Some of the country is still racist. For them, there's a HUGE difference between: Maybe I should swallow my racial prejudice or ignorance because things are so screwed up in washington. The black guy there might be okay. and I want a black guy in my everyday life, at work, in my neighborhood and my local bar.
I agree that some of the country is still viscerally racist. But "more awareness of the racial implications" is not the same thing - it just means that one's comfort zone on racial matters has shrunken considerably for those who think they can get away with business as usual.
Really? I thought only Michael Steele (RNC chair) and Clarence Thomas felt that way. Perhaps you could give us some stats as to how many African-Americans feel the way you do. Just curious.>> Any black dude that votes R is a sellout? Some of us black folk think voting for either one of those ridiculous parties is obtuse. Even with the current con artist as president. Symbolic bullshit. Damn, if you're going to get political on a porno board. Can we at least acknowledge any porno guy with a brain is libertarian? I realize we don't read in this country (thus the aforementioned idiotic choices of Democrats and Republicans by a majority of the voting public), but anyone who has a problem with Lex should read Money Snot, by Lawrence C. Ross. Lex is a businessman, which is abundantly clear in the beginning, and the end of the book, which also covers dozens of other black adult performers. What no one has posted is all the black people in the business that are employed by Lex. Furthermore, he treats them extremely well. Vanessa Blue and he broke up, but she still collaborates with him, because of his loyalty, intelligence and all around business sense. Maybe working with these profitable, high maintenance white talent allow him to do other productions and employ lots of black, brown and everything in between folks. You think George Clooney and Kevin Spacey can do creative films without financing them with *sellout shit* (Take a look at Batman Forever or KPAX for instance) And does anyone think these woman wont break down eventually? They are probably holding out on IR, to get more money, which is smart. For every Vicky Vette that won't get with a brother ever, I can give you a list of women that held out, only to do IR, years after being in the business: Gina Lynn, Janine Lindenmulder, Juli Ann,Veronica Rayne, Rucca Page, Savanna Sampson......Tory Lane held out on purpose, so she could produce her IR movie. Smart. Yea, I like to see a girl do IR. But I have to admit I'm intrigued by a girl that holds out, then does it down the road. I blew off Juli Ann, and Gina Lynn until they did Lex. I lose interest (Vicki Vette,Jenna Jameson,and boring Tera Patrick) if they never do IR. But fuck it, Carmella Bing is the shit. I have to watch that woman.
It is safe to say that Vicki Vette will never get with a brother. With her,it's not about money...she is just too proud. Everytime she gets asked why she gives replies that make it obvious that she is feels she is too good for us. As for Jenna Jameson and Tera Patrick, I think it was just business decisions. I love Carmella Bing too but I was disppointed in her "Hell No" comment. I still hope Carmella does IR someday. Edited by - Nimrod on 8/29/2009 8:58:07 PM
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the unknown pervert Deactivated User
I'd like to stay but I've got a plane to catch. 3243 Posts 5/06
Posted - Aug 29 2009 : 8:59PM
Of course some of those racists take the form of not believing a black man does not act or conform to their preconceived notion of how he should act.
No, just those 2, plus Alan Keyes. Those guys are space cadets. Colin Powell is at least sane and Republican.I read that book and I do not recall Lex threading the needle between condemning Jenna Jameson and Serenity for refusing work with black men on the one hand, and then turning around and hiring women just like them. I WOULD REALLY love it if David Duke had a hot daughter who he would send to Mercenary Pictures for some on-camera work, redneck to redneck, with a Klan tattoo prominently displayed. I'm tired of Lex merely flirting with racial self-hatred for the sake of business - I want to see him gang-bang it! Embrace the madness...
