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| WhiteBOY Member  305 Posts 11/06 |  Posted - Jul 15 2008 : 10:08PMI have watched "Kelly's lost movie" from Evil Angel today, directed and starring mr Siffredi. I have many many of his films, and I am NOT easily shocked. However, I saw something that I can't get out of my head. In ths "Bonus footage", there is a scene, might be slightly bondage themed, where Rocco is DESTROYING Kelly totally. I have never seen better/worse merciless powerfucking, anytime, period! It is very emotional and violent, and Rocco, spits, slaps, destroys her ass (the usual), but wait there is more. Very abusive hitting! Yes, it's beyond slapping, and tears are running, and at one point brave Kelly stops and hits his dick and claims that he must have broken her nose!!! "Did you brake my nose"?, she asks several times. Rocco is just pushing her saying something like "Do not play with me, or do not challenge me, quit this game" or something. Very very disturbing I thought. It is 30 minutes of merciless and violent shock-porn. I used to be shocked of Max Hardcore and Dirty Harry, but they are Teletubbies compared to the Italian stallion (Not Stallone!). For hours later, this scene lingers in my memory... What a burst of violent fucking! [Link] |
| elgringoviejo58 Senior Member 1460 Posts 1/07 | Posted - Jul 15 2008 : 10:48PM [Link] |
BlackSix  All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07 | Posted - Jul 15 2008 : 11:33PM [Link] |
| Flash Golden Age Classic 11018 Posts 5/01 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 1:16AM [Link] |
| conquistador Deactivated User Hellhamster. 2947 Posts 10/03 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 1:17AM [Link] |
| TomChoad Member I Likes Ya 685 Posts 1/08 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 8:58AM [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 9:32AM [Link] |
| WhiteBOY Member 305 Posts 11/06 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 10:05AM [Link] |
| BigBobxxx Senior Member 2681 Posts 5/04 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 10:34AM Are there that many viewers that get-off on this sort of thing? Am I to gather that people are fantasizing about beating-up their sexual partners? I kind of understand B&SM role-playing, although it is not my thing. But, beating-up on people with the intention of causing pain escapes me. [Link] |
| WhiteBOY Member 305 Posts 11/06 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 10:40AM [Link] |
| hollywood woody Senior Member Death is caused by swallowing small amounts of saliva over a long period of time. George Carlin 1567 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 11:52AM [Link] |
| BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 1:32PM [Link] |
| Eli Cross Member What's the fun of getting old if you can't be dirty? 141 Posts 4/06 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 2:56PM I haven't seen the scene in question so I can't comment specifically, but I always felt like Kelly was the only girl who ever gave as good as she got in Rocco's stuff. Certainly she knew what she was getting into. [Link] |
| skronker Notable Legendary Icon Scopophiliac 9780 Posts 9/02 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 3:05PM [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 5:15PM Suffice it to say, there are people (men and women) who get it. And they often find one another. Which is exactly what happens when you see a scene with Rocco and Kelly. There is something dark and borderline disturbing about it. And that's what makes it compelling. It's the dark, visceral side of human sexuality. I think, perhaps, that's the sort of thing Max was trying to tap into but Max just wasn't as tactful or skillful about it as Rocco. And plus, Max isn't a handsome man with a suave accent and a particular charm. Another difference is Rocco has a sense of humor. Max's porn is (and always has been) humorless with a real mean streak running through it. I never got the sense that Rocco doesn't like women. Rocco's dark side has backfired on him a few times but it worked for him far more often than it backfired. Edited by - randomprecision on 7/16/2008 5:16:37 PM [Link] |
| sam46 Deactivated User 564 Posts 1/07 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 5:45PM RP- what does a creampie feel like? [Link] |
| Clam Digger Deactivated User Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 6:00PM [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 6:17PM [Link] |
| Clam Digger Deactivated User Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 6:25PM [Link] |
| tricia_devereaux Evil Angel DVD Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 6:41PM A good portion of the time, she told Rocco she wished he didn't even pay her because she didn't think of it as work. [Link] |
| burningdownthehouse Member 93 Posts 5/08 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 7:02PM http://www.rogreviews.com/reviews/read_review.asp?sku=1271 Yeah, nobody was actually harmed in the making of it, but it was listed on the Extreme Associates obscenity trial. It really worries me that people get off to stuff like that... [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 7:45PM [Link] |
| Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07 | Posted - Jul 16 2008 : 9:24PM To me the entertaining thing about Kelly is seeing how nonchalant (and sometimes playful) she is about letting guys do all those things to her. [Link] |
