The Jenna Jameson effect (attn Devon_3)

Author	Post
Shotgun Styles Deactivated User Gentlemen prefer Blondes, Blondes prefer Chocolate. 175 Posts 5/06	Posted - Apr 21 2007 : 11:52PM I see you're becoming frustrated. Don't. I used to get all worked up about IR Dodgers myself, but research and listening to people has helped me understand the issue much better. Porn has experienced a "Jenna Jameson effect". She was one of the first internet generation porn starts to capitalize on race baiting. She was coached away from Black men early in her career, and soon realized that her "purity" of race was a marketable commodity in and of itself. What makes this insidiously sinister is that she decided to make racial "purity" into a fashion statement. Like a Gucci purse, or Prada shoes. Racism became a fashionable accessory. Fast forward several years, and she has convinced a great many others in the business (because of her success) that racism is fashionable, and more importantly, marketable. What new girls coming into the business don't realize, is that race had little to do with her success. Nor did the porn she produced. Jenna Jameson is who she is because Howard Stern used his millions of listeners to make her into a brand name for porn. Look how many avid porn fans lament her terrible scenes, and even worse attitude. She is more celebrity than porn star, but most females coming into the business don't understand that and try to emulate her success anyway. The second thing you need to realize is that many people don't like the word "racist" or "racism". White males are particularly averse to it, as it always feels to them as though they are being accused of something. Thus, there has been a concerted effort to change the definition of racism to gerrymander it around what Jenna Jameson and others do with regards to racial discrimination. DO NOT fall into the trap of arguing what racism is and isn't. Discrimination based on race is racism. Period. Whether it's refusing to do IR porn, or cabbies who won't pick up Black people, it's the same thing. Accept that the people who are arguing against IR Dodging as "racism" are only doing so out of fear. They are afraid that liking a racist person makes them racist. Like cooties. Instead, rather than beating your head against the wall arguing semantics, focus on the real culprit here: money. New girls in the business, particularly ones like Tera Patrick (back when she was new) who get lot's of attention. They want to make as much money as possible, as fast as possible. They want a contract because it means a six figure income and a limited number of fuck scenes. Race is at the bottom of their priority list. However, as a consequence of the coaching they get, they are taught to believe that remaining racially "pure" will help them achieve their goals. So when they say "personal preference", you should hear "financial decision". Believe me, if IR was the most profitable way to make money and become a contract star, they WOULD ALL DO IT in a heartbeat. Look at Taylor Rain. She wants so badly to maintain the image of "pure" southern white woman. Problem is, she keeps getting caught with Black dick in her. Why? Because she doesn't believe any of the racist nonsense she's been spouting. She says it because that's what she thinks white men want to hear. Lastly, before you get to down on Jenna Jameson herself, bear this in mind. She fucked Dennis Rodman. In an attempt to seduce him into making a porn video with him, she fucked him at an event they both hosted. He balked at the last minute on Howard Stern's radio show, so now Jenna denies that anything happened. But it goes to show you that she'd throw her "purity" status away in a heartbeat for a big enough payday, which she saw in the offing if she could make a Dennis Rodman sex tape... Army of one, Hooah! Edited by - Shotgun Styles on Apr 21 2007 Edited by - Shotgun Styles on Apr 22 2007 [Link]
Shotgun Styles Deactivated User Gentlemen prefer Blondes, Blondes prefer Chocolate. 175 Posts 5/06	Posted - Apr 23 2007 : 1:21AM bump for Devon_3 [Link]
junglew Senior Member 1042 Posts 12/02	Posted - Apr 23 2007 : 2:07PM I could not of said it better. Articulate and true. Wayne In Dallas [Link]
Clam Digger Deactivated User Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05	Posted - Apr 23 2007 : 8:11PM Shotgun Styles wrote: ......Porn has experienced a "Jenna Jameson effect". She was one of the first internet generation porn starts to capitalize on race baiting. She was coached away from Black men early in her career, and soon realized that her "purity" of race was a marketable commodity in and of itself. What makes this insidiously sinister is that she decided to make racial "purity" into a fashion statement. Like a Gucci purse, or Prada shoes. Racism became a fashionable accessory. Click to expand Webster's dictionary defines "race-baiting" as: the making of verbal attacks against members of a racial group. Can you share with us when Jenna did this? Or for that manner the name of