WOmen in porn are exploited

Author	Post
truebeauty New Member 1 Posts 1/13	Posted - Jan 28 2013 : 5:03PM Some videos that I watch I really see how the women are not really enjoying or are hurt but they just go on. I find its not very fair or just. They should be able to voice out how they feel. this makes it really irritating as a woman to watch it ......not all videos though but a lot! i feel that many things needs to change in this industry.......... [Link]
tricohitalo Member 159 Posts 4/11	Posted - Jan 28 2013 : 5:50PM [o\\|] They are not forced to stay in, that's not raping, that's porn. If some girl want to stop scene, scene will be stopped. But then - no money. Let's face it: there are 2 kind of girls in porn - whores (they will do everything for the money) and sluts (they primarily purpose is pleasure). [Link]
LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05	Posted - Jan 28 2013 : 5:55PM ^ add workers to that and add male performers to your description especially for your first truebeauty wrote: Some videos that I watch I really see how the women are not really enjoying or are hurt but they just go on. I find its not very fair or just. They should be able to voice out how they feel. this makes it really irritating as a woman to watch it ......not all videos though but a lot! i feel that many things needs to change in this industry.......... Click to expand you might be interested in this thread [Link]
Quorrl Senior Member 2835 Posts 3/11	Posted - Jan 28 2013 : 6:18PM @truebeauty: Is this about women who are really physically hurt? Or is this more about porn that wants to give the viewer the illusion/impression that the female performers are uncomfortable/dominated/submissive , in all the different shades? That would make a difference for the discussion. The cases where porn performers don't really "enjoy" a scene or at least don't enjoy it as much as they would like to make the viewer believe would be the majority of all porn... I mean, porn is hard work. It's natural that that's not always enjoyable for the workers. [Link]
a9nostic Senior Member 1056 Posts 8/08	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 12:25AM LCF wrote: ^ add workers to that and add male performers to your description especially for your first truebeauty wrote: Some videos that I watch I really see how the women are not really enjoying or are hurt but they just go on. I find its not very fair or just. They should be able to voice out how they feel. this makes it really irritating as a woman to watch it ......not all videos though but a lot! i feel that many things needs to change in this industry.......... Click to expand you might be interested in this thread Click to expand You might actually BE this thread... [Link]

RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 1:37AM A troll is not the greatest way to begin your posting career. [Link]
Kezza Member Female porn lover 334 Posts 6/12	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 1:50AM I'm a woman too and I can see where truebeaty is coming from I sometimes don't feel comfortable watching something a performer is not comfortable doing. But I don't think it's a big deal when you see them relaxed and smiling with the guy or guys they are in that scene with afterwards. I don't necessarily think they are hurt they just weren't 100 percent comfortable at the time with whatever act didn't make them feel so comfortable with. [Link]
LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 2:07AM a9nostic wrote: You might actually BE this thread... Click to expand I'm not used to hide [Link]
LeyaFalcon Senior Member Something Else 1000 Posts 12/12	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 3:50AM tricohitalo wrote: [o\\|] They are not forced to stay in, that's not raping, that's porn. If some girl want to stop scene, scene will be stopped. But then - no money. Let's face it: there are 2 kind of girls in porn - whores (they will do everything for the money) and sluts (they primarily purpose is pleasure). Click to expand does this make me an attention slut instead of an attention whore?? Personally, I love being degraded or "exploited" in my scenes, it turns me on. [Link]
Geri Member 329 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 6:06AM There are a few people in porn I would strongly advise women not to work with. Paul F. Little (Max Hardcore) would be one of them. Because it is quite clear that he has been guilty of not stopping when women he was performing with clearly told him to stop. [Link]
geralt Member 495 Posts 7/11	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 11:39AM I agree that some porn is way too extreme, like Max Hardcore who thrives upon degrading women and treating them horribly. But I view pornstars as sexual athletes, it's a big difference with sex in real life and sexual circus acts in porn. As long as the girls don't get pushed to do things they don't want to, I think it's up to them to set their limits. [Link]
Gunzo Senior Member 1377 Posts 2/05	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 12:10PM As with everything being an aware consumer is required. You want the animal on your plate to be tortured before being slaughtered for your eating pleasure? Most likely not. You want the girls in porn being disrespected on set? I sincerely hope not. So fuck Max Hardcore and a select few others. Even if it's just acting I still don't agree with with that crap. [Link]