| burningdownthehouse Member 93 Posts 5/08 | Posted - Jul 17 2008 : 1:21AM [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Jul 17 2008 : 1:23AM [Link] |
| burningdownthehouse Member 93 Posts 5/08 | Posted - Jul 17 2008 : 1:25AM [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Jul 17 2008 : 3:28AM If you really want to talk about it - I'll tell you why it doesn't really worry me even if people are getting off to things like Forced Entry (I think that was the title). First of all, it's because I believe that people who watch are just voyeurs, not doers. They just like to watch. And I think there are two main types of people in this group. The first type is the kind of person who will watch just about anything he or she is legally allowed to view just because. The second type is the kind of person who looks for the shock value in everything. And these kinds of people are everywhere. Every time you see an accident on the road and you see all those rubberneckers slowing down to look at the carnage, you're seeing these people. Nobody will admit it was them but it has to be somebody, doesn't it? These are the same type of people who go to see the blood and guts horror flicks just so they can be shocked and disgusted. Of course, there's considerably less shame in this than there is watching (and enjoying) a porn flick like Forced Entry. Right? It's OK to be titillated by blood and guts as long as nobody gets fucked in the process. These people make shock porn and that is the whole attraction. People who want to be shocked. It doesn't necessarily mean they're a serial killer or rapist in the making. I don't make any assumptions about people based upon what they like to watch because I could be way off base. And like I said, if they were interested in doing anything besides watching, they probably wouldn't be interested in fiction anyway. [Link] |
| tricia_devereaux Evil Angel DVD Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00 | Posted - Jul 17 2008 : 5:36PM In a movie like Forced Entry, I AM disturbed thinking that there are people out there who are sexually aroused by seeing a girl look like she is very not into what is going on. And I'll actually agree with something that was said in the Max thread - in porn, if the girl really isn't into it, it's not special effects that are being done to her in post. If she's eating vomit and upset about it, she's actually eating vomit and upset about it. There IS such a thing as roleplay, and I'm OK with that. But what type of guy gets his dick hard by watching a chick being physically forced to do something that she doesn't want to be doing? [Link] |
| elgringoviejo58 Senior Member 1460 Posts 1/07 | Posted - Jul 17 2008 : 5:54PM [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Jul 17 2008 : 6:40PM I did watch some of the Frontline documentary that I think was made during the making of the Forced Entry flick. I don't know. I guess I would have a problem with it being made if the girls aren't OK with it. But we just keep coming back to one question. If they aren't OK with it, why are they doing it? We're going to have serious problems in this country if we start going down the path of saying that because the average person wouldn't be OK with it or the person doesn't appear to be enjoying it, then that must be the case. We already have a problem where it seems like a director has to ask (audibly) every few minutes if she's OK and ask her to confirm she's loving every second of it. I don't know if that's the reason why it's done or not but it seems that way. The only assumption a viewer can make is that everything has been arranged and discussed and negotiated ahead of time. I couldn't look at any mainstream Hollywood movie and tell you everyone involved was fine with everything they were asked to do. This becomes a serious problem with features because there's generally a plot and the participants are expected to stay in character. I mean, if the plot involves a bank robbery, how are we to know it isn't real? We assume it isn't. We assume the clerk is just an actor and he's only pretending to be frightened. If someone is shot, we assume they're only pretending to be dead. We have no choice but to make those assumptions because it's supposed to be fiction. If we see people wallowing and fighting in the mud in a movie, of course the mud is real and they might even get a few scrapes and bumps and bruises. And they may not enjoy getting all dirty and so forth. But we assume they agreed to do it. Fiction is all about suspension of disbelief. That is, you become engrossed in the plot and you willingly "forget" you're not seeing reality. Obviously, you can't make a porn movie where people fuck showing obvious penetration and cum shots without it being real to a degree. But again, whatever is real about it, the average person assumes it has been arranged and agreed upon. If it hasn't, we can't know that. Obviously, some people assume the opposite. What is the reality? And is that true in every case? I would hope that even if it does occasionally happen that we have performers being subjected to real non consensual acts that it's the exception rather than the rule. If you watch the movie The Accused with Jodie Foster (I think), the rape scene looks totally real. She doesn't look pleased. How do we know there weren't people who got off to that movie? I mean, I don't really agree with movies like Forced Entry because I