Of all the fishes in the sea, the mermaid is the one for me! 410 Posts 6/02
Posted - Nov 24 2002 : 3:28PM
_________________ Phil thee G said:
"Dislikes… TGirl/She-Male receiving oral from/penetrating a male participant" ________
Agreed. This is why I cannot get into she-male flicks. When I watch porn I almost always (99% of the time) fantasize that I'm the guy in the flick. It would be impossible in this case. The other 1% of the time that I might watch (strictly as a voyeur), I'd want the she-male to assume a strictly masculine role (i.e.-fuck a woman or receive oral from a woman).
___________________ Pontus said:
"1 - Would I have sex with a very beautiful and feminine she-male? Answer: NO. 2 - Would I have sex with that hermaphrodite that I saw on that television show? Answer: MAYBE. The reason that I might do it is that this situation would be the closest realization of the fantasy." ________
I would agree, & also add that I would consider sex with a post-op trans-sexual (one that had gotten the whole "works" replaced).
1 - Would I have sex with a very beautiful and feminine she-male? Answer: YES.
Call me a fag, call me queer, call me bi, but I like what I like, and if you don't like it, than don't watch. Perhaps this topic should be killed, because nothing more productive is occurring here, people are looking for excuses on why they might enjoy watching a she-male flick, rather than admit that might actually like it.
If you like this genre, good for you, but don't anylize what other people like, just because you may or may not understand it.
I don't like a lot of things but if I were to spend my whole time arguing my point, I would never enjoy the things that I do like.
---BIGmike, going and going and going since MCMLXXX---
Hi,I agree ... here´s my wishlist for Joey if he reads this :) Please more girl(s)/shemale(s) scenes or shemale/shemale or nefertiti/girl/shemale :). I don´t mind closeup cockworshiping and stroking scenes ... maybe the other partner (whoever it is) could do the stroking. Wouldn´t mind to see more adultstars to appear in Rogue Adventures like Kate Frost,Jessica Darlin or ?
BIGmike, your post here is very perplexing to say the least.
This is an open discussion where each person participates voluntarily. Each person is bringing to the discussion his or her own viewpoint, adding more nuance to the subject at hand. If you have grown weary with the subject, why not simply stop clicking on the thread?
In question # 1 (and # 2), I meant those literally as questions that I was posing only to myself (and not intending that other people pose those questions to themselves). (I realize now that I wasn't being grammatically correct. I should have said something like, "Questions that I am posing exclusively to myself.") However, since you DID answer Question # 1, here's my stance. If you feel differently, and would answer the question the other way, fine. I certainly wasn't judging you (you did that to yourself ). I suspect that subconsciously you were reacting to what P-Knuckle posted earlier. But my earlier posts make it clear that I disagree with P-Knucle's opinion sharply, though I do respect both him and his opinion.
Now, since you answered a question that wasn't even directed at you and answered it the way that you did, here is MY response (not a response that YOU put into MY mouth, but my OWN response). My response would be that if you chose to have sex with a she male, then that would not change your sexual orientation. In other words, if you were straight to start with, I wouldn't think that that would make you gay. This point is perfectly consistent with the views that I expressed earlier (especially when I wrote of John Stagliano). To drive home this point further, if you were straight to begin with (and I assume that you are), and had sex with a she male, I wouldn't think that that would make you any less heterosexual than myself, just because I wouldn't.
You see, BIGmike, here's what I've found about people in general (and when I say people in general, I'm NOT including you): they're EXTREMELY homophobic! I think a lot of this ties in with religion, particularly Judaism and Christianity (you know, especially the Sodom and Gomorrah account in the Old Testament). While I do have religious views like most people, I go out of my way not to be judgmental (to the extent that I'm able, anyway).
One final point, BIGmike. Rather than for you to unilaterally decide (or suggest) when a thread should be closed, why not let that occur in the ways that it usually does: either the administrators deciding to close a thread or the thread running out of steam because people voluntarily stop posting in it. This is something that I realized when I proposed in a post in that notorious Marc Wallice thread that it be closed. My suggestion was promptly overruled. Then I realized that it wasn't my place to make such a decision (or suggestion) in the first place. Ironically, the thread was locked shortly thereafter (but by that time, I was wanting the thread to stay open!).
Why is life so complicated?
