Yeah it's most definitely true, look in the Porn News forum to find a thread about this, I can't link to it as I don't know how,lol. But Ariana did indeed take on 65 men.
Well if you want a big scene with lots of guys then you might check out her Gangbang scene, Gangbang Girl #35, she takes on 21 guys for her 21's birthday!! A better scene though I think is her Gangbang Audition with just five guys but I personally don't like a lot of guys standing around. This 65 man deal will be something to look at to see how they pull it off and I know Ariana had fun doing it as I've talked to her but I prefer her in more intimate scenes with no more than 2 guys, much more than that is just clutter after a while.
Unbelieveable! Even during a time when the govt. is threatening actions that would severely compromise the industry as it operates today, people are still willing to engage in such risky behavior.
Maybe we deserve to have a bunch of right-wing zealots dictating to us...it appears we haven't learned a damn thing from recent tragedies...its a shame and it does a serious disservice to the performers whose very lives are now threatened due to such irresponsible activity.
We should give Devil's Films all the credit for not selling out to the US government. I mean fight for your rights to shoot whatever you want instead of laying down like a government slave, that's my opinion.
i didn't realize that engaging in risky behavior happens to go hand in hand with the governments "threatening actions"... to the best of my knowledge a sex act is a sex act whether it be myself banging 65 guys or the girl next to me having straight up vaginal sex with one partner.
the last thing I AM is naive; i am oh so well aware of the difference. at the end of the day the last thing i am worrying about is your comments on my contribution to the fall of our industry.
darling, it is i who will be here 20 years from now on top of my game, successful and very very happy. you can sit there with your incredibly strong finger muscles attacking me all you want; but in all reality if you feel so strongly maybe you should put your strength and your emotions to better use.
some people will stand there and place blame, or point the finger if you would and others, who do not even bother saying a word; are fighting for your motherfucking right to be a goddamn pervert.
INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH THOSE PEOPLE ARE WHOM YOU ATTACK !
and what are you doing ? you are writing on a fan website... congratulations you have made such a difference in the fight.
i sincerely hope that my sarcasm is clear to you.
i have chosen not to reply, or acknowledge any of the threads in reference to the industries ordeal with the health department this long for a reason. maybe i should not bother hitting post new reply even know.... but this had to be said.
all my love, and prayers for those cattle who feel they have to create their own drama.
and all of my heart to my most wonderful fans who are a constant reminder of why i do what i do.
Sorry Ariana, I agree with Jag completely. Not only that, but your reply to his post was ridiculous. Not once did you even address his point, all you did was flat out insult the guy, and state how much better off you'll be in 20 years? Whats that about?
There's a difference between porn, and plain stupidity. Its already been stated that this company didnt EXPECT all 65 guys to show up, and that the scene TURNED into that when they realized... That alone makes it blatantly obvious that all the men may or may not have been tested properly.
You can do whatever you want, thats your right. But it doesnt change the fact that it was incredibly irresponsible, especially considering the recent events that have taken place in the industry.
Respectfully Arianna, I have to agree with Cel. I'm sure that you were quite comfortable with whatever precautions were taken with regards to testing that us 'loser' porn fans aren't privy to, but your intimation that letting 65 men cum inside of you is the same as having sex one on one is absurd.
I'm confused. People are still taking shots at Darren James for shooting unprotected in a foreign country, but this gangbang is a cause for celebration. I'm honestly not here to attack Arianna or Devil's. Can someone from the industry please explain the difference to me?
i suppose everytime i fuck i should put out a press release. here is what i did, and here are our tests. they did not expect 65 guys to show up, but 65 guys did... with all current legitimate tests. I sat and went over every last one of them myself. if i did the same thing with 65 american performers would you feel the same way ? do you think that i am that much of an imbecile that i would put my own life in danger ?
my reply is mostly out of anger and frustration. i do not feel as if i should have to defend my own integrity. people spend so much time assuming that the thought never crosses their minds that they may actually be wrong.
the point i was attempting to make regarding my having sex with 65 guys or some girl just fucking one is that the health department is not seeing either even the least bit differently. they have an agenda, and my having sex with 65 guys is the same as anything else.
maybe it is not the same to you, or myself even... but it is all the same to them.
when i get a personal phone call from cal/osha i'll let you know.
as for the recent events affecting my decision to shoot this scene, i have taken every single precaution neccesary to ensure my safety. That statement should be enough by itself. It is within the business where in which i can understand taking heat for any of my actions, not from anywhere else.