Brandon Lee Harrington New Member 4 Posts 6/11	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 1:58PM Its just up to the women to research the company/website before they do their scene. Its really easy to know what the scene will be like, based on previous scenes they have shot. They should know what they are getting into and then decide. Problems occur when agents book scenes and the women dont really know what they are getting into. [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 29 2013 : 7:18PM geralt wrote: As long as the girls don't get pushed to do things they don't want to, I think it's up to them to set their limits. Click to expand I wouldn't even go that far. I'd say as long as they can walk away anytime, I'm fine with it. Will they "get blacklisted" if they keep walking out on directors for no obvious reason? Probably. Would they (realistically) get blacklisted for walking away from a Max Hardcore type of situation if they were lured in under false pretenses and they (somehow) didn't know that person's reputation? I can't see that happening. I don't know the people in the porn business well enough to be able to say 100% "this won't happen" but my impression of most of them is that they would not be interested in being part of a coercive machine that would blacklist a girl simply for walking away from someone like Max. They're interested in making money. Not creating bad publicity. Edited by - randomprecision on 1/29/2013 7:25:42 PM [Link]
JigglyBoobs Senior Member 1614 Posts 3/12	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 2:37AM The masses are exploited by greedy governments and corporations. Plenty of people don't enjoy it but they go on and deal with it. It's not very fair and just and they too should be able to effectively voice out their discontent. It's irritating as a person to both watch it and be a victim of that greed. Not every corporation is greedy and fond of tax avoidance but a lot of them are. I feel many things need to change in this society... [Link]

BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 5:07AM geralt wrote: I agree that some porn is way too extreme, like Max Hardcore who thrives upon degrading women and treating them horribly. Click to expand Max Hardcore isn't even working anymore. [Link]
hoochimama Deactivated User 1437 Posts 5/10	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 8:56AM Some videos that I watch I really see how the men are not really enjoying or are hurt but they just go on. I find its not very fair or just. They should be able to voice out how they feel. this makes it really irritating as a man to watch it ......not all videos though but a lot! i feel that many things needs to change in this industry.......... ____________________________ Please ID these PlayboyTV girls https://forum.adultdvdtalk.com/playboytv-foursome-identification-thread/ Edited by - hoochimama on 1/30/2013 8:58:17 AM [Link]
Zinister Member 23 Posts 1/13	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 12:30PM It's all about decisions. Consumers: What you decide to watch and sponsored. Companies: What they offer in response to the consumers. Porn Talent: What are they willing to do for a paycheck. Law: What allows to shoots and etc. The power is in the consumers, what they sponsored and whatnot. There's plenty of different porn niches to choose from. And for the concerns viewers, hey there's lot of pink/vanilla stuff out there. [Link]
Geri Member 329 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 4:30PM BlackSix wrote: geralt wrote: I agree that some porn is way too extreme, like Max Hardcore who thrives upon degrading women and treating them horribly. Click to expand Max Hardcore isn't even working anymore. Click to expand I wouldn't be so sure of that. He said in an interview in February last year that he was going back into the porn business. And I think he has a strong sexual compulsion to do what he does. Apart from that and his reputation, I think the guy has two fundamental problems: 1. He's basically a one trick pony 2. He can't seem to grasp that just because some porn women enjoy what he does to them it doesn't mean all, or even most, of them will. [Link]
arhed Deactivated User 137 Posts 1/11	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 5:13PM Do every person enjoy their job? No. Do they like it? No. But if they want the money from the employers they do the job. Same goes for porn. The guys and girls can so no, they won't do face fucking. No they won't do rough anal or slapping. But if they say yes and they get paid for it then they should have no complains. [Link]
fanofporn New Member 5 Posts 1/13	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 6:16PM I guess , most do enjoy working . If they dont , why do they keep coming back to same directors again and again . Having said that , I do not like girls being abused on screen. [Link]
Geri Member 329 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 7:34PM Actually, in some ways I think the women in porn get more choices about what they will and won't do than the men do. For example, full penetration anal sex. A girl who refuses to do this can still get lots of work. Especially if she's pretty and/or good at girl/girl. Guys who do gay/bi/tranny porn obviously can't say no to doing anal - even though in reality some gay and bisexual men aren't into anal sex at all. And I don't think guys working in straight porn will get much work if they refuse to do it either. Are there any male porn stars who don't do anal? [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 7:45PM He said in an interview in February last year that he was going back into the porn business... Click to expand Exactly, last February. [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 