Pontus
Edited by - Pontus Maximus on 11/24/2002 7:05:52 PM
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superfly skywarrior Deactivated User
England 180 Posts 6/02
Posted - Nov 24 2002 : 8:27PM
pontus is right, homophobia is very common even if it doesn't involve the hate crimes that are featured in the news. it almost as if its installed at a young age that being gay isn't just different its WRONG aswell. most of my family are homophobic, my sister once said of her son, "i don't care what my son turns out to be as long as he's not gay" she said it such a matter of fact way, it freaked me. my cousin is a lesbian and my mother can't even bring herself to say the word, she told me that my cousin "had gone funny" as if it was an illness. homophobia is as illogical as racism.
Pontus Maximus, thanks for the clarification. You bring up some good points.That's the way I understood it to be, also. I hadn't seen the hermaphrodite in question.
This thread is too long for me to read right now, so I apologize for being redundant.
I'll just add my perspective.
The more the merrier. It ain;t for me. But when I saw Kate Frost choke down 10 inches of Brazilian she-manhood in some Joey flick, while a Brazilian he-man rammed her in the ass, I thought I was gonna blow a fat load!
It's freaky. Freaky fucks with your mainframe. Having your mainframe fucked with is a fundamentally good thing in this world that is so fucked-up. You dont; have to be gay. You just have to like sex. Give me a shemale video with goodlooking shemales and at least one real female and whoever else is around, and I can find something erotic about it. DO NOT give me some poor girl rimming Mark Davis so that the view I have is of Mark Davis's bunghole. I do not need THAT. But a guy with a dick that is being sucked by a girl with a pussy is still a het enough turn-on that I won;t worry that the guy with the dick that is being sucked also has a whomping pair of hooters.
Rock the fuck fucking on! Chix w/Dix ... (see: "Clerks.") Skronker
This thread has gotten somewhat ridiculous. Early in the thread, I mentioned the fact that I was somewhat intrigued by these DVDs, although I am a very straight individual. Now I'm reading comments that make statements to the effect that I must be a latent homosexual with repressed tendencies. What kind of horseshit is this????
I like to watch lesbians get it on too - does that mean that I am a latent lesbian as well????
Get a life and stop portraying your fringe theories as if they were gospel truth. Fact is you can't understand or cope with this within your own psyche, so your answer is to attack others around you that may be able to find enjoyment here. Sorry, but I have a grip on my own sexual identity that allows me to experiment a little in fantasyland without impinging on my self-respect.
Aybesea, no, the thread hasn't gotten somewhat ridiculous, but some of the posts that have been made I disagree with as strongly as you do (as you can see from all of my earlier posts).
When addressing P-Knuckle's comments directly, I was playing the Devil's Advocate in saying something like, "the most that you could say is that someone watching she-male porn movies is exhibiting homosexual tendancies." Here's what I meant: that if a person is of P-Knuckle's mindset on this issue, the most that he/she could say logically is that a person watching she-male porn movies is exhibiting homosexual tendancies, but certainly the person couldn't deduce that the viewer was a homosexual. Do you see what I meant now, Aybesea? But I think that the whole line of reasoning is horseshit just like you do (and I've made that VERY clear in my earlier posts).
I've been on quite a few forums, Aybesea, and what I've noticed is that many people are VERY quick to judge someone as being a homosexual (not that I'm judging homosexuality or condemning it in any way). Many people have posted things like, "If two straight porn studs perform a DAP or a DPP with a porn chick, then those guys are 'gay' because their dicks are touching." Or, if straight, male porn fans are discussing a straight porn movie, if one of the fans says ANYTHING about a male performer's penis (for example, about the size, whether or not the performer can get or keep wood, etc.), then that porn fan must be gay. This kind of thinking is so widespread that it's inescapable.
Even in mainstream society, this kind of thinking is prevalent. For example, in the classic Jimi Hendrix song, Purple Haze, there is a line where Jimi says "'Scuse me while I kiss the sky." People have misheard that line and thought Hendrix said, "'Scuse me while I kiss this guy " and concluded that Hendrix was a homosexual! And look at the endless times that other famous people have been incorrectly labeled as homosexuals or lesbians.
My theory is that most people are kind of crazy in general, but especially when it comes to sexuality (and even more so when it comes to homosexuality).
