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| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 | Hi, first time poster here so be gentle with me. :) I stumbled on this site while searching for tips on couples porn. Yes, I know it's been asked before, but hear me out. I write on behalf of both of us, my wife having tasked me with finding movies to watch to get in mood and learn a thing or two. None of the recommendations I have found (here and elsewhere) is working for us. :( A little background without going into detail too much (sorry ;-) ): We have been together 15+ years (both in our thirties) and have always had great sex, still do. Neither of us have been much into porn. My wife has watched some when stumbling over it in a hotel room or similar, but it hasn't really done much for her. I have watched it as a substitute when alone (business trips, etc.), but haven't been very impressed either by. Our common problem seems to be that we find the movies we've seen to be lacking in passion and/or setup. Granted, I'm a guy so I get off on the visuals, but intellectual stimulation + visuals is hotter. From time to time we've watched "erotic" mainstream features (9 1/2 weeks, In the Cut, Wild Things, etc.), but have been very disappointed each time. We simply want longer and more explicit sex. Neither of us care much for the normal hard-core stuff (too many close-ups, too little passion). We want a good setup (doesn't have to be a plot, but a situation which is erotic) and really good sex with people who enjoy it with more focus on the beautiful bodies than close-ups. I have searched and read pretty much every list there is. I know about the Comstock films (too documentary), Blake movies (too cold, while pretty), the golden age stuff (too campy and really not very good IMHO), Playgirl (quite cold, "polished"), etc. etc. If I were to rule out the above examples and similar, what else is there? Can anyone recommend anything that would match what we're looking for? Does it even exist? Our backup is to just watch the stuff out there and fast forward through what we don't like and accept what's on offer. But I would hate to miss anything good that might be out there. Apologies for the length of my post and the warmest of thanks for any help! [Link] |
| BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07 | She's The Boss, It's a Secretary Thing are also excellent with more extended set-up but tend to more of an minor S&M angle in the sex scenes which may or may not be to your tastes. |
| Joey Starr Senior Member Still wanking after all these years. 8082 Posts 10/00 | Apart for the golden era classics, I'd strongly recommend movies directed by frenchman John B Root (be careful he has also do some more "gonzo" stuff, single scenes, for JTC) such as "Le principe de plaisir" (Marc Dorcel, discontinued and hard to find), "Une nuit au bordel" (Marc Dorcel), "Inkorrekt(e)s" (JBR Media) , "Ludivine" (JBR Media) and his most recent "Montre-moi du rose" (JBR Media). I've watched part of "Montre-moi du rose" and it's so much better than even the best current porn : real cinema that should be shown in movie theaters! Edited by - Joey Starr on 8/8/2009 6:22:29 AM |
| Piratical New Member 4 Posts 3/08 | Our favorite flick of all time is "Zazel", an older movie but it still holds up for us; it's unique and creative and features stunningly beautiful women. We like some of the Digital Underground movies directed by "Celeste", which tend to be more couples friendly. I agree about Andrew Blake -- his stuff is gorgeously filmed but the result is often too cold and calculating, and we are fond of watching couples together, which doesn't show up in his movies all that often in recent years. |
| Gore Gore Girl Doctor of the Erotic Arts 7238 Posts 1/09 | I would have to second BlackSix - Elegant Angel is where it's at. I'm female, in a long term relationship, and am approaching my 30s and in my opinion it doesn't get any better than Sam No/Mason. I will watch all of her movies - they're amazing. And it can't hurt that Manuel Ferrara, who features in many of these movies, is hot as hell. |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 | I will have to search for and take a look at the movies suggested, but some quick research yields that for example the Elegant Angels stuff is pretty much "regular" hardcore? Don't get me wrong, I would probably really enjoy Massive Asses (hey. I'm the guy here) but I'm not sure it really fits what we're looking for collectively? Are the guys really attractive, and is there a "mood"? Some of the other stuff (the french titles suggested as well as Zazel) suggested seems hard to find, but I'll give it a try. Regardless, it seems that there really isn't a studio