IAFD removes the "IR" tag from their database. (page 5)

Author	Post
suavehuman Deactivated User 301 Posts 1/20	Posted - Jun 21 2020 : 12:06PM ^ hahaha.. exactly what I was thinking! He's debating against his own argument. He's running on both sides of the story. [Link]
2bollocks Senior Member 3592 Posts 3/10	Posted - Jun 21 2020 : 12:26PM More importantly will something be done to stop fools on porn sites asking about a starlet "Will she do IR? Will she do IR? Will she do IR? Will she do IR?" [Link]
Draxxx Senior Member 3831 Posts 2/07	Posted - Jun 21 2020 : 12:44PM booted bandit wrote: ^ you've created an artificial argument and then successfully debated with yourself... well done I guess...? if you read their statement, in no way was it stated that their reasoning was because the 'IR tag is offensive.' It was removed because it has been historically inaccurate. yes, a replacement should probably be forthcoming, but one issue is more pressing than the other. Click to expand They said "IR" in porn represents "Racists stereotypes & imagery" "Stereotypes and imagery that informs acts of racists and hatred" That's not supposed to be seen and thought of as offensive? I also pointed out why it makes/made sense in terms of porn why the tag was used the way it was and didn't reflect real world accuracy. The question was asked why the tag term was only used for black people and I gave what I saw as the reason why...Because it would make the term far less effective when serching a porn data base for that sort of info. Edited by - draxxx on 6/21/2020 12:49:17 PM [Link]
Mike Hawk CEO Dixon Cider Member I heard that! 885 Posts 1/20	Posted - Jun 21 2020 : 1:17PM 2bollocks wrote: More importantly will something be done to stop fools on porn sites asking about a starlet "Will she do IR? Will she do IR? Will she do IR? Will she do IR?" Click to expand Why? It's a valid question as long as it's not beat to death. However, it will get beat to death, dug up, then beat to death again. If only there was another way of locating said information. (Insert about 10 laughing emojis as I completely crack myself up) [Link]

Mike Hawk CEO Dixon Cider Member I heard that! 885 Posts 1/20	Posted - Jun 21 2020 : 1:29PM suavehuman wrote: ^ hahaha.. exactly what I was thinking! He's debating against his own argument. He's running on both sides of the story. Click to expand Which side won? [Link]
Flash Golden Age Classic 11017 Posts 5/01	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 2:21PM BIPOC-AIC has issued a statement: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE MEDIA STATEMENT BIPOC-AIC Issues Media Statement Regarding Racism in Adult Entertainment Industry UNITED STATES (June 23, 2020) - Earlier this month, leaders within the Adult Film Industry acknowledged its unfair, historical issues with racism, including disparate wages based on ethnicity, and began the process of formulating strategies to correct these issues. The BIPOC (Black, Indigenous, and/or People of Color) Adult Industry Collective (https://www.bipoc-collective.org) was formed to answer this call, with the belief that all marginalized communities must be included at the table, in all discussions, when making decisions surrounding repairing harm against impacted communities. The BIPOC Adult Industry Collective is a group of performers, directors, and producers, spanning a range of jobs within the consensual and commercial sex trades, who are dedicated to working towards bringing changes in order to make the adult industry a safe space for all to work, explore, and thrive, regardless of ethnicity, gender identity, or sexual orientation. Moving forward, the BIPOC-AIC requests the following: An elimination of wage disparity based solely on race. Over the past 2 weeks, the industry's main talent agents, several performer coalitions, and major trade publications have called for, or stated, that they will support this initiative (https://www.xbiz.com/news/252675/agencies-pledge-to-end-talent-rate-disparity-declare-support-for-blm & https://www.apac-usa.com/single-post/2020/06/03/Adult-Industry-Professionals-for-Black-Lives-Matter). We look forward to witnessing progress made in this area over the next few weeks, as production resumes after a lengthy production moratorium due to COVID-19. An increase of BIPOC below-the-line staff in all aspects of production, including make-up artists, grips, gaffers, catering, editors, directors, and producers. An industry-funded career development pipeline, to provide performers looking to move behind the camera with the proper education, tools, paid internships, and employment opportunities to do so. While we sincerely appreciate the gesture, BIPOC-AIC has concerns regarding