any other credible star that may have done such a thing? I'm curious, where did you get this information about JJ? Does it come from interviews or her book? Shotgun Styles wrote: Fast forward several years, and she has convinced a great many others in the business (because of her success) that racism is fashionable, and more importantly, marketable. Click to expand Was this done in seminar format? Perhaps she has done an infomercial on the subject? Where does this information come from? Shotgun Styles wrote: What new girls coming into the business don't realize, is that race had little to do with her success. Nor did the porn she produced. Jenna Jameson is who she is because Howard Stern used his millions of listeners to make her into a brand name for porn. Look how many avid porn fans lament her terrible scenes, and even worse attitude. She is more celebrity than porn star, but most females coming into the business don't understand that and try to emulate her success anyway. Click to expand I have not followed JJ all that much other than her scenes with Randy West, which were real scorchers. I'm sure Howard Stern has a great affect on a lot of performer's careers, or they wouldn't continue to do the show. But why do you suppose Howard chose Jenna above all the others? Do you think that hes he is a racist? If she has become wealthy and is now more than than just a porn star, what on earth can be wrong with that? Should females coming into the business only aspire to become crack whores and nothing more? I think that most people try to emulate successful people in their chosen fields. I have. What about you? Shotgun Styles wrote: The second thing you need to realize is that many people don't like the word "racist" or "racism". White males are particularly averse to it, as it always feels to them as though they are being accused of something. Click to expand I don't like telling people what they "need to realize", but I will agree that many people don't like racism. I also think that any black person reading what you have said might be amused, since most if not all the racism that they have suffered has been at the hands of white Americans (usually males). You speak of white males (whatever that means) as "they" or "them". Does that mean that you are a person of color? You seem to be making a lot of generalizations that border along "racial lines" if not stereotypes. Though, as a white American (male) I am very adverse to racism, no matter the source. Shotgun Styles wrote: Thus, there has been a concerted effort to change the definition of racism to gerrymander it around what Jenna Jameson and others do with regards to racial discrimination. Click to expand What do you mean by "a concerted effort to change the definition of racism"? What is this new definition? And, who is making this concerted effort of which you speak? Shotgun Styles wrote: DO NOT fall into the trap of arguing what racism is and isn't. Discrimination based on race is racism. Period. Whether it's refusing to do IR porn, or cabbies who won't pick up Black people, it's the same thing. Click to expand Well now you have confused me. First you warn against falling into a trap, and then you dive in it head first. Perhaps it would be clearer, if you defined what you think race is. After all, how are any of us able to define "racism" if we have not established what race is? I am very interested in your thoughts on the matter. Shotgun Styles wrote: Accept that the people who are arguing against IR Dodging as "racism" are only doing so out of fear. They are afraid that liking a racist person makes them racist. Like cooties. Instead, rather than beating your head against the wall arguing semantics, focus on the real culprit here: money. Click to expand You really got me scratching my head here, are there racist that you like and therefore do not fear? That can't be what you mean. Please elaborate. Shotgun Styles wrote: New girls in the business, particularly ones like Tera Patrick (back when she was new) who get lot's of attention. They want to make as much money as possible, as fast as possible. Click to expand Silly me but I thought that Tera was, I hate to use the term, bi-racial. The part about wanting to make a lot of money and making it as fast as possible, is everybody's dream, in or out of porn. It's the American way. Shotgun Styles wrote: I am sure that They want a contract because it means a six figure income and a limited number of fuck scenes. Race is at the bottom of their priority list. Click to expand Not all girls want a contract, they view it as a drop in income and opportunity. If race is at the bottom of the priority list for contract minded girls, then how are they racist? Shotgun Styles wrote: However, as a consequence of the coaching they get, they are taught to believe that remaining racially "pure" will help them achieve their goals. So when they say "personal preference", you should hear "financial decision". Click to expand I'm curious about this coaching thing. Do you think