or a category of movies which fit what we're looking for. I guess we want mainstream(ish) porn, porn with a feeling. I'm not sure it exists yet. Anyway, going off on a slight tangent, I notice that in threads like these there a are a healthy share of women posting. I am curious, did you always enjoy hardcore or is it something that you discovered to your surprise? Disclaimer: I am in no way attempting or contemplating to introduce movies my wife doesn't want to watch. With that said I sometimes wonder if disinterest in "regular" hardcore is due to societal pressure or learned patterns? What I am thinking is that if what we would prefer doesn't exist, maybe we really should get wide variety of the stuff that is out there and just sample it. Maybe we'll find something we enjoy. Anyone with experience of the approach? How did it work out for you? Again, many thanks for the advice this far! |
| Gore Gore Girl Doctor of the Erotic Arts 7238 Posts 1/09 | Hey Parachuter - these are really interesting questions, and certainly ones I can relate to. I used to be very anti-porn, up until I was in my early 20s, mostly because I assumed all porn was by its very nature anti-woman and anti-feminist. I had never actually watched a porn movie, and I didn't plan on doing so. I can't remember why, but I ended up watching some kind of uber-soft lesbian scene, and was completely taken aback by how much it did *not* feel exploitative. I was so surprised, in fact, that I set about exploring what other movies were out there. A few years later, and I'm writing my dissertation about pornographic literature/film. I started out with features, particularly Wicked (and I'm still a huge fan, even while I've branched out into other genres and studios). Powertool Massacre stands out as a life-changing moment for me (I'm a horror nerd), and Stormy Daniels' movies occupy a special place in my heart. I also began reading feminist theory that was pro-sex (I'm a PhD student in gender studies). Another pivotal moment was when I was researching for a paper about women who direct porn, and watched Riot Sluts 2. I went into that movie expecting to find it abhorrent and scary - I mean, I was genuinely scared, and really dreading it - and I was totally blown away. When you say you want something with mood and feeling, this is exactly what I found in Riot Sluts 2, and other Mason/Sam No movies. It's really hard to explain the appeal of her movies - but certainly it's all about the mood and feel of her films. So, I guess what I'm saying is that you and your wife should explore different things. Sometimes the things you think you will like turn out to be a disappointment, while exposing yourself to new things can yield unexpected reactions. I absolutely do not condone the attitude of "breaking in" the girlfriend/wife - talk to her about it, and embark on an adventure together. It's fun! Keep dialogue open, talk about likes and dislikes during the movie, and in general be open with each other. So, in short, back in the day if I had been presented with Massive Asses 4, I would probably have dismissed it, probably with disgust, assuming it was made in an exploitative and sleazy way. Now, I eagerly await pretty much all product from Elegant Angel. I don't know if this means you should suggest it to your wife, but certainly it might be a fun risk for both of you. It could be fun, also, for your wife to do a little reading online into the makers of these movies - I have found that reading interviews with Mason, and the performers, as well as watching behind-the-scenes features on the dvds really adds to the experience, and lessens the "scare" factor. Hope this helps, and have fun! |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 | |
| john lyons Senior Member Co-founder of Vinegar Syndrome 1188 Posts 1/08 | |
| BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07 | |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 | Sadly, it isn't what I am looking for. I can definitely see how it is considered hot, and the chemistry is indeed much better than in many other hardcore clips. However, it's still quite far from sensual, passionate sex. In my humble opinion it is still acting on her part. Unless I managed to miss it, she never climaxes - at least not in any believable and strong way. It still very much looks like porn shot for male consumption. Now, each to their own and I wouldn't dream of criticizing someone's taste, so if it works for you - good! I'm growing increasingly frustrated though. Can it really be that hard to do porn properly? I just can't seem to find movies that depict women actually getting excited for real, well apart from the Comstock movies that is. If only there were porn features with that quality to the sex! It seems like for 99% of the people involved in porn these days it's just a job, and as such it can never really result in good stuff. I guess the last resort is amateur flicks, or 70s stuff, both of which feels more genuine. Again, thank you for the suggestions and the above is in my humble opinion. |
