Sorry for the awkwardly phrased topic. I wish I could have had more space to better describe the question. I'll rephrase asking, as a consumer/supporter/viewer of heterosexual porn, if the male talent involved in a scene has done gay/bi content in the past, or is alternately doing gay/bi content concurrent with straight work, does that take his stock down in your eyes, or does it take the stock you might have in straight scenes down for you? If you found out one of your favored or favorite male performers was going to do a gay and or bisexual scene, would you still be able to enjoy his straight performances the same? I have a feeling most people would say no, that it either wouldn't have any impact on their appreciation for the kind of porn said performer does which they normally enjoy, or it wouldn't have a significant impact. But at the same time, there seems to be some credence to the business oriented stigma that would diminish the bankability of a male performer who is popular in hetero porn if he were to venture into gay or bisexual territory.
Also I wanted to make it clear this is not an ambush for anyone who may answer yes. To my mind, nobody should hold it against anyone for responding either way. It's fair to state how you naturally respond. I could even understand feeling averse to the idea.
Not at all. What a performers sexuality is has no basis on whether they do a good job in the movie I am watching. Jamie Gillis and Wade Nichols, Jack Wrangler, and George Payne are four actors that did a great job in movies and we're in gay/bi movies as well.
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Dragon Sign Deactivated User
3381 Posts 12/13
Posted - Sep 10 2016 : 6:57PM
I never liked the statement (not referred word-by-Word correct): "My friends back in college, I meet them from time to time. They are lawyers etc. They ear a lot more than me. I'm a just pornstud. I would done something else if I was givenh the chance, earning the same." 1. If you don't like the job, or gets ashamed/really can't stand it deep Down and must take loads of viagra, quit. 2. If you'd be better off sweeping the floor for a better pay, quit. 3. If you are a bi, well that's not the issue, really. But don't act like you don't care about nothing but money. Hores in true term is really not what this is all about. Mark Ashley said this has nothing to do with prostitution: It's showbiz, it's entertainment. So make it a show, stop bitching about money, and stop fucking like you don' care. It's a waste of time and money, from all sides of the story, maybe except from those who start bitching about it, obviously.
I'm not an actor, but I play one on TV 911 Posts 4/06
Posted - Sep 10 2016 : 7:09PM
Couldn't care less. My viewpoint on most male porn performers is pretty much binary. I either think they are okay or I don't. I've never thought someone was a bad performer because of something they did in a scene I haven't seen because that would be pretty silly. And I generally don't do background checks on the performers I watch. I wouldn't be offended if a performer I like had done Bi/Gay work in the past (or currently) but I also have no urge to go and check. I've heard a significant portion of males in the industry have performed in Bi/Gay scenes (and, no Flash I don't have stats to back that up, but I think I recall seeing it on an HBO special) so odds are some of the performers I like have done it, and I'm fine with that.
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Dragon Sign Deactivated User
3381 Posts 12/13
Posted - Sep 10 2016 : 7:15PM
So an actor who just act and don't care if he's any good, that an eay pick for your viewing pleasure? A footballer who doesn't give a fuck and only acchieve caps for the sake of future reference, is all about what makes your day?
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Dragon Sign Deactivated User
3381 Posts 12/13
Posted - Sep 10 2016 : 7:16PM
So an actor who just act and don't care if he's any good, that an eay pick for your viewing pleasure? A footballer who doesn't give a fuck and only acchieve caps for the sake of future reference, is all about what makes your day?
Do you guys agree or disagree that it could impact a performer's bankability though? Should the big time producers or other moneyed interests be concerned about that if it affects their bottom dollar? While most who have the confidence of conviction or values to answer this are likely to be progressive on the issue, I still suspect, perhaps cynically, that a percentage of consumers wouldn't be able to get over that idea. It doesn't mean they'd then decide to boycott any straight mainstream content featuring said male performer out of hatred from then on, but they may simply avoid future content with that person. I know it sounds really trifling, but I'm sure there are consumers out there who would be affected in that way. What about the performers themselves who may think it would? Is it all in their head that it would be bad for their career? Or do you think they've heard it would be bad. While it's anybody's guess just what percentage impact it could have on any given male performer's sales numbers, I feel pretty sure that the impact is both certain, and certainly marginal at worst. I know it would have an effect, but I couldn't imagine it being more than 10% drop in popularity. In the broad scheme of things, I don't believe 10% is all that worrisome. But then it's not my money it would affect, so that's easy for me to say. I also don't know of anyone who's interested in taking a 10% pay cut anywhere in these times. On the flipside, what if it could potentially boost their popularity? Is this conceivable? Anyway, for my part, I hope to see the stigma diminished soon. Maybe it is totally unfounded from a business perspective after all. I would actually like to see a popular mainstream male performer, like a Lex Steele or another, cross over and do a scene with a trans-performer like Natalie Mars. Not sure if that even qualifies as bi or gay or whatever. But it would be hot and interesting IMO.