Jewell was coached? If she was, whoever "they" are did a lousy job of it. I do not recall her ever mentioning such coaching. She does appear to have met with some success. Kaylani, who is also, should I say multi-cultural, happens to be both a contract girl (Wicked Pictures) and one of my all time favorites, seems to have missed out on this coaching stuff as well. The first scene of hers that I ever saw was in U&C 116 (I think that is the number) where she was royally fucked by both Randy and (hold on to your hat here) Mr. Marcus. Very hot. She has gone on to do a couple more scenes with Mr. Marcus for Wicked (not as hot IMHO as I prefer gonzo to features). Maybe you do not wish to count Kaylani in any of this, and I certainly can understand why, as she does not really fit into the mold of an Aryan sex goddess. Shotgun Styles wrote: ....Lastly, before you get to down on Jenna Jameson herself, bear this in mind. She fucked Dennis Rodman. In an attempt to seduce him into making a porn video with him, she fucked him at an event they both hosted. He balked at the last minute on Howard Stern's radio show, so now Jenna denies that anything happened. Click to expand Just who are you addressing about getting to down on Jenna? (I would want to be first in line for that). How do you know that Jenna did or didn't fuck Dennis Rodman? Further more if she did fuck him as a means of seducing him to make of all things a porn video, wouldn't that by your definition, make her not a "racist"? And what does that say about all of that "coaching" that you refer to? If it is true that Rodman refused her "seduction", does that make him a "racist"? Again I'm only using your definition, as best as I understand it. Unless you are Forest Gump or Zelig like, how is it that you "know" what Jenna & Rodman did or didn't do or what their motivation was. Shotgun Styles wrote: ....it goes to show you that she'd throw her "purity" status away in a heartbeat for a big enough payday, which she saw in the offing if she could make a Dennis Rodman sex tape... Click to expand Purity is not a quality that I would normally associate with a pornstar, unless we are talking about Kami, err I mean Imak. I don't think anyone discriminates against the color green, however. I looked up racism in Wikipedia and cut the following, you may find it as illuminating as I did: Racism is a belief or ideology that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially to distinguish it either superior or inferior to another race or races. Was it Kierkegaard who said: "I have a big cock, therefore I must be black"?..I don't know, maybe it's something I heard Imak say. I frequently confuse them. [Link]
Devon_3 Member 71 Posts 10/06	Posted - Apr 23 2007 : 10:42PM WELL SAID Shotgun Styles Shotgun Styles wrote: I see you're becoming frustrated. Don't. I used to get all worked up about IR Dodgers myself, but research and listening to people has helped me understand the issue much better. Porn has experienced a "Jenna Jameson effect". She was one of the first internet generation porn starts to capitalize on race baiting. She was coached away from Black men early in her career, and soon realized that her "purity" of race was a marketable commodity in and of itself. What makes this insidiously sinister is that she decided to make racial "purity" into a fashion statement. Like a Gucci purse, or Prada shoes. Racism became a fashionable accessory. Fast forward several years, and she has convinced a great many others in the business (because of her success) that racism is fashionable, and more importantly, marketable. What new girls coming into the business don't realize, is that race had little to do with her success. Nor did the porn she produced. Jenna Jameson is who she is because Howard Stern used his millions of listeners to make her into a brand name for porn. Look how many avid porn fans lament her terrible scenes, and even worse attitude. She is more celebrity than porn star, but most females coming into the business don't understand that and try to emulate her success anyway. The second thing you need to realize is that many people don't like the word "racist" or "racism". White males are particularly averse to it, as it always feels to them as though they are being accused of something. Thus, there has been a concerted effort to change the definition of racism to gerrymander it around what Jenna Jameson and others do with regards to racial discrimination. DO NOT fall into the trap of arguing what racism is and isn't. Discrimination based on race is racism. Period. Whether it's refusing to do IR porn, or cabbies who won't pick up Black people, it's the same thing. Accept that the people who are arguing against IR Dodging as "racism" are only doing so out of fear. They are afraid that liking a racist person makes them racist. Like cooties. Instead, rather than beating your head against the wall arguing semantics, focus on the real culprit here: money. New girls in the business, particularly ones like Tera Patrick (back