| Aplus Senior Member 1431 Posts 5/05 | |
| Aplus Senior Member 1431 Posts 5/05 | |
| BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07 | |
| lilacwine Member "Don't let your lava love turn to stone." 489 Posts 5/06 | |
| Zoid Senior Member Boobies and Anal 2004 Posts 5/04 | |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 | |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 |
Still, I am absolutely amazed that 90s Andrew Blake is the closest thing I have found to a match. Amazed since I refuse to believe I am the only male who would value seeing more feelings and chemistry on screen. Not to sound condescending - each to their own and all that - but I absolutely fail to see why someone in a happy relationship would be interested in extreme closeups, or mechanical intercourse (add most other standard porn ingredients here). We prefer the real life closeups we get whenever we want to, we simply want some spice to set up a naughty evening. I mean, we are far from prudes. Give us scenes with sexual experimentation of all kinds and we're all over it. But leave something to the imagination. Let us fill in the blanks. I can honestly not believe it can be that hard to understand, and that no producer will take a shot. I have decided to end my search and simply conclude that the erotica industry still focuses 99.9% of efforts on single men, which may be understandable - but sad. Anyway, a warm thank you to all of you who replied and tried to help! |
| BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07 |
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| Savoy All-Star Member Sucker for Sinners 1844 Posts 12/06 | It's either hardcore or it's softcore. There is no in between. You're right. What you're looking for doesn't exist. Porn is a creation. And since you seem to want something more glam and slick-looking, that involes more set-ups, more technical focus, more stopping and starting, more direction of the performer's fucking...etc, etc which all detract from the hot, passionate, all-consuming sex you want. Could you have mind-blowing consensual sex if you were stopped every 3 minutes, told to reposition mid-stroke, worried about blocking a girl's lighting and on and on. Probably not. In my porn-viewing experience, the less the performers are directed, the better. Unfortunately, that makes it hard to produce Andrew Blake-style porn with heat. |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 |
What is your point anyway? I am disappointed with the lack of quality content. If you enjoy what is already out there, fine - have fun. |
| Savoy All-Star Member Sucker for Sinners 1844 Posts 12/06 | Is it possible? Sure, it can be done. Anything is possible. But that is not the reality. It seems that really good pornographers who care about producing hot sex scenes tend to enjoy harder sex. They become immune and are bored with the sort of thing you are looking for. That's why you can't find it in professional adult. So there is beautiful porn out there with passionate real sex, but from your descriptions, it's much too hard for your tastes. Sorry to bum you out by agreeing with you. |
| Roads To Moscow Dianic Wicked Pictures,Vouyer Media, Axel Braun Productions, Marc Dorcel, JoyBear Pictures, abbywinters.com 1390 Posts 7/05 | Parachuter, welcome to ADT. I'm sorry certain members (they know who they are) weren't gentle with you - especially since you asked that they be. But hey, that's just the culture of this site in 2009. Anyway, track down Robert Fuest's Aphrodite and David Hamilton's Laura and Bilitis. Not the easiest movies to find anymore, but well worth the effort. Good luck in your search my new friend... LOL, I can already hear Savoy sharpening her knives since I had the temerity to disagree with her. So it goes. [Image not found DB] [Image not found DB] Edited by - DM/PR on 8/13/2009 2:01:24 PM |
| Savoy All-Star Member Sucker for Sinners 1844 Posts 12/06 | (Aw..come on, he`s a 5 days in. Someone`s gotta bust his cherry...to a pulp.) ;) I do get irritated because this is the exact kind of porn I search for. Modern day pornographers just don`t seem to care for it. My hopes have been raised again and again only for me to be disappointed. If he is open to 70s porn, there are a plethora of titles, but something current? The hunt continues... |
