Hi, I just received my first VIVID DVD (Masseuse #3) and was completely shocked and disgusted to find out that VIVID edits out complete scenes from their DVD releases to make room for their interactive crap and promos. For example, on the Masseuse #3 DVD, 3 1/2 sex scenes are edited out. 2 of the missing sex scenes had their star, Taylor Hayes, in them. (How do I know these scenes are missing? Because I read the review of the movie written by Roger T. Pipe on [url=467284]www.adultinternetservices.com. There are other ways to tell: read the cast list or carefully watch the trailer for the movie.) Apparently, this practice by Vivid is well known (but not by me!). You can read more about it at [url=467285]www.internetdump.com/users/jsmith So I hope that this will inform any other potential VIVID DVD buyers out there of what they are really going to get when they order a VIVID DVD. As for me, I will not be buying any more VIVID DVD's. While the few sex scenes that were on the DVD were really hot, it is just not worth the money. I can get high quality sex scenes (and lots of them) from other labels, such as Private.
wangwho69: Welcome to ADT! Yes, the fact that Vivid used to edit their features down on DVD (apparently they've caved to consumer pressure and won't be doing so in the future) has been well known. It's also been a frequent topic of bitching & moaning here on ADT, probably more than just about any topic. Here's the latest thread: [url=467289]https://www.adultdvdtalk.com/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=714&forum_id=1&cat_id=1</A . The studios are here and listening, so feel free to give your feedback--they take it to heart and, in some cases, even reply to your comments publically. Saki
------------------ [url=455144]My Adult DVD List</A (Updated 05/14/00) | [url=464769]My Adult DVD Reviews</A
I don't understand why the editing is necessary in the first place. I Just got my DVD player recently... so my collection is not that big yet... but I do have two special edition DVD's... Contact and The Birds (I'm a huge Hitchcock fan!! can't wait to get the Psycho and Vertigo SE's... and Rear Window is supposed to come out this year). Anyway, these two discs have tons of extra stuff on them and they are both one-sided. The Birds has not only the movie (close to 2 hours I think) but also an hour and a half documentary! Contact is the same. A move that is over two hours long and probably a good hour or more of "making of" extras... not to mention a number of audio commentaries that you can have run though the entire movie! So if mainstream DVD's can cram so much stuff on one side of a disc... why not VIVID? Are they using lower capacity discs to save money or something?
Hi all, Thanks for your kind replies. I guess my relative "newbie"-ness in the adult Video/DVD world has been exposed. In response to the comment by Saki (I think) about Vivid discontinuing this practice, I believe Masseuse #3 DVD was released around March 2000. So if Vivid really has discontinued the practice of ripping out sex scenes from their DVD's, I don't know when we will be able to start enjoying the benefits. If the people from Vivid are reading this, please, please, please do not waste any of the hot scenes you have from your beautiful stars. They should have the highest priority for DVD space - not the adolescent virtual sex games.
takeo: Those mainstream discs you mentioned are indeed one-sided, but they are dual layered (DVD-9), meaning that there are two "sides" encoded in different layers on one physical side. So you get the benefits of two sides without having to flip the disc over in the middle. For what it's worth, I believe Vivid is using DVD-9 on all of their flagship "Vivid DVD" releases, and on selected "Vivid Raw" titles. And, as a bit of trivia, Contact was the first DVD-9 released, by Warner Bros. back in 1997. BTW, Vertigo is the best classic mainstream DVD I've seen yet, and is one of my all-time favorite movies. five_star: Thanks for asking Vivid to respond. I know that they lurk, but it would be nice if they would interact and maybe shed some light on their thought processes. wangwho69: I believe that Masseuse 3 was released on DVD in March 1998. It may have been reduplicated since then, but I don't think that it has been remastered. Saki ------------------ [url=455144]My Adult DVD List</A (Updated 05/14/00) | [url=464769]My Adult DVD Reviews</A [This message has been edited by Saki (edited June 01, 2000).]
A little birdie told me that when Vivid used to drop their "A" titles to catalog, edits were made. When they press to DVD, they do it from the edited master, not the original. This MIGHT explain this phenomenon. Might not, just thought it could shed some light.. I did hear that this practice has since been eliminated so new Vivid DVD's should be ok. [This message has been edited by MasterB (edited June 01, 2000).]
