[Link]
Hotwife Behaving Badly - review by bono-one| Author | Post |
|---|---|
Flash  Golden Age Classic 11018 Posts 5/01 |  Posted - Apr 27 2018 : 11:52AM[Link] |
| Maxxx Stirner Deactivated User 319 Posts 11/14 | Posted - Apr 27 2018 : 1:39PM I don't even think the fetish is necessarily a bad thing, it's the fact that it's a SEGREGATED fetish that is built on the disvalue of black women and the selective marginal value of black men that is a problem. [Link] |
| whatsatelephonebill Senior Member 2935 Posts 10/11 | Posted - Apr 27 2018 : 2:36PM And as to that Lee Roy Myers tweet, interracial is a fetish as much as teens are a fetish. The "fetish" and, more importantly, the "taboo" nature of it come more from the way the scenes are constructed than from the tag they are labeled as. This idea that if we get rid of the category, we get rid of all the interest in it and the baggage of it is more than a little misguided. There's a lot more work required here than just stopping using a label. Edited by - whatsatelephonebill on 4/27/2018 2:39:51 PM [Link] |
| LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05 | Posted - Apr 27 2018 : 6:01PM In Europe that IR tag only saw the light recently , for decades it had no labels at all, it wasn't a thing , the category was created to facilitate any research a customer could do, especially with online salesLet me get this straight , IR is a "segregating term" but "zebra" isn't? Edited by - LCF on 4/27/2018 6:05:09 PM [Link] |
| LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05 | Posted - Apr 27 2018 : 6:07PM There's a lot of people who watch only that kind of porn there are entire sites solely devoted to that fetish. there are also some productions who don't do any difference and could put whatever scene and performers without any label for it. I.e. Rocco movies or feature movies and Porn Fidelity too Edited by - LCF on 4/27/2018 6:11:32 PM [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 2:50AM Also, I see this myth persisting which needs to be debunked yet again: the assertion that "interracial" ONLY stands for white female + black male. This is patently untrue. Go to XRentDVD or AdultDVDEmpire or any other major vendor and click on their "interracial" category. You will find black female + white male and even Asian female + white or black male in there too. It just so happens that white female + black male is the most popular that it overwhelms the category. But you're not paying attention if you think it is exclusively consisting of white female + black male. People should stop spreading ignorance coupled with such indignation. [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 2:52AM AdultDVDEmpire "Interracial" category All this SJW blather. For crying out loud. People are just mad that there is a particular combination that is the most popular. If they were honest, they would admit this is just a denotative dispute. It has nothing to do with "power" and "justice" and morals. It's convenience. Convenience to do with a luxury commodity. I've long been supportive of constructive criticism which suggests actual proposed solutions, but just banging on about "systemic" discrimination and "racism" has done absolutely nothing to resolve this. I suggested they could just increase the specificity of interracial categorization by implementing tags like BF/HM for black female + hispanic male. This shorthand has already been in use for quite a long time among online communities. Interested in interracial content featuring Hispanic women and Asian men? HW/AM Are these tags going to be nearly as popular as the main IR tag? Hell no. I have never seen any top selling IR porn that did not feature black men, except the occasional black female + white male porno. The people complaining loudest about this issue as it is just want to sound important. They want to seem "woke." You can try all you want to change the categorization. 9 out of 10 interracial pornos will still be the same thing: white women with black men. And I say this cynically as someone who would be happy to see more variety. [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 3:29AM Really? Flash, with all due respect, how about every major porn studio out there? lol Have yall taken a look at the sales charts in the last, idk, 5 years? I love you guys, but please! I recommend yall take a look at the charts on AdultDVDEmpire or XRentDVD - both sales and rentals. Over the last 4 years, perhaps longer, I've seen IR go from about 40% of the charts to 70% on XRentDVD and from about 10% of the charts to 30% on AdultDVDEmpire. receipts: http://www.xrentdvd.com/Top_Adult_DVD_Rentals.html https://www.adultdvdempire.com/best-selling-porn-movies.html If any of yall want snapshots of the charts from Xrent for about the last 4 years, I can provide dozens more. And producers see the same thing. "At the current time, black actors and actresses are treated more as a niche or side show unlike their counterpart white peers" According to whom? Black male performers are DOMINATING. They aren't a "side show" - they are the MAIN attraction, super-stars even! Maybe this sounds crazy but when people are being paid more than others, it does not reflect that they are being devalued, but rather the exact opposite. Mandingo is a god to this industry. Dredd is a god. Lex Steele and Shane Diesel, at least for a decade or so were gods. This is racists' worst nightmare. The irony to hear so many indict this industry when it has created icons of black men. Anyone disrespecting these guys was putting their reputation on the line and working to cut a short path to being blackballed. Producers could theoretically survive in the industry avoiding delivering IR, but