Evil Angel is a seperate company from Elegant Angel, though at one time they were together.
Euro Angel, I believe, is a part of Christoph Clark, who shots for Evil Angel. So Euro Angel is not a seperate studio, but a production company(?) of Clark's.
Evil Angel was founded by John "Buttman" Stagliano, and Elegant Angel was a part of Evil Angel, which was founded by Patrick Collins. They were partners but seperated the two companies after different directions got in the way.
Plus I hear that Patrick is/was very controlling, while John is more laid back, easier to work with.
Of course I am not the most qualified to answer this question, and the above is what I've pieced together from my brain, after reading various forums.
Evil Angel is a totally seperate studio from Elegant Angel, and Euro Angel, I believe, is part of Evil Angel.
Elegant Angel turns out some great releases, though not nearly as many as Evil Angel. But Elegant has gotten better lately, though the extras aren't Evil Angel's caliber.
Squid, Evil Angel is definitely the more consistent, quality company. Christophe shoots for Evil Angel and most of the other directors are up to his quality. You'll have to sample the other director's works though, because they each have their own flavor and you need to find your cup of tea.
Cheers for that!! As I said I'm a fan of Christophe's work, but I will definately look into the work of others from Evil Angel. Probably a few from Elegant Angel as well.
Evil Angel turns out the most consistent porn, I'm a huge fan of JOEY SILVERA, because he is quirky.
Jules Jordan is next, and then Christoph Clark. A few of Rocco's are great. Buttman is great, but a bit too much ass tease for me.
John Leslie is my least favorite of the bunch, though sometimes he turns in solid films, but he can be a bit too artsy-fartsy for my tastes.
Christoph Clark is a great director, definitely on the extreme side. I'm a fan of Christophe Clarkes work, so would like to get hold of any stuff which is similar.
Jules Jordan is right up with him.
---BIGmike, over & out!---
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hurricane Deactivated User
103 Posts 4/02
Posted - Aug 29 2002 : 9:41PM
Squidmonkey, here in Europe Evil Angel DVDs are hard to get and expensive. But several EA titles are now available for a reasonable price (20-25 euro) in PAL format at these European labels:
- Shiva (e.g. Lex the Impaler) - Night Trips (e.g. Buttman) - MMV (Rocco, Buttman, C. Clarke's Euro Anal Teens)
Yeah I think I'll try out various directors and get a feel for each style of work that they all produce. To be honest I didn't know that they all worked for Evil Angel, so thanks for that!!
Hurricane
Cheers!! which European mailorder shop would you reccomend to get these titles??? any suggestions??
Thanks again
SQUIDMONKEY
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PornManiac Deactivated User
aka Steve K 325 Posts 7/02
Posted - Aug 30 2002 : 7:09AM
Erodvd.nl and orgazmik.com are about the best mail order. I would try those.
I have good experience with both: www.buy-nowshop.com -MMV- if there is a title you want that is not listed on their site, just email them and they will inform you whether it can be back-ordered. www.erodvd.nl -Shiva, Night Trips, MMV-
No not a Evil Angel fan site but in the DVD arena and for overall consistancy Evil Angel is the better of the two companies. When they first split I would say the two companies were equal in quality and doing extremely hot movies but after the whole split with Rob Black and company Elegant Angel kind of lost their way.
Only recently have their videos started to improve again and their DVD production is way behind the times as far as quality of transfers and extra's.
All of the individual directors at Evil Angel have their own distinct style.
BIGmike - you actually did a good job though if memory serves me (Tricia correct me if I am wrong) Elegant Angel was actually started during John's partnership with Bruce Seven and at first was the producer for all girl movies for the company. When Bruce moved on to his own company Patrick moved in and then started making b/g movies under the Elegant Angel name.
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DenverDon Benevolent
Firmly Embedded in Depravity 5914 Posts 7/02
Posted - Aug 31 2002 : 12:50AM
Tricia,
I'd be interested in your response/confirmation to lee-carvers post!