30 2013 : 10:43PM Geri wrote: BlackSix wrote: geralt wrote: I agree that some porn is way too extreme, like Max Hardcore who thrives upon degrading women and treating them horribly. Click to expand Max Hardcore isn't even working anymore. Click to expand I wouldn't be so sure of that. He said in an interview in February last year that he was going back into the porn business. And I think he has a strong sexual compulsion to do what he does. Click to expand Regardless, he'd have to be stupid to just go back to business as usual as though nothing happened. Apart from that and his reputation, I think the guy has two fundamental problems: 2. He can't seem to grasp that just because some porn women enjoy what he does to them it doesn't mean all, or even most, of them will. Click to expand On the other hand, some of the critics of his "style" would complain even if he only used women who loved every minute of it. You can't win with these types of people. Even if the girl loves it, they claim she had a bad childhood (probably true in many cases but still not relevant) or some other BS. The bottom line is that it just offends some people. They don't care if it's consensual or not. [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14595 Posts 3/02	Posted - Jan 31 2013 : 2:01AM Geri wrote: He can't seem to grasp that just because some porn women enjoy what he does to them it doesn't mean all, or even most, of them will. Click to expand Sure he can, but women enjoying it wasn't the point. Quite the opposite, in fact. Little created Max Hardcore in order to cater to an audience that wanted to see women abused, either for revenge or just because they like seeing other people in discomfort. He'd already been touching on that in his earlier productions, so I have to believe that the creation of MH reflected audience feedback. Well, the feedback he wanted to hear, anyway. However, watch the scenes Leanni Lei did with him and you'll see that he respected a performer's limits when he had to. Did he push them when he thought he could get away with it? Probably. What I'm certain of is that he's the kind of guy who contracts the girls to do X and isn't going to change the program just because they discover that doing it hurts. [Link]

Geri Member 329 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jan 31 2013 : 4:38AM RandomPrecision wrote: The bottom line is that it just offends some people. They don't care if it's consensual or not. Click to expand Well, that can be said about all porn. [Link]
Geri Member 329 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jan 31 2013 : 4:52AM Hardware wrote: However, watch the scenes Leanni Lei did with him and you'll see that he respected a performer's limits when he had to. Click to expand So he managed to be professional sometimes. It's the times he didn't act like a professional that are a problem. Hardware wrote: Did he push them when he thought he could get away with it? Probably. What I'm certain of is that he's the kind of guy who contracts the girls to do X and isn't going to change the program just because they discover that doing it hurts. Click to expand That's the problem. When you're having sex, any kind of sex, if the other person says they have to stop, you have to stop. If Max was doing a scene and he felt like he had to stop - cramp attack, searing pains in his chest etc. - you can be damned sure he'd stop. [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 31 2013 : 5:51AM Geri wrote: RandomPrecision wrote: The bottom line is that it just offends some people. They don't care if it's consensual or not. Click to expand Well, that can be said about all porn. Click to expand True. But the people who are always coming out against ordinary porn don't really have any good excuses. They're pretty transparent and don't really have too much credibility with anyone other than radicals. People who complain about guys like Max appear to have a point. Despite the fact that there aren't many people like him in porn. [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14595 Posts 3/02	Posted - Jan 31 2013 : 6:40AM Geri wrote: So he managed to be professional sometimes. It's the times he didn't act like a professional that are a problem. Click to expand To my way of thinking, there are a couple of issues being conflated here. First, whether or not "Max Hardcore" did things which were not discussed and agreed upon beforehand. Second, whether or not Mr. Little is a compassionate human being. As to the first, my sense is that "Max Hardcore" did what was agreed upon, though it seems that it was the agent at times that was doing the agreeing and the performer getting stuck with the bill. As to the second, I tend to doubt it. [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 31 2013 : 9:54PM Hardware wrote: As to the first, my sense is that "Max Hardcore" did what was agreed upon, though it seems that it was the agent at times that was doing the agreeing and the performer getting stuck with the bill. Click to expand That was my impression as well. The question remains - Did the agent do it deliberately or was it just the kind of misunderstanding that tends to happen when you have a middleman? [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Feb 1 2013 : 2:44AM Seems like good evidence that Dick Nasty was often the agent in question and he did it intentionally, not inadvertently, as it happened on more than one occasion. I don't think that clears Max of any responsibility though. [Link]