the elimination of the terms "IR," "Interracial," and "Ethnic" from online search engines, copy, and awards shows (https://avn.com/business/articles/video/a-statement-from-the-avn-ceo-883301.html), which may do more harm than good: Our concerns include how this elimination will affect product sales, brand management, and the possible deletion of BIPOC from nominations and awards altogether. We instead seek to change the language surrounding marginalized people, and ask these terms be expanded to be more inclusive. Additional ways in which this should proceed: An expansion of "Interracial" and "IR" to include all BIPOC performers with non-BIPOC performers. Performer autonomy over how they wish to be identified in terms of ethnicity, age, body type, gender identity, and sexual orientation in all copy, regardless of medium. An increase in BIPOC writers, including screenwriters, publicists, journalists, copywriters, marketers, and social media managers in the industry - as direct hires or paid internships. Educational / knowledge resources for industry media, as well as public relations and marketing professionals, in regards to language and tone for representing BIPOC. Expanding descriptions of performers beyond ethnicity, to include identifiers such as hair and eye color, body type, and other relevant SEO keywords. A rejection of derogatory terms & themes as they relate to race, gender identity, and sexual orientation from all forms of media and copy. An end to a mockery of religion, ethnicity, age, and body types; we acknowledge that sexual desire & fantasy are fluid and ask the industry to explore ways to cover these themes without using slurs and making fun of the people represented in these communities. All digital spaces that allow consumers to upload commentary, content, or interact with performers must establish and implement filters which block racially-charged language and abusive behavior. The safety and mental health of performers should always come first, and the industry must stand against online violence towards performers. BIPOC-AIC further envisions the following changes: Paid Diversity and Intimacy Consultants at every company in the commercial sex industry. Diverse staffing at every company to include women, BIPOC, Queer, and Trans people. BIPOC-AIC is additionally calling for a complete reform of Booking Agents' & Talent Managers' business practices: During the booking process, performers will receive a complete copy of the model release, including studio information, project name and scene title. Companies will provide performers with any title changes for subsequent releases, including compilations and third-party releases, with the option of the performer opting out of inclusion in those releases. Before a booking is confirmed, a conversation between directors / producers and talent must take place to confirm talent is fully aware of the nature of the project, producers are aware of talent's personal limitations, "no" & "yes" lists, and any additional pertinent information regarding the project. BIPOC-AIC is currently discussing what "complete reform" looks like, and look forward to inviting agents and managers to sit down with us to ensure the best interest of talent is at the forefront of changes moving forward. BIPOC-AIC requests an increased presence of BIPOC and LGBTQIA representation in nominations, on stage, and on red carpets at awards shows. After a recent meeting, AVN has announced an overhaul of every step in its awards season process, to make sure Black performers, directors, and talent are better represented in its show. AVN has agreed to a talent liaison and are "rethinking" their approach to judging and nominations. AVN has also agreed to a Black host at the 2021 AVN Awards (https://avn.com/business/articles/video/avn-announces-changes-to-awards-to-increase-black-representation-883675.html). BIPOC-AIC is thrilled to see this olive branch extended, as well as the hosting of Town Halls by other media outlets and studios. We look forward to continuing the conversation with all awards show producers and media outlets, and invite them to sit with us to discuss how they, too, can show their dedication to an equitable approach to the upcoming awards season. We at BIPOC-AIC are so happy with the call for a #pornstrike from ally performers, who stand in solidarity with us and want to see an end to racism and sexual violence on set. We are in early talks to form a mutual aid fund, to help performers who cannot risk striking due to financial hardship, and will update as this moves forward. We stand by our allies and we are hosting an "On-Camera Consent Negotiation" training, taught by King Noire, of Royal Fetish Films, and