It allows the latent homosexuals to have their cake and eat it too, so to speak. They can rationalize in either direction and don't have to torture themselves with guilt.
I say more power to them! God love them! The thing I used to hate was when the local stores would put the she-male stuff right next to the girl-girl. I was always finding myself attracted by some fetching "lass," only to have the jarring experience of finding a snake in the bushes.
BC, I think I've finally come up with the ultimate, definitive answer:
We're ALL either homosexuals and lesbians or latent homosexuals and lesbians.
And if anyone accuses anyone else of being one or the other, or denies that he or she him- or herself is one or the other, then you can be absolutely certain that that person is either one or the other.
Mystery solved.
As Robin Williams used to say, "Nan-noo, nan-noo."
Pontus
Edited by - Pontus Maximus on 11/26/2002 5:47:11 PM
The original topic question was 'shemales-why???' and my answer is 'shemales, why not?' But questioning why people like this type o porn I don't think is a harmful thing and anyone who takes offense to it I apoligize.
So, I decided to take a field trip to a local smut shop (smokin lingerie in scottsdale) and looked at a few she male vids. The themes in them seem to run the spectrum of sexuality. Shemales vs shemales, males vs. shemales, females vs. shemales, etc. I am going to go back on what I said prior, because I don't think you can lump enjoying she-males into a homosexual fantasty category; thus, my observations are not about shemales as a whole, rather, it is about scenes involving males and shemales. If a man in reverse cow position taking a penis in his ass from a she-male is not gay, than I don't know what is. Homosexuality is not a bad word, it shouldn't be looked down upon as such as its a beautiful and natural thing, and when people deny being it when they like dick, who is the one that is being hateful? That to me sounds repressive and scared of one's owns desires. And yes, thats my opinion again.
When I suggested latent homosexual tendencies, I was not saying that you would go out and do what you fantasize about...so, maybe your not homosexual in your lifestyle choice, but that you have homosexual fantasies. Which is healthy and quite normal. Jeez, I can think of other things that people watch on video that is 'heterosexual' in its action, and I truly hope that do not go out imitate it in real life. She-males seem kinda normal compared to some things I have seen.
If I ruffled any feathers before, again I apoligize. I was just making comments (both as a devils advocate and objectively,) to further the discussion and push it into considering the meanings behind the desire of the topic. Maybe since I don't fantasize or desire she-males sexually I shouldn't even comment on posts like this. But when topics dip into discussing masculinity and feminity (by setting standards and using judgement) I have no qualms stepping in and making the same judgements on sexuality, which I think is easier to define than obtuse notions such as what is feminine or masculine. If I'm wrong, thats ok. But at least its a more interesting topic to bring heat to than the a-typical 'vivid sucks' discussion.
which is the perfect opportunity for me to tell u all that I'm gay. BWAH AH AH !!!! Of course, it has no relation whatsoever anymore to the initial post, but what has been lately, really, so I thought come on, let's go, vodka, time to come out AH AH AH !!!
I couldn't agree more about homophobia and how prevalent it is, even among porn fans. By the same token, no one should take it as 'homophobic' merely because one doesn't care to see she-males in their porn, or is tired of all the dick-rubbing in straight porn. I find so much emphasis on DAPs, DPPs, and even DPs in straight porn a turn off, and was a little taken aback that some saw this as homophobic, because I certainly don't think I am. I even enjoy watching gay porn occasionally. I just don't wanna see it when I'm watching straight porn, because I would like to project myself into the scene.
All straight guys I know like having sex with females, and most would not want some other guy in there rubbing dicks with him when he's trying to have sex with HER. I don't think gays would appreciate females showing up in their porn, in fact they would HATE it, and isn't that the same thing?
While I wouldn't label someone who watches shemale or DAP videos just occasionally, or out of curiosity, as having homosexual tendencies, I've never known a guy who watches them regularly who didn't. I'm not saying they don't exist, or that there's anything wrong with it, I've just never met one.