when she was new) who get lot's of attention. They want to make as much money as possible, as fast as possible. They want a contract because it means a six figure income and a limited number of fuck scenes. Race is at the bottom of their priority list. However, as a consequence of the coaching they get, they are taught to believe that remaining racially "pure" will help them achieve their goals. So when they say "personal preference", you should hear "financial decision". Believe me, if IR was the most profitable way to make money and become a contract star, they WOULD ALL DO IT in a heartbeat. Look at Taylor Rain. She wants so badly to maintain the image of "pure" southern white woman. Problem is, she keeps getting caught with Black dick in her. Why? Because she doesn't believe any of the racist nonsense she's been spouting. She says it because that's what she thinks white men want to hear. Lastly, before you get to down on Jenna Jameson herself, bear this in mind. She fucked Dennis Rodman. In an attempt to seduce him into making a porn video with him, she fucked him at an event they both hosted. He balked at the last minute on Howard Stern's radio show, so now Jenna denies that anything happened. But it goes to show you that she'd throw her "purity" status away in a heartbeat for a big enough payday, which she saw in the offing if she could make a Dennis Rodman sex tape... Army of one, Hooah! Edited by - Shotgun Styles on Apr 21 2007 Click to expand Thanks Shotgun Styles, what you said makes sense. I also heard about the then virtually 'new' and unknown porn slut Jemma Jameson sleeping with the world famous Dennis Rodman so she can hook up with him 'next time around' to make a sex tape with her so she can gain quick fame and make 100% profit from the sales. Dennis Rodman saw what was up, took the pussy and ran. P.S. Please PAY ABSOLUTELY NO ATTENTION to that bumbling WHITE RACIST IDIOT poster 'Clam Digger'. On his previous anti-Interracial thread, he CLAIMED he was a Black man (which was one of the most UNCONVINCING acts I've ever witnessed on the net), NOW he admits to being a White person. This racist FOOL hates IR porn so much and the fact that a Blackman is sexually satisfying a White porn starlet, that in his furious rage, he cannot remember what race he is, LOL hahahahaha. I think if I post a next IR clip, he skin will turn RED. LOL Edited by - devon_3 on 4/23/2007 10:45:48 PM [Link]

Shotgun Styles Deactivated User Gentlemen prefer Blondes, Blondes prefer Chocolate. 175 Posts 5/06	Posted - Apr 24 2007 : 6:13AM Clam Digger wrote: I'm curious, where did you get this information about JJ? Does it come from interviews or her book? Click to expand I have read your entire response. However because it is intellectually dishonest, I cannot effectively respond. You are either too naive to have a grown up discussion about the state of race in pornography, or you are intentionally distorting the issue in order to serve your own ends. It is clear when you bring up Tera Patrick not being white that you have no grasp of the issue at hand, or refuse to deal with it for your own personal reason. The backlash against IR is solely against Black males, regardless of the race of the female. Mercedez is Hispanic, Asia Carrera Eurasian, and Jenna Jameson is white. All are well known dodgers. If you don't know this, you need much more education on this subject before you can have a conversation at the level that Devon_3 and I are. If you do know this, you are intentionally distorting the issue, as Devon_3 has accused you of, to suit your own purposes. If you firmly believe that there is no anti-Black male current among top stars, and believe that IR Dodging is just a figment of our collective imaginations, then there is no point in discussing it with you further. I may as well discuss the genetic details of evolution with an Evangelical Christian. It's a waste of time. You don't want to hear me, and therefore you won't. If however you wish to start over, with an honest debate of the issue, I'd be more than happy to explain my thinking. [Link]
Shotgun Styles Deactivated User Gentlemen prefer Blondes, Blondes prefer Chocolate. 175 Posts 5/06	Posted - Apr 24 2007 : 4:20PM Thanks Shotgun Styles, what you said makes sense. I also heard about the then virtually 'new' and unknown porn slut Jemma Jameson sleeping with the world famous Dennis Rodman so she can hook up with him 'next time around' to make a sex tape with her so she can gain quick fame and make 100% profit from the sales. Dennis Rodman saw what was up, took the pussy and ran. P.S. Please PAY ABSOLUTELY NO ATTENTION to that bumbling WHITE RACIST IDIOT poster 'Clam Digger'. On his previous anti-Interracial thread, he CLAIMED he was a Black man (which was one of the most UNCONVINCING acts I've ever witnessed on the net), NOW he admits to being a White person. This racist FOOL hates IR porn so much and the fact that a Blackman is sexually satisfying a White porn starlet, that in his furious rage, he cannot remember what