Wolf Hudson. The workshop is structured for male-identified performers, along with directors and producers, regardless of race, to address consent issues in the industry. A formal invitation to this free / donation-based workshop will follow in the coming weeks. Thank you to our allies, friends, and fans who support our efforts to end racism and sexual violence in our industry. In working together, we can create a healthier working environment which ultimately produces a more profitable bottom line. In closing, BIPOC-AIC urges both industry members, as well as the public, to sign our petition at https://campaigns.organizefor.org/petitions/end-racism-and-wage-discrimination-in-porn?share=169f4ea8-1933-415d-b4dd-5004521ba57a&source=copy_email&utm_source=copy_email, to tell producers and distributors of adult media you support our efforts, and do not want, nor need, racist themes in your porn to get off. BIPOC-AIC will be releasing a video PSA shortly. To view, as well as keep up to date on our ongoing discussions, workshops, resolutions, and other news, bookmark https://www.bipoc-collective.org; BIPOC performers and directors who wish to join our Collective may email Info@BIPOC-Collective.org. Signed, BIPOC Adult Industry Collective https://www.bipoc-collective.org About the BIPOC Adult Industry Collective: The BIPOC (Black, Indigenous, and/or People of Color) Adult Industry Collective was formed to answer the call to address the adult entertainment industry's issues with racism, including disparate wages based on ethnicity, and to develop, advise, and implement strategies to correct these issues. The BIPOC-AIC believes all marginalized communities must be included in all discussions when making decisions surrounding repairing harm against impacted communities. We are a group of performers, directors, and producers, spanning a range of jobs within the consensual, commercial sex trade, dedicated to working towards bringing about changes needed in order to make the adult industry a safe space for all to work, explore, and thrive, regardless of ethnicity, gender identity, or sexual orientation. For more information, including news, updates, schedules of events, and more, visit https://www.bipoc-collective.org. Edited by - flash on 6/23/2020 2:27:37 PM [Link]
whatsatelephonebill Senior Member 2935 Posts 10/11	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 3:11PM The important part in regards to this topic: While we sincerely appreciate the gesture, BIPOC-AIC has concerns regarding the elimination of the terms "IR," "Interracial," and "Ethnic" from online search engines, copy, and awards shows (https://avn.com/business/articles/video/a-statement-from-the-avn-ceo-883301.html), which may do more harm than good: Our concerns include how this elimination will affect product sales, brand management, and the possible deletion of BIPOC from nominations and awards altogether. We instead seek to change the language surrounding marginalized people, and ask these terms be expanded to be more inclusive. Additional ways in which this should proceed: An expansion of "Interracial" and "IR" to include all BIPOC performers with non-BIPOC performers. Performer autonomy over how they wish to be identified in terms of ethnicity, age, body type, gender identity, and sexual orientation in all copy, regardless of medium. An increase in BIPOC writers, including screenwriters, publicists, journalists, copywriters, marketers, and social media managers in the industry - as direct hires or paid internships. Educational / knowledge resources for industry media, as well as public relations and marketing professionals, in regards to language and tone for representing BIPOC. Expanding descriptions of performers beyond ethnicity, to include identifiers such as hair and eye color, body type, and other relevant SEO keywords. A rejection of derogatory terms & themes as they relate to race, gender identity, and sexual orientation from all forms of media and copy. An end to a mockery of religion, ethnicity, age, and body types; we acknowledge that sexual desire & fantasy are fluid and ask the industry to explore ways to cover these themes without using slurs and making fun of the people represented in these communities. All digital spaces that allow consumers to upload commentary, content, or interact with performers must establish and implement filters which block racially-charged language and abusive behavior. The safety and mental health of performers should always come first, and the industry must stand against online violence towards performers. Click to expand As some of us were saying, while eliminating the tag is a nice gesture, all it is is a gesture, and there's arguments to be made