threadman, I'm not sure who this first part was aimed at. I don't wanna respond if it wasn't me, but if it was, i'll post a response.and then, there's these...that's just common sense. all the positives in the world can't prove a rule, but any ONE contrary example can disprove it. it's just a variation on the man who does something racially charged then says, "but I have plenty of black friends."surely you see a difference between (not necessarily 'racist' but at least this) a racial issue and whether batman is too cheesy for anyone with talent. Unless you are implying that it takes more talent to do black guys or something, which sounds just as wrong... Edited by - wraithlead on 8/30/2009 2:15:51 AM
Wow. It's so easy for people with no financial stake in something to toss out the word "sellout". I don't think Lex is a "sellout" at all for putting a popular pornstar that people want to see and increase his sales in his movies. If Alexis (or whoever) is a hot commodity and his sales go up with her in a movie that shows that the fans want to see her and in the end he's trying to give fans what they want. I imagine he might've had certain feelings about hiring grls that wouldn't do IR but he obviously grew and got past that (as many of you need to do). Where exactly was that type of thinking getting him anyway? Would he be punishing Alexis in some way by not hiring her? Would that have taught Alexis some sort of lesson? Would Alexis have had some sort of revelation that since Lex wouldn't hire her she needed to change her game plan or change her ways? In a time when sales are down should Lex run his business based on what a few fans (who probably don't pay for their porn anyway) complain about?
Nothing says I love you so much as a tongue in the ass. 2884 Posts 1/03
Posted - Aug 30 2009 : 2:26PM
Maybe Lex had issues with Jenna and Serenity back in the day, and I can remember when Jesse Jane was making noises like she'd consent to do IR with him and he rejected the idea as a pr move that he wouldn't be part of, but time and maturity blunt the hate and give him a clearer picture of what's important. So now he chooses to dwell on the positives of the multitude of women in the industry who have no problem with fucking black men, rather than seethe with hate for those that don't. If Alexis Texas is selling her ass for Mercenary, then Lex is her pimp daddy. Try to maintain that picture in your head and he seems like so much less a sellout. I vote no.
I don't know if Lex and Vanessa Blue have collaborated in the biblical sense, but more in the way of producing video. If I recall correctly from Money Shot, they have since there break up. On another board, there is a claim that Carmella Bing is pimped (literally) by Ben English, and he has a strict no IR rule. Could be wrong, but I have a hard time believing a thick, ethnically diverse, porn star from Oregon, is inherently racist. Most of the never going to do IR women are older- the aforementioned Vette, Tabitha Stevens etc. Lex is a business guy that went to Syracuse and worked on Wall Street. I'm sure he views the talent about as personally as he did the suits up there. Always business, never personal.
Until he says, "Jenna, Serenity, all is forgiven! I no longer seethe with hate!", I vote yes. BTW, why is anyone accusing Lex of being the hater? Aren't the bigots the real haters? Or was Lex the bad guy because he didn't smile when someone thought of him as less than human? Edited by - Sheldon on 8/30/2009 3:02:06 PM
And what is the deal with Vicky Vette, anyway? She has one strong defender among progressive African-Americans in Anthony Kennerson, who claims that she only does her current husband, who happens to be white. On the other hand, her prior husband was a white-supremacist named Frank. Tough to believe that those views didn't rub off. Anyone know more - feel free to jump in.
We have been together since her break up from Lex and I can assure that she has not collaborated with him or Mercenary in anyway since then. Money Shot was released in 2007 - a year after their break up. Michael www.AdultBizLaw.com www.2257Safe.com Edited by - pornlaw on 8/30/2009 4:10:29 PM
Her husband said she is the one who was...one way or the other, it it must have rubbed off. He even sent letters to porn producers about it before he died.As for her only working with her husband, it isn't true. She has done recent scenes on her website with other porn stars like Tom Byron.