mapofhawaii Senior Member 1050 Posts 3/06	Posted - Feb 1 2013 : 11:57AM What needs to happen is that agents and other performers need to advise the newbies about the directors and performers that have reps for treating women badly, or coercing them into doing things they don't want to do. I think a lot of that was going on, according to what some girls have said, with Max, Khan Tushion, and some performers. The story of Canadian girl who felt pressured to do double anal in her first scene, and got HIV from Darren James is a perfect example. [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Feb 1 2013 : 2:22PM mapofhawaii wrote: What needs to happen is that agents and other performers need to advise the newbies about the directors and performers that have reps for treating women badly, or coercing them into doing things they don't want to do. Click to expand I guess that would work fine in a perfect world where everyone trusted and liked everyone. Unfortunately, I can see that kind of thing turning into a way to get rid of your competition or get even with someone. [Link]
H1gh Contra5t All-Star Member "My asshole just naturally opens up because that's what I want, I'm so horny for it" 8498 Posts 1/13	Posted - Feb 1 2013 : 3:35PM People like the OP really frustrate me because it is clear that they have an agenda of discrediting porn before they even post their opinion. The OP, like others who get a kick out of being self-righteous for hating on the industry, typically pick a popular stereotype and use it to tar all regions far and wide with the same singular attribute. Then, having justified it to themselves that the one example applies to all directors, producers, and companies declares that the industry must change across the board. It smacks of ignorance and a lack of research into the facts. If you had done your homework Mr/Mrs OP you would have come across many a shining example of how the industry has not only liberated many of its female performer's but have actually made real professionals out of them. You would have read about the great successes of performer's who have gone on to direct their own films, to manage their own businesses, to branch out and succeed in mainstream media. Behind the camera, in an area of the industry where they are the minority gender, they manage themselves, their finances, their promotion and put out top quality entertainment that put a considerable portion of their male counterparts to shame. Furthermore, a lot of these especially successful women have a reputation for performing hard, rough, forceful sex film after film. These performers who clearly have above average intelligence, who know how to manage themselves, who know how to guide others, who have the nous to make the right business decisions, who are not easily bossed around and influenced by others, and who have the strength of mind to maintain all of these admirable qualities - do these really sound like the kind of people you are describing? Do you really think they would be putting other people or themselves through something if they did not want to? Do the sound like the kind of performer's who would subject themselves and others to pain for the sake of the anonymous viewer's entertainment? It's pretty much a rhetorical question, but either, this is the answer - no. We should be championing the Belladonna's, the Bobbie Starr's, the Mason's, the Sasha Grey's, and the Francesca Le's of the industry for their presence of mind to do what they want exactly how they want it. We should hold them up in high regard to spite the cynics and the misinformed who lambast these great admirable women rather than applaud them for their achievements. If you had done your homework Mr/Mrs OP you would have read much more about the great deeds of these proud women than about the sadistic behaviour you cite. But then, that would not suite your agenda would it. Praise the legends, and smite the cynics with them. [Link]
CummingLinguist All-Star Member 5908 Posts 11/11	Posted - Feb 2 2013 : 8:21AM BlackSix wrote: Seems like good evidence that Dick Nasty was often the agent in question and he did it intentionally, not inadvertently, as it happened on more than one occasion. I don't think that clears Max of any responsibility though. Click to expand Hardcore/Little went to jail right? If he tended to use one agent, is it possible that we are discussing conspiracy to commit rape? Mackochist wrote: ... We should be championing the Belladonna's, the Bobbie Starr's, the Mason's, the Sasha Grey's, and the Francesca Le's of the industry for their presence of mind to do what they want exactly how they want it. ... Click to expand Was Mason/Sam No a performer? If so, I would love to see one of her scenes. [Link]

Easydiver Member 7 Posts 9/12	Posted - Feb 2 2013 : 12:21PM truebeauty wrote: Some videos that I watch I really see how the women are not really enjoying or are hurt but they just go on. I find its not very fair or just. They should be able to voice out how they feel. this makes it really irritating as a woman to watch it ......not all videos though but a lot! i feel that many things needs to change in this industry.......... Click to expand I'm with you...if the girl does not enjoy it or I suspect she doesn' t enjoy it..then it kills it for me stone dead. [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14595 Posts 3/02	Posted - Feb 2 2013 : 2:51PM RandomPrecision wrote: That was my impression as well. The question remains - Did the agent do it deliberately or was it just the kind of misunderstanding that tends to happen when you have a middleman? Click to expand Oh, I think we can be sure that he did it