think it will only piss anti porners off more and I have no idea why anyone would want to do that. At least deliberately. But as far as what kind of person would enjoy it? Like I said, I think those people will be out there whether these movies are made or not. A certain number of rapes and sexual assaults happen and always have. I think if someone is going to rape someone, they're going to do it one way or another. If the people who watch it are just voyeurs, I just don't make those judgments. We could go beyond porn and wonder what kind of person likes to watch or read about morbid news stories. What are they thinking? Why are news stories that feature graphic descriptions of violent events so popular relative to everything else? Why is there this strange cult that builds up around serial killers? Seriously. I've talked to people who knew everything there was to know about Jeffry Dahmer or Ted Bundy. That's a bit more than simple curiosity, isn't it? And yet they were pretty normal people. As far as I know, they didn't have bodies buried in their basements. We live in a world where serial killers have fan clubs. Are there some sociopathic personality types within these groups? Undoubtedly. Are they all dangerous? I just don't think it's possible to make that kind of blanket assumption. Because I just don't know. I've read the rationale for different types of fetishes and sexual interests written by different people and frankly, some of them just seem so bizarre, I can't get my head around it. Heaven only knows why this thing or that thing turns a given individual on. So I would say you can blame Extreme for making such a movie but it's impossible to pick out a random person who might watch it and try and figure out why. For that matter, I have no idea why they wanted to make it. My best guess was for the shock value. [Link] |
| Trilisser Member 19 Posts 4/08 | Posted - Oct 5 2008 : 12:40PM It would rationalize these discussions if some moralizers really learned about those practices that can be very rough, like hanging women by their breasts. One female submissive mentioned that she once was caned so hard that the cane broke, yet her enjoyment was beyond description. [Link] |
| ToneBone Member 176 Posts 8/07 | Posted - Oct 5 2008 : 1:41PM Look, I'll make it real simple. I watch porn to get off; not to feel like shit. A girl getting repeatedly slapped in the face while she's fighting back tears is NOT sex by ANY definition, no matter how much spin some demented pseudo-intellectual on the internet tries to put on it. If you think this is the "dark" side of human sexuality, guess what, child rape is a dark side of human sexuality too. So is necrophilia, so is beastiality. Doesn't make it ok or rationalize it one iota. As a fan of rough, mutually enjoyed sex, it pisses me off that so many morons who attempt to make this kind of film can't tell the difference between intense fucking and physical abuse. Don't come back at me with the same old "she signed the papers" or whatever recycled bullshit you usually come up with. You're filming a girl get physically beaten as tears are welling up in her eyes and in some cases is openly crying. The universal facial expression of distress is unmistakable. If these girls are that good at "acting" they're in the wrong business, and even in the unlikely event that they are acting, the disgusting nature of what you're filming still remains. Again, I reiterate, I LIKE rough sex. I engage in it in real life. But I've never made a girl cry or used her as a punching bag under the guise of sex. If you think that is erotic or even ok, get a fucking clue. And while you're at it, GET SOME HELP. [Link] |
| Ramsey Senior Member Trina Michaels fan 10332 Posts 10/02 | Posted - Oct 5 2008 : 2:19PM [Link] |
| LubeNLuv Senior Member 1854 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Oct 5 2008 : 2:43PM So why not show this in porn? Because the underlying deep trust and caring that MUST be in place for true power exchange can't be faked. You can go through the actions of course...bondage, rough sex, leaving marks on the submissives skin, forced orgasms, etc. But it's JUST a performance and unless the couple are both very much into the role-playing aspect it almost always comes across as cruelty and just "harsh" sex. There are some scenes I've watched at Kink.com where the performers are very much into D and s roles, even if not necessarily as partners with one another, and they pull it off so that it looks realistic and hot. And then there are scenes (the majority) where the women aren't truly submissive and the men aren't really Dominant but just playing that way and it shows. The women don't look as if the pain is a turnon for them. With someone who really IS into it, and not just for the paycheck, it takes on a transcendence that's very hard to put into words. It's a "haze" where pain and pleasure are almost indistinguishable and she truly starts to "egg on" her Dominant to bring her more of both. That's why it's called "power exchange" in real life....you willingly put your entire trust into anothers' hands with the expectation that they will use that trust to bring you to levels of excruciating pleasure. In porn, about the only thing that's really exchanged (except in rare instances) is money for performance. The only way I can explain it is to be a male who is about to cum but you repeatedly bear down past that point of about to burst and continue to fuck....it's