I'm certainly not one of the people accusing Steele of hate. I don't even have much of a problem with it. I happen to think it's a bit 'sellout-ish' in the academic sense, but I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. It's not like someone paid him to go to klan rallies and talk about how dumb he and his family are. That would be offensive. This, though not offensive, is still selling out. For proof of my standpoint, I give you that Vicky Vette is still in many scenes I wouldn't forget if I could. Her DP creampie in Incumming, her turn in Gangbang MILFs, and others. So maybe I'm selling out, but she does some of the best work, so I don't care. Tell you the truth, since I'm probably never going to meet her, I don't care about her preferences beyond my screen. Don't mistake my 'yes, i think it's selling out' for an opinion that something should be done about it. It's stupid and offensive on some level that isn't close enough to home for me to care. If not for the internets, I probably would never waste time thinking about race and porn. But that's why Gore invented the internets. So we could waste time talking about crap we would never even think of without them. Also, maybe we're all victims of too much information. If I wasn't a member here, I'd never know that Vicky Vette said no to IR, much like I wouldn't know anything else about the industry beyond what comes on the DVD behind-the-scenes. And when watching scorching hot sex, maybe what we don't know can't...ummm...turn us off?
You are right about the internet.Without the internet, we wouldn't know all these infos about porn stars. I've been watching porn for years and never knew there was racism behind close doors. I would have never imagined in a million years that there would be racism in a very liberal industry like porn. I used to think that certain girls didn't do IR just because there wasn't much interest from the fans or the producers. I think porn stars who refuse to work with black men need to be a little diplomatic when asked why they don't do it in interviews. A simple NO answer will be good...they don't need to make offensive comments about black men in their answers. As for Vicky she now says she won't do it because of preferences, but I find it hard to believe because she did Ron Jeremy less than 3 years ago, and that version of Ron is very fat. I think Ron lost some weight recently but in that scene he was very large.On a side note, Vicky is known to be very friendly, smart and outgoing. Edited by - Nimrod on 8/30/2009 4:59:20 PM Edited by - Nimrod on 8/30/2009 5:12:09 PM
I've always been aware that racism, much like stupidity, can exist EVERYWHERE, in every race, industry, geographic area, religion, what have you. I dunno...it makes me think of the old expression, but adding porn in. So now there are three things we might not want to see being made, sausage, legislation and porn, metaphorically though because I love behind the scenes footage. As for the racism stuff, I knew it was there, just like everywhere else, but without the T.M.I. on the internet I wouldn't be reminded of it every time I log on here. My solution is to chat in these threads when I feel like it, but put it out of my mind when I press play. lol.
I'm a liberal who loves some quality interracial porn, but I basically agree with this. It's time to move beyond this. I understand it's a business decision with Lex. I just don't want anyone telling me it's a business decision for the girl to not do black guys, because that's total bullshit.
I agree with Lex -- why should he care what his employees personal beliefs are? If they do a good job and are professional, who cares? I am white/Canadian Indian and probably would not have sex with a black girl (ok, maybe with Mariah Carey) -- because I am not attracted to them sexually, not because I think they are trash. Sorry if my dick doesn't work with people that I am not attracted to! However, if I were directing I would hire one in a hot minute if I thought she would make me money and a better product. I do pay attention to what attracts the masses -- and Lex seems to meet my criteria for hiring, so I would hire him. I would also hire Tyra Banks (the talk show host, not the porn talent one -- I don't know anything about her) or Queen Latifa because they are professional and attractive so they would make me money and a good product -- even though they don't turn me on. This is coming from a person raised in the most racist, backwater state in the Union (Michigan), so I know about racism -- I see it everyday. Edited by - mharris127 on 8/30/2009 8:32:53 PM