| Gore Gore Girl Doctor of the Erotic Arts 7238 Posts 1/09 | This thread continues to get more interesting. I think I agree with everyone (is that possible?), and thanks DM/PR for the suggestions - I want to see what this "semi-hardcore" might look like. On another note, is there even a word for this kind of porn? I watched AfroDite Superstar a while back, and remember the director calling it "erotica" (she pretty strongly resisted the term "pornography"), one of the performers called it "softcore" (but it was *not* simulated), and meanwhile several publications mused over the issue. Interesting. Anyway, I will add another few cents: I have looked for this elusive "hardcore with feeling" and most of the time I get what I expect. The real gems seem to appear when you don't expect it, and I think this is indicative of the genre - it's "real" but also a fantasy. A curious breed of film. Anyway, I have sat down to a Wicked movie (best place for features, in my opinion) several times, not expecting the sex to be anything special (pretty but not hot), and been really taken by surprise by a scene that seemingly comes out of nowhere, I assume because the couple were really into it, and/or the director did an awesome job (along with the rest of the crew, might I add). One distinct memory of this was the Voodoo/Tori Black scene in The Wicked (which I otherwise didn't think was a good movie), and the scene in Accidental Hooker with Kaylani Lei watching the couple (scene 3? Can't remember the performers). I know there are other scenes that caught me by surprise, but can't think of them off the top of my head. Anyway, maybe this is the band-aid solution - individual scenes that just "work" in the way the OP described. |
| Savoy All-Star Member Sucker for Sinners 1844 Posts 12/06 | (Believe me, I've tried. Now I haven't watched 300 movies a year like some have(!), but I have watched over 300 XXX movies over the last 3 years so please do not tell me I just have to be "willing to dig around for it".) I haven't seen "The Wicked", but I did watch "The Accidental Hooker". God, I loved the opening of that movie - Kaylani Lei walking the Hollywood streets at night - it looked and felt amazing and...free, oddly enough. (I get sick of those lofts that Wicked shoots in a lot.) That threesome you liked? It was pretty to look at, but it felt very directed to me what with the cigarette smoke and all the posing between Lei and the couple (Victoria Sin and Niko). A great scene that felt real and in the moment was in "Just Between Us" - the bj scene in the bathroom between Carmen Hart and Brad Armstrong. I loved that scene, but would I recommend the movie to the OP based on his list? No. Besides a BJ scene is all about dick and the guy seems to want very little genitals. |
| Roads To Moscow Dianic Wicked Pictures,Vouyer Media, Axel Braun Productions, Marc Dorcel, JoyBear Pictures, abbywinters.com 1390 Posts 7/05 |
To be 100% clear: I said one must be "willing to dig around" to find the titles I used as examples because to my knowledge none of them are available on DVD domestically. It was a reference to ease of access, not anyone's cumulative experience... Another Hamilton movie, A Summer In St. Tropez, comes pretty close to what the OP was looking for was well. I have an ancient Thorn/EMI VHS copy of it. Thematically I think it's what the OP desires. Further, I do think there are several Wicked movies that would please the OP. All About Anna which was released domestically by Wicked might fit the bill, too. Question for the OP - Do you have a Region-Free DVD player? If so, all the Hamilton flicks I mentioned are contained in this import box set. [Image not found DB] Roads To Moscow / Twitter: @roadstomoscow |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 | First of all, Savoy: Sorry if my reply was a bit on the harsh side. To me you came across as defending the state of the industry and accusing me of searching for the impossible. I now understand that you are frustrated by the same issues as I? As for the rest of the (very interesting) discussion, I do realize that I have outlined things that when combined means I am being very picky. And it goes even further. All about Anna is actually a pretty good suggestion, but it didn't do it for me either (haven't even bothered to view it with the wife). The reason? Not glamourous enough and the people didn't turn me on. So the "list" is actually even more complex: - Good, passionate sex with chemistry. - Some setup or maybe a plot (although not too complex and "talky") - Little focus on close-ups and the mechanics. This is not the same as "no genitalia", not by a long shot. It can even contain closeups. But you know what I mean, most hardcore tend to be at least 30% pure closeup action. Once in a while is cool, but not for any major length of time. Why? We want to