race he is, LOL hahahahaha. I think if I post a next IR clip, he skin will turn RED. LOL Click to expand He's got a long way to go, no doubt. Many of the pro-Dodger crowd are just fans of certain stars whom they want to support. Others are indeed racialists who are uncomfortable with Black men entertaining their favorite white starlet. If you read through his post to me, he gives away another facet of the pro-Dodger argument that I should have told you to watch out for: playing dumb. This one can really piss you off, particularly if you are honestly trying to explain something to one of these guys, and they continuously (and intentionally) distort everything you say. They pretend as though the last 50 years never happened, and that America is some racial utopia. They pretend as though there hasn't been widespread hate directed at Black men and White women for intermingling with one another in this country. They do this to frustrate you into cursing them out and calling them racists. Now, they can cry to the board moderators (not just here, but other boards too) and try to get you banned for ad hominiem attacks. Maybe it works, maybe it doesn't. But it's a tactic just the same, and should be countered. If you read my reply to him, I attacked his false premise that racism was just a myth. I further went on to explain that I'm not about to bother discussing the issue with someone who obviously doesn't seem to want to understand it. Edited by - Shotgun Styles on 4/24/2007 4:23:05 PM [Link]
Slonik Member 87 Posts 1/07	Posted - Apr 24 2007 : 5:29PM Shotgun: If I were a mod here I'd ban you not just for ad homminem attacks that can be found in all your posts but also for racism against white people you express in EVERY one of your many threads. Some time ago I dated an African girl. Being a white guy I felt it was very important for me to understand her social background. I loved meeting her parents, little bro, friends-both male and female. That's how it works when you love and respect someone. And that's why I'm saying you have no respect for white women. You have just hate for white men and you think you can hurt them by fucking "their" women. Well I got sour news for you Styles...it does not work that way. For most of the peeps there are no "our" women or "their" women. We see an individual girl who has every right in the world to choose who she wants to fuck and who she doesn't. [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14594 Posts 3/02	Posted - Apr 24 2007 : 6:54PM Mods don't ban people. That's up to the admins/site owners. mod hat: I agree that we can do without the name calling, though. As satisfying as it may be in the short term it does nothing to advance the discussion. If anybody doesn't think that rational discussion is possible then do the rest of the board a favor and don't post on the subject. [Link]
Clam Digger Deactivated User Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05	Posted - Apr 24 2007 : 7:18PM The conspiracy is upon us! [Link]
Shotgun Styles Deactivated User Gentlemen prefer Blondes, Blondes prefer Chocolate. 175 Posts 5/06	Posted - Apr 25 2007 : 12:44AM Slonik wrote: Shotgun: If I were a mod here I'd ban you not just for ad homminem attacks that can be found in all your posts but also for racism against white people you express in EVERY one of your many threads. Some time ago I dated an African girl. Being a white guy I felt it was very important for me to understand her social background. I loved meeting her parents, little bro, friends-both male and female. That's how it works when you love and respect someone. And that's why I'm saying you have no respect for white women. You have just hate for white men and you think you can hurt them by fucking "their" women. Well I got sour news for you Styles...it does not work that way. For most of the peeps there are no "our" women or "their" women. We see an individual girl who has every right in the world to choose who she wants to fuck and who she doesn't. Click to expand Ah yes. The "I can't be a racist because I nailed a Black chick once" argument. Not very original Slonik. Before you go and defend yourself for being a racist, keep in mind that I never accused you (or clam digger for that matter) of being a racist. First of all, there's no need to "post your credentials" by telling us about some Black chick you were nailing. It only undermines the dubious point you were trying to make about how race doesn't matter. If it doesn't matter, why do you need to disclose your race and then claim "street cred" by brining up some Black woman you tapped? It matters, and you know it matters. Perception is reality at the fulcrum of business and marketing. Business interests supersede all petty insecurities about penis size and sexual mythology. For the buying public, it's about race. For the marketer it's about money. For the females involved, it's about the path of least resistance, and the shortest distance to the goal. Edited by - Shotgun Styles on 4/25/2007 12:46:11 AM [Link]