If Beyonce or Halle Barry were pornstars, will you refuse to work with them while getting paid? I understand you might not be willing to date them but if you were a pornstar, will you honestly refuse to work with them? Do you think that most of the women who work with black men have a preference for black men in their personal lives? I don't think so but they work with them anyway, and that is how it's supposed to be.By the way, I don't consider Mariah Carey black enough to enter this conversation.. Edited by - Nimrod on 8/30/2009 9:20:15 PM
People need to understand that doing porn is different from having sex in a dating or marriage context. How do you explain that the same women who claim they won't work with young fit black guys because they aren't attracted to them, don't have any problem working with Ron Jeremy in his 60s ? I know there might be some girls who wouln't want to work with him but they are in the minority. But when it comes to black guys, a vast majority of the top talents have a problem working with them. To refuse to work with someone in porn, you have to find him or her extremely repulsive, not just average or a little unattractive. Edited by - Nimrod on 8/30/2009 9:02:21 PM
I don't say any of this in a racist way. Unfortunately, a man has to be at least somewhat attracted to a woman (or another man, but that is not me either) to get it up. Most women feel the same way about men. Black is not sexually attractive to me, period -- and is likely the same for talent like Alexis Texas and others. I already said I would hire black women for movies if I were a director -- not because I think they are attractive but because they make $$$ and deserve a chance just like anyone else. To reference Nimrod's examples, Halle Berry is way too thin for fucking and would probably break in two if anyone tried to fuck her anyway. Beyonce has an ok body but her face is a horror show -- too hard looking (like most black women). As for Ron Jeremy, he is to women like Nina Hartley is for men -- older but attractive enough to fuck. I also like a creamy white skin tone on women, which blacks don't have by design. A woman's skin and facial features are part and parcel of what attracts me to them (along with personality, but that is less important for just fucking them) -- a black's skin is too dark and their facial structure is too hard to turn me on. Sorry, but that is the way it is, and if my dick won't work I can't fuck them. Also, it is not just blacks I won't fuck. Angelina Jolie is a good example. With her scummy, slimy appearance, too thin body and oversized, slimy looking lips I couldn't fuck her either -- she is just too butt ugly (even worse than Halle Berry). I'm not the fussiest person around, but like most I have standards. My point is that just because a woman won't fuck Lexington Steele doesn't mean she is racist. She just may not be attracted to him, period. That doesn't mean she is a card carrying member of the KKK or even that she wouldn't hire him in another capacity. Also remember that porn is best if the participants are actually having a good time. Fucking someone that is not attractive is not a good time, period!
(Quote from Ninja: @mharris127: You are not qualified to make porn casting decisions regarding black women if you are "not attracted to them sexually".) Maybe in your opinion, but I can have someone on staff that could help me in this regard or have the talent tell me who she finds attractive if necessary. Also, just because they don't turn me on doesn't mean I am not educated enough to figure out what the market wants. Example, just because Roy Karch or Bud Lee don't fuck men doesn't mean they are not qualified to cast them in their movies. Most people know enough to reasonably guess the public's opinion of attractiveness.
Lex is a businessman. In the world of business, the market dictates what type of product is sold to the buying public. If anything, Lex is showing good business acumen. If you look at the NBA as a example, certain players such as Allen Iverson were box office draws at one point. The owners probably looked at him with disdain but because he could put people in the seats, his issues were ignored and he was marketed as a drawing point for the league. As his popularity and production declined so did his profitability for team owners. He now has no team. If the likes of Alexis Texas and others who refuse to work with Lex and other black male talent were not a draw to the DVD buying public, you would not see her being used very often. Once there presence is no longer able to move DVD's off of the shelf, they will be discarded like washed up athletes, or either compelled to engage in things they did not initially want to do or feel the need to do such as IR. At the end of the day, its all about profit. In the world of porn, sometimes even IR movies with milfs and over the hill pornstars sell better than black porn. When Lex or some other black male actors cast one of these women for a scene, do you really believe it's because they are desperately attracted to them? It's that market there after.