painful, but it's an "excruciatingly pleasurable" type of sensation. For some women, getting slapped has the same sensation. The slap itself isn't pleasureable...she wouldn't want you to walk up to her in the kitchen while pouring herself a glass of milk and belt her across the face. But within the context of having sex, it takes on a whole new dimension and is therefore "welcomed." Again, very hard to explain...you either get it or you don't. But porn is such a shallow medium. It can show the act of sexual intercourse but rarely portrays the intensity of emotion that goes with same. I really think porn BDSM suffers even more...it shows the pain to a broad audience who really can't comprehend the sensations that go along with same. So many viewers just shake their heads and say "OMG, she's getting abused, that's not sexy." Then again...there's a shitload of viewers who think suprise butt sex is the norm on a first date also. [Link] |
| killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08 | Posted - Oct 5 2008 : 2:55PM I think my problem with the whole "rough sex/bdsm in porn" thing is that if porn is to be believed, virtually every woman in the biz gets off on being treated cruelly, and almost no men do. If there were just as many men holding back the tears because they're getting the shit kicked out of them by the girls as there is the other way around, I'd be fine with it all. Truly, I would. I wouldn't watch those flicks because it's not my thing; but none of my spidey-senses would feel funny about the fact that those flicks exist. Instead, no matter how many times I try to rationalize it in my head as "this is a kink I don't understand, but that's ok", it just feels like a male-dominated medium where males are calling the shots. And like any other male-dominated, male-controlled medium or industry or vocation or whatever, it just seems like plain old sexism. No kinks, no experimentation, no exploration of sexuality; just dudes getting off on the fact that they have power over chicks. [Link] |
| LubeNLuv Senior Member 1854 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Oct 5 2008 : 3:58PM And I think that is the point. The stereotype in our society is that "beating" a woman is wrong and therefore has shock value when portrayed at all. However, a woman beating a man is "kink" and the guy must be into it to submit to it, right? Sot it's not really "beating" him at all...it's just rough sex. It's those stereotypes that make "rough sex" actually "rough" for some. Not the scene itself. That's just the calling card. But since so many porn fans relate to the women as "innocent females" and not as porn performers, they automatically view rough sex scenes as being "over the line," not because it really is but because it challenges their stereotypical views of "right" versus "wrong" ways to treat a woman during sex. It's pure sexism. Inflicting pain on a woman in a porn shoot becomes a real "issue" on this board and others because it's viewed as abuse, she must not have liked it, she was in pain, she "clearly" was afraid for her life, etc etc etc. If a guy is in a D/s scene as the sub, you don't hear this kind of outrage at all. He's just getting his freak on. I think that many viewers are too sexist to actually believe that a woman would willingly submit herself to physical pain as a means of getting off. It's just too big a shock to their way of thinking. Many men may WANT a submissive woman, some want a very dominant (even Dominant with a capital D) woman or at least one who is aggressive in bed. But to actually a see a woman who goes far left with her submission is just unacceptable to that stereotype we all hold no matter how high a road we may want to say we take. It challenges our way of thinking just too much to accept as possible. Mind you, I am not in favor of beating a woman. Not outside the bedroom without her consent (and willful desire) at least. So no flaming bags of dog poo on my porch, please. I'm merely commenting on the shock and sometimes outrage often voiced over rough sex scenes. It never ceases to surprise me. Maybe I'm too far into kink to recognize normative sexual deviancy (is that an oxymoron?). Attaching a clit clamp with weights to my wife is erotic to me and flogging her hard enough to leave marks has her literally orgasming and begging me to fuck her. But I'd NEVER consider endangering her by moving my cock from her ass directly to her mouth or pussy without a cleanup first or forcing anal without the right prep. Vive la difference! Edited by - lubenluv on 10/5/2008 4:02:59 PM [Link] |
| killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08 | Posted - Oct 5 2008 : 8:00PM What I'm asking is, does what you say above address the fact that there is so much beating of women in mainstream porn, and so little beating of men, and make a conclusion as to why that is? I admit that I'm in over my head here, so I don't understand all of this; but I'd like to. I get the idea that it can be sexism to assume that women can't enjoy being the submissive. What I'm wondering is why we don't see men being the submissive just as often. I think you provide an explanation for that in saying that it doesn't seem as "risqué", or shocking, for a man to be submissive to a woman, and that's why you don't see it as often. Am I interpreting your point correctly? [Link] |