But back to shemales - I dug through my old VHS tapes and found that Kelly Michaels movie I had taped. Lo and behold it turns out that it was John T Bone / Metro Production (and although no videographer is credited, could this be what Mike Quasar sometimes refers to about "paying his dues"?)
this is the kind of variety you used to see all the time on satellite. sadly, thats no longer the case. ive seen her look better, though. she seemed a little jacked up on something, and was having wood problems at times, though thankfully the cameraman didnt dwell on that too long. enjoy, kids
guess what starring kelly michaels, anabelle chong, sunshine, mark andrews, etc. a john t bone production
this is the kind of variety you used to see all the time on satellite. sadly, thats no longer the case. ive seen her look better, though. she seemed a little jacked up on something, and was having wood problems at times, though thankfully the cameraman didnt dwell on that too long. enjoy, kids
guess what starring kelly michaels, anabelle chong, sunshine, mark andrews, etc. a john t bone production
this is the kind of variety you used to see all the time on satellite. sadly, thats no longer the case. ive seen her look better, though. she seemed a little jacked up on something, and was having wood problems at times, though thankfully the cameraman didnt dwell on that too long. enjoy, kids
guess what starring kelly michaels, anabelle chong, sunshine, mark andrews, etc. a john t bone production
this is the kind of variety you used to see all the time on satellite. sadly, that's no longer the case. i've seen her look better, though. she seemed a little jacked up on something, and was having wood problems at times, though thankfully the cameraman didn't dwell on that too long. enjoy, kids
guess what starring kelly michaels, anabelle chong, sunshine, mark andrews, etc. a john t bone production
I am going to bump this because this question has been running through my head for the last day or so...Also I am curious if anyone can tell me if the sale of these movies is larger, smaller or about the same as five years ago when this thread was out?
I don't understand the appeal, but it seems many folks like it and to each their own. I just don't understand why any gay topic posted here probably gets moved to the separate special ADT "gay talk" section yet these shemale topics seem to pop up here everyday. Might as well get rid of the gay section for fairness sake. And yes I've heard the argument that sex with trannies isn't homosexual, and some even say it's straight, but still it's at best questionable.
What I just don't understand is why people who have no interest in trannies can't resist clicking on and repeating the same thing on every solitary one of the tranny threads. Is it that hard to ignore things that don't interest you?
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Clam Digger Deactivated User
Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05
Posted - Dec 26 2007 : 3:18PM
maybe someone could clear up some confusion on my part. what is the difference between a transvestite and a she-male?
I love anything different in porn that's why I love strap-on, bisexual and tranny porn. That doesn't mean I want to go have sex with a tranny I just like to watch it. I remember when I first saw a transexual porn, I was shocked that two guys were blowing each other, but now I like it and it turns me on when I watch it.
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john thomas Deactivated User
1168 Posts 6/06
Posted - Dec 26 2007 : 4:15PM
A "transvestite" is a person of one gender who sometimes (in very rare cases permanently) dresses in clothes associated with another gender. Usually it is a man who occasionally dresses in items classed as 'women's clothes' but Marlene Dietrich, for example, was considered a transvestite for sometimes appearing in men's suits at a time when trousers were not standard female attire. Because transvestism has come to be associated with male homosexuality, male heterosexual transvestites tend to prefer the term "cross-dresser". A "transsexual" is a person of one sex who has had medical intervention - usually hormone treatment, sometimes surgery - in order to have a body more like that associated with another sex so that they can live permanently, and be recognised by others in society, as a member of that other sex. Transsexuals are commonly divided into "pre-operative" and "post-operative" depending on whether they have had surgery to reconstruct their genitals (a pre-operative transsexual may still have had other operations such as breast implants). A "she-male" is a pre-operative male-to-female transsexual.
I apologize if someone thought I bumped this thread to knock it. There were not alot of Tranny threads so I wanted to bring the issue up again without everyone repeating the same objections. I am not knocking it I am curious to know the appeal. Who buys these movies the most and what are they looking or it them are the real questions I have.
