Reviewers Recommend Cherie's Pool Party Parfait - review by fu_q Starring: Cherie DeVille, Vince Karter, Mazee the Goat, Jimmy Bud, Ace Hardz, Hollywood Cash. Read review
My husband likes my bliss tears. The tears don't turn him on, but I know he likes the idea of me being so well fucked, satisfied and moved that I've entered some kind of happy altered state. There's a difference between bliss tears and distress tears. Porn being the pantomime it is, it's hard to tell what's going on. Edited for grammar - I don't think so straight when I'm recalling being fucked into a transcendent state Edited by - Loraine on 11/17/2009 1:42:56 AM
And on that fateful day, the hatred consumed me... 1423 Posts 3/09
Posted - Nov 17 2009 : 1:56AM
If bad grammar and incoherent thought were giveaways for a good sex life, there must be some members here (generally of the deactivated kind) fucked to the very ends of bliss.
Jesus - I didn't realise things had gotten so serious we were headed toward this kind of personal attack - my private life is none of your business. I'm not on here to fight with people, so I'll just leave it at that.
Wow, that sounds crazy. I saw Romance (didn't Breillat make that?) so I can imagine the kind of atmosphere this occurs in. This happens in conjunction with sex? Or is it a "regular" dramatic scene?
“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09
Posted - Nov 17 2009 : 9:42AM
I'll restrict my comments to a general nature as I haven't seen the scene in question. Also, although I have similar feelings as Bob, I won't speak on his behalf, just my personal experience. Although it might be archaic and not entirely justified (or accurate), as a male (esp. American male), I too tend to reflexively react to crying (esp. women) as a response to a negative event. I understand that people cry in response to joyous events, but to be quite candid, the vast majority of times I have seen people cry was in response to negative events (pain, distress, anguish, grieving, etc. etc.), therefore I usually associate it with something noxious. Consequently, I don't find crying arousing when watching media. As far as protective personality, this tends to be part of my personality influenced from my life experiences (although somewhat changing). So appropriately or not, it's hard to separate it sometimes. Edited by - BYOB_Kenobi on 11/17/2009 11:34:11 AM
A skirmish has developed around this most interesting thread concerning the anciallary question: "What reasons might there be for a guy not liking to see a girl in tears in a porn scene." -- One conjecture is that men don't like to mix emotions with their masturbation. -- Another (broadly speaking) is that men see tears as evidence of "something wrong" being done to or experienced by the performer to evoke those tears, and their reaction is a mix of protectiveness and disgust. Tears, in general, are a complicated issue because each individual's personal story is uniquely embedded with specific incidents (and general family histories) of crying and the contexts within which that crying occurred. As a consquence, different people will naturally interpret tears differently. Some of these differences are likely to follow gender lines (in a rough sense), but it's got to be far less simplistic than that. Did you parents ever cry? If they did, were either of them given to hysterics or unstable behavior? Under what circumstances do you most often see other people crying? What makes you cry? Has anyone you've had sex with ever cried during or just after the act? And if so, why? Have you -- and, if so, why? The possibilities, if not endless, are vast.
Yes, this is what I was trying to get at. A few pages back, I was one the folks here who turned the movie off because it wasn't my cup of tea (though I promised to return to it when I was in the right mood). So, count me amongst those who find women crying to be unsettling, especially if I think the woman is being hurt, physically and/or emotionally. This was the only thing that made me cross to start with - the idea that only men would find this upsetting. Not sure how my comments were misconstrued to mean that I didn't think men should be upset by a woman crying. So, yes, I think we're all raised to find people crying unsettling (I hope), and especially women because of a few things, one of which is simply how we're raised (men and women) to see women, and another of which is that historically women have been subject to sexual violence more so than men, and in a way that's directly linked to their sex. These two elements combined, it's no wonder it's difficult to watch a woman cry during a porn scene. I think it's different for a woman watching a scene in which a woman is crying (at least it is for me, judging by other peoples' reactions) because there is an identificatory process at work, alongside the empathy/urge to help. But I wouldn't discount men identifying with women either - I believe this happens a lot, just like women identify with men. Of course, the scene in question is far more complex than, say, a Max Hardcore scene (and it should be noted that all I know of his movies is what other people have described/images I've seen - and it looks like I would be nauseated by it), so I'm not sure it can be addressed according to these more traditional approaches.
