Also, when I talk of "bits" of software, depending on where you want to burn this "VCD", "SVCD" or "DVD", this can be quite a time-consuming process involving many programs.

IMHO, generally not worth it.

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I realize that the qaulity will not be as good as DVD but the whole concept appeals to me. It seems like it could be cost effective to both buyer and seller. No need for packaging, no shipping and handling. However, Adult Empire seems to be a bit pricy given the quality. Especially for streaming video. Are their any other sites that offer VOD?

Still Campaigning for Inari Vachs
All I want to give you is the best part of a man --from The Full Bug by Van Halen
Endorphin's ADT Lair
LEGALIZE THE HERB

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There used to be software that could save streaming video to disk however I remember it caused a legal hassle and it may not be available anymore. I think it was called Streambox Ripper.

-- Snowman

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I imagine that after the seven days expires, the movie will no longer work -- like shareware software that offers a trial period. In that sense, it wouldn't matter much whether someone burned it to a CD-ROm or not. Also, if someone did burn it to a CD-Rom and then watched it within the seven days, they really wouldn't be doing anything they couldn't already do, except they wouldn't be teathered to one machine. I'm not sure if this is possible or not. It would depend on the way they set up the license key system.

About what Tricia wrote, I don't think copying it to a CD is the same as giving it to a friend. It would be more like purchasing a movie ticket - and then sneaking in a video camera so that you could watch the movie again later. It's not as bad because the same person would be viewing it. In a real sense, the marginal loss is more than likely zero, because the only way an adult producer would make money off of that person again would be if they purchased *another* license, which seems unlikely. On the other hand, if they gave it to a friend, now that friend, presumable interested in porn might not buy something he otherwise may have (although I think this is unlikey also).

Copyrights are fine, but I think the industry would be deluding itself if it thinks that the end consumer is a good place to focus their efforts in this regard. I'd estimate that about 85% of porn consumers who rent porn make home copies of the movies or parts of them if they like it. If consumers didn't have this ability, I think there would be a big drop in sales. However, in the long run, these people might develop a stronger interest in porn and turn into consumers who may purchase in the future.

I personally think that many porn consumers are willing to spend a few bucks renting a tape, and maybe another buck on a blank, but only a much smaller percentage is going to purchase a DVD. As the price of DVDs approached rental prices, the number willing to purchase will increase of course. In this respect, the industry doesn't lose much, because those customers never would have purchased an original sell video to begin with. It's a different market. Some people will be happy to rent the fullscreen version "Lord of the Rings" on a VHS tape at Safeway for $0.99 and others will rush out to buy the "Deluxe" letterbox edition with 16 hours of bonus material on DVD for $19.99. These are not the same consumers.

Where should adult producers focus their time, if concerned about copyright? Mainly on commercial activities. They should seek out adult video stores who buy one copy and then dupe five to rent out. They should also focus on piraters who manufacture bootlegs and then sell them in retail shops, swap meets or even places like eBay. Trying to crack down on copyright violations of the individual consumer is not only impossible from a practical standpoint, it is not cost effective and probably counter-productive in developing a market for porn.

Bring this back around to VODs again, I think the appeal of them is quite limited unless consumers have the right to burn a permanent copy of the program. This is *especially* true at the price point of $8.95 and 10.95. That is within a stone's throw of a regular DVD, which is superior in every way. Also, as another person pointed out, there are NO manufacturing costs, distribution, or S&H costs for the retailer. Looking at it from this perspective, it seems like a rip off for the consumer. The industry might be wise to offer VODs at much lower price point, perhaps $2.99.

-- Snowman

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Seems rather restrictive.

-- Snowman

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In my opinion, VOD is doomed to fail. Most VOD's I've seen just aren't high enough in quality for me to be able to get off while watching them. The ones I've seen even lack standard navigation (you mean I can't fast forward?? ARGH!)

In order for it to really take off, they need real time fast forward capabilites, as well as full screen semi-crystal clear display (which is possible). In fact, I've seen one company that has VODs that look great full screen. But there lies the problem. Once you get great quality streaming over the net, you are going to attract more and more pirates. And there are plenty of illegal ways for pirates to capture this video if they want to.

I've seen one company that allows downloads of their VOD with an option to keep it for one year. This uses microsofts Media Player DRM to make sure that the file is only playable on that one computer, and will stop working after 1 year. This seems like a more reasonable idea to me. Once the stream is fully downloaded, you'll have better luck fast forwarding, and you won't run into "Buffering..... please stand by" problems. Pirates would need to crack Microsofts Digital Rights Management to distribute the file (which, now that I think of it, is probably possible as well).

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But yes, I do think that a person trying to crack the code to be able to view it longer (or, in the example that Joeblow gave about Media Player DRM, to be able to view it on a different player or for a longer time) IS stealing.