I have heard the rumour about the testing maybe not being up to what it should have been but I don't know for sure and would welcome Ariana or Mike clearing that up. My concern is only for her safety and whether or not it's 65 or 165 is not relevant to me. If the proper precautions were taken then I say go ahead because if the govt. wanted to go after the industry as hard as some fear this one scene wouldn't make the big difference. Honestly I'd rather not see such big deals done but I realize Ariana is an adventureous type of gal so this obviously appealed to her. Again I just hope all the necessary health issues were taken care of and nothing was sacrificed in order to meet this high #.
Thanks Ariana we were typing at the same time evidently,hehe! If you say you took all the necessary steps then I'm cool with that, my concern is always about the girls and the guys as well. I want hot sex but I want you and your partners to always be as safe as possible!!
please dont quote me as calling any porn fan a "loser". i myself am a porn fan, and without the porn fan what i do would not exist... i think i explained in my above post my argument regarding the difference between letting 65 guys fuck me, or having one on one sex.... i apologize for not being more clear in my original post.
Thats all we're concerned with. Trust me nobody here is trying to question your career decisions, or piss you off. Just trying to make sure the tradgic events of the past arent repeated.
If you say the necessary precautions were taken, then i'll believe you, even though I may have heard different.
We luv ya here, dont be so quick to jump on the defensive ;)
like i said... i'm just frustrated, and its not just from this specific issue. i've read everything, not just here regarding the current situation with the fines and cal/osha. this more or less just set me off. i've seen so many ignorant comments in reference to TT and that whole ordeal, that when finally something was directed towards me everything that ive been holding back commenting on just resurfaced. that in itself is a whole other novella i could write.
I'm glad that this was easily resolved, and apologize for my overly-defensive reply... i hope that you understand.
Ariana all you would have had to do is give him that beautiful look you get in your scenes and I bet he would have,lol!! Hope we see you in chat tonight, it could be a good discussion and I mean that in the best way as the crowd is always respectful of the talent and if not Denver Don kicks their ass to the curb or Drew if he's there!! Melissa you're invited also, we love your intensity too in your scenes!!
BTW I'm right in the middle of a review, Ass 2 Mouth from Platinum X, do you think they'll cum after me, Big Brother that is,hehe!!
duh! she said, "I am oh so well aware of the difference".
Besides no one who did not work on that set knows if all guys were tested or not. I would like to think they were all from the male talent pool of some local agencies and therefore 'trustworthy' performers who are tested regulary.
I don't know who you adress but as I write here too I feel adressed. I think the 'fans' are the ones who could vote with their wallet for a change, so the audience is not all that wrong to raise consciousness for safer sex.
However I do admit that I've nearly given up on that, while many 'pornfans' praise their stars, they live in denial, refusing to accept that their cry for more extreme sexacts makes the working conditions for the very talent they adore even worse in the long run. So in a way I can understand Arianas comment about fans who demand their "right to be a goddamn pervert". On the other hand every pornstar needs fans. For me to participate in a 65 guy creampie record would be out of question but I'd never point fingers.
Though I believe you should be allowed to perform whatever sexact you're comfortable with in private life, I still think a mandatory creampie ban would serve the health of the talent pool a big deal, as would a considerably increased use of condoms (which can only go along with a change of the mindset of many fans).
As long as all goes well everybody cheers, but at the first sign of trouble your suddenly all alone, tho people say they care they dont mean it. Do we really need more girls walking all alone on some Island waiting to die? If you really worship your stars you should care about their well-being and should not refuse to buy movies in which they use condoms to protect their health.
Moreover you, YOU FANS, shouldn't buy this film in question. Ariana got her money now, she won't be hurt if you don't buy it but the producers lose money. So in the end it's the fans who could boycott such productions.
its our choice, it is my choice not to use a condom, or to use one if i so wish. we are not forced to not use condoms. if we only shot condom-only porn you would get condom-only porn. you dont need to boycott certain types of porn to protect us. i find the notion sweet and endearing considering your agenda. but we arent forced to do anything. i feel perfectly safe with the testing which we have now, as do many others. it is very few who do not feel the same.
its our choice, it is my choice not to use a condom, or to use one if i so wish. we are not forced to not use condoms. Many talents (both male and female) have no choice but shooting no-condom porn to get their cut.
If we only shot condom-only porn you would get condom-only porn. so what? Am I the one who needs to live through male performers to fulfil my masturbation fantasies.
but why? I mean you could still have blowjobs w/o condom. You could still do cumshots on skin. Just because there is a barely visible rubber ruins all your fantasies? I don't get it. In real life most of ya horny boys would have jerked off before your fav star even had the chance to get the condom out of the package
You can do whatever kind of scenes that you want to do.