| ToneBone Member 176 Posts 8/07 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 2:51AM Having said that, I largely agree with your first post. It ties in to what Ramsey brought up about Rocco being looked upon differently than Max or Khan Tusion. The acts performed may be similar, but the chemistry between the partners gives it an entirely different nature. Most women who work with Rocco seem to be attracted to him. The sex appears to be mutually enjoyed. The rough play in this context stems from lust, whereas with the likes of Brandon Iron or Max it's more like calculated abuse mainly because the girls don't have the same sexual chemistry with these men. In the absense of arousal, the girl's reaction to being roughed up is the same as it would be in any non-sexual context: discomfort and distress to the point of breaking down. And there is absolutely nothing sexy about that. Edited by - tonebone on 10/6/2008 3:03:08 AM Edited by - tonebone on 10/6/2008 3:06:08 AM [Link] |
| Brandon Iron BrandonIron.com 3832 Posts 3/02 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 3:38AM [Link] |
| ToneBone Member 176 Posts 8/07 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 4:07AM And for the record, you're not talking to a bunch of sheltered, sexually naive puritans here. So please, enough with the rationalizations and street corner philosophy. I practice rough sex; everything from spanking and hair pulling to choking and slapping. There have been girls who made me spank them so hard I had to stop because my hands were hurting. But I've never- not once -made a girl cry or continued to do something to her while she was clearly shaken up. The problem is this industry is filled with bully-wannabe's like yourself who mistake abuse with domination. You're not really a Dom, so you think to impersonate one you have to beat the shit out of a girl for 30 minutes. Way to go buddy. You're a regular Alpha Male! But hey, it's all relative right? Perfect bullies, pushing limits and all that good stuff.:) Whatever helps you sleep at night bro. [Link] |
| Brandon Iron BrandonIron.com 3832 Posts 3/02 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 5:14AM If your assessment is right then kink.com is wrong....fuckedandbound.com is wrong....Jake Malone is wrong...Joey Silvera is wrong....I can go on and on but as a seasoned practitioner of rough sex, I am sure you are familiar with some of their work. [Link] |
| miracle2k New Member 2 Posts 10/08 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 9:55AM [Link] |
| RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 10:44AM If I came crawling to your door and told you they were bein' real mean to me and asked for your help, that would be a different story. I'm going to venture a wild guess that none of them ever asked you for help. But hey. Since you're such a humanitarian - such a CHAMP, you could send them money so they don't "have to" star in porn flicks  Which says more about what you think of porn and the people who make porn than it does about anything else. If that's really what you think of them, don't watch it. If you think women are so goddamned stupid they can't give informed consent, you sound more like a sexist pig than any of the guys who make "abusive" porn just for the bucks. I don't think half of them really get into it. I applaud the ones who do. Not because I personally think it's a neat fetish but because at least they enjoy what they do. In the mainstream (The porn you wouldn't call abusive or disturbing), how many women do you think really get off on what they're doing? They may be OK with it but do they really like it? I would be willing to bet most of the women who seem to go out of their way to be featured in "dark" porn do so because they really get off on it.So don't watch it, don't think about it and don't read about it and then you won't be disgusted and we'll all be happy. You'll be happy because you'll be blissfully ignorant of the fact that there are people who have sexual interests, fantasies and fetishes that don't meld very well with your superior sensibilities and I'll be happy because you aren't constantly grumbling about the fact that you're aware of it.Do you believe you're qualified to judge whether or not someone "needs help"? I could be wrong and maybe you are. Maybe you have a degree. But my guess is that you know even less about mental health than you (apparently) do about kink. And the fact that you can't even use your judgment to refrain from exposing yourself to things that upset you and make you feel sowwy for people who you don't even know and who, indeed, may enjoy what they're doing speaks volumes about your judgment. I think you don't have a clue what you're talking about and you make these silly posts because it makes you feel like a good person. What are you overcompensating for? You want to make accusations? How's that one fit? [Link] |
| Long Noel Member 245 Posts 7/07 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 11:36AM [Link] |
| threesomebody Official BlowBang Judge Would you like my autograph? 2491 Posts 12/04 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 11:47AM I loved the scene in question. [Link] |
