to stir fry some shit . Didn't your momma ever tell you "two wrongs don't make a right" ?
Some people feel offended by Vivid and their ilk , others by Meatholes . Thankfully there's still enough disagreement to prevent this place turning into a full on gush fest .
actually, i saw plenty of support for him at the time, and those situations were real and this is make-believe. . all i see is someone who's taken a lot of shit there going after them. i probably would too, in fairness, but let's call it what it is. and it's not too early for me, i absolutely think you have to assess it relative of who's saying what and who's done what here. if i didn't post there i'd probably silently agree with you but dismiss the thread's direction as agendafest 2005, but with no justin timberlake. i don't want to defend something i don't really like, so i'm not going to anymore, just look at who's saying what.
I don't know who's been taking all this heat you're talking about , but this thread seems remarkably similar to the Vince Voyeur one - just with far fewer people having any interest . I guess more ADTers watch RLD instead of JM . WooHoo , a triple acronym in one sentance score . Waddo I win ! Waddo I win ?!
Porno movies, sexy videos, xxx. Adult DVD Talk at your service. 6409 Posts 11/99
Posted - May 22 2005 : 1:30PM
Yes. It's getting annoying as well as pathetic. I don't want to be in a position where I have to assume a company is trying to create controversy to promote their product. However, I have been put in that position and am closing this thread.
Please feel free to discuss the issues in another thread - without the shilling.
Best of Forbidden Scenes 27, The - review by Captain Jack
Posted - May 20 2005 : 6:52PM