Why say no, when it feels so good to say yes. 117 Posts 10/06
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 5:09AM
Then why does this happen! Do you guys really like this or are they doing this just to piss everyone off out of spite...
The girls bouncing on the guys lap...zoom in on the ass from ground level...show the guys balls...zoom out...show his face....show her face...zoom out....show fully body shot from side angle...zoom out...show full body shot from behind...zoom out switch to spoon position on couch, zoom in on pussy...zoom to chest...zoom to faces...zoom to full body..zoom to faces...zoom out to cum shot...zoom to girls face...zoom to guys face...zoom to dick...zoom to girls face...zoom to pop shot...zoom back to guys face...zoom to girls face...end of scene.
That's when I turn off the fucking DVD. I know you can't please everyone but why does this happen? I say pick 5-10 solid angles and stick with them, preferably all full body shots. Does anyone know of any solid studios that actually pick some solid positions and try to really stick with them?
If you hate what I described above, steer clear of Redlight District, they do that all the time. Steer clear of Zero Tolerance, steer clear of Platinum X. I could keep naming names but you get the idea. You'll just be disappointed.
I don't care about the number of camera angles. What gets me is the zooming in and out, and when the camera guy gets creative and twists it and turns it around and sometimes upside down, and floats it around the room ... all that movement actually makes me nauseous. But, I get motion-sick really easily (long car rides, boats, etc.). I could totally understand someone else digging that, though. And ya gotta play to your audience.
Porno movies, sexy videos, xxx. Adult DVD Talk at your service. 6409 Posts 11/99
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 9:27AM
danceswithporn - if you hate porn so much why are you spending so much time watching it and participating in a porn forum? please have some friggin manners. the "idiots" you speak of are here participating in the conversation. if you actually want anyone to listen to your criticisms then state them in a constructive fashion.
That's interesting. I don't ever recall shooting a movie with all of that "zooming" that you're talking about. As a matter of fact, I haven't shot a guys head in a video since about 1997. Are there guys in these movies?
Edited by - Mike Quasar on 10/13/2006 11:51:20 AM
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Midtown Deactivated User
299 Posts 7/05
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 11:58AM
Agreed that he doesn't have to call the porn producers "idiots." Otherwise, his criticism is valid. My theory is that a lot (if not most) porn directors prefer men over women. Why else would they devote so much of each scene to the guy's butt? It's not like they don't know what's being caught on film. Also, why the need to humiliate the female performers? That's not sexy. Only a man who somehow hates women would want to film that.
I personally hate it when directors zoom too much, I mean that way you will never be able to shoot the girls' feet and for me that's the most important part of the body. Full body shots is the way. I actually hate it even more when directors shoot the action from the side instead of from behind where they can get better angles. I wouldn't call them idiots, perhaps they lack certain talent to shoot all the right angles the way John Stagliano or Rodney Moore can.
That's just the Anabolic house style, I think. Though I don't think it's zooming, but herky-jerky motion patterns. I prefer a stable shot that includes the girl's face and some of the "action," but some shooters have no patience for that. Some of the best shooters in porn right now are guys like Jonni Darkko, William H., Bryan Xin, Jake Malone, and whoever has been shooting Manuel Ferrara when he is in scene in his own movies, because they do things I consider essential to capturing "heat."
1) The woman is _always_ prominent in the frame, especially her face, verbalizations, expressions.
2) the male performer is entirely present, emphasizing chemistry and communication, or else is framed and positioned in a way that he becomes a surrogate for the viewer (hard to explain how that happens, because I don't mean strictly Mike John-style POV).
3) Scenes can be "edit-y," but follow a clear flow, often making use of a location by having performers change location as they change positions, creating an element of surprise and variety.
4) When the choice is between a full-impact genital close-up and a shot of an emotional outburst, the choice is _always_ to capture the performer's expression.
5) Remember: Not everything is purely visual.