| LubeNLuv Senior Member 1854 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 11:51AM My wife and I are both proficient in Judo. She is actually more advanced than am I. Although far weaker than she was prior to her cancer treatments, in her prime she could easily get me into any number of pins or submission holds in combat simply due to her size...I outweigh her by 100lbs and have a foot of height on her. But she's freaky fast and limber and was rather like trying to catch a greased pig. It was actually our mutual love of martial arts that led to our "rough sex" and eventually to complete D/s part-time relationship (out of the bedroom, she's a force to be reckoned with at all times). Our sex life became one of "I have to tame her" and her role of "I must resist being tamed" until we found an extremely erotic balance dynamic in between. We've since found many D/s couples who are also active in various forms of martial arts....it seems to be the 'native sport' of the Lifestyle in fact. Well that and motorcycles but I blame that on the love of leather. So I know we aren't alone. While I respect your opinion, I just don't see it that way. A man does not always have the power to control what is happening. Ever take a look at the web site "meninpain.com?" I assure you those men are totally helpless once they've allowed themselves to be trussed up like that. Short of exercise of a safe word, there's not much they can do. Same for women over at sexandsubmission.com. They can call it quits via safe words if they like but once you are bound it's true submission. And that's where the power exchange and TRUST are supposed to play their roles. In real-life relationships, that trust has time to develop. For porners who just signed up for the scene minutes prior, I've no idea if this is even possible unless both are quite familiar with the roles and/or one another beforehand. I'm sure that's the case in a few scenes I've watched, but not in most. But to claim the women are less capable of controlling the action because they are women and therefore "the weaker sex, physically and psychologically" IS sexism. [Link] |
| LubeNLuv Senior Member 1854 Posts 3/06 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 12:04PM I think the simple reason you don't seem men in submissive roles as often in porn is that porn, as I was trying to point out, is a terrible medium for this. Porn is made to make money and the way it makes money is largely via the fulfillment of masturbatory desires of a male audience. There are SOME mainstream themes of male submission that you can find in abundance...cuckhold scenes for example, although that's more psychological emasculation than true male submission. But otherwise, yes, male submission is risque and therefore niche and not appealing to a broad porn-buying audience. So it gets relegated to a niche. [Link] |
| tricia_devereaux Evil Angel DVD Patience is a virtue, but who wants to be virtuous? 4283 Posts 4/00 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 12:25PM Thanks for sharing your experiences with us. [Link] |
| ToneBone Member 176 Posts 8/07 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 2:49PM |
| ToneBone Member 176 Posts 8/07 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 3:08PM Let me emphasize, I have no problem with it when the girl is enjoying it. I practice that kind of sex regularly. But I can also understand why people who don't engage in rough sex would be taken aback by it. You have provided some exceptions but the rule remains: Women on average are not physically as strong as men. This is a basic fact of life which I can't believe I actually have to argue about. You pit an average man and an average woman against each other and 9 out of 10 times the man will overpower the woman. The 1 out of 10 exception doesn't change the overall pattern. If that wasn't the case there would be just as many abused men in relationships as there are women. We would have as many battered men shelters as women's. The fact that some women are good at martial arts or some men are weak and sickly does not nullify the rule. But as far as the general topic is concerned, I agree more with your take than I disagree with it. So I'll leave it at that. [Link] |
| CharlotteVale Member where ultra-feminine meets ultra-anal ;) 78 Posts 7/08 | Posted - Oct 6 2008 : 6:09PM I completely understand why some people might find rough sex or a girl seeming to be in pain unappealing. What I find disturbing though is the suggestion that people who like to explore the darker side of sexuality must somehow be sick or wrong. There are a few fairly "normal" things that some people find hot as hell that I find unappealing. Doesn't mean I need to say that the people that watch or desire these things are wrong. I just don't watch them. Of course I believe that no model should be forced to do something against her will but like Brandon Iron said, sometimes a girl wants to be pushed beyond what she thought she could or should do. I love seeing and experiencing the intensity that comes along with a little healthy fear. I can be afraid of something but want more than anything to keep going. For me, these experiences are how I learn about myself, and connect with the person I'm with. Sure it's not for everyone but neither is squirting, or anal sex, or a gang bang. I find the exploration of the rough side of human sexuality to be fascinating and stimulating and I plan to continue to seek out those kinds of experiences. I think it's important for people to see girls who enjoy pushing boundaries, who aren't afraid to show themselves as vulnerable, girls who are more interested in expressing who they are and what excites them than in becoming the commonly accepted image of what female sexuality should be. Charlotte [Link] |
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