Girls who flake on shoots!

Author	Post
John Knowles NJ Films 178 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 27 2004 : 12:54PM We have a saying here - sometimes, you can't give money away in this business. It amazes me that girls who are scheduled for a shoot, getting paid the rate they have requested for a couple of hours of work will flake with no call. It puts everyone off, costs the company money in kill fee's, may delay a release if the shoot is on a tight schedule, and gives the girl a bad name. I have the ultimate respect for those performers that are professional - show up on time and ready to go, call when they are running late or can't make the shoot. Thank you!! NJ Films Inc John [Link]
croy Platinum Member Discovry 4574 Posts 3/04	Posted - Sep 28 2004 : 12:12AM Strippers flake out all the time, even when they know there are regulars waiting to give them hundreds for hanging around. Since I see many porn stars as being a subset (though perhaps more extreme) of strippers, I don't see why you are surprised. Lack of professionalism abounds in the world - from managers on down. [Link]
Kimi Lixx Senior Member 2012 Posts 6/01	Posted - Sep 28 2004 : 10:26AM I love performers who flake. Gives reliable gals like me a chance to take their work at the last minute. Just marvelous... really. Gotta love them desperate directors struggling to find any talent available at the last minute so that they don't lose the entire day's work. Go on gals, flake to your heart's content. It's all good for me. [Link]
John Knowles NJ Films 178 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 28 2004 : 11:26AM Croy - I am not surprised, just amazed when money is on the line. Lack of professionalism IS everywhere. I think I am more surprised when things go smoothly! Kimi - Great attitude!! NJ Films Inc John [Link]
Kperv The Cuddler *struck (She slipped) 1818 Posts 1/04	Posted - Sep 28 2004 : 1:28PM Now if only someone would flake on that big budget Wicked feature Devinn Lane mentioned in another thread. I'd kill for a feature with Devinn and a certain reliable gal from Ohio. [Link]

nietzsche Deactivated User 5470 Posts 8/03	Posted - Sep 28 2004 : 1:54PM Kimi Lixx wrote: I love performers who flake. Gives reliable gals like me a chance to take their work at the last minute. Just marvelous... really. Gotta love them desperate directors struggling to find any talent available at the last minute so that they don't lose the entire day's work. Go on gals, flake to your heart's content. It's all good for me. Click to expand Shouldn't reliable girls demand to be paid more? [Link]
croy Platinum Member Discovry 4574 Posts 3/04	Posted - Sep 28 2004 : 11:43PM They do get paid more by virtue of showing up and doing their scenes. Also they get extra work if alert. Since they get paid by the scene (piece work) and not by fulfilling the terms of a contract, penalties are difficult. If it was a one scene contract with time incentives, that could be a workable thing. However, the production side would also be limited in the time they get the performer. John Knowles - I have seen and known of managers screw up the making of money constantly. Funny thing is that these are the same guys who insist on others being professional. The demotivation factor losses more money. [Link]
Myload Senior Member A rose is what you are to me 2069 Posts 6/03	Posted - Sep 28 2004 : 11:52PM It's the girls' obligation to show up for the shoot. [Link]
Death Star Deactivated User 47 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 2:32AM For God's sake, sue 'em. Or take their asses to small claims court. Make examples out of them and let everybody know who's on the porno bad list. Create a bad actor/actress review website so all producers can know about who to avoid. That's why written contracts are important to show they were supposed to show up at soso time at soso place. Looks good in court. Look what happened to that black Miami Dolphins player who must now return millions just because he felt like retiring and not fulfilling his obligations in good faith. Dumbass boy. [Link]
Chico Wang Member 775 Posts 1/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 4:21AM Flaking girls is just a nature of the game in this business. I find I can generally minimize it by booking a shoot on the same day or the next day. I find that when I book weeks in advance, more than 2/3's of the shoots don't go through unless I have a real good relationship with the girl. With some agents, I demand they either spend the night at their house or mine to ensure I don't screw my guys out of a booking. Some agents are better than others in this business. One thing I won't tolerate is to hear an agency tell me on the day of the shoot that my first choice was sick or had the once-a-week car accident or the every-other-day grandpa falling down the stairs routine. They'll try to get me to shoot another girl who is available. These second choices almost always look like mules. If you don't like flakes, you're in the wrong business. It's a cost of doing business in this industry. Chico [Link]
Death Star Deactivated User 47 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 5:12AM Can anybody tell us how much money can be lost due to a no show flake? Give us an example, a total dollar loss figure, and sort of a breakdown on this total. Entertain us to the reality of porn production. It is very easy for us viewers to think it is so easy, smooth, and profitable to make smut. I'm sure one needs to have a thick skin and know how to laugh and enjoy life. Maybe that's why Chico is always laughing that he is drunk. Looking forward to hearing from all you producers, performers, and directors. We love hearing about your business realities. [Link]