6) The more flexible the shooter's knees, and the less his (her) fear of getting goobed on, the better the shots will be, and the more intimate and artful the scene.
This only show how subjective porn is. I think these 4 guys are terrible when it comes to shooting the right angles. I mean I saw all 3 squirt movies from Elegant with Flower Tucci and I couldn't believe how bad the camerawork was of William H. I mean when you have a girl like Flower Tucci you would think you want to shoot in her in all her glory, from head to toe, not just her pussy, squirt movie or not.
Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 1:00PM
I'm gonna cry. I wanna connect with the guy too... but alas, I know that I'm not the target market for selling thousands of copies of a DVD. I'm going to make it my personal mission in life to encourage women to be perverts too!!!! Then maybe we'll have enough spending dollars pooled together to get some decent shots of the guy too. I mean, not to take the focus off the girl... but just show them both looking at each other while they're fucking.
Wait......... scratch that. I want more better-looking guys first... then I'll start on that whole mission thing. Carry on...
...me meeshka probably is right, right on the Money! It didn't take me long to start buying John Stagliano's stuff early on."Big Phat Apple Bottom Bootys" would be the Archetype for me right now. Crazy about the Music Video's, right distance, hiked skirts and proper booty attire but whoever EDIT's cuts to another shot/angle too quick. It's as if TT Boy might be fined by the FCC of porn. A few years ago I went as far as to purchase a couple of [VT]"Black Mystique" to get full-body shots. Got to check out Elegant Angel's "Big Black Wet Asses Series!
I agree with you 100 percent. I can't tell you how many scenes I've watched that have been ruined because the director will only do close up shots of body parts or shots from far away like you're watching the action from across the street. I want to see mid-range full body shots like you said.
There is no zooming in porn, there's swoops. A great director/shooter has balance, timing, rhythum and flow. Mike, E.E. Tony T., Chico, Strong,VV, all have those qualities.
Cal444 Somewhere thinkin Men are headless thrusting torso's, I haven't see male faces in ages
I know most people hate Vivid's stuff, but check out one of there directors, B.Skow. I have reviewed some of his/her movies and I think he shoots some of the best sex scene's out there. Even with Vivid's "rules" he or she somehow get's some really good stuff. The sex scene's are pretty much what you guy's say your looking for.
A Huge +1 for the extremely wise skronker here. I'll also throw a +1 cal's way. The blame / credit for a lot of this stuff can be shared between whoever's behind the camera and whoever's sitting in the editing bay. It wasn't until fairly recently, like maybe in the last year, that I realized what can really set apart a good cameraman from a great one. A good cameraman knows what shots to get and often leaves it up to the editor then to mix it right. A great cameraman has to leave it to the editor as well, but they can also move around the action without making you notice it. The camera just flows with the action, and takes you for a ride without ever making you feel like asking for directions or pulling the car over so somebody else can drive.
"Vegetarianism for me is about saying ‘yes’ to things - even meat." - Coupling
Why say no, when it feels so good to say yes. 117 Posts 10/06
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 5:27PM
I apologize, I should have said it differently. I don't hate porn and I really like this forum. It just really bugs me to see so much camera bouncing during a scene.
Why say no, when it feels so good to say yes. 117 Posts 10/06
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 5:40PM
I apologize for saying Zero Tolerance, I meant to say Diabolic. Zero Tolerance is actually really good about trying to hold camera angles longer for guys to enjoy them.
I meant Diabolic. A good example is Spring Chickens 10. After all the intro interviews, no camera position is held longer than 20 seconds that I could find. It's a zoom on the girls face, zoom out to full body, zoom to hole, zoom to face, zoom to hole, zoom out, etc. etc. etc. Seems like each angle is held for like 4 seconds each.
I apologize for being so harsh earlier. RLD and Platinum also make good stuff. I've just come across some stuff that really bothered me.
