just cause I'm a giver you can come help with the retaining wall for the spring rains... no really it's honetly the greatest thing ever, outside doing something physical and productive
Happy Birthday! Hope You had a great day. Boy, you are still HOT!!!!
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Porn Scout Deactivated User
3735 Posts 10/02
Posted - Mar 29 2007 : 2:39AM
If you think about the number of women that have done porn in just the last decade or so and then consider the fact that we almost never hear about them again once they leave the industry, you have to conclude that it's at least somewhat possible to re-enter mainstream society.
I imagine it depends on a lot of factors. Notoriety, certainly, is a big one - the number of scenes she does and how well-known she becomes. I think that's pretty obvious. It probably depends how distinctive her looks are. I've seen some girls in BTS segments that were completely unrecognizable prior to having their makeup done. Add a change of hairstyle and a lot of these girls you wouldn't know if they were sitting across from you on the bus.
It probably depends where she's coming from and returning to. I mean, if all her friends from high school know she went off to do porn, and it's all over her myspace page, and she's from a small town where everyone knows everyone, then yeah, she's gonna have a problem. On the other hand, if she didn't have a lot of friends in HS and didn't plan on returning to wherever she was from in the first place, then she'll probably have an easier time with it.
Hey whiteboy ! What do you mean here in Europe you can fit in society ? If a porn star walks down the street screaming she's a porn star, even here in Europe I don't believe they will call the minister to give her a medal of merit !
There are some things I'll never be permitted to do, and some things I'll always be open to the accusation of doing. I'll never be permitted to work with anyone's children, and I'll always be under suspicion of harming children. Mine and others. That is part of the stigma of sex work.
I find it flabbergasting that some woman can neglect her children and eventually drug one child to death while teachers and doctors watch and refer her to Children's Services over and over and she manages to evade action. I've been arrested twice for endangering children! My daughter gets a teeny scratch on the side of her foot and my neighbor calls the Children's Services and they're out investigating me the following day with orders to remove my children on the spot because I'm a stripper!! (this was many years ago - the social worker actually accused me of showing her the wrong child because the tiny little band-aid covered scratch on my daughter's foot couldn't possibly be the gaping wound the neighbor reported) I ended up consenting, not once, but three times, to 6 week long supervised parental instruction visits to prove that, while I was indeed a stripper, I provided all the necessary food, care, medical needs, educational instruction and shelter for my children without exposing them to wild orgies and a constant string of naked people or whatever the hell they thought I was doing. To this day I keep all my porn memorabilia in a padlocked box to "protect" my children, all of whom are sexually active and only one of which are under 18, from my horrible perversity.
Can I re-enter, assuming I ever left, whatever passes for normal or decent society? Sure, absolutely, as long as I mind my Ps and Qs, never step outside the lines, draw any attention to myself, and carefully maintain my distance. They don't want me, they don't want my kind, and they're going to persecute me if they can find any opportunity. It's my job to never give them an opportunity. They'll find one anyway, and I'll fight for myself, and for everyone like me.
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Clam Digger Deactivated User
Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05
Posted - Mar 31 2007 : 11:57AM
But they will buy the DVD's and the videos & maybe hire you and Imak for the bachelor parties, won't they....At least you can be true to yourself..
Yeah, I could probably give up everything I've worked my ass off to get, leave my family and friends behind, cut my ties with everything familiar that I've ever known, and go somewhere else. I could get a job doing some random dull thing. Only to have some jilted dude or jealous chick dig up some decade old nudie pics of me from the wonderful internet and have all the same crap start all over again. How many times should I be forced to run away?
I do look like all my pics. All fifty gazillion of them. I've worn dopey make-up, wigs, and insane costumes, but when it comes down to it - nobody doesn't recognize me from my pictures.
Does it mean I get fans running up to me in the mall yelling "Hey, you're Kimi Lixx!" No. It doesn't. (that's only happened to me once) It does mean that I get emails from people saying they found pictures of me "sucking off that black guy" and they threaten to tell my mom. Yeah, like my mom doesn't know. They would LIKE to harm me. I can't be harmed by personal blackmail because I haven't kept any secrets. If I did work a regular job, I'm sure people would try to harm me by telling my boss. So, I already know that when I do move back into the non-sex work force I'm going to have to disclose my history or risk being blackmailed. I already know it. That's how people are.