From comments I have seen just here on these forums, I suspect that for the general marketplace it would diminish the value. Homophobia seems to come into play when men watch porn and the thought of a gay or bi male in their porn seems to bother them. Why I don't know. Maybe they are afraid that seeing a gay man naked might make them gay?
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Sep 10 2016 : 11:08PM
^^My impression is that it is primarily performers and/or agents who have an issue here, not consumers. It also seems that their issue is mostly with men who continue to shoot gay/bi porn while also shooting straight porn. Lexington Steele and Nikki Benz talk a little about this in an interview they did, which can be found on YouTube under the title "Nikki Benz: I Would Guess 85% of Males in The Industry Are Bisexual." Skip to 7:20.
I don't think it's a coincidence that the top studs in straight porn and the ones most requested around her to be in scenes with women don't have a history of bi/gay content. Even female performers will refuse to work with these men even when they have clean bills of health. The mentality also seems to apply to men who perform in Femdom.
Hmm interesting points ^ and ^^ I am a pretty big fan of femdom. That's one of my top kinks after IR. It's been a while since I paid much attention to that genre though. And now yall mention it, it does seem odd that more of the big names in mainstream "safe" porn (including IR) rarely go into femdom. I would like to see Lex or Rico Strong or Prince or some other stud do some femdom scenes. I'm not talking pegging or anything that far. Just fairly tame femdom, like bondage, CBT (cock and ball torture to the layperson) and tease and denial stuff. Stuff that's more "torture" than torture. Like when the femme is interrogating the man and tickles and teases his dick, exercising such "methods to make them talk." But we hardly even see any of that, which again is pretty tame still. I think the closest thing that comes to mind was Rob Piper with Nina Elle. He was bound in a electric chair. But that didn't really have any hardcore femdom. Really hot scene though! Maybe they think it's bad for their image? But how can it be? I don't think there is anything emasculating about indulging in that kind of roleplay. Once the strapons come into play, okay, I can see that changing things. But as Rihanna sings, chains and whips excite me. Edited by - Melvyn on 9/10/2016 11:57:34 PM
Fat bottomed girls make the rockin' world go round! 1551 Posts 5/09
Posted - Sep 11 2016 : 12:01AM
I'll answer this question by saying I like Christian XXX. I'm a straight guy who likes to watch b/g scenes. I've enjoyed watching Christian XXX perform for many years. I've had conversations with him in this forum. The fact that he shoots scenes of the type I don't watch doesn't effect my opinion of him. While a few may enjoy tagging someone with the "gay for pay" tag, to me it's just a job. Edited by - dogzcatcher on 9/11/2016 4:34:03 AM
The philosophy I find most helpful here is, if you don't like it, but it's not hurting you or anyone else, then why not just ignore it? There's a lot of nasty stuff in porn that some of my favorite performers have done. Circus act stuff way overboard for my taste. So I just don't go looking for it and if it shows up on their Twitter timeline, I just skip past it.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Sep 11 2016 : 1:22AM
^^^I don't doubt that many of them view it as bad for their "manly" image. Gender role politics come into play. Even without any strapons involved, a lot of these guys don't want to be perceived as the "woman" in the scene, the person in the submissive role. It's a lot of nonsense imo, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's where a lot of these guys are coming from. The result is that by and large when a known male performer is in a femdom scene, he's know from gay/bi porn. That's where trans porn gets their male talent from as well. Edited by - misspornUSA on 9/11/2016 1:22:48 AM
This is the only guy I know of who I know does some crossover. I still watch some of his scenes. Ignore the ones not to my taste. Everyone else, I don't know. don't care. it's their business.