most of them would lose money. There are indeed niche brands for every fetish out there, and maybe some of those little known producers low on the totem pole - hardly industry titans - could be disrespectful and it won't affect their business. But all the big players bow down to bbc. They all pay more to hire them. Performers like Jason Brown, Flash Brown, Rob Piper, and several others have all been given contracts. They are highly valued. This industry IDOLIZES and GLORIFIES these guys. It used to have almost as much love for black females too, like Pinky and Cherokee D'ass, but then the recession happened and coupled with the rise of Tube sites, that destroyed most of black consumer driven genres. Personally I miss the genres that were catered too before this catastrophic decline in the industry. I miss the more "urban" skewing content, directed by black pornographers like Alex Devoe, Jake Steed, and Justin Slayer. But they catered to a lot more of the diverse ethnic and curvaceous women seeking customers who aren't in the market anymore. If the consumers aren't consuming, the producers ain't gonna be producin. But now we've seen the unparalleled success of Lansky via Blacked. This is a flagship enterprise. They invested heavily in casting. Black performers have gotten rich and fat off of this industry. Have you SEEN what happens to these dudes over time? Lex, Mandingo, Rico, etc - they all get fat. That does not reflect guys hurting in the bank account. They are eating GOOD and BEEN eating good for over a decade. Big name producers and shot callers have intimated at least as much on this very forum, on this very topic (in older threads) about how black male talent typically ask for more than white male talent. And they do that because they know they are worth it. And everyone of yall can continue to expect black male performers to make more, and treated with the utmost respect by any producers/directors with the at least a modicum of business sense, until CGI reaches a point where the relative scarcity of black male talent is obviated by technology. Edited by - melvyn on 4/28/2018 3:33:41 AM [Link] |
| jm6d Member 417 Posts 2/11 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 4:21AM [Link] |
| Quorrl Senior Member 2835 Posts 3/11 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 4:44AM His central point is that sex between black and white humans should not be presented as not normal or "abnormal". Because he fears that this too much confirms social stigmata about black men and leads people to believe in prejudice etc. One can disagree with that, but I don't think that he doesn't clearly see the consequences. [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 6:00AM [Link] |
| LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 11:37AM Good look producing "specials" with no labels and selling those online or on demand and especially good luck finding the product you want with a search key so unspecific as "special" [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 3:08PM [Link] |
| Assanova Member balls deep 296 Posts 1/04 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 6:06PM [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 7:11PM 2nd A to your Q, which further explains the 1st answer, lots of men. There's a huge community/forum called LPSG, which stands for large-penis-support-group. It is mostly guys interested in straight porn featuring well endowed males. I don't care if that sounds suspect (urban code for "homosexual") to anybody. If you think they are gay, why wouldn't they just be about gay content? It's not like it's hard to find, and I'm sure there are numerous gay communities focused on gay porn. The appeal of seeing well endowed guys lay the hammer down on girls goes back to the earliest days of adult entertainment. Probably back to ancient Egypt. I think a lot of it is about ego and vicarious identification. For my own 2 cents, porn featuring a guy who is less endowed than myself is almost entirely useless. I don't identify or fantasize about being either or white, frankly. Nothing against white dudes. I have love and respect for people as individuals of any ethnicity, class, gender, shape, or what have you. 3rd. True. There's lots of hung white dudes. And not all black guys reach even the global average size. 4. If you're looking for hot black women in porn, it's not hard to find, although we have to grant that production catering to this is more limited. But HardX has a popular series I see show up on the best sellers list with each edition called Black Anal Asses. And there's other popular series focused on black female with white men. and, contrary to what critics of "interracial" as a category falsely insist, these DO show up in the category if you search on most adult DVD sites. All these critics have to do is search. I see these titles intermittently on the front page of ADT too. There IS demand for them, but we have to always keep in mind that the consumers who MOST demanded more porn with black babes were black consumers who have largely left the market since the recession, but I think are gradually returning, but it will never be the same level of demand in pro produced porn cuz of tube sites and amateurs. [Link] |