Mightn't you have misconstrued the posts that set you off? That is, the guys were speaking solely from their own point of view while maintaining an unstated belief that women would feel equally protetective toward other women (albeit, perhaps, with a slightly different set of interpretive lenses)?
[Link]
Clam Digger Deactivated User
Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05
Posted - Nov 17 2009 : 12:55PM
I am thinking about every romance oriented war movie made in the 40's, that I have ever watched, where two lovers are at a train station. The guy is leaving for war, with the very real possibility of him never to return. I can imagine Donna Reed, Loretta Young or Barbara Stanwyck (substitute any starlet of the era) and the handsome soldier in a very bitter-sweet kiss, tears welling in her eyes, as they stand before uncertainty, kissing one last time. Were those tears a negative thing? We can say that it absolutely is a sad, tragic movement and a very honest one, a real one. Do we find ourselves caught up in their moment? I think most of us do. In the scene being discussed in this thread, its the last time two lovers will be making love. It's passionate and it is bitter-sweet. Tears flow as the character, Kristina is playing, begins to mourn the impending loss of her lover. The only thing startling about it, I think, is the emotion and honesty of the moment. Some of us, for some reason, feel uncomfortable seeing real emotion and passion in our porn. We never see it in this context, so either it passes by unnoticed or we are but off by it. Are we uncomfortable with it because some of us feel exposed to emotions we do not expect, as we sit alone in the dark. Who likes surprises? Is it that we don't expect to feel intimate, in our private time? Is that the real source of some of the objections, being expressed here? Hell, if we wanted intimacy wouldn't we be off fucking our SO's, for those of us, who have one, or need intimacy. Well, maybe. Are most men afraid of real intimacy? Is that the real issue here? Is that what we really like about porn, the lack of intimacy and real emotion?
I'd say that was very true from my perspective too. I've seen more than enough porn over the years to know that performers don't always get along, don't always want to fuck each other, or don't always want to do certain things. I've also seen a few directors I'd describe as jerks even on their best days. So I can surely understand anyone's initial misgivings or uncomfort when underlying things aren't known or expressed or written well. But I've also learned to never guess or assume over the years also. I know that when performers are comfortable with each other or know each other really well, they can say or do things together beyond what's considered normal or what's usually expected.
A romantic feature film set in wartime has a distinctly different set of "norms" than a porn video does . As such, the interpretive framework is different.As noted in this thread, that "narrative" context is not expressly set up or otherwise clearly evident in the scene itself. This information has come from Kristina after the fact in this thread.Now we're back to a simple (and self-congratulatory) explanatory framework: on one side, the emotionally open viewers; on the other side, the emotionally stunted ones.Some of the objections? Maybe, or maybe in part -- who knows?. In any case, there aren't enough objections of any kind here to be statistically significant in terms of demonstrating a trend or the reasons for it.Everyone needs intimacy, even if they don't know it. But, that sidebar aside, watching other people's intimacy on film and being intimate in one's personal life are entirely different matters. Sometimes mainstream movies are about intimacy; sometimes they are not. I don't think that sheds much light in general about the real-life intimacy issues of movie-goers, who are a varied lot to say the least.Would you like that to be the real issue?We? Who is we? Is that what you really like about porn? If so (or if not) why do you feel qualified to generalize about other men?