As long as you wait a minimum of two weeks, and better yet four weeks, until you start doing porn scenes in Los Angeles again. Likewise, you should have at least two consecutive negative HIV tests done at AIM before working again.
Because it's not just your health that's at stake here. It's the health of the entire pool of performers in Los Angeles, who do go to AIM and get tested regularly.
If your bosses at Anarchy/Python were really generous, they would pay you, for all the work you would miss out on while you wait out those weeks.
that s more possible in gonzo than in feature where you're interrupted every minute for a make-up touch-up or different angle, or light changing.
[Link]
Ren Galskap Deactivated User
35 Posts 9/04
Posted - Oct 6 2004 : 10:08PM
Ariana,
I'm not trying to talk you out of anything, or tell you how to run your career. Nothing I'm saying here is meant to reflect on your intellegence or your ability to take care of yourself.
You're probably aware that Darren James tested negative on a PCR-DNA after he was already infected. All tests are inherently faulty forms of protection. In LA, AIM reduces the risk associated with tests by testing all performers every month. One-shot testing gives you some protection, but there's still a higher risk of a false negative with one-shot testing than there is with regular, universal testing. You can't get the same protection you get from AIM's tests unless you also use AIM's testing program.
You should be able to do whatever you wanna do, but then a quarantine period should be respected.
Not because it s you Ariana, not because it was shot in Europe, not because of how many guys, but because no-one should forget that what happened to Darren, Jessica, and the others already happened, and it (unfortunately) will happen again.
Recently i was talking with a performer about that (the quarantine period that should be respected for every performer coming back from a place where AIM can t control testing). His reaction : it happened a few months ago, so we don t have to fear anything before a year or two.
Wow, Melissa, can you tell me the title of that Red Light movie? thanks
[Link]
Ren Galskap Deactivated User
35 Posts 9/04
Posted - Oct 6 2004 : 11:09PM
Mean time between outbreaks is six years, so he figures there won't be another outbreak for a few more years. Ummmmm...
Major earthquakes occur in California how often? Once every five years? So after a major earthquake, CA is safe for a few years. Except sometimes they happen two weeks apart.
If the mean time between HIV outbreaks is six years, there's approximately a 15% chance of having one or more outbreaks any year. Any year. Regardless of when the last outbreak occurred. (It's a Poisson distribution.)
Actually, we don't know what the real mean time between outbreaks is, so the real probability of an outbreak any year could be much higher. An outbreak can occur anytime a performer is careless and gets infected. What are the odds that nobody in the porn industry does something careless this year?
fuk, i dont know if i can wait til January for 65 Guy CP
ariana is completely awesome.
i love how people like to patronize her as if she needed a lecture in "safe porn sex". she strikes me as being intelligent so i'm sure she would take utmost effort to be sure she's safe in making this film.
Edited by - Glory Boy on 10/6/2004 11:39:28 PM
[Link]
Ren Galskap Deactivated User
35 Posts 9/04
Posted - Oct 7 2004 : 12:28AM
Let's look at this from a purely financial viewpoint. Keeping it hypothetical, let's say Betty Pornstar has received an offer to do a fifty-man creampie. Betty is trying to figure out if it's worth the money. She's a pretty sharp businesswoman, but her math is rusty, so she needs to keep this simple.
The producer making the video has decided to do this in Europe. Normally, male performers aren't expensive, but he's going to be hiring fifty of them, and they're cheaper in Eastern Europe. To show his appreciation to Betty, he's paying for her plane tickets and food and lodging while she's in Europe, and he's paying her $5,000 instead of his normal $4,000 for a gangbang creampie. (I'm pulling numbers out of the air.) So Betty has no cash outlay and earns $5,000. As a business woman, she likes the cash flow aspect.
However, Betty has two hidden costs: her opportunity costs, and her risk. As Renee points out, Betty won't be able to work for a few weeks after doing the creampie, so she'll lose the opportunity to earn money while she's waiting to do her second PCR-DNA test. Her opportunity cost is the value of all the jobs she has to pass up while she's waiting. Betty has a pretty good idea how much money she would normally earn during that period, so that part of the calculation is easy.
