Does anyone remember those scenes from the movie "Andromeda Strain", where the doctor works on the patients from inside an airtight suit so he is totally isolated from them?
That's how porn will be filmed in the future - no real physical contact, anesthetic, cold and lifeless. All cumshots and penetrations will be simulated.

I'm gonna start buying up any movies I've had my eye on for a while - they may be pulled!

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ps: Here is Chico:s No Swallowing Allowed #3 -topic.

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I'd much rather be without facials than with goggles.
But that still leaves dental dams and gloves.

My US porn consumption would be limited to what's already been produced thank you very much.

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Hey, maybe they'll bring the biz back to New York!

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The number of outdoor scenes would be cut down drastically because of the long winters - But hell, that's a good thing IMHO!

If any stars want to contact me in advance for places to stay, please feel free!

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OTOH, why not look at some opportunities to make some money on this.




TonyC said:
"It was only when I realized that flirting was about what I could give (rather than what I could get) that I started to become a good flirt."

Edited by - Walter Burns on 9/17/2004 12:51:41 PM

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Edited by - joeblow69 on 9/17/2004 1:04:32 PM

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- Saki

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I think Drew's right about the written procedures. As far as the protective gear goes, I wonder if talent might be able to sign waivers to work without it (or at least some of it). Of course, as a company owner I would want talent to be able to demonstrated that they had full knowledge of the risks involved before signing a waiver. Otherwise, I might still be liable if something happened and the talent claimed not to have known what was being signed away.

I'm sure a lot of owners are unhappy right now but this could be a good thing, if it means the industry standardizes on protocols for scheduling and shooting scenes that avoid what happened the last time, and actually requires the talent to become educated about STD's and sexual behavior before being allowed on the set.

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- Saki

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I do see how it could be interpreted as coercion though, particularly if every employee waived their rights.

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There would also be unintended hazards to other people if one guy decides he doesn't mind working near unsecured tanks of explosive gasses placed on ladders going up the side of a 300 foot tower, and stuff like that. Other people are bound to be exposed.

OSHA probably gets tired of people losing fingers in cables, getting burnt to death, and 16 year old kids losing arms in bakery equipment. They probably don't want to mess with people deciding they like the risks.

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Stupid politicians trying to "protect" the porns stars. That's some of the funniest B.S. I've heard in a while. They are just bowing to there conservative base or whoever else is anti-porn. But yet, most of these P.I.P.'s (People In Power) have probably seen and owned hundreds of tapes and DVDs of these and past porn stars in action.

Get real. The only people they are fooling is the fools that believe everything that they say.

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"Employers in this industry must provide the hepatitis B vaccine series to employees who may be exposed to blood, semen, vaginal fluid or OPIM."
good thing.

"If an employee has unprotected contact with someone else's blood, semen, vaginal fluid, or OPIM, the employer must provide them with a medical evaluation and follow up at no cost to the employee .
great. Hahaha suddenly some of the ideas of those 'far from reality' come true.

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Or is this just too arcane a concern?

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Certainly one can choose to mandate regs based on the worst case scenario, but it is a choice, not a necessity. One could also choose a combination of education, protection and protocol. So long as the industry can demonstrate that each worker is well aware of the risks and has the freedom, knowledge and power to make an informed decision in every instance, then I don't see that OSHA's 'to-do' list is a necessity. Generally speaking, a 'to-do' list is undoubtedly cheaper for a company to implement and easier for OSHA to enforce but, as written, this list is likely to drive the industry out of business, or at least out of California.

Why should inspectors "waste their time" on waivers in the porn industry? Because they exist to serve the workers, not the other way around.

Having said all that, I believe it is all to the good that companies have an authority to answer to when they neglect the safety of their employees. I don't want OSHA to ignore the industry, I just want the industry to have standards and training in place so performers know what's going on at every shoot and can protect themselves in the manner they feel is best.

--------------------
danged typos

Edited by - hardware on 9/17/2004 4:04:51 PM

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If the inspectors were allowed to be present at some shoots of their favorite stars, perhaps they could be swayed towards leniency.

Hey, everything is up for negotiation, right?