get turned on by seeing others being turned on. Closeups don't really convey those feelings well. - Beautiful, natural people. I like women with natural curves and most body types/colors. My wife (naturally) prefers well trained men (don't have to be muscular). - Preferably technically good; well lit, good soundtrack etc. This is however not a must. It's merely a bonus. So, yeah - I realize the above list is pretty much impossible currently, which is why I am frustrated. As for 70s porn, my (limited) experience is that in that era many movies tended to contain people who were genuinly interested in the sex. It was a lot about sexual liberation which meant that much of it was actually pretty hot. 70s early 80s stuff, for exampel danish/swedish stuff (I think Rodox fits the bill?) that is hardcore without setup still actually is very hot to me as in many of the scenes the girls actually seem to be getting off. They're really wet and the orgasms seem real. Now, I could watch that but my wife is looking for more sensualism, at least at this point. Really, it would be awesome if some producer could realize that there are probably lots of couples out there who simply want to see other people have the kind of sex they enjoy and see emotional connection leading up to the action. We're really no "vanilla" couple, so the sex can be hard/passionate and kinky - but there has to be some love there. Well acted or real chemistry, doesn't matter. But the aggressive, down-talking, closeup-y, male-focused feel of 99% what is out there simply doesn't work for her - or me. It just turns us off. Maybe we should record our own movies. :D |
| Parachuter Member 11 Posts 8/09 |
BTW - thanks to you (and everyone else) for the suggestions. I'm going to research all of them. In the meantime the game plan is still to just watch what I have been able to get hold of and let her decide what works for her and what doesn't. As she said herself, maybe it turns out that she likes things she didn't think she'd enjoy. If not, there's the FF or eject button. |
| T0MBOne Senior Member 1200 Posts 5/08 | I've also recently watched some other French films that might work for you---LES PLAISIRS FOUS, RX FOR SEX, EVENINGS OF A VOYEUR COUPLE. Good luck. T0M---T0MBOne Edited by - T0MBOne on 8/14/2009 11:30:07 AM |
| john lyons Senior Member Co-founder of Vinegar Syndrome 1188 Posts 1/08 | |
| Aplus Senior Member 1431 Posts 5/05 | |
| john lyons Senior Member Co-founder of Vinegar Syndrome 1188 Posts 1/08 | |
| oneking Member 34 Posts 9/09 | I just joined the forum, and I see the last post was a while ago, but if you're still following this, I want to share a few thoughts with you from a guy who's almost in EXACTLY the same camp as you. My wife has influenced me over the years to expect more from porn than I used to (damn her)! It's rare that she can get turned on, but from time to time, it has happened. Like you, the "magical moments" for us occur between two talented actors, who are genuinely attracted to each other, and who are attractive, themselves. Genuinely attractive, NOT OVERDONE. These have to be believable as real people. Further, the scene is treated as if we're getting a secret glimpse at their sex play, as opposed to them "performing" for us. Another key ingredient is a slow and steady build up of anticipation of what it will be like to see these two finally get together. As they get more horny, so do we. Little things go a long way like a flash of cleavage, a reveal of a garter belt as she crosses her legs, a secretary secretly eyeing her boss's package, while she holds her pen between her lips, etc. In addition, when the sex starts, the acting has to remain solid. No "sex acting." The turn on is watching a woman bend over to be fucked, because she's so damn horny, she WANTS to be fucked, and we get to watch! That's the turn-on, is it not? We don't need to see endless closeups and fancy camera angles. Just seeing attractive bodies going at it with abandon, and being able to see all parts of those bodies at once, is the payoff. And when things get going hot and heavy, we don't want loud rock music, we don't want exaggerated moans, we don't want silly dialogue, and we don't want silence, either. We want the real things that most of us say when we're having great sex. (Just as a side note, for some reason, it almost never sounds fake when a woman uses the word "shit" during sex. Watch for it, and see if you don't agree. Maybe that's why you only hear it once in a while) As for the "money shot", if everything leading up to the climax has been the way I described, I don't need to see any sperm at all, and I suspect you would agree. Although, as a personal preference, I do enjoy seeing a guy getting a post-intercourse