It is disheartening that Kimi and Kami have been persecuted and stalked on account of their porn careers. I ascribe this to the fact that American society is still highly sexually repressed and dominated by fundamentalist zealots and than some people are evil hypocrites.
I have a lot of respect for Kimi and Imak. (Even though I still don’t know who Imak is or does it matter) They seem to have found happiness in judgmental and hypocritical environments. I wish them and their families’ only happiness and success.
The USA is not an Utopian Society, and probably never will be. The issues that Kimi and Imak describe will always exists--no matter how many times we see photos of Jenna at "semi-mainstream" events, or with Paris Hilton. Remember, Tito Ortiz was recently dis-invited to a US Marine Corps Dinner when they found out he would probably bring Jenna with him as his date.
so the people who actually live this are wrong and your rose colored glasses are right, it makes no sense to cling to a thought that you have no proof of, but have proof telling you it's wrong. Well actually that's no silly it's the basis for religion, but either way at this point we have a dead horse.
side note, the guy that did all that to me went after kimi also, because she assosiated with me
I want to thank Kami and Kimi for posting about some of the sh*t that porn women have to go through at the hands of stalkers, hypocrites, and other assorted assh*les.
Of course your right I didn’t realize your persecution was worse than blacks and homosexuals and other people. We just need to tell them to suck it up don’t we.
I’m sorry your experiences were so bad. I hope I’ve never purchased one of your movies. I would hate to know my enjoyment contributed to your pain.
I’ll take off the rose colored glasses and join you in a course of “there’s no hope the world is black hole and we all must die”
so the people who actually live this are wrong and your rose colored glasses are right, it makes no sense to cling to a thought that you have no proof of, but have proof telling you it's wrong.
Click to expand
I just remembered an interview with female porn performer TJ Hart, who says that a downside of doing porn is that it prevented her from adopting a child--which is something she really wanted to do.
My point is, there are more examples of the "price" a female porn performer pays in her inter-action with mainstream society. And, even if you live in the most progressive city in the nation (San Francisco) there are still legal and social hassles if you're a porn performer.
Here's a thought: with all the money the industry companies/owners pool together into marketing, lobbying and legal expenses, wouldn't it be nice if some of it was focused on helping performers like Kimi and Imak navigate through issues like child custody? Nah...now I guess I'm the one wearing rose colored glasses!
Much love to the girls who fight this battle every day.
where the heck did that come from? the thread is about the discrimination of porn performers. The fact that a child is starving in Africa doesn't mean I don't get hungry at dinner time. People suffer worse, doesn't mean we don't suffer
I would do it again, I bought my house, but you can look at things objectively and realistically without throwing a temper tantrum. Like it or don't there are down sides, coal miners get black lung. I'm attempting (while taking a swing at the hourse myself) to let you see a full picture.
We live under a legal system that lets repeat child offenders and rapists go with what amounts to little more than a warning. Why would you blame fucked up behavior towards former (or current) pornstars on fundamentalists? The reality is that the majority of people in this world view the sex trade as one big lumped up mass of seething depravity. Pedophilia and Vivid full length features go hand-in-hand simply because they both have the word "sex" in them. Fundamental religious beliefs aren't the only driving factor here....Jerry Falwell isn't the only moron with a slanted view in our society.
I started this thread it’s about “can porn stars re-enter society” and find acceptance. It never was about the discrimination of porn performers.
It came from numerous posts that inferred that female porn stars (I’ve never heard anyone say anything about male porn stars) were the scum of society and could never be accepted again.
And you say this is true? Porn stars cannot be accepted by society. By anyone or anywhere in this country.
And you speak for all porn stars.
That is very sad.
Edited by - Shagdog on 4/1/2007 4:37:50 PM
Edited by - Shagdog on 4/1/2007 5:13:22 PM
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Dither Persona non grata
I love America 650 Posts 8/05
Posted - Apr 1 2007 : 5:01PM
I think a society will always in some way or another strive for conformity. In some places it's enough to look like a metal-head or wear unusual clothes, and you'll be met with suspiciousness and prejudice. Discrimination can never be eradicated fully, it's too close to human nature. I'm not surprised that former pornsters are met with suspiciousness and prejudice. Legal discrimination is however not tolerable in any way.