John Knowles NJ Films 178 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 11:39AM CROY - we had had managers screw up when we book a girl for anal and she shows up to the set surprised, or late, or not bringing what we asked. You never really know if its the agent, the girl or the secretary working for the agent. Chico Wang - I agree, its all part of being in the adult business but I don't think there is any other business that I would rather be in. Roll with what happens and make it work!! Have fun! Death Star - The money can vary depending on what type of scene you have booked and how many people you have to pay kill fees to. Lost location fees - additional location fees if you are waiting for a replacement or just time if you have to reschedule. It really varies. I think its more of an inconvenience but it is all part of being in this business!! Its still the best business in the world. NJ Films Inc [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14595 Posts 3/02	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 3:39PM John Knowles wrote: CROY - we had had managers screw up when we book a girl for anal and she shows up to the set surprised, or late, or not bringing what we asked. You never really know if its the agent, the girl or the secretary working for the agent. Click to expand That's what a written contract's for. [Link]
devinn Devinn Lane 69 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 4:48PM Contracts are only for contract girls. It would be too time consuming to draw up a contract for every performer or to try and sue if one flakes. It's simple, if a performer flakes, don't hire them again. Soon enough they will build a rep for themselves as being unreliable and will be out of work or will have to agree to do harder stuff to get hired. Why do you think most girls only last two years? For many reasons but this in one of them. As a director/producer it is my job to research people before I hire them. If I'm not sure I ask other directors about them. The last thing I need is someone setting my day back four hours and making my PM work harder than he has to. As far as $$$ goes, well if the day is scrapped because you can't replace the person, it can cost thousands of dollars to do a pick up day. Most of the time the individual can be replaced. There's always someone more motivated to fill that space. xoxo Devinn [Link]
John Knowles NJ Films 178 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 5:01PM Hardware - I wish we did sign contracts ahead of time but in most cases, the model release or contract, is signed on-set. Agents tend to be a bit testy when you try to book their talent directly as they think they are going to get cut out of the pie so to speak. So, when dealing with the agents, and 99% of the time they are great to deal with and will bend over backwards to help you out, sometimes mistakes are made in communication and the girl is not given full information of just plain forgets. We have even had girls come in the office with their agents and then on the day of the shoot, the agent can't reach the girl so you have to look around for someone else who is available. Its just one of the things that go along with the business. It gives g reliable people like Kini Lixx the chance to get even more work. All in all, this is still one of the best businesses to be in!! I wouldn't change a thing. NJ Films Inc [Link]

BigBobxxx Senior Member 2681 Posts 5/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 5:05PM Just curious... How about the studs and the tech people? Are the guys and the crews more/less/the same when it comes to reliability? [Link]
jewel denyle Platinum X Pictures 769 Posts 4/03	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 7:12PM Lacey Thom totally flaked on me for my movie last week. [Link]
John Knowles NJ Films 178 Posts 9/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 7:22PM The guys we use are reliable people that I have known for a long time. The techs also. And so far, that side if it has been smooth! NJ Films Inc [Link]
neophyte Member UK 101 Posts 2/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 7:30PM Is reliability at all common anywhere in the sex industry? I don't think I've ever "flaked" on an appointment with an escort, but often my stomach is churning when I deliberate over whether to see a new girl. It must be tough being a young girl making money by getting screwed by a stranger or two in front of a crew of other strangers. Heck, I know guys who can't face going into work when all they have to do is sit at a desk all day and look busy. I know diddly about the porn business, but I can see it's tough for porn producers who've got a lot of overhead to pay whether a girl turns up or not, but I feel for the girls too. [Link]
HeyNow Oblivious Gold Star Hey! 5965 Posts 1/03	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 10:34PM I'm not sure what the point of telling us about this, plus telling us the names (well, one name). Are we supposed to boycott their work? This topic is really about "missed appointments" and would be more properly placed in the Nonsense forum (of course, IMHO, since I'm a lowly peon.) This forum is for cum gulping and such! [Link]