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Aug 31 2002 : 1:15AM
In the beginning, John financed Elegant Angel as a sub-company of Evil Angel. Patrick Collins was considered the partner in Elegant Angel, not Bruce. Elegant was started in 1990. Bruce Seven did direct the first 4 movies for the company, which were girl/girl movies. Patrick Collins had been a salesperson for John at Evil Angel, who he got to know through Tianna.
In 1996, Patrick suddenly split off from Evil Angel. The two companies don't hate each other, but they haven't done any business together since Patrick left.
When Patrick left, John considered suing Patrick over the rights to the Elegant Angel name, which had been developed and made popular through it's association with Evil Angel. However, John said he let it go "because I thought it might be fun to have some competition in the business. But Patrick hasn't been up to the challenge."
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DenverDon Benevolent
Firmly Embedded in Depravity 5914 Posts 7/02
Posted - Aug 31 2002 : 1:25AM
Thanks Tricia,
And I apologize profusely for misspeeeeeling your name, but if you ever want some French completely mangled and twisted, just send it to me. I'm a master at getting it twisted so it is totally incomprehensible!
Aren't they both just about portraying sex? I don't think "Ass Worship X" says anything more meaningful than "Booty Duty X".
Plus, I think an argument could be made that with Elegant Angel's new direction, their features are more substantial (in terms of being about something) than the typical Evil Angel release. A good example is "Big Bottom Sadie".
Plus, I think an argument could be made that with Elegant Angel's new direction, their features are more substantial (in terms of being about something) than the typical Evil Angel release. A good example is "Big Bottom Sadie".
The one thing that really hurts Elegant Angel is the lack of extras and the A/V quality on a lot of their DVDs.
But I like several of Elegant's releases new releases as well as a lot of past releases.
Elegant Angel may not be the most consistent studio, but when they do get it right, it's pretty damn solid. They have definitely been releasing some hot titles lately.
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Sep 2 2002 : 12:00AM
Since I'm part of Evil Angel, I can't really offer an opinion on which company is better.
I would like to point out on the "feature videos" aspect though, that Evil Angel is coming out with two (IMO - really good ones) features in September. Several reviewers have already told me that at least one of them blows all of the other features from 2002 out of the water. (How's that for humble? !!!!) Sorry about getting a little arrogant there, I'm just really proud of my company, and it's SO frustrating when people still confuse us with Elegant. Except for our names, and the fact that we both make a lot of gonzo porn, we really don't have anything else in common anymore.
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Sep 2 2002 : 3:29PM
squidmonkey- no, it's totally fine. I'm actually glad to clear up any confusions about Evil Angel whenever I can, and especially on this topic, since for awhile, Elegant Angel was doing everything they could to bank on the similarities of the names and the logos and stuff.
I want to thank all the people who have commented about Elegant Angel. Both what you like and what you don’t like are very important to me.
I also want to thank Tricia for reminding people that Elegant and Evil are two separate companies. With as much respect as I have for all the directors at Evil Angel I do not now, nor have I ever wanted to be confused with them. Both in style and execution we are different companies. Since the beginning, (with a guy by the name of Parker Schurman), I have focused on getting new directors that are true perverts. I haven’t always been successful, but I have had some pretty remarkable results with directors that were for the most part unheard of before they were with Elegant Angel. I have always focused on this and working with the directors personally. John is, and always will be, more conservative in his approach, and his time is VERY important to him. He prefers the majority of his directors to be proven commodities. This is less risky, and requires far less of his time than the time he would spend with a newer director. And this approach has proven to be very successful for Evil Angel. In fact, both approaches have worked well for both companies for some of the same reasons!
Recently, John and I had dinner and we discussed various directors and talent. We shared some of our likes and dislikes, and I think we both agree that good directing is the result of hard work, creativity, and competitiveness, but MOST importantly, a genuinely powerful sexuality.
My approach to pornography is vastly different than John's. I like to shoot from the hip so to speak. John is much more detail oriented. A girls orgasm is my primary focus, John's is different. You’ll never confuse our styles! I am really anxious to see his new film. I don’t get to watch much in the way of other peoples’ stuff anymore, but I am looking forward to seeing this one.