Savoy, Although I don't follow the Kink.com sites closely these days, I believe that there are a fair amount of emotional-release-crying scenes on them. But, as you noted above in connection with "Fuck Slaves", they may be too BDSM'y for your tastes.
hairshirt (noun): 1. a shirt made of rough uncomfortable cloth which some religious people used to wear to punish themselves. (If you ask if someone is wearing a hairshirt, you mean that they might be trying to punish themselves to show they are sorry for something they have done.)
pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07
Posted - Nov 18 2009 : 3:06AM
Yes, Breillat did make Romance, but I liked Anatomy of Hell and Fat Girl a fair bit more. It happens either immediately before or after a sex scene, they're both naked on bed and he's comforted by the woman. But then they're naked throughout most of the film. I don't recall the reason for his outburst, I think it may be left unexplained. I wouldn't mind seeing the film again, although I'm sure many people would find it pretentious and talky (which it is), but after seeing it I thought it reminded me of the tradition in French writing for the pornographic novella, and soon after I found out that the film is based on a novella by Breillat.
^ It's all dreadfully dreary, you know because if you have sex in mainstream film, it's got to be full of angst or else the director is accused of wishing to arouse their audience... and then the trouble starts... And Skronk - I love you too - my heart has no limit - apparently.
pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07
Posted - Nov 18 2009 : 4:23AM
It is pretty dreary, but Breillat openly calls her films pornographic so I don't think she's too concerned about it being seen that way, I think it has more to do with her being French. Shortbus was 'sex positive' and had a good response from critics in general. Cameron Mitchell said that he liked the European films that were integrating hardcore but wondered why the were all so dark and disturbing so he thought he'd make a comedy. Sometimes though even those on the far-left pro-porn side can be pretty insistent that all sex has to be 'positive' which makes it hard for anyone to deal with the darker aspects of sexuality seriously, imo.
I enjoyed Shortbus too. I also heard somewhere that The Girlfriend Experience was initially supposed to have hardcore scenes, but after casting Sasha Grey, and all the hype etc, Soderbergh decided to play it safe. Not sure if this is true, but if it is, I'm mad at him. I agree with Blacksix - there doesn't seem to be a middle ground because there is so much at stake politically. Older feature films seem to be the only hardcore movies that dabble in both "bad" and "good" sex in the same movie, in dark ways and jovial ways, and also downright confusing and complex ways. Much more mentally satisfying, in my opinion. Of course, it's always nice to have Buttwoman to go back to, just like having The Jerk on standby is always nice after watching something like Monster.
I just got done watching another scene with Annette Schwarz in tears, this time due to sex, not just a gift. It's in Beyond the Call of Booty 2, it's the same scene with the bizarre stuff with the beer bottle near the beginning. Later on the sex gets so intense she completely loses it, at one point she's sobbing and clutching her face in her hands. It's intense even by her standards.
just checked it out on VOD out of pure curiosity. i don't watch her B/G stuff. anyway, i agree. the crying was stupid. it's cool if she was feeling it and all and looking forward to fucking the guy, but i remember when jewel de'nyle was REALLY looking forward to fucking rocco and she didn't cry like a nutjob. i ain't never seen no shit like that and i hope i never see it again. she lost her shit.
^ That scene is actually one of the greatest I have ever seen. She didn't lose her shit, she just really, really feels for Manuel (and even that's probably an understatement, lol). Hell, my favorite Kristina scenes are the ones when she paired with Manuel. Those scenes are just FLOODING with chemistry, lust, and attraction.
I can't expect everyone to like everything I do. It's just never gunna happen and I would go crazy if I tried. I still wouldn't change one thing about this scene. I'd rather lose my cool and look like a "nut" while caught up in such an intense sexual moment that I can't control myself, than be one of those lame girls that is so consumed with how she looks and acts that the sex suffers. That's just me.
^^^ Did you really need to express your opinion in such an offensive way? Kristina has been posting in this thread. Show a little consideration and respect.
Cherie's Pool Party Parfait - review by fu_q
Posted - Nov 17 2009 : 1:40AM