Chico Wang Member 775 Posts 1/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 11:17PM I personally could care less about the money. I don't book locations because most of my shoots are at the Diabolic house, in the wilderness or at Boogie Nights. It fucks with my guys who lose out on money when they could've been working or planning their day to do other things. But it's my time that I get annoyed with. I could be doing other things that brings in $$$ or I could be out drinking or having some girl massage my back with her titties. Sitting around doing nothing but waiting for a girl is irking. Luckily I don't get them too much but I know some directors that seem to get it every other shoot. Chico [Link]
croy Platinum Member Discovry 4574 Posts 3/04	Posted - Sep 29 2004 : 11:31PM HeyNow wrote: I'm not sure what the point of telling us about this, plus telling us the names (well, one name). Are we supposed to boycott their work? This topic is really about "missed appointments" and would be more properly placed in the Nonsense forum (of course, IMHO, since I'm a lowly peon.) This forum is for cum gulping and such! Click to expand Well he did want to vent about a problem with working in porn. [Link]
Light Up Member post coital cigarette 51 Posts 7/04	Posted - Sep 30 2004 : 4:08AM I guess it would cost more to have loads of understudies :) Then there's a chance they both flake! [Link]
d3pr4v3d m4n14c Member 18 Posts 6/04	Posted - Sep 30 2004 : 11:02AM Kimi Lixx wrote: I love performers who flake. Gives reliable gals like me a chance to take their work at the last minute. Just marvelous... really. Gotta love them desperate directors struggling to find any talent available at the last minute so that they don't lose the entire day's work. Go on gals, flake to your heart's content. It's all good for me. Click to expand A reliable, and as some critics put it, incendiary performer. I wonder how you have enough time to post on here let alone breathe. [Link]
SyberScott Senior Member 1462 Posts 1/03	Posted - Sep 30 2004 : 3:56PM Jewel, would you reconsider hiring Cris Taliana for your movies? [Link]

dcypher999 Sin City Films 6 Posts 11/03	Posted - Sep 30 2004 : 6:24PM What about flaking guys? Last time I shot I had both Brandon Iron and Alex Roxx flake out on me at the last minute. My PM told me that Brandon, who had been booked for almost a month, had to finish a PXP title that weekend and was sorry to have to back out. Totally bummed me out. I was more concerned about having him in the movie than I was most of the chicks I hired. HCG [Link]
Starlet Deactivated User 51 Posts 8/04	Posted - Sep 30 2004 : 10:18PM My heart goes out to the crew guys every time some Wicked/Vivid etc. contract girl decides she doesn't 'feel like' working that day. They are left waiting around for hours for a replacement, and, if none can be found, they go home without pay that day. Often they are also stuck with equipment rentals. Think the companies reimburse them for this? Nope. No kill fees for the crew. [Link]
TonyC Comstock Films 2523 Posts 8/03	Posted - Sep 30 2004 : 10:29PM Chico Wang wrote: It fucks with my guys who lose out on money when they could've been working or planning their day to do other things. Click to expand And then Starlet wrote: They are left waiting around for hours for a replacement, and, if none can be found, they go home without pay that day. Often they are also stuck with equipment rentals. Think the companies reimburse them for this? Nope. No kill fees for the crew. Click to expand Am I actually reading what I'm reading. Talent flakes, crew doesn't get paid? I'm stunned. I can't think of any crew that I've ever worked with that would accept such terms. I certain would never expect such terms. If the talent doesn't show, that's the producers problem, not the crew's. No wonder there are lamp cords, dirty sneakers, and lightstands in the backgrounds of shots. -T.C. [Link]
barrybrn Senior Member 1568 Posts 9/03	Posted - Sep 30 2004 : 10:38PM SyberScott wrote: Jewel, would you reconsider hiring Cris Taliana for your movies? Click to expand Oh, not this again. That was a crazy ass thread in the past! [Link]
Starlet Deactivated User 51 Posts 8/04	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 2:06AM Am I actually reading what I'm reading. Talent flakes, crew doesn't get paid? I'm stunned. I can't think of any crew that I've ever worked with that would accept such terms. I certain would never expect such terms. If the talent doesn't show, that's the producers problem, not the crew's. Click to expand Welcome to the wonderful world of porno making. This is indeed the way it is. No wonder most crew guys can't stand the lazy ass talent. The girl decides she wants to sleep in, or blames a last minute STD for not showing up, the crew doesn't get paid that day. [Link]
Death Star Deactivated User 47 Posts 9/04	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 3:03AM Don't the girls make many times more money stripping and hooking than performing porn? Maybe that's why they don't take their filming jobs so seriously. [Link]
Phil McCrackin Member Somewhere near You!! 13 Posts 10/04	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 1:13PM Wow, I have been "away" for a while and just getting back into this - I didn't realize that things happen that often! I guess its often enough for JK to post it here. [Link]