Some will always say that one or the other is better. Right now I have the strongest stable of directors in the history of Elegant Angel and that is saying something, I have an arsenal of innovators and that’s got me more excited about the future than I have been in quite some time. I love Mason!
She is so utterly REAL! From her convictions and integrity, to her camerawork and editing she is a force to reckon with and will be a huge influence on the industry. In fact I told John that she does remind me of him in more than a few ways.
I also want all of you to know that Parker Schurman is back and will be doing a new hard-core fetish line called “SLAVE DOLLS”
This guy only directed 2 scenes for me before he left porn in ’94 and both were highly regarded. One won an award for “BEST ANAL SEX SCENE” from AVN. And I’ve known him since B.P. (before I was in the biz) and he is a true pervert, in the best sense imaginable. For the feature crowd I have Axel Braun, and there are 4 others that I have high hopes for including a guy named Paulo from Brazil that really loves big butts and horny girls, and some youngsters from Canada that I think will re-energize the Filthy First Timers line!
All the DVD concerns are being addressed and with your help we’ll eventually have a DVD format that will combine all the right elements in a way that is technically sound, hot and informative. So, if it matters to you, let me know. It takes time to change things in a technical sense, to do it right I need your input so don’t be shy.
Wow. Welcome to the forums, Patrick, and I hope we see you around here a bit more in the future. Thank you so much for giving everybody a taste of what you're about at Elegant Angel and the differences between you and Evil Angel.
It's great to see some more industry type folks here in the forum and do hope you visit often and post even more.
All the DVD concerns are being addressed and with your help we’ll eventually have a DVD format that will combine all the right elements in a way that is technically sound, hot and informative. So, if it matters to you, let me know. It takes time to change things in a technical sense, to do it right I need your input so don’t be shy.
Okay, first, you need to do something about the twisted pix photo gallery. Second, if possible, put some outtake footage of the film bought, rather than the same ol same ol as an extra. Third, interviews with stars, before a scene and after a scene are nice.
The films, by themselves are good to great, but this is DVD after all, so why not include a few more goodies?
Also, a quick comment/question on the Sluts with Nuts line, why is every scene a three-way, how about some one-on-one she-male/she-male scenes. You know, mix it up a bit...
Welcome to the forum Pat. Keep up the great work you guys do over at Elegant Angel. You guys have been putting out some really great stuff, I just need to review some more of the DVD's I have here. Unlike BIGmike, I like the twisted pix on the DVD's, still looking for 1 of me, LOL.
Thanks to both Pat and Tricia for giving us a little history behine Elegant angel and Evil Angel. I know 1 am a bit partial toward one of those company's, but I really do enjoy both company's movies.
That's great to hear, especially after seeing how far Elegant Angel has come along in the last year or two. If you want some fairly prompt feedback on some of your ideas, please check out the Polls Forum here. There's been past polls about DVD features by both members and other companies that should be able to give you some decent input. Some of them might be hard to find, so feel free to post any questions you have and you should get quite a few honest answers from the people buying the DVDs. I don't think there's anybody here who doesn't want to see all the companies coming out with better products. Although some of the ideas are sure to vary, you should hopefully also get some good ideas that could be easily implemented.
Patrick, here's my advice. I'd enjoy Elegant Angel DVDs a lot more if you would have the extras match the movie. So for example, include the "making of" of Exxxplosion on Exxxplosion, instead of on a bunch of later titles, and have the stills be from the main movie. Also, please, please get rid of William H. Nutsack, even if he is a friend or relative of yours.
I notice Elegant angel has already begun to return to full trailers, instead of 10-20 second useless blips of the title. This is also a good and important step. And from what has been written repeatedly on the forum, I can state that most consumers want simultaneous or nearly so DVD releases with the VHS, which is something you have already achieved in most cases. So two points are coming along fine, and now the extras need to be upgraded, thanks for reading.