| Flash Golden Age Classic 11018 Posts 5/01 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 7:21PM I looked through your receipts and you proved my point, I saw not a single feature movie in either list. I stopped reading your post at this point since none of it was relevant since you opted to remove all the criteria of my statement. [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 7:28PM I give ton of credit to Lansky for elevating not just IR but the whole industry standard. By delivering a degree of class and polish with Blacked he made IR legitimately glamorous. This was great because it delivered to an under-served market. But that doesn't mean the entire industry abandoning uninhibited gonzo-style provocative freakiness like we got from the original HushHush run or from Jake Steed with their race-play is some necessary mandate. Now it is fans of this genre which are being under-served. [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 7:31PM The scenes are IR but they aren't? What is this issue you're talking about now? [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 7:54PM But they do. IR sells better than almost any other genre. That by itself is a selling factor. It is added value whether you market the product as such or not. If a producer doesn't market it that way, then that's money they're just leaving on the table. Why do almost all these parodies feature at least one interracial scene? You're asking why would they pay for something which they do pay for all the time. Even the Star Wars parodies, they had Lex Steel play Darth Vader. Now why on earth would they do this, especially given that Darth Vader isn't even black, UNLESS they knew they were gonna make money off it? What we have is a case of casting for a feature in which the producers have gone out of their way to include an IR scene and incur an IR fee. When you look at the sales charts, IR sells quite well. It has more value than your standard vanilla scene. If it did not, then nobody would be making them. Or at least, nobody could possibly try and bargain for higher rate. If nobody is willing to pay that extra cost, then it is obviously not worth it. But we hear about exorbitant IR exclusive paydays all the time. I don't think guys likes Jules Jordan or Greg Lansky have an interest in setting fire to their funds just cuz... These guys are smart. Lex Steele has gone on record saying he did the same thing. He paid more for IR scenes because he knew it was worth more. Same with MimeFreak. We can't keep saying that things which have more value or somehow being "devalued" much less "debased." You can try and read the minds of the people producing this stuff, who only recognize value where they see it, or to read the minds of all those consumers who drive this practice, to judge them as bigoted or racist, but I just don't see it as logical or moral. It's going up against logic and decency. These producers and consumers are decent people. Many of them are black themselves, so why assume there's some kind of bigotry here? It's all about the money. And keep in mind, all of that explains why a studio would indeed pay more just for 1 scene in a feature - because it's still obviously worth it. But if they hired that black male talent to do multiple scenes with females who all wanted a higher than standard vanilla rate, even though the movie was not by design intended to be marketed as interracial, then they are really throwing money away if they don't market it as IR. By marketing it as IR they will make significantly more money. Again, just look at how well IR sells. Putting it in that IR category means it will sell better than if they for whatever reason failed to recognize this and just marketed it as a generic porno, even though demand for IR is so high. [Link] |
| Flash Golden Age Classic 11018 Posts 5/01 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 8:06PM [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 8:15PM IR is not worth more on account of white females charging more. These females charge more because they know it is worth more. It is hazardous to try and read people's minds and indict them on some assumed moral grounds, when it is far more logically explained by the simplest, most basic economic reasoning. It is unfair to scapegoat the workers whose practices are enabled by the consumers. I refuse to condemn the likes of Jules Jordan or Greg Lansky who only play by the same rules to the same ends as black directors/producers who also play the same game. I think we can all rest assured that Jules, Greg, Lex, and Mimefreak would love to never have to pay more for IR ever. But the only way to enforce this "equal outcome" is to impose some sort of regulation, which by definition means unequal opportunity. It tells the investor that they are not allowed to invest as much as they determine a commodity is worth. There are bidding wars that female performers can take advantage of, holding out for whomever gives them the best offer. This drives that exclusive payday up. I don't see who has the authority or the right to tell a producer that, no, they may not spend X amount on a good or service because it is too much. The same thing applies with how they market movies and how vendors categorize them. All these producers want to do is cater and satisfy demand. There is no bad guy to point the finger at here. This is a result of the demands of the market. It is consumers who decide. At ANY RATE, this is all rather tangential to the point of moot cuz the "interracial" category does not exclusively denote black male + white female. That's just a misconception which unfortunately many performers both new and old don't seem to comprehend yet. [Link] |
| Melvyn Senior Member 2797 Posts 12/12 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 8:18PM [Link] |
| Flash Golden Age Classic 11018 Posts 5/01 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 8:56PM Another way to look at it is, if Wicked remade Hercules, Derrick Pierce could be Hercules but Isiah Maxwell can't unless the movie is marketed as IR. I feel this puts black male actors at a disadvantage because they can'thave that lead role, you feel it doesn't because Isiah Maxwell can have the role of black male having sex with white female in the blacksmith shop. If this was the other way around, white America would throw a fit. [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Apr 28 2018 : 10:44PM [Link] |
| LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05 | Posted - Apr 29 2018 : 5:28AM It's like attaching "four wheels" to a single brand of cars , it's just bullshit , I wasn't talking at all about the appeal of women extrafilled with impossibly large dicks. i was only mentioning that due to kind of research you're going to make and the kind of backlash the cookies you'll get will throw at you , IR is one thing "big dicks" will give you another whole forest of trees Edited by - LCF on 4/29/2018 5:29:34 AM [Link] |
| Maxxx Stirner Deactivated User 319 Posts 11/14 | Posted - Apr 30 2018 : 4:50PM One thing I would add is that the increased intensified segregation of the IR biz model has happened in a context ever slowing sales contraction going back to 2008. The money milk and honey period of porn was the late 90s to late 00s and the IR issue was not as bad. I think that a more integral way of doing things would actually help to renew porn sales for the better if done right especially considering that the world is becoming more multi-cultural. The idealized white girl and steriotypical male might not be long for marketing life. LCF Zebra girls is simply a play on words connoting black on white sex. It's no different then something like ebony/ivory. I see no problem with that as a creative descriptive term. [Link] |
| Zingerbrook Member 580 Posts 3/17 | Posted - Apr 30 2018 : 6:44PM I guess the category of "interracial" is not hard to understand in terms of where it comes from. It was not an offensive term some decades and 'blacks' with 'whites' was the common conception. I could go on. I guess what we have now is a categorization problem. It's harder to find content, as the term has become diluted. The extreme would be to not label skin color at all, which to me is ludicrous. Colors are colors, and color is an artistic choice and a viewer choice. Porn is also fantasy-driven. Like it or not, 'race' is a factor within society and therefore can be a component of sexual fantasy. Let it be so. I cannot bring myself to condone social engineering. On a performer, individual level, that is a different matter. As someone who has been in the position of paying, I refuse to pay different rates on the basis of race. If someone of one race lowballs their own rate on the basis of race, I personally feel compelled to pay them the higher rate. Actually, I have adjusted lowballs for other reasons as well. I think it's only fair. Edited by - zingerbrook on 4/30/2018 6:45:40 PM [Link] |
| Maxxx Stirner Deactivated User 319 Posts 11/14 | Posted - Apr 30 2018 : 8:24PM [Link] |
| Zingerbrook Member 580 Posts 3/17 | Posted - Apr 30 2018 : 9:20PM This is where regulations could help... Of course, society and government are so fucked in the head regarding sexuality, there's no way in hell I'd want more of their regulations in porn. The problem seems to be improving over time, albeit slowly. I'm not so directly involved in porn production these days and am more on the market research side (yeah, we exist). Depiction of bodies in porn is WAY ahead of mainstream in some important respects, including a wider variety of body types, skin tones, races, and personal styles depicted as attractive. I would also that there is more diversity in porn, period, versus mainstream Hollywood. So there's that. [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 8:12AM [Link] |
| LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 12:27PM Zebra scenes , Zebra Porn , how long dou you think you'll have to wait before somebody would notice that Zebras are very much as hung as horses and originate from Africa and do the association Zebra = Big dicked animal from Africa = Black man? Also do you really believe there's a segregation intensification in porn? Really? I've never see so many black women in major productions as right now even Digital Playground is producing IR porn a while now Edited by - LCF on 5/1/2018 12:32:24 PM [Link] |
| DickDrainersXXX Dick Drainers 851 Posts 5/16 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 1:32PM www.dickdrainers.com [Link] |
| DickDrainersXXX Dick Drainers 851 Posts 5/16 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 1:44PM [Link] |
| Maxxx Stirner Deactivated User 319 Posts 11/14 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 6:23PM IR porn is selling but it's in the context of a contracting industry that is far from the heights of 1998-2008 when the marketing was not so entrenched. LCF You realize I'm not calling for a formal term like zebra girls right? It's something specific to dogfart that gets the point of the fetish across in a label. It's no different then, say, ebony/ivory parings or something like that. These are not meant to be market wide labels. I suspect that there's more black women because there's more people getting into porn because it's not as stigmatized as it used to be. Doesn't change the fact that fully phenotype black women have little to no prospects for winning any major awards or being of similar value to their white counterparts. There's also the point that Flash has been making about black men not showing up in any features. It's no coincidence that there hasn't been a black male AVN POTY since 2003. [Link] |
 | |
| DickDrainersXXX Dick Drainers 851 Posts 5/16 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 6:43PM Just don't get why you all are looking for new descriptive terms.www.dickdrainers.com [Link] |