Starlet Deactivated User 51 Posts 8/04	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 5:24PM Death Star wrote: Don't the girls make many times more money stripping and hooking than performing porn? . Click to expand Yes, but only AFTER they have already made several movies and made a name for themselves on the box covers. Unknown porn girls can't feature dance and therefore won't make any more money than the regular house strippers. Same goes for hooking. [Link]
Death Star Deactivated User 47 Posts 9/04	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 5:31PM Fascinating profession. They make more money than us working stiffs with college degrees. [Link]
Kimi Lixx Senior Member 2012 Posts 6/01	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 5:42PM Starlet wrote: Yes, but only AFTER they have already made several movies and made a name for themselves on the box covers. Unknown porn girls can't feature dance and therefore won't make any more money than the regular house strippers. Same goes for hooking. Click to expand Umm, that's not quite true. "Regular" women can make more money escorting and dancing than porn performers. Porn performers who then go on to feature dance and do high priced escorting make EVEN more. I said "can", not all dancers make a lot of money, and not all escorts do, either. However, if the assumption is that you were attractive enough to be in demand in porn then you could probably be hauling down plenty of bucks in the club or behind closed doors. I honestly believe that if you aren't an exceptional talent and in unbelievably high demand, you really better love the job. The money isn't a real great incentive. [Link]

Eric Lowery Member West Hollywood 234 Posts 3/04	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 6:40PM Death Star wrote: Can anybody tell us how much money can be lost due to a no show flake? Give us an example, a total dollar loss figure, and sort of a breakdown on this total. Entertain us to the reality of porn production. Click to expand I couldn't find it in the other thread, but I read Teagan flaked on one of Jenna's movies. It cost Jenna $20,000 I believe. [Link]
Death Star Deactivated User 47 Posts 9/04	Posted - Oct 1 2004 : 7:10PM Yoo hoo, Bridgette. Wanna share some more of your stories how you got extorted for some cat food? [Link]
RedLightMisfit Member 103 Posts 1/04	Posted - Oct 4 2004 : 3:35AM $20,000?! How? [Link]
AC Cream Deactivated User 1066 Posts 5/04	Posted - Oct 4 2004 : 4:04AM RedLightMisfit wrote: $20,000?! How? Click to expand RedLightMisfit, She had to cancel the scene, but she still had to pay the people who were there. Add to that the location and I can imagine that would add up. AC Cream [Link]
HeyNow Oblivious Gold Star Hey! 5965 Posts 1/03	Posted - Oct 4 2004 : 10:54AM Eric Lowery wrote: Click to expand I couldn't find it in the other thread, but I read Teagan flaked on one of Jenna's movies. It cost Jenna $20,000 I believe. Click to expand I guess she should have spent an extra 1K or 2 to have a backup girl. [Link]
eyevu Member Los Angeles 11 Posts 8/04	Posted - Oct 5 2004 : 8:47PM These girls know they can get away with it b/c porn wouldn't be very good with out them, Old Supply and Demand Economics. But some of them don't deserve any money and some deserve more than they are getting. Just my opinion. [Link]
oatmeal Meat Popsicle Seeking Beauty 1738 Posts 8/04	Posted - Oct 6 2004 : 8:44AM I don't know if the information on this board is 100% accurate but some of the pay rates I've been reading on the board seem ridiculously low. I would love to see the women paid handsomely (pay raise and a percentage of video profits to encourage a quality scene) but I could see that sending video prices through the roof. Can anyone point me in the direction of Utopia? [Link]
Starlet Deactivated User 51 Posts 8/04	Posted - Oct 6 2004 : 7:55PM [/quote] She had to cancel the scene, but she still had to pay the people who were there. AC Cream [/quote] No, she didn't. They had to call in a new girl which delayed eveything. The location costs, perhaps. But other than that, there were no extra expenses. People were already there, and there is certainly no 'crew overtime' being paid in porn. [Link]
Light Up Member post coital cigarette 51 Posts 7/04	Posted - Oct 29 2004 : 7:37AM Has it also happened that when a performer flaked it disrupted continuity in the takes? [Link]
imak Adult Film Legend 3345 Posts 2/04	Posted - Oct 29 2004 : 8:57AM back in Pittsburgh im a PA on a bondage site and i get their first turn on the air heat rig the lights lay out what equipment will be needed for the senerios and white balance, then if the girl doesnt show i clean it all up and go home with no pay (as does the make up artist) [Link]
licker Senior Member Heretic, Iconoclast, Skeptic 1141 Posts 8/03	Posted - Oct 29 2004 : 10:14AM Kami wrote: back in Pittsburgh im a PA on a bondage site and i get their first turn on the air heat rig the lights lay out what equipment will be needed for the senerios and white balance, then if the girl doesnt show i clean it all up and go home with no pay (as does the make up artist) Click to expand Sorry to hear that Kami. That really sucks. [Link]
imak Adult Film Legend 3345 Posts 2/04	Posted - Oct 29 2004 : 8:47PM it does, but it beets working at Tropicana! anyways as a model I have never flaked in my year in the biz, i have never missed a shoot for any reason. [Link]