I'm sure there are plenty of performers who don't have problems after they leave the industry. Maybe they never did more than a few videos. Maybe they put on weight and don't look anything like they did a few years ago. Maybe they used to have bleached blonde hair and implants and now they have mouse brown hair and a flat chest. Maybe fifty gazillion other things. Or maybe, just maybe, they get really freakin' lucky.
None of that applies to me.
I had problems with the sex industry long before I went into porn. Just stripping in Cleveland put me at the bottom of the list of acceptable humans. Matter of fact, when I went into porn it was sort of liberating, I felt legitimate - a REAL adult industry performer instead of just a low-life stripper. I felt like the jerks who harassed me finally had a real reason to bother me. "You only thought I was bad before, look how bad I am NOW!"
It's just sad to me. I don't bother people. I'm reasonably discreet. Half naked women don't walk in and out of my house (much). I don't parade around town wearing skimpy clothes holding a sign that says "I DO PORN!" I don't even drive a flashy car. There's no reason for people to bother me.
I won't hide what I do. I won't lie about what I do. I won't even pretend that what I do is a bad thing for people to do. That's what they can't stand. They can't stand the fact that I'm not ashamed. Since I won't renounce my actions, they have to renounce me. I've been disowned by the acceptable humans.
When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro 306 Posts 2/07
Posted - Apr 1 2007 : 5:44PM
Dude, the very question :"can porn stars re-enter "decent" society implies discrimination against porn performers. If there were no discrimination, the question would be moot.
actually I've hurt more than my share of people with my choices but that's more a function of my personality than anything else. Bottom line I would do it again, I would just get drunk less and yap less
I don't know if that is true or not. I know I have never intended to hurt anyone in my porn career. It's entirely possible that I have. I know that I have certainly met people who don't understand that porn is for fantasy play, not for reality play. They really do believe that they can do all the things they see with no unpleasant repercussions. I guess that's okay when it's me they're doing it to in a professional context, because I can understand where it's coming from and deal with it. But I wonder what all those men and women who aren't doing it to me are doing to unsuspecting people in their lives and if it does cause hurt to some of them.
In case you're not sure what I'm talking about, remember - I did a Slap Happy scene. If I had it to do all over again, I absolutely would have done it, done it sooner, younger, and more of it - but I might have made different choices about some of the things I did knowing that there are consequences to others, not just me, that I might not be willing to take responsibility for.
Now you can’t even try to hold yourself responsible for all the stupid people in the world. Look at all the people hurting themselves copying jackass stunts.
If someone hurts someone else, it’s there fault not yours. And you could have just as easily kept someone from being hurt too. You can only be responsible for yourself and be true to yourself.
People can only shame you if you let them.
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Porn Scout Deactivated User
3735 Posts 10/02
Posted - Apr 1 2007 : 11:30PM
This is a good thread. I'd like to hear from some other former female performers, if there are any lurking out there.
I made the point in another thread that I thought girls would be wise to employ the services of a financial advisor when entering the industry. Everything I've read here reinforces to me that I was right about that. I suppose it's probably a waste of time saying it though.
Porn stars can't "re-enter decent society" because they never left "decent society". Come fucking on.
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Dither Persona non grata
I love America 650 Posts 8/05
Posted - Apr 2 2007 : 7:37AM
I don't think that kind of self-blame is a wise path to go down. No matter what you do, it can always be misused by someone, there will always be people who'll take it the wrong way. I don't think that's what spawns those who're bothering you either, it's more the strive for conformity.
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Clam Digger Deactivated User
Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05
Financial issues have not been a problem for me. I didn't waste my money. I'm sure that a lot of the very young performers don't have a solid idea what to do with their cash, though.
I have never heard anyone say anything about Male Porn Stars. I think part of the reason. Men do not make good victims. They don’t fit the female interview TV couch analysts very well. The format starts out with a humiliating and shameful story about the victim. Then the crying. Then the victim promises to get help. It ends with sniffling and smiling.
Ron Jeremy goes on TV for an interview and he’s treated like a celebrity. A female porn star goes on for an interview. The same people tear her a part, try to talk her into quitting porn.
Anyone every heard an interviewer ever ask Ron Jeremy to quit porn. Bring in Dr. Drew in talk to the hedgehog about quitting porn.
The myth that sex and love is inseparable dominates any discussion about sex. Men have always been allowed to separate sex and love, but women were never allowed too. I think a lot of women are now acknowledging they too can separate sex and love.
Women in our society are not allowed to say, “I’m not in love, and I don’t want marry him. I just want to fuck him.” That is a right men have always had.
It’s not acceptable for women, prostitutes or porn stars to say I enjoyed the sex.
I think Internet porn will change that. I think, as more women don’t accept the shame it will get better
No, I'm not responsible for stupidity. I am responsible for my own actions. When my actions lead others to believe something I don't support, then my actions are in conflict with my own best interests. If I make porn that I believe encourages violence towards women, then I'm doing something that I think makes the world a worse place. I shouldn't do it. And once I came to understand that too many people don't know the difference between fantasy and reality, I stopped making that kind of porn.
Back to the topic...
When I first read this thread, I was offended at the distinction being made by the statement "decent society". As if porn work is an indecent society. I know it's just semantics. We all know what is meant by it. Can porn performers have usual average lives after leaving the industry?
Most of us have usual average lives while we're in the industry. We still pay the bills, we still shop for groceries, we still raise our kids, we get stuck in traffic and take the trash bins to the curb. We do all the same things everyone else does.
Some of us live extravagantly. That's not a porn performer exclusivity. Some of us have drug problems. Also not a porn performer specific issue. Some of us have relationship drama. Definitely not limited to porn performers. Some of us have problems with the law. Again, not just us.
We're an average group of people doing an unusual job that tends to collect some negative attention. It doesn't generally change us as people, it just gives us stuff to put up with that a lot of people don't have to put up with.
We can blend back in if others don't out us. Unfortunately, a lot of us will be outted, and denial isn't always feasible. Denial isn't always desirable, either. I won't deny my actions, I'm proud of them. If that means I'll have a crazy woman or two standing on my front yard screaming porn whore at me, so be it. Maybe my stance this year means that next year someone else gains acceptance and tolerance.
I went to a trade show recently for my line of work and, as usual, there was a large variety of "booth babes" on hand to help draw people into the booths on the convention floor. Later that same week, I went to a bachelors' party in that city and one of the girls providing entertainment recognized me from the convention floor...she is a part-time 'booth babe' when she's not stripping.
"Booth Babe" may not be something you see on many resumes, but it's an honest living, just as stripping and other forms of sexually-oriented careers. I asked her if she was working her way through college and she said that she was...as a marketing major. She actually made several contacts at the trade shows that (she hoped) would turn into job opportunities later.
Not porn, I know....but just an example of how a smart woman can manage her talents.
I am glad, that I am living in the Netherlands, not in the USA or Germany.
In NL, I never heard such dumb prejudices, like " women who are in porn are stupid, are ONLY doing it for the money, have no chance doing other things for a living.... etc. " I never was in porn, but I knew some women who were in the 80s or 90s, and they had no bad experiences. Most were even playing under their real name ( dropping the last name, because of privacy/security ). Sometimes fans, males and sometimes even females, were asking for an autograph or praised their movies. Or they talked about their last movie with friends, neighbours or members of the family. Because porn was socially accepted by the dutch society, it wasnt something for frustrated men only, but a movie genre widely recognized.
In Germany it was totally different. On the one hand, men are watching porn, but on the other hand, many men talked very harsh and from top-to-bottom about the women in porn. Porn stars werent respected, but looked down upon them. I can remember a case of an 18-year old girl posing for the Playboy only, getting many troubles, because she had her last months in school and awaited her final exams. They wanted to extract her from school. Or a case of a female student working as a speaker of a student group, she played in some porn movies and had to resign her function.
I am no expert of the US situation, I only was in the US one time, but I fear, the situation is more than in Germany than in NL.......
If you are really a big star, like Jenna Jameson, then you have made it. Apart from right-wing neo-evangelical christians, nobody will doubt what she has received for porn. Because she is famous and you can even buy merchandise of her. But if you are girl 1 from Las Vegas, or girl 2 from Texas, then many people will see your acting job as some sort of prostitution before a camera.
One funny remark to the end: The former east-german communist dictator, Erich Honecker, prohibited porn in his "German Democratic Republic", but had one of the largest collections in his country.
Posted - Mar 28 2007 : 9:05PM