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Midtown Deactivated User
299 Posts 7/05
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 5:41PM
Dude, you have to understand that a lot of people here like the whole "reality porn" thing. Their definition of good porn is a fuzzy picture that eventually focuses square on one or more guy's hairy butt. He's doing anal on someone. You hear noises that sound like they're coming from a woman. But, you can't be sure, since she(?) is completely blocked from view. For some reason, this is what porn directors think the average male viewer wants.
Good directors explicitly try to avoid the dreaded "man-blanket." Man, I wish you would list a few things you've been watching that you think really suck. All the things you've complained about are not generally present in any of the good one-on-one scenes I've viewed this year, so I'm curious what pickle jar you've been dipping into.
If Manuel is in the scene and the girl is gazing longingly into his dreamy french eyes, I'll shoot his head. If it's some other guy and she's staring longingly at her watch, I'll avoid his head :)
Rule #1. No clocks or watches are allowed within the view of the female talent at any time . If the scene is in a kitchen, cover the clock on the oven and microwave with electrical tape. If the sun is starting to set, send a PA outside to shine a giant light into the window. In extreme cases, all calendars should be removed from the set as well.
The "man blanket" thing, while being the directors job to correct, is a clueless male performer screw up. Good meat puppets know to open for camera at all times in all instances.
You are not the only one who gets upset with some directors... I my self got pissed off with some of them quite a few times and still do, criticizing them of having complete lack of the sense of beautifulness and sensuality, not mentioning, any touch of adult director's instict at all. Also many times I accused certain creators of being general incompetent to shoot exciting erotic poses at the proper angles and distances, applying the right light, the just set up or the adequate time. Yeap, there were times that I caught myself laughing hysterically for some directors constant disability to video hot sexual activities other directors can. I thought it was a matter of technique, experience or just wrongful mentality.
Maybe they were all of them... and still more, but my friend today I know that a porn movie, a certain scene and even a specific position needs many things to come out perfectly. And even succeeds to do, it can't possibly satisfy every adult spectator who has varying personal criteria about what is sexy, beautiful or hot.
Well, I think porn productions are getting improved constantly and most directors learn the techniques from others or from their participants which apply them in action. Of course there are still artists who deny to evolve but in this case you have the power to choose to watch or not their creations.
Finally, I have seen DVDs which were shot from several different angles and had multiangle as an option to your DVD remote control. Cool stuff, but cost a lot and is very difficult to be applied. I hope this to be more effective in the future. I think that option would help you and many others...
You are definitely not alone on this one. This is probably my main gripe with porno films in general. I always call it the MTV Affect. I suppose there can be some debate about which influenced which first, but I'd swear I was like watching an MTV show or video when I watch adult films sometimes.
I think one of the main problems is that the sex isn't always that continuous, so cuts and edits have to be made to piece it together. Like Quazar, I think chemistry, or lack of it, forces directors or editors to constantly change frames too. If the director doesn't like what he sees, you can best bet he/she is gonna chop it to pieces. And let's not forgot Cable TV, which has always been a necessary evil in my view.
Not really sure how long I want any particular shot to be held, but I do want it held long enough for me to jerk-off to it though. It can very from scene to scene, or director to director. Some directors/studios seem to shoot more footage than others, so they may be ones you wanna check out. Evil Angel seems to be one that immediately come to mind. To me it's not so much how long a shot is held, but more about capturing the "heat" or visual image I wanna see. Styles ae subject to tastes, so I'd never tell anyone who to watch. I can only say who I really enjoy watching. They are in no particular order: Jules Jordan, Joey Silvera, Justin Slayer, Lex Steele, Mike John, Stoney Curtis, Seymore Butts, John Leslie, Patrick Collins, Cash Markman, and early John Stagnolia. And there are many others, but those are the most consistent with me personally. I've seen very few films by those directors that I didn't visually like. Keeping in mind that the right women have to be in them also, and more often than not, those guys seem to cast women I really like also.
Introducing Brandi Swan
Posted - Oct 13 2006 : 5:09AM