The example about sneaking a video camera into a movie theatre is also an example of stealing, in my opinion, because if that person ended up liking the movie enough to want to watch it again, even from their camera tape, then (in my opinion), they liked the movie enough to pay for a rental or some form of repeat viewing.

At Evil Angel, our "focus" is not on the end consumer copying movies. We want our consumers to be happy, and the not-too frequent copying of our movies from a rental or from a friend is not going to make or break us. However, if that practice became too dominant, we possibly would start to see a decline in sales.
We do however, spend a lot of time searching out mass duplicators of our product, and do everything in our power to prosecute them. This doesn't apply to individual copies of product, of course.
Evil Angel doesn't put Macrovision on our DVDs because it isn't worth it. The types of things that Macrovision protects against are not what our main concerns are.

Going with Video On Demand for us was a difficult decision. We finally agreed to put on a somewhat limited catalog of our movies. It was always our hope that a VOD customer might see one of our movies and like it, and therefore rent or purchase a different one from us. If we discovered at some point in the future that people were defeating copyright safeguards on VOD programs more often than we were gaining repeat business from new customers, then Evil Angel would definitely decide to pull out of VOD until something new was developed, and the same with whatever the new device would be.

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Edited by - rieekan333 on 1/24/2003 11:33:12 PM

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I like the buyer/seller relationship. However, each part wants to milk the other for all it is worth. I have listened to Pyromania so many times that $13 seems like quite a bargain. I'm sure that Mercury wishes they had charged me a few hundred dollars. However, I also bought Beautigul Garbage and was quite a bit dissappointed. After the fact, I'd say I got about $1 dollar enjoyment out of it. Where's my refund?

Part of the problem with the record industry is that they are trying so hard to make themselves look important that they fail to see where the true importance is. The true importance is heard in the voice of the concumers. I have little patience for the company inflating it's importance. Example: #1 Crush by Garbage, a great song, is only available on the Romeo and Juliet Soundtrack. There is nothing else on there that I would be willing to pay for. I'd gladly pay $3 for that song, but I won't pay $13 for the entire CD. The option just to buy that one song is not given to me. Could it? Yes, I really think so. I am a fan of albums, but there really needs to be a better market for individual songs.

So what does this have to do with porn? As a consumer I like DVDs but I can see a market for something else. The idea of being able to download something, to have it instantly, to have it without the packaging and the expenses associated with it, sound appealing to me. When I first saw Empire's VOD I thought there was a new breaktrough. $8.95 for porn. Then I realized that I could only view that porn for one week. Didn't seem like much of a deal to me, in fact I considered it quite a rip off. Only Naughty Nav would choose instant but limited viwing porn over permanent collection porn for a difference of merely $10. Now, this could be profitable...but I think the industry could be better off by either lowering the price on the limited viewing or getting rid of the limits. I would glady pay $9 for something I could burn onto a Cd for my own private viewing (and the price of the CD). But I ain't paying $9 for less quality than a DVD and losing the right to view it a week later.

I think my idea has many merits and I imagine that 10 years from now that option will be readily available without being theft. The question remains as to who is going to see the value of it first. Evil Angel wink wink.

The environmentalists should love my idea. No packaging, less garbage.

Also of note. Downloads do not enusre less copyright infringement. There are programs out there that let you burn a DVD and there is always the standby VCR.

Joe Blow, where is this site that lets you download for a year?

Still Campaigning for Inari Vachs
All I want to give you is the best part of a man --from The Full Bug by Van Halen
Endorphin's ADT Lair
LEGALIZE THE HERB

[Link]

Actually, your idea is a very good one.
There is a company in Germany who was (is?) trying to get that concept started in a format similar to this:

Porn companies would license out movies in the form of scenes or whole movies to the German company's website.
Customers would log onto the website and have custom videos/DVDs/whatever made by purchasing selected movies or scenes.
For example, if the person liked Monica Sweetheart, they could search the site for scenes that she was in and purchase those scenes to be burned onto a DVD. Each scene would cost a certain amount (not all companies need charge the same amount for a scene), and the German company would split royalties with the original porn company.

Unfortunately, the logistics were very hard for that company to work out, and we actually haven't even heard anything from them in about a year.
But if something like that were done properly, Evil Angel would probably be very interested.

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As far as good ideas..the Germany company's idea sounds great. I remeber Flesh Peddlers 3. Most of it really sucked, but the scene with Charlie, Dee, and Melanie Stone, would certainly be worth a few bucks.

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The idea of a pay-per-view is that you can watch the movie as many times as you like for a certain period of time. Since the concept is similar to rentals, Action-DVD.com gives you 120 hours for a downloaded movie and 76 hours for a streaming movie. You can burn a downloaded movie to a CD and watch it from a different computer. With the current technology you’ll have to watch the movie on a PC. With all the limitations in mind, on-line per-per-view is still a great idea, since it gives one an option to watch the movie now, rather than waiting for it to arrive by mail.

Action-DVD.com Technical Support

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