The main risk is the risk of getting HIV. To calculate the cost of the risk, Betty has to find out what the incidence of HIV infections is in the area where she'll be working, use that and the binomial distribution to calculate the odds of one or more of the men she's working with having HIV, use that to calculate the odds of an infected male getting a negative test or forging a test, and finally calculating the odds of a man with a false or forged negative test transmitting the virus to her. Then she has to calculate the lifetime earnings that she would lose as a result of getting HIV, and estimate her lifetime medical bills.
Fortunately, there's a way for Betty to avoid all this calculation; get an insurance policy that covers all her HIV related costs and lost income, should she become infected. That forces the insurance company to do all the math for her, and puts a dollar amount on her risk. So Betty gets out the phone book and starts calling.
The first thing she discovers is that nobody wants to insure her. There's no market for this. Insurance companies aren't set up to deal with this. So she checks around and finds a company that specializes in unusual insurance policies. Specialty insurance is expensive. They do the math for her and come back with a price for the insurance; $10,000.
So Betty concludes that while the cash looks good, as a businesswoman she's actually losing money on the deal.
Isn't a little foolish to speculate when you are pulling numbers out of the air? It sort of makes the speculation meaningless. Ariana strikes me a sharp gal, I'm sure she calculated everything accordingly.
The only thing bad about this whole thing was the fact.......that I was not one of the guys ;-)
Personally I wish there were more girls in porn with such a great attitude towards their work as Ariana. Ariana always gives her best in her scenes, a lot of girls could learn a lot from her!
That is the point you are missing. You have certain precautions in mind, someone else has more someone else has more or less. here is an example (each level assumes the precautions of previos levels if applicable) level 0-no precautions level 1-regular testing level 2(x-ray/vivid level)-condoms for anal/vaginal no creampies nothing cool level 3-condoms for all penis contact no semen contact dental dams rubber gloves eye goggles ear protection level 4-latex or similar for all contact with other persons or their fluids level 5-hazmat suits level 6-no contact with other persons or their fluids level 7-all activities involve only one person who is sealed in a bubble
Who is to say what level is appropriate. Better to let the individuals involved decide.
Stepping from Level1 to Level2 means reducing the amount of offers to a minimum for most talent. If all performers really had this choice most of them would happily chose Level2. Many fans sadly decline all responsibility and refuse to see these simple relations. On a personal note, if you really think sex without anal creampies and cumfarts is boring you just demonstrated your lack of class and imagination.Talents who refuse to work with condoms but get excited when it comes to how to maximize health risks can shorten the wait for the next outbreak drastically.
Besides who do you want to fool? If you can get the same MONEY in a 'boring? 1on1 condom scene' as in a 65 guy creampie gangbang my guess is that almost everyone would chose the former rather than the latter. I think it's a good thing Melissa decided not to do creampies anymore. She can serve as a model for other talents. Just say no to creampies.
What makes me really sad are all the fans who refuse to buy condom porn and need creampies to whack off. They give a fuck about talents health and yet want to be oh so caring. Just wait until the next outbreak I guess all the skronkers, ramseys and glory boys will raise a fund to support her fav girl once she is infected and can't work anymore. Nothing you will do but ask sanctimoniously "How could that happen?" That's the sad truth.
eastern and central europe exceed any african nation in new infections and new infection rates, and manages to do so while generally considered to grossly under-report hiv data. assuming they got the talent from the absolute riskiest demographic outside(and maybe including iv drug users) i don't see why there's not reason for taking a month off to make sure everything's kosher with the test results.
I meant no disrespect toward you specifically - and definitely was not attacking anyone's integrity or right to work. I merely think that at this time, certain actions play right into the hands of those trying to censor what is produced. You may call it caving in to these forces, but I think sometimes a little self-censoring in the name of discretion is a wise and powerful tool. Kind of a "those who fight and run away live to fight another day" type of thing.
I apologize if my post felt like a personal attack to you -- the whole situation is frustrating to all involved and I did not intend to add to that frustration. It is a sad day when 'the forces that be' have succeeded in creating an atmosphere where fans and performers cannot exchange opinions in a genteel manner.
tricia_devereaux wrote: The estimate of $12,000 for HIV meds each year is pretty accurate. 4 doctor visits a year to one of the best Infectious Disease specialists in the nation cost me another $2500 including all the blood tests I need each year.
skronker wrote: I feel bad for people clinging to the bottom rung of the ladder who have to deal with these types of expenses. Thanks for the info. It really puts some things into perspective. (Like, for instance, why it's ALWAYS a good idea to use a condom! -- Speaking non-professionally here. There but for the grace of God, and so on ... ).
Ariana Jollee @ Adult Empire
Posted - Oct 5 2004 : 7:41PM