It's OK. I was more irritated with the people who are always constantly bashing gays, bis and people who like trannies. It's interesting to talk about if people can keep it civil. I think it would be easy to simply label people who like trannies as gay if the only thing they could get off to was trannies or men. Most guys who like tranny porn are not exclusively attracted to trannies. Nor are most of them attracted to masculine looking men. They merely accept those trannies as women. Transgender people feel that they were born the wrong sex. That's not necessarily the case for gay men. Most gay men like men but they don't wish to look or act like a woman. They like men and they're comfortable in their own male body. Most men who are attracted to trannies are attracted to women as well. Most of them are not equally attracted to masculine males. It isn't necessarily a gay thing. From Wikipedia -Considering that many trangender people don't consider themselves to be male at all, I find it laughinble that people want to call people who like trannies gay as a matter of fact. The reason so many trannies keep their dicks is because, well, without them, they'd have a pretty tough time enjoying sex. They make that compromise. If you look at most of them, everything else is 100% feminine. That's because that's the way they want to look and the way they want to live. They are generally plagued with the underlying feeling that they should have been born female for most of their lives until they finally give in. (generally) Guys who like trannies accept them as women It's important to make a distinction between that and being gay. Not because there's anything wrong with either of them. But simply because they are two different things. A lot of people don't appreciate being labeled in the first place. But if we have to label someone, slapping the wrong label on them can only antagonize them. There are obviously areas where all of these themes sometimes overlap (which causes even more confusion). Most gay men are happy in their own (male) bodies. Hair, muscles, personality. all of it. Some might point out that the stereotypical effeminate accent is prevalent among gays but I think that might have more to do with it just being a stereotype and gays (knowing that) using it as a way to communicate their gayness to other gays (as well as straights) than a desire to appear feminine. I've met my fair share of gay guys and my fair share of bi guys. I've never met a bi guy with that stereotypical gay accent. And I've met a few openly gay guys who didn't have it either. Gay (And bi) men, generally, don't have any desire to be women. Or if there is a little bit of it there, it doesn't override their contentment with being male. In fact, many gay men aren't attracted to trannies in the slightest. Some of them don't even claim transgenders as part of the gay community. Edited by - randomprecision on 12/27/2007 12:58:53 AM
The same reason why lesbian porn is not in the gay forum: It's what many heterosexual men like too watch and because most gay men don't like shemale porn in the first place. How hard is not to click on the topics that don't have your interest? Edited by - lange on 12/27/2007 5:07:59 AM
Some people get turned on by shemales, some people don't, some people even resent the idea of shemales, I guess there are also some men who exaggerate with their shemale porn refusal to the point that they reveal a deep case of homophobia and remind me of men who secretly swallow Viagra but then say I would never need it even when anonymous on Internet forums which is quite strange. I personally like shemales, but as anything else, there's always a thin line between the shemale who can turn me on like a hot woman would, and the shemale who would disgust me. Trust me, some shemales are hotter, sexier, more beautiful, and more feminine than many women. On the other hand, and I do not want to get into names because I don't want to offend people, some shemales are nothing more than a sleasy dude with some make up and some implants.
Where did I say I didn't have interest in the topic? You are jumping to conclusions. Perhaps you should look at the topic. And just because straight men watch it doesn't make it straight porn. Straight men watch gay and bi porn as well. If anything, all I was saying is there might as well not even be a gay forum since the classifications are as hazy as they are.
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spiderphil Deactivated User
34 Posts 12/07
Posted - Dec 27 2007 : 7:37AM
for me it was always a curiosity thing, come on guys when we are alone in the adult section of a video store you usually turn over the dvd box of the weirder stuff ex fat, granny, or shemale. but when you are with your friends you usually play it straight and look at the normal ones. i watch tranny porn but i don't think its gay
To illmatic: Sorry it was just because you were so eager to move these kind of topics to the gay forum where I don't think they belong. I believe must guys watching shemale movies are straight and some are bi. I don't think shemale movies are 100% straight but I know that I'm 100% straight even though I like some shemale movies now and then. As I said before I think placing shemale topics in the gay forum would be wrong because most gay men don't like shemales they would prefer a real guy not someone wishing to be a female. Edited by - lange on 12/27/2007 7:44:07 AM
I failed to read the entire thread, but I remain convinced that trannys fall squarely on the middle ground. Granted, they definitely skirt along the homo/hetero DMZ, but half of those skirts these days are undeniably appealing from an entirely hetero POVI think thats one way of looking at it, and to be honest with oneself, you need to look at both sides objectively, lest you wake up one day from a suppressed state of denial, with a dick in your ass. Personally, it wasn't until groundbreaking results from female hormone injections became overwhelmingly evident in todays tranny, that I finally began to take notice. So you could also say, its the strong attraction to the female qualities, that induces interest. With tranny's it takes a lithe stature, a feminine persona, dainty fingers, and a soft feminine face to work. If any of those denote male, it fails to sell. Basically, its a dick on a chick to be accurate.