The issue isn't that you haven't found any attractive, it's that you think you never will...but even with attraction, I'll give you that it's up to you. However, your statement that basically "I'm not racist, so most likely others aren't either" is a bit naive. As a professional, college-educated, black guy who works in corporate America, I see all types. And as a talkative guy who gets along well with others, and likes a good conversation about real topics, I can say from experience and from a few friends experiences too. One of the hardest things I've seen when dealing with race is for non-racist whites to really wrap their minds around racism. Not exactly the same, but it's at least a little similar to non-addicts trying to understand addicts. I'm an alcoholic, and the whole "why don't you just stop" question makes sense to normal people. But since they have no idea what it's like, there's nothing I can do to explain it to them. Maybe an extreme example, but you get my point. If you aren't racist, and your family didn't try raising you to be, and if you're northern like in Michigan, then there's something you won't get about the way things work for the person who has spent 30 years thinking the way do, and hearing all your friends and family reinforce that.Sorry, but if you think Michigan is the most racist state in the country, you have a LOT to learn about racism. Check mississippi, arkansas, some deep south place...or some western state where they know a LOT more about militias and don't have to deal with being so close to Detroit. I've lived in Buffalo, NY, Suburban Detroit, and now Fort Wayne, Indiana, and spent lots of time elsewhere, family in North Carolina, friends in Seattle, Atlanta, even stayed with my parents overseas for more than a month twice while they were there on business. Michigan isn't the worst I've seen. By far. When politicians who should know better send out parody songs like "Barack the magic Negro"...or when people in congress talk about finding the "great white hope"...and try to say Obama isn't American. He's, according to them, obviously african...then they obviously live in places where that's acceptable to say or else some pollster would say it, or they wouldn't get elected...what part of that sounds like your story?What does that even mean?
That said, I don't run around claiming "Racist" all day. I just enjoy a good conversation/argument, especially since none of this seems to be offensive, and people are giving thought out answers. And for all the 'get over it' people, nobody said they had to click in here...
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the unknown pervert Deactivated User
I'd like to stay but I've got a plane to catch. 3243 Posts 5/06
Posted - Aug 31 2009 : 3:10AM
Even if Lex is not performing with these women, isn't he still directing the scene? If they were the true racists you make them out to be they would never agree to be placed in a position where he could tell them what he wants them to do and how to do it. It's not like these performers couldn't have chosen to book work that day for a white director instead of Lex yet they instead chose Lex. So actually if anyone is selling out it is the performers that have agreed to work for him. Undoubtedly definite, absolute, scientific proof of racism if there ever was such a thing.
^^ Wraithlead, it is hard to describe a hard rather than a soft face. I'll try to give you an example. Compare Kimi Lixx's nice, round, pretty face with Angelina Jolie's face. Notice how Angelina's jaw bones jut out visibly and her cheeks are sunken in, some people even have cheek bones jutting out they look so bad. Belladonna is also a very extreme example of this to the point that she looks unattractive (her nasty tattoos and bad teeth don't help, either -- but she doesn't have Angelina's lips, to her benefit). A pretty woman (by most standards) doesn't have her jaw bones visibly sticking out of her face. I am picking extreme examples and people of the same race for clarity, obviously. Most black women look more like Angelina Jolie than Kimi Lixx (Halle Berry is an example).
Yeah, i thought that's what you meant. Just with the millions of black people in america alone, i don't think it's realistic to think you won't find one that has what you'd consider attractive. the jump from "i haven't yet" to "none of them are attractive" is a bit suspect.
Wanted to say something regarding Carmella Bing. I called her several months ago about getting together, and began the conversation by staing that i realize that she doesn't do black guys but asked if she would make an exception for her biggest fan who happens to be black. First, there was silence, then she asked me who the hell told me she doesn't do black guys. I told her that i read that she doesn't do interracial scenes. Carmella went on to say that was bullshit and that she just hadn't been offered the right project with the right amount of money. She said she would love to do a all out gangbang with plenty of facials and even creampies. The money would have to be right for this and it never materialized. We ended up talking for about an hour shooting the breeze and needless to say i was blown away that i was talking to my favorite porn star. Now, i'm sure you guys know that Carmella escorts, and that was actually the purpose of my call to her. We are gonna hook up in a few months and as long as i go to aim to get tested she will do me BAREBACK. Talk about a once in a lifetime experience.
Ron Jeremy was ok in the 70s and 80s but you can't tell me that all those girls who worked with Ron in the 90s and 00s find him attractive. Although I believe some women might refuse to work with black because of looks, I believe it should be a small minority. You don't think that none of these girls refuse to work with black men because they look down upon them? Why do you think some of them says it pisses off their family members? Does it piss their family off because they aren't attractive or because they don't see them as equal?