blow-job and then cumming in the girl's mouth, who swallows. When it's clean, and obviously real, it's extremely sexy to me. Just a personal thing. So, assuming we're on the same page, let me mention a few things that have been helpful for me and my wife: Remember names of good actors and actresses (Honey Wilder, Asia Carrera, Kelly Nichols, Colleen Brennan, Tish Ambrose, Annette Haven, Marilyn Chambers, Zoe Britton, Michelle Lay, Ashlyn Gere, Jerry Butler, John Leslie, Steven St. Croix, Savanna Samson, Tom Byron, Penny Flame, Herschel Savage, Kylie Ireland, Jezabelle Bond, etc) Remember names of good directors known for plot and emphasis on couples-friendly sensuality (Paul Thomas, Veronica Hart, Bud Lee, Fred Lincoln, Jerome Tanner, Stuart Canterbury, etc) Rent one or two dvds from companies who produce full-length features (Wicked, Vivid, VCA, etc), as opposed to Gonzo. Keep an open mind about late 70's-mid 80's videos, which often approached things from the angle we're discussing. Familiarize yourself with some of the foreign titles that were mentioned, in earlier posts. Europorn is interesting, there's X and there's XXX. The XXX stuff is pretty light on plot, from what I've seen. But then there's X, which occasionally hits the bullseye, because it's basically mainstream with mainstream actors, who happen to be doing scenes with explicit sex, which they handle with just as much professionalism as the other scenes. One of the hottest things I've seen in recent years was a 70's foreign X rated film called "The Punishment of Anne" aka "The Image." My wife and I watched it together, and DAMN! This movie just keeps upping the ante, and increasing the erotic tension with each scene. The young girl who plays the lead is outstanding, and does some pretty kinky stuff, but with absolute femininity and aplomb. The director is Radley Metzger. Check it out! Also, on the foreign front, we recently enjoyed an unrated french film called "Cheeky" aka "Trasgredire". It was refreshing to see sexuality handled with such joy, and such tease, throughout. The lead is an absolute knockout from head to toe, and has sex with both men and women. Something as simple as her nudity is handled with such finesse by the director Tinto Brass, that it just takes you along for the ride, and you find yourself turned on everytime she sheds her clothes. Very erotic and fun. Foreign films seem to get the closest to what you refer to as "semi-hardcore." You see genitalia, and sometimes even oral sex and penetration, but it's still a mainstream film in its culture, so the emphasis is on the movie as a FILM, and its actors as people, who just happen to be SEXY people, especially with Tinto Brass. Plus, if you're tired of seeing bald coochies, you'll LOVE his films! One final thought. If you and your wife enjoy girl/girl sex, I recently stumbled upon a production company called Sweetheart Video. We watched a scene from their DVD "Strap-on Specialist", and my wife called it the best porn scene she ever saw hands down. This company's mission statement is to put two attractive natural women together who can act and are attracted to each other, give them a simple scenario, and let them act it out, climaxing in passionate sex with each other, and have it all happen in about 30 mins. If this scene is any indication, they accomplished that goal, PERFECTLY. A naughty 20-something seduces her boyfriend's mother, who first tries to be prim and proper, but slowly is overcome with lust, and sheepishly gives in. Even while she's spreading her legs for the young girl, she's still looking around to make sure no one's there and muttering to herself "Oh, my God..." My wife was so turned on by the realism of this scene, she couldn't even wait for it to be over. She jumped me, only 10 minutes into it! What struck me was that this scene accomplished what rarely happens. We got to see two good looking people, doing a convincing acting job, (which normally only happens in foreign or unrated indie films), but then when the sex part took place, there was no fade to black. They actually fucked, and did one HELL of a good job at it, while we masturbated and watched! No annoying closeups. Just a good overall view of the action. No annoying dialogue, no music, just passionate exclamations, dirty talk, and sweaty orgasms. So, there you go, my friend. I hope this, in some small way, alleviates the frustration, and gives you a bit of a gameplan. The magic is out there, but it's hidden. If you're willing to hang in there and look, the rewards can be quite...rewarding! Edited by - oneking on 9/1/2009 2:47:12 AM Edited by - oneking on 9/1/2009 3:00:49 AM Edited by - oneking on 9/1/2009 3:01:27 AM |
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