So, the way my rationale figures it, a scorching hottie, with long, tan, supple legs, who's 95% female and 5% dick, formulates as the hetero side of the ground zero equation. While dudes with long hair, broad shoulders, a hairy ass, who also happen to sport the 9" wood, will therefore represent the definitive gay side of the .05 hetero/homo DMZ. Edited by - Endless Loop on 12/27/2007 8:01:41 AM
I only watch shemale porn where the shemale is on the receiving end. I don't like it when the shemale does the guy also. And I only like shemales who are very feminine looking. But most movies don't live up to these criterias. Plus most shemale movies have low production values and are not worth watching.
I like shemale porn but I wish bi porn could get as popular as shemale porn. I don't see a difference between the two and at least in bi porn you have a beautiful women in the mix. I guess what I'm saying is I'm jealous that shemale porn is getting all this attention over bi porn.
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john thomas Deactivated User
1168 Posts 6/06
Posted - Dec 30 2007 : 11:49AM
Let us try and answer the queries phatbasey bumped this thread to raise before the New Year. Though my thoughts here are only partially worked out so perhaps this response should be considered more a preliminary sketch for what an answer might look like. To begin, BustdownGal has elsewhere made the useful suggestion that we can categorise men who watch porn as "pornographically straight" (if they buy/rent exclusively M/F and F/F porn and variations thereon), "pornographically gay" (if they view M/M porn only) and "pornographically bi" (if they mix and match). Useful because it dispenses with the messy question of how people identify their own sexuality in favour of the empirical facts of what they actually view. Shemale porn, it transpires, is viewed overwhelmingly by men who are (otherwise) pornographically straight and remain so, rarely by men who are pornographically bi and never by men who are pornographically gay. Given these empirical facts, I think we must reject the idea that shemale porn is the province of closeted and self-deceiving homosexuals/bisexuals (if that were so we would surely see far more of an overspill and a movement from shemale to gay porn which is not there), accept that the enjoyment of shemale porn lies more within the range of heterosexual desire than anywhere else, and accept the self-assessment of most fans of the genre that they are perfectly heterosexual men, even if other heterosexual men find that notion uncomfortable to process. So, shemale porn is watched by heterosexual males. However, I do not think any heterosexual male will turn to shemale porn the moment he comes to porn. Rather the taste for shemale porn is something developed after the experience of more conventional porn, possibly, indeed, only when one has become jaded to conventional porn. Either viewers are finding in shemale porn some reinvigorated form of the delight that once they found in mainstream porn but to which they have become desensitised there over time or they find in shemale porn a substantially different delight but one for which they could only acquire a taste through exposure to more mainstream porn. Thus the pleasure people take in shemale porn is either a stronger or a variant version of the pleasure people take in any porn. Whichever it is, it seems to me that the question of what is the appeal of shemale porn is only a particularised form of the broader question of what is the appeal of porn in general. So let us turn to that broader question. It is a big question. After all, people enjoy porn in different ways: for some it is the pleasure of fantasy, they insert themselves in the scene; for others it is a voyeuristic pleasure, they enjoy the spectacle or take vicarious pleasure in the perceived pleasure of the performer; for yet others porn is only a jumping off point for the pleasures of their own fantasies or sexual activities - and that is only to scratch the surface. There are probably at least as many ways of watching porn as there are people watching it. Can we really bring them all under one umbrella? I believe we can. What I want to argue here is that what we all enjoy watching in porn is not the sex but the performance of sex, the playacting of it. Aristotle says (roughly) that a drama works by presenting actions in a form that provokes emotions in an audient but, being already complete, does not permit that audient any route to act upon those emotions, instead those emotions, provoked but without an outlet, can then be regarded with a dispassion that in the ordinary course of events is not possible. This reflexive experience of ordinary emotions, this reveling in the pure experience of emotion, allows us to better understand such emotions and our responses to them and, because in Aristotle's system it is pleasurable to learn new things, it is pleasurable to watch the performance of a drama. From a Darwinian perspective the idea that it is pleasurable to learn makes perfect sense: an animal able to learn new things will have a survival advantage over one that follows blind instinct; an animal that enjoys learning and seeks out new knowledge will have a survival advantage over one that can learn but gets no reward for doing so. So whether it is the deep contemplation of the most rarefied art or the pleasantly numbing embrace of the most mindless