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Ron

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Scott Kinney
Diversified Video Associates
www.xxx-imports.com

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But if the companies have to film outside California, I don't think they'll stray too far. Of course companies always go to Europe anyway to shoot girls, but those that need to shoot in America will probably just go to Vegas or something. If a company doesn't completely relocate, then trips here and there to Vegas won't be to expensive.

I think going any farther than that on a regular basis will kill any profits they may eventually see from the movies they're making.

Just my humble opinion.

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If studios are required to use condoms, dental dams, gloves, etc, porn as we know it will cease to exist. Even more ominous is the prospect for a complete failure of a multi billion dollar industry. Who would buy porn where the talent is forced to use dental dams, gloves, condoms, etc. You might as well put a big garbage bag over each of the performers and let them roll around on top of each other.

The other obvious option is to relocate to a locale more accomodating. I would hope common sense prevails and this is what occurs. How bout Michigan?

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Also according to the LA Times, "Actor Brandon Iron said he also welcomed Cal/OSHA's efforts but doubted they would make a difference." Iron is quoted in the article: "I'm not sure it's enough of a deterrent to other companies to change the way business is done." Brandon Iron's Good Source of Iron movies would be fined under the CAL/OSHA regulations. The movies depict guys cumming into the mouths of women. This is an exchange of bodily fluids. What Brandon said was probably taken out of context. He may not know that Evasive Angles and TTB Productions were given fines for the guys not wearing condoms. Every company could be fined under the CAL/OSHA regulations. Even Wicked Pictures and Vivid Video are in violation because the guys don't wear condoms when the women give them oral sex.

I think that T.T. Boy used bad judgement in deciding to make
porn movies in Brazil without condoms. In Brazil, Condoms are mandatory for x-rated movies. It was not the Brazilian government that punished T.T. Boy, it was CAL/OSHA. In Brazil, it's not as easy to verify that someone is HIV negative. In the United States, people can contact AIM to verify paperwork. In Brazil, who would know if the paperwork is fraudulent? I think that this is a slippery slope kind of
situation. If people let CAL/OSHA get away with this, who knows who they will come after next. This situation is simular to the government prosecuting Extreme Associates.
A lot of people do not like T.T. Boy and Robert Black but if the government can persecute them, other people will nailed by the government later. The lilihood of getting HIV from vaginal intercourse is small. On the average, it takes hundreds of times with the same person to transmit HIV through vaginal intercourse. The Myth of Heterosexual Aids (written by Michael Fumento) mentions studies with couples that backup this information.

John Holmes did at least 2 porn films after he knew that he had HIV. Tracey Adams, Karin Shubert, Amber Lynn and Cicciolina all had sex with Holmes when he had HIV. They have not gotten HIV. Even with anal intercourse, it normally takes multiple times with the same person for the virus to make someone else HIV positive. Rock Hudson's main lover didn't get HIV from him. Herpes is much more likily to be transmitted then HIV. If someone has an outbreak of Herpes, there is a 50 percent chance of someone else getting it. When Holmes was making movies, anal intercourse and creampies were much less common then they are now. As far as sexual practices, I think that creampies are the biggest cause for concern in the industry right now. Anal intercourse is already much more risky then vaginal intercourse, anal creampies make the scenes even more dangerous.

I think that x-rated companies should have voluntary condom use but I don't think condoms should be mandatory. Even if all video companies allowed condoms, I think there are still many people that would not use them. Years ago, I noticed some Anabolic gangbangs in which some guys would use condoms but most of the guys would not have them on. When I was at the AVN Expo, I asked Christopher Alexander about what I observed. Alexander said that he would hire women that were OK with the guys not wearing condoms. Christopher Alexander said that he would let guys wear condoms. After I had my conversation with him, I haven't seen guys wearing condoms in Anabolic movies.

Since CAL/OSHA advocates worker safety, why don't they ban stuntmen and boxing? I was watching Supercop again, Jackie Chan was hanging onto a helicopter. I know this was real because the credits showed behind the scenes footage.
Jackie could have fallen to his death. Tommy Morrison is not allowed to box any more because he has HIV. Besides HIV, boxing is a dangerous sport anyway. Boxing has people beating each other up for the entertainment of others. Football has dangers too, maybe they can ban that as well. CAL/OSHA is picking and choosing what they consider to be worker safety.