What I would like to know is: WHY BOTHER IN THE FIRST PLACE !!!????? Surely it is more work for the studio to edit down a master and then release it, rather than release the original master in the first place. I really fail to see the logic of this. Unlesssss.....the idea is that mugs like us buy the chopped up version in the first place, then complain to the studios about it, who in turn "cave in" to the pressure and release the unedited version (which is their plan all along), which us poor saps buy again, and the studios make their money twice over. Call me cynical if you will, but doesn't this strike anyone as a little bit insulting ?
My understanding, Pasky, and Vivid is free to correct me if I'm wrong, is that the A List titles going to catalog are edited down to save money on VHS tapes, since they can save money on these older titles by releasing them on tapes with shorter running times. Therefore, there is a definite cost-savings motivation for the editing. It would make sense that Vivid used to use the edited VHS master for their DVD master. I just don't understand why they wouldn't use the original unedited master since there isn't much of a cost or technical limitation when it comes putting all of the footage on a DVD. I don't think porn consumers are as dedicated as mainstream DVD collectors. While Disney may be able to make money twice (or more!) on their releases, I don't see anyone who likes a particular adult movie enough to buy it again, especialy after getting burned in the first place. There's too much porn out there, and to be honest, there are not that many titles worth owning anyway. Besides, it's pretty expensive to master and press a limited run of discs, so it would be a big gamble to intentionally try to dupe consumers. The studios seem pretty risk adverse... Saki
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Pasky: What I would like to know is: WHY BOTHER IN THE FIRST PLACE !!!????? ======= Consumer contempt coupled with the need to save a few pennies per tape so they can keep their profit margin yet still retail them for $9.99. It just shows you that even Vivid, the kings of plotted porn, think so little of their *films* and *movies* that they're just jackoff fodder, so what does it matter if scenes are edited for space. A real indication on how far the adult industry has to go to be taken seriously as "art". Hopefully as more middle class consumers come in and crowd out the knuckle dragging raincoaters, this circumstance will evolve to consumers favor. The upwardly mobile who pay $4 for a cup of coffee and bitch about Charbucks will certainly not support this in the marketplace and will make their feelings of outrage and disenchantment known far and wide. God fear the tyranny of the self righteous materialist :-) DVD will help bring this about even quicker. Praise Allah And if the folks at five star and from what we've seen from complaints voiced about Private, Evil Angel and Up 'n' Coming is any indication, many of those working on the "inside" are actually concerned about quality control as well. Ain't technology grand? The Internet has stripped bare how this industry operates. Where any piece of crap can command dollars. Now thanks to chat groups like this, RAME etc. we can band together and share our experiences and gripes. I think as this develops even further this can only bode well for consumer input into porn. Where for decades the feeling was that the average stroker was too ashamed to complain about crappy product. Mooks of the world unite! BTW - Regarding Vivid's vivisection of their movies. There is a guy on RAME who has maintained just what films have been amputated so you can check and not buy mutilated porn. Anyone one of you brainiacs have that url handy? Torris
Hi, I'm the guy some of you were referring to who maintains the Vivid Outtake List. You can check out the most recent edition at [url=467287]http://internetdump.com/users/jsmith/vividsux.txt</A
I just wanted to add my two cents, as I see there is still some concern over this issue. First of all, the edited master is NOT the same version that gets copied to DVD. The DVD copy is a completely different cut all together. Catalog versions of videos are cut off at 70 minutes, but the edited DVDs are sometimes longer. For instance, check out Saki's review of "Masseuse 2" and you'll see the run time is listed at 90 minutes, while the reissued video is around 71 minutes. I believe someone brought up a good point about the real necessity for these edits. The only answer I can give is that it is simply a cost cutting measure, so to them, it's necessary. Vivid is trying to pinch pennies and save duplication time by editing their films to fit the 75 minute cassettes. They do not appear to the only company with such a policy as Legend Video, and Caballero employ similar tactics I was unaware that Vivid was planning on changing their policy with regard to edited DVDs, but I must say that I continue to remain skeptical. The last time I spoke with a Vivid representative, I was promised uncut VHS copies of both Masseuse films, and they did not deliever. Beware of Vivid DVDs and tapes! ------------------ J. Smith [url=467288]http://internetdump.com/users/jsmith</A [This message has been edited by JS (edited June 03, 2000).] [This message has been edited by JS (edited June 03, 2000).]