entertainment, all alike work by provoking emotions that can then be held with a certain inquisitional detachment. The difference is only that entertainment provokes only easy emotions and permits pat, unindividualised answers to the questions we might be prompted ask ourselves about them, while art provokes the more profound emotions - even the darker emotions that we might prefer to pretend we did not have - and demands that we make our own path and find our own answers to the troubling questions such emotions pose. Popular entertainment fools our minds that we are learning or relearning something while art proper really does allow at least the possibility of learning something genuinely new about ourselves and the world. Porn falls on the side of entertainment. Let us particularise this model of an Aristotelean-Darwinian aesthetic for the case of porn. The performance of sex in porn works like any other dramatic performance: it provokes emotions that can then be experienced in a reflexive way. We are all sometimes conscious of sex as performance: we do something not because we think it will be pleasurable for us or our partner but because it seems appropriate to the part we are playing. Porn reminds us that sex is always a performance whether we are conscious of the fact or not. Porn does this most effectively by giving us sex in a highly simplified form. While sex is mostly about people and the emotional relation between them, porn is mostly about genitals and the rude mechanics of sex. The women are commonly in their reproductive prime, well-built (if not by God then man), prettier than average, well-groomed, need little stimulation, and joyously submit themselves to the demands of their partner(s). They are fuck dolls, not women. The men are commonly well-endowed, always ready to perform, and can last indefinitely until required to cum, which they then do in massive volumes. Less men, more permanently erect cocks with legs. This reduction of sex to its basics allows our minds to regard our responses to sex in a comparatively uncomplicated way and thus to believe that we are better understanding ourselves. Thus the centres in out brain wired by evolution to reward us with an experience of pleasure when we have learnt something are stimulated. In short, what is most enjoyable in porn is exactly the same as what is most execrable about it: sex without the inconstant human factor. Ultimately the appeal of porn wanes. Sex is always interesting because people are constantly variable - but porn is less about people, more about genitals and genitals are comparatively unvariable. Eventually all porn looks the same. It all looks the same because it is all the same. There are ways out of this. One is to turn to porn that brings the human factor back in. Toy-free lesbian porn almost has to be more about the interactions of individuals and less the interaction of genitals so Abby Winters and the like score well for human-centred porn. There is Tony Comstock, of course. There are features where the sex is placed within a context of a story and character to give the impression (or perhaps the illusion) of a human factor. I would also suggest that, oddly, porn centred round the degradation of women (or men) is, much less admirably, doing the same thing, bringing a human factor back into porn: when a performer in that genre is shown distressed or in pain the viewer is at least assured that they are a human being with feelings, not a performer going through the motions. Another way out is to turn to porn where the performance has taken over completely: circus act porn, bizarre penetrations and unconventional performers. And then there is shemale porn. Shemale porn take porn to the next level: beyond the distilled performance of sex to the distilled performance of gender. (M/F strap-on porn does the same thing in a milder way.) In shemale porn the normal categories of male/female, penetrator/penetrated, sexual aggressor/recipient, etc are all up for grabs. All gender is performance. In shemale porn this fact is dramatised in the most radical way. We enjoy this performance of gender roles for much the same reasons given above for why we enjoy the performance of sex in more mainstream porn but new vistas are opened not available to mainstream porn. Thus shemale porn can reinvigorate one's experience of porn but is only really comprehensible if one comes to it through conventional porn. So shemale porn presents a schematised performance of gender in sex, provoking emotions in the viewer which the mind can then reflect upon dispassionately, enjoying for their own sake as a pure experience of emotion and coming to a deeper understanding of them, which, being hardwired by evolution to find learning things about the world and ourselves pleasurable, we find pleasurable. Some people - perhaps too ideologically committed to standard gender categories as 'natural' or too little exposed to porn to have learned the appropriate ways of enjoying the emotions provoked, perhaps for other reasons - cannot muster the necessary partial detachment and can only react with revulsion. Note, this also explains why so many of those who dislike shemale porn feel compelled to announce the fact and come on to dedicated threads solely to decry the genre: unable to enjoy the provoked emotions with the necessary detachment they are forced instead to act upon those emotions in expressions of their disgust. QED