Jamie Gardner www.demicomix.com/Carnal01.htm

Edited by - Jamie Gardner on 9/17/2004 6:09:32 PM

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Edited by - M.B. on 9/17/2004 6:12:41 PM

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{from: Los Angeles Times, www.latimes.com}

Two porn companies fined for allowing unprotected sex on set

Friday, September 17, 2004
01:37 PDT LOS ANGELES (AP) --

State officials have taken unprecedented regulatory action against the porn
industry, fining two adult film companies more than $30,000 each for allegedly
allowing actors to perform unprotected sex.

edited: please provide links to articles instead of pasting the entire article here.

Edited by - Drew Black on 9/18/2004 12:11:34 PM

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I think the courts will ultimately decide things, hopefully in favor of consenting adults. In the meantime, perhaps the Industry should try to get the bureaucrats to back off pending court decision(s)-- as an incentive for the back-off, we might want to consider negotiating with the government to leave us alone if we agree to cease doing anal creampies (and even possibly agree to condoms for anal?)!

Dave Cummings
www.davecummings.com (No pop-ups)

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I understand these list just as a guideline what talents can demand on their workplace,
not as an absolute requirement for an shot. I deduced this from the fact they list regs for the case
of unprotected sex, maybe I'm wrong.
Anyway it gives the employees the rights they need so bad just in case something goes wrong
and a std-hazard occurs. These days HIV may be seen more as a chronic diseases than as a lethal one
but did you ever think about the costs of treatment. Who pays for you if you have no personal health insurance?
Now the porncompanies can't escape responsibility and will think twice at what risks they put the talent.
Coz if your transsexual analcreampie line ends up in a fiasco, you can pay a long time for the victims.

Ultimately some people like TT-Boy have drawn the attention of politicans due to reported horrible working conditions.
That many companies try to please the customers fetishes without waisting any thought about the health of the performers
is just another reason you now face overadjustment.

$30.000? doesn't he pay that from petty cash? I wonder who gets this money the OSHA or some talent.
BTW don't think 30k will do in case you want to pay meds for a proper HIV+ treatment until the rest of your life.

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OSHA is not to be fucked with, that's for sure. Having been a funeral director for a few years, I've dealt with OSHA a lot. Their "universal precautions" standards are unbearable...even for funeral directors...let alone porn producers. One issue never mentioned is that once you start following "universal precautions" (using condoms, gloves, and the like), you must also follow proper disposal techniques. Items such as used condoms, gloves, even towels and wipes, are considered biohazardous waste under universal precautions, and must be disposed of in special containers and then removed by a licensed biohazardous waste disposal service. That equates to a lot of money for funeral directors, who may only embalm 15 bodies a month...What will it mean for producers who are shooting 30 scenes a month, involving 60 to 90 people?

I haven't seen any info regarding proper disposal? Has anyone else?

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- Saki

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- Saki

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What is so wrong with protecting the talent? Is it the method the govt. is going about or does the porn companies resist any kind of legislation into their business? It just seems curious that they are willing to pick up stakes to go Vegas, Montreal, Czech Republic where ever.

Edited by - Caracalla on 9/17/2004 7:37:45 PM

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The way I see it, driving cars can be dangerous too; but if you are forced by government to drive with max speed of 10 mph for your safety, what's the point of driving in the first place?

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*sigh* all this nah nah nah talk - i shoot my porn elsewhere just shows that most producers are unwilling to face the nuisances that undoubted exist. Why are so few people discussing how to improve working conditions for performers? Just wait until the next health hazard hits? And btw, who says other states in the U.S won't follow the Californian example?

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Even though I would much rather you folks do what you do, but to quote the Baha Men, "Who Let The Dogs Out". It's gonna be a fight, and I hate to say that we all might end up losing. I don't know what the March fall out consisted of, but a best bet would have been to allow government input to preven this from occuring. It's obvious that Hitting Evasive 1st was no lottery pick.

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