deliberately. Whether he was in cahoots with Little is another story. Given the way this industry operates, I can see it happening either way. However, again, shoots like Leanni Lei's suggest to me that if the gal set limits that Little had to agree to in order to get her then those limits were respected. In other words, difficult though it may be to believe, I think Little operated within his own code of ethics. It isn't a particularly forgiving code, though, because if a gal's agent agreed that she was going to do X then Little wasn't going to let her off the hook, even if being on it came as a surprise to her. I'm sure his take was that it was not his problem, and she should take it up with her agent - after the shoot that he had already paid for was over with. In the meantime, he expected her to do what was agreed upon. Like I said, I don't think Little's a particularly nice guy, but he's hardly unique in the entertainment business, which I why I think I recognize his type. [Link]
geralt Member 495 Posts 7/11	Posted - Feb 6 2013 : 5:36PM BlackSix wrote: geralt wrote: I agree that some porn is way too extreme, like Max Hardcore who thrives upon degrading women and treating them horribly. Click to expand Max Hardcore isn't even working anymore. Click to expand Amen to that. I hope he's behind bars. [Link]
TomChoad Member I Likes Ya 685 Posts 1/08	Posted - Feb 6 2013 : 6:17PM I don´t know. To me "exploited" means bangladesh sweatshops, child soldiers in sudan and underage prostitution/kiddie porn...but that´s just me [Link]
LeyaFalcon Senior Member Something Else 1000 Posts 12/12	Posted - Feb 6 2013 : 7:01PM ^^ Agreed [Link]
Geri Member 329 Posts 7/12	Posted - Feb 7 2013 : 4:59AM I wonder if the OP will ever come back and comment further? [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Feb 7 2013 : 7:22AM Hardware wrote: In other words, difficult though it may be to believe, I think Little operated within his own code of ethics. It isn't a particularly forgiving code, though, because if a gal's agent agreed that she was going to do X then Little wasn't going to let her off the hook, even if being on it came as a surprise to her. I'm sure his take was that it was not his problem, and she should take it up with her agent - after the shoot that he had already paid for was over with. In the meantime, he expected her to do what was agreed upon. Click to expand This makes sense. I was just pointing out earlier though that I don't think any of the more respectable people in the industry would blame a girl for walking out on Max. I'm wondering if a girl couldn't sue her agent for doing this deliberately? [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Feb 8 2013 : 7:15AM Geri wrote: I wonder if the OP will ever come back and comment further? Click to expand Doubt it they were probably just trolling. [Link]
WardqueenJanine Member 914 Posts 2/08	Posted - Feb 8 2013 : 9:45AM RandomPrecision wrote: A troll is not the greatest way to begin your posting career. Click to expand Still only one post; good insight. [Link]
humane Member 33 Posts 5/12	Posted - Feb 25 2013 : 7:03PM I think many people love seeing pretty and innocent girls exploited. I know I do. Of Course Max Hardcore is the most famous exploiter of girls but nobody does a better job than sinnistar.com For example; [link inactive]Kalyn Arianna [Link]
kromos Member 12 Posts 6/11	Posted - Mar 18 2013 : 6:06PM There certainly seem to be a handful of misogynists in the porn production industry, but using the term "exploited" is needless hyperbole in all but the rarest of scenes. I'm not aware of any instance in commercially-produced American porn in which a woman was forced to participate. I do get the impression that occasionally a scene is more extreme than the actress expected it to be. I think there needs to be a complete and explicit understanding of what will happen in the scene, and no tolerance on the part of actresses, agents, or fans for going beyond that without the prior permission of all involved. Ultimately, porn actresses need to take charge and call-out the jerks in the industry, and refuse to work with them. For example, I have to believe that there are several women who consciously chose not to work with Paul Little (Max Hardcore). Sex scenes can take a big toll on the actresses physically, and being in the industry can be very socially isolating. It is hard work which deserves appropriate compensation. Even more so given that the industry exists primarily because of those female performers. I assume that most of them do it for the money. I don't say that in a judgmental way--I think it's a perfectly legitimate choice to make. My point is simply that most of the women in the industry do a deliberate or unconscious cost/benefit analysis of being a porn actress--weighing the compensation against the physical demands, risks, and potential social stigma. I think that a small number of the women who work in porn have an experimental/alternative personality in regards to their sexuality. For them, porn provides an opportunity to explore fantasies within a controlled environment. Lastly, I think there are some women who probably shouldn't be in the porn industry to begin with since they don't seem ready/able to deal with the physical, emotional, and social ramifications of being a porn actress. In the end, those of us who view porn should never lose sight of the fact that porn actresses are real people. They deserve our respect, not simply as porn actresses, but as human beings. [Link]
bigd01987 Member 66 Posts 12/12	Posted - Mar 18 2013 : 9:57PM amen to that [Link]