Well many consider those who perform DP or are in the same scene with other males as gay or at least bi, could be a reference to that? If so very few performers work 1 on 1 only and even less with no other man in the scene
If he started out as a crossover performer I guess I've tolerated it in the past for some. If somebody like Manuel, Adriano, Rocco etc. start pitching and catching on the side of course it's going to change, they'll no longer be the masculine starlet slayers for many of their fans. Or I could just use this as an opportunity to show how PC and far-left I am. 'Noo I totally wouldn't see any difference at all because that's how much I love gay and bi people'.
^^ As a matter of fact lots of BI performers, gay performers, cross overs, and all in between are actually among the male talents in higher demand , and I'm talking only about those known about it , there are those who are straight only in porn but real life bi. Anyway here's the thing , those who PAY to get the scenes of those all around pansexual performers can hardly be considered left wingers or Politically correctness champions, they buy porn if they don't care what the performer did or does in his real life apparently doesn't matter to them . they trust him to deliver, with their money, you can call this a political statement on the subject Edited by - LCF on 9/11/2016 10:57:29 AM
@ gore girl If your answer to this topic's question is yes, how do you think the liberal porn fans are going to respond? Hostility which is something most people want to avoid. And there's also this thing nowadays where people are trying to impress eachother by showing how supposedly 'tolerant' they are. I'm not saying everyone here does, I didn't read the whole thread yet. Edited by - 2bollocks on 9/11/2016 11:02:49 AM
MOD: The OP asked for people not to be bashed for their views. The forum etiquette also requires the same. This thread is now heading straight into bashing because of views so bring it back.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Sep 11 2016 : 11:37AM
^^I don't really see much evidence of false political posturing and virtue signaling in discussions of porn among porn fans. Edited by - misspornUSA on 9/11/2016 11:38:07 AM
I'll go one further - I find it hot. If this is rooted in my desire to be PC, then I should get an award for how thoroughly and unconsciously I have integrated my political posturing into my perversions.
I picked your post because you named some of the first performers I saw in porn and who I consider to be some of the greatest male performers of all time. They didn't just do great sex scenes but they could actually play a believable role on screen. Something most of todays performers could never do. That said I don't know if they would have had the career they did if they had started in the era of the internet where you can find out with just with the click of a button that your favorite male performers also appears (or has appeared) in gay porn. All of the performers you named did gay/bi porn at a time when that wasn't possible and by default we didn't really know that our favorite performers also did gay/bi porn. We also didn't know much if anything about AIDS/HIV. I suspect the biggest issue many women in todays porn have with male performers who do both hetero and gay porn is that you significantly increase the possibility of transmission of the HIV virus. They have some easily verifiable reasons to think that. Having bareback sex with male performers who also do gay porn will increase their chances of getting infected with the HIV virus and testing can't guarantee that it won't. I found out that Peter North had done gay porn while he was still popular and that didn't stop me from watching any of his movies but I also didn't have any way to see him perform in those gay movies so there was always the believable denial aspect to consider.
The flipside of that is what may really be bothering some consumers. From other threads around here I think many people don't believe that gay-for-pay even exists (the "he wouldn't/couldn't be sucking dick if he didn't like it" notion), so they think "what's really going on" is gay/bi performers doing straight-for-pay scenes. And I think that ruins some people's suspension of disbelief when they watch porn (probably mainly the faction who envision themselves in the role of the male performer).
Fat bottomed girls make the rockin' world go round! 1551 Posts 5/09
Posted - Sep 11 2016 : 4:58PM
^ This sounds similar to the episode of "The Soprano's", when Tony discovered that Uncle June was talented regarding pleasing his girlfriend. The girlfriend let it slip at the beauty parlor about Uncle June's abilities, it got back to Carmella, who told Tony. In Tony's mind, if one did that to a women, he would also do it to a man; logic that escapes me. Some folks have views about what excites them or turns them off set in stone. Others change with time, just like the way The Supreme Court now views marriage between two human beings. Love is love. I'm much too old to give a damn about being politically correct. I'm retired and I enjoy giving the impression to my neighbors and friends that I'm that "crazy Vietnam veteran who lives at the end of the road".
I loathe creeping PC authoritarian culture, and I still find this topic hot too. Thing is, I find gay male+male sex a turn off. I'd go even further than to say it's repellent, but to use words like "gross" I think isn't necessary, as while I am very anti-PC and anti speech policing and anti-sensitivity nannying in the public domain, I am sensitive to the sexuality of others. But that is how I feel about it, and guys are just gross. I hope I can say that as a guy lol. The only exception is black guys sometimes. Out of the thousands of porn scenes I've checked out, I've never once watched a gay male scene and have no interest in that. I'd say at least 75% of my library is hetero, with the remainder being female+female or solo female stuff. Perhaps the closest thing to queer I do like from time to time is femdom stuff, but even finding good examples of that which strike a chord with me is extremely rare. So I personally don't want to see any typical gay stuff but for some reason if the dominant dude is black, and the sub is something other and sufficiently feminine, like Natalie Mars, then that's curiously hot. I would definitely have to check that out. The sub just has to be pretty, which Natalie is. Her little dick is mildly distracting, definitely not a plus, but that's not her fault I figure. It's more of the psychological aspect I think that is hot, but obviously it wouldn't appeal to me at all if she wasn't pretty or at least cute.
I don't think I would really care, but I don't think there has never been a male performer that I appreciated that crossed over, at least not to my knowledge.
Some, sure. All? No. I personally think that most of them are probably bi. Anyway, the more pertinent part is that the group of people I was talking about also seem to believe that bisexual men either don't exist at all (i.e. there's only gay or straight), or that bisexual men are mainly defined by their personal interest in cock, not in pussy, hence a belief that it can't possibly be the case that any of those performers enjoy fucking women. And I think that's what really annoys some people, some sort of anger that all these beautiful female porn stars are at the disposal of men who are supposedly just there for the paycheck.
I don't think they believe that bi's don't enjoy women, I think they believe that bi guys don't enjoy women as much as hetero men, which I believe is correct. And I disagree on 'some, sure'. A male performer who does gay stuff 'for money' is likely in the closet, or bi-closet. Whoever might tell me "oh they're just so comfortable in their sexuality that they would bang dudes" isn't convincing me.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Sep 12 2016 : 9:30AM
Yeah. It's especially worth mentioning since one of the things I always see pop up in conversations about guys being "gay for pay" are their erections, as if this is sure evidence that they are sexually aroused by their scene partner/partners. Yet it seems that pills and needles are as commonly used on gay porn sets as they are on straight ones.
^ Even without drugs, the idea that a man must be gay or bi in order to get hard and jizz with another man is an absurd oversimplification of sex and sexuality, not to mention sex work.
IDK. I would probably need a blindfold and the guy would have to be silent in order for me to perform the same way with a guy as with a woman. And already that's an obstacle cuz I like to see and hear women.
See? Those last two posts above Melvyn's are exactly the False political posturing I already picked up on at the start of the thread. It's not gonna fool me. Edited by - 2bollocks on 9/12/2016 5:03:23 PM
So if one of us says, "It doesn't bother me and I really don't care if a male performer I like also does gay/bi porn," are you assuming that deep down we really don't feel that way, but we are pretending to be more tolerant because we are "trying to impress each other"?
^^Yes that, but especially when they said that a "straight guy" doing gay porn couldn't possibly be enjoying it homosexually just because he happens to have a massive erection and shoots a huge cumshot in the experience. No connection whatsoever right there. Btw while I was laughing out loud at the audacity of that statement it didn't mean I found it funny at all, that would be prepousterous to think that just because I'm making laughing noises while almost tearing up it could actually be because I find it funny. No connection at all over there either. Interesting world some porn fans live in.
I'm not an actor, but I play one on TV 911 Posts 4/06
Posted - Sep 12 2016 : 5:42PM
I always enjoy it when the guy who is obsessed with people licking each others' assholes makes grand pronouncements about other people misrepresenting their sexuality. Laughing Out Loud, indeed.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Sep 12 2016 : 5:52PM
^^^I always express my opinions honestly on this forum, even when they are controversial. Remember our discussion on the "In Canada isIT CHILD PORN if girl looks like minor" forum? Did you leave that discussion thinking to yourself "Man, this girl is so pc"? Look at my comments on "Is IR becoming too PC?" or "tired of 'curvy', I think its fat." I have no interest in engaging in false political posturing to impress others. Edited by - misspornUSA on 9/12/2016 5:53:10 PM
Posted - Sep 10 2016 : 6:01PM