I prefer Evil Angel and I was a huge fan or the Extreme Associates directors that left Elegant Angel and now I like the edge of Evil and they do have new directors too like JJ and Nacho but I honestly can't pick a favorite since haven't seen any of the new Elegant movies.
In reply to this recent post I am curious as to why you would tell Mr. Collins to "get rid of William H. Nutsack". Could you give me a specific reason why you feel this way? If I get fired I'll be pushing a shopping cart filled with twisted pics, desperately searching for anyone who might trade some cigarettes for a signed print.
Shit! ..and I thought I was a little to harsh with the Seinfel analogy. The last thing I would like to do is for someone to loss his Job. But seriously Willy what have you done to make Speelie so angry of you? maybe you can change your ways :) ..In my case I would like Patrick to give Tony Ribas a reprimand!
"I'd enjoy Elegant Angel DVDs a lot more if you would have the extras match the movie"
I agree! We are working on making this happen now. Where the Girls Sweat...train time, and the new Internally Yours#3 will have 'behind the scenes' footage. The slide shows are matching on everything we release now... and have been for the last several titles. Thanks for your input! Patrick
Hey Patrick, I think the best bit of news is that you and John managed to patch up your past differences and became friends again.
Besides, two companies doing good porn with different points of view is better than one shooting at every direction, right?
Send my love to Mitzi. Hell, give her a raise cause she deserves it! I did a very good review of your blues CD just because she asked me o so very politely!
does anyone else find it peculiar that Patrick Collins, Mason, William h nutsack, Axel Braun and Parker Shuman have all posted? within about 2 hours how bout tony ribas? next?
William, you are welcome to stick around if you stop dancing in womens' clothing when you introduce the DVD extra footage, and stop playing tricks with fake penises that squirt hand lotion, and similar annoying bits. These actively take away from my enjoyment of the Elegant Angel DVDs. There's ways to be silly and fun without going over the edge into frustrating the viewer. I'd rather see you simply be "Bill the DVD Editor, here to give a little behind the scenes information" or something similar, instead of "William H. Nutsack, Class Clown."
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Sep 3 2002 : 6:03PM
Patrick - nice to see you here! Best of luck to you in your recent restructuring. I'll be checking out one of A Braun's vids in a few weeks when I get some free time, and I recently saw Lady Fellatio. (I remember when the first Dr. Fellatio was conceptualized - God, has it been that long?)
Anyway, good luck. I'd love to see Elegant Angel be back on top again. (Well, almost on top. Of course I've got to do my best here at Evil! )
Speelie: My approach to the dvd extras WAS to give a quirky lead up to the girls. Obviously, you were not entertained by my silly antics. Would you rather see me introduce the ladies wearing gold chains, fake and pimped out, telling the viewer how much the girls love to suck cock? I was just being myself. This is how I really am, one half to three fourths retarded. No seriously, this is just my sense of humor. I just wanted to give something different and maybe, just maybe, make someone giggle.
I didn't know Patrick was involved with Elegant Angel from the beginning.
Welcome to the forum by the way Patrick.
Thank you Tricia for setting the record straight so to speak.
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Planet Sex Deactivated User
1951 Posts 6/01
Posted - Sep 3 2002 : 6:46PM
You guys should check Pat Collins´ earlier works, like TIANNA´S HUNGARIAN CONNECTION, DEPRAVITY IN THE DANUBE and the BUTTWOMAN IN BUDAPEST series with Tianna.
BTW, do you guys know that there is a gay porn director (as in "director of gay porn" - if he´s a "gay director" as well, I don´t know) also named Patrick Collins?
..... I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.
I dunno, I kinda enjoy William H. Nutsack's antics, its definitely different that what anyone else is doing.
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Planet Sex Deactivated User
1951 Posts 6/01
Posted - Sep 4 2002 : 6:51AM
They don´t bother me either. And there´s always the FF button when I´m not in the mood for people clowning around, and all I want is to see a little pussy.
..... I am a brother to dragons, and a companion to owls. My skin is black upon me, and my bones are burned with heat.