Caballero aren't clever enough to edit their VHS tapes. They just transfer the unedited feature onto a poor quality tape and abruptly cut off anything beyond 75 minutes when the tape runs out! Criminal behavior when you consider that their catalog includes many Golden Age classics. Has anyone seen Caballero's DVDs yet? So far I've only read a less than complimentary review of Night Trips 2. I was already put off buying this title by the sleeve(which looks like a lousy photocopy) and the review confirmed my suspicions. I'd like to hear any comments about the quality of their other titles like Amanda By Night,8-4 and Centerspread Girls. Any chance of reviews appearing on ADT? [This message has been edited by The Wanderer (edited June 03, 2000).]
The Wanderer: The Caballero versions of Night Trips and House of Dreams are in some ways better and in some ways worse than the DaViD versions. Better in that the menus are new and some of the more annoying video problems are cleaned up. Worse in that the supposed transfer directly from the "original film elements" still appears to be from a VHS master. And the most unforgivable thing of all is that they encoded each chapter on a separate TITLE, which triggers a pause between each and every scene. Caballero should be shot for doing that... Saki ------------------ [url=455144]My Adult DVD List</A (Updated 05/14/00) | [url=464769]My Adult DVD Reviews</A
Remember that DVD's have the capability to be double-layered and double-sided. This capability is rarely used. But this means that DVD's have potentially 4 times the space. Thus I see no reason for this editing. I can undertsand not making a double-sided DVD as that would probably raise the cost but my guess is that a double-layered DVD wouldn't cost any extra money. Thus I see no real need for editing. What I do find particularly annoying are the ads on the DVD before the movie. It really pisses me off that I can't skip the ad sequence. They should allow us to skip it, once you've seen the ads several times it gets annoying to be forced to fast forward through it every time. DVD's have the capability to skip and not just fast-forward so please let us skip those annoying and nasty ads. We paid for the DVD so we shouldn't be forced to see the ads every time we want to see the movie. [This message has been edited by DGF (edited June 04, 2000).]
DGF: It's actually more expensive to produce a single sided, dual layer title (DVD-9, aka RSDL) than it is to do a double sided, single layer disc (DVD-10). Not only do you have the physical challenge of encoding two layers on the same physical side of a DVD-9, but it's a lot easier and cheaper to use the same master for the side B of a DVD-10 over and over again (that's why the extras packages--trailers, clips, etc.--are often the same on the side B of many studios that use DVD-10. By using flipper discs, the only concern the studio has is basically determining the content on the main side. As far as ads, I don't like them either, but it was only a matter of time before they started appearing on DVDs. You'd be hard pressed to find any adult VHS tape without the normal phone sex and website ads on them. It comes down to a revenue issue--just like magazines that have 1/3 of their pages dedicated to ads, studios use those commercials to defray the cost of production. And as DVD's popularity grows, I'm sure we'll see more of that. Saki
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PornBoy Deactivated User
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Posted - Nov 22 2000 : 11:32AM
Do you knbow if Dyanna Lauren's Bad Wives is edited because I liked that movie when I rented in on video and I would go ballistic if anything was taken out for the DVD transfer.
I heard that this was Vivid's official response about 6 months ago regarding the extras and deleted scenes.
"We pride ourselves on providing you [the customer] with additional footage from our other features leading to our 4 Hours label on all of our DVDs. In order to do this, we must make some cuts within the movie itself."
This I was told was from a former employee of Vivid Interactive and evidently, it is not something that Vivid themselves have control over as Vivid Interactive is a separate company.
This was told to me by the owner of a local retail store that phoned Vivid in response to customer complaints. He added now that Vivid is including this 4 Hour bonus disk, their practice of deletion may be ending.
It almost appears as if Vivid is trying to flood the market with their product and by saying it has 4 hours (which it doesn't), they can gain market share. Too bad it seems to be backfiring as the American public doesn't appear to be as stupid as Vivid and the presidential nominees might think.
here on ADT, probably more than just about any topic. Here's the latest thread: [url=467289]https://www.adultdvdtalk.com/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=714&forum_id=1&cat_id=1</A .