That was my point. I also think that we need to point out that almost all european (white)top porn stars don't have a problem with working with black men. Is it because they have lower standards? The top white male porn stars like Ron Jeremy, Tom Byron, Herschel, Marc Wallice, TT Boy and many others don't have any problem working with black women. Is it because white males are more likely to be attracted to black females than white females are to be attracted to black males ? I don't think so. Edited by - Nimrod on 8/31/2009 9:34:43 AM
I had the same experience but let me tell you that there is fake out there pretending to be Carmella Bing. I schedule an appointment with her and I told her to show proof it was her but she failed to do so. She finally told me she wasn't the real Carmella. After some intense research, I came across the real Carmella Bing and we chatted. If you want her contact info, just send me a personal message...the email address online isn't the real one. She used to work for those people, not anymore
(Quote from Nimrod: That was my point. I also think that we need to point out that almost all european (white)top porn stars don't have a problem with working with black men. Is it because they have lower standards? The top white male porn stars like Ron Jeremy, Tom Byron, Herschel, Marc Wallice, TT Boy and many others don't have any problem working with black women. Is it because white males are more likely to be attracted to black females than white females are to be attracted to black males ? I don't think so.) I bet lots of people have a problem with Marc Wallice -- he gave five female stars AIDS in the early 2000's because he was positive and faked test information (one of which we know right here on ADT). I'll bet he would fuck anything that would let him at this point! Also, I don't doubt that some talent is racist. As for all of them, I doubt it. Some people just don't find black men/women attractive, period -- nothing to do with thinking they are inferior or anything like that!
Bare with me a moment. let me just try to have mharris satisfy my burning curiosity about his statement "I'm not sexually attracted to black women." I've heard this sentiment a lot here. Since you make this statement in such a off-hand matter of fact manner I assume you you are sincere. I'm guessing you are a heterosexual male so you're attracted to the feminine form. If the women skin is darker than Mariah Carey's you're not attracted?. What do the black women you're not attracted to look like?. I'm not judging your personal preference. Personally it the women individually I'm attracted to, so I can't get my mind around your statement. I'm genuinely curious.
^ I've explained this once already, but I will try again. I am attracted to feminine women with soft, womanly features and creamy white skin (a few are attractive because of their flaws, usually a somewhat ruddy complexion but still feminine and relatively white). A bit of a suntan is acceptable, but don't push it, ladies. Most (98 per cent at least) black women have hard, angular faces and some have overly large breasts as well. Also, black women cannot have creamy skin by their very nature. I honestly cannot say that I have ever seen a black woman (except maybe Mariah Carey) that I am attracted to. Tyra Banks is close, but her face is still thin. Edited by - mharris127 on 8/31/2009 11:27:37 AM
For the sake of this argument, don't consider Mariah Carey black. She is much closer to white women than black women...she looks just like latino women. There is nothing black about her facial features or skin tone.
I was talking about Marc Wallice in his prime, not post AIDS. I have no doubt some people don't find blacks attractive either...but do you think that attraction is that important to porn stars? Do you think the actors/actresses that work with blacks date blacks in their personal lives? How many porn stars do you know who get turned down by women of their own race because they aren't attractive? Very few.
This "hard face" Halle Berry somehow has become recognized as one of the most beautiful women in the world and somehow has become a leading endorser of many beauty products. This leads me to believe that millions of people do not share your opinion that this "hard face" woman is unattractive. Edited by - planetj on 8/31/2009 12:43:23 PM
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jni1973 Deactivated User
81 Posts 8/09
Posted - Aug 31 2009 : 12:45PM
LMAO!!! THAT IS THE DUMBEST SHIT I'VE EVER READ. I DON'T THINK ANYONE BELIVES YOU ONE BIT.
mharris127, you are kidding right? there are some wind up merchants on here and if it's your aim to be number 1 in that department you are well on your way, some may argue that you are already there i won't put up an argument to the contrary but i must admit you have made me LMAO for a good 10 mins, thanks.
Lexington Steele @ AEBN
Posted - Aug 29 2009 : 12:41PM