| Maxxx Stirner Deactivated User 319 Posts 11/14 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 9:09PM I could be ok with the IR term, I simply don't like how it serves as a segregating process that continues the worst of US history. [Link] |
| Zingerbrook Member 580 Posts 3/17 | Posted - May 1 2018 : 11:44PM Porn is at a state in evolution where it needs to educate its potential audience. It's not about business models as much. It's about normalizing sex and fantasy and videos of it. Reading meanstream news about porn is cringeworthy, or downright retarded (in the traditional meaning of the word). That needs fixing. Or else, there will be little market growth. Or, political idiots will do the educating, which is even worse. [Link] |
| LCF All-Star Member Non Prevalebunt! 10364 Posts 1/05 | Posted - May 2 2018 : 11:30AM Do you realize that the hamerring idea of cool black guys giving overwhelming sex to white girls as it is portrayed in your "segregationist" IR in the last 20 years actually did push a lot toward a more sexually mixed society? Or do you think it didn't have any effect on the real world ? Do you realize that most of the 30- got their sexual informations more on porn than anything else?Of course I do , I just went on with the example and the fact that you don't find "zebra" derogative in my view it's way worse than Interracial. And would be for many other ways to say: it's black dude fucking a white girl , in a different way as for the POTY , would you mind to put some names here? Performers who did awesomely at least one year and should have won but didn't? Unless you mean a random black guy should be awarded just because. I'd put a black woman who should have won but didn't it was Skin Diamond who had an outstanding couple of years doing basically anything at the higher level Edited by - LCF on 5/2/2018 11:35:17 AM [Link] |
| Maxxx Stirner Deactivated User 319 Posts 11/14 | Posted - May 2 2018 : 2:40PM You're absolutely right zinger. What needs to happen is more dynamic tube site friendly digital forms of paying performers and producers. I put out an idea here of there being a definitive tube site(perhaps pornhub or another emergent one) that has a sophisticated performer producer tipping tribute system that can be progressively scaled. Basically the bare minimum can be something like $1.25(1 to performers 25 to producers if it's a performer producer like Riley Reid or Angela White it can be just $1) scaling up to $25(20 and 5 tribute to producer goes down slightly)you get the picture. I think that's the answer in the digital age we live in. Porn needs to build itself around micro tribute and transactions due to the simple fact that porn's value is a mile wide and an inch deep. There can still be a secondary place for the subscription model though I think the price has to be 3 quartered down from what it currently is(2.50/7.50 a year/month not 10/30 as is the current model) There also has to be more subscriber dictation on things like the girls and the scenes. Hard media prices need to come down as well to roughly that same 3 quartering value. And yes, porn and sexual media(as I think it should be called in a more umbrella sense) needs to be more normalized and integrated into society. For this you need very a strong intellectual well spoken strain of thought and practice in porn. I would also think these porn figures would speak out against the current IR model. What porn needs is a David Bowie to 1983 MTV like porn star who's most likely white and female. I think the market transformation that is required is tied to plugging into the emerging late millennial iGen sexualities that are likely going to be more bisexual in focus. Think of all the horny young women who do not have a good looking guy to rub off to beyond a gay porn context. I think a big part of this is changing the way the boy/girl formula is presented. ^ Yes it did LCF if we're talking about the worst aspects of racial segregation that say black men shall not fuck 'our' women. But that period has passed. And a more holistic way of depicting black on white needs to be pursued. I don't think realize that there is such a thing as an IR racist. The guy that got deactivated last page was actually PM rage typing to me about this issue(threats and all) and actually let out that he thinks black women are ugly. IR has that contradictory underbelly and it's one of the reasons why there is a racist element to it. Why do you think Vixen has only had ONE black male black female scene which got a few more thumbs down then usual. Fact is that IR, while it did great things in regards to racism in the last quarter of the 20th century, is now a hindrance in regards to authentic inter-ethnic sexual harmony. Also, again, 'zebra girls' is not in itself an offensive term. It's a clever word play of labeling a black female white female scene. There is no issue with it in an of itself. It would be like labeling an asian african sex scene black and yellow. It's simply creative word play with a harmless context. Skin Diamond is an interesting example in that she is more on the mixed side and white supremacist based cultures have a history of giving preference to that particular phenotype. If you look at someone like Anna Foxxx for instance I don't think she has the same prospects of getting nominated. These are just the facts of the current racialized dynamics in porn. [Link] |
| axer321 Member IR 20 Posts 5/18 | Posted - May 27 2018 : 9:40PM People like IR particularly what it is, ww bm. Thats how it goes, how bad is that? [Link] |
| Use the code below to link to this topic or a specific post. |
| URL of this thread |
| Link to this post with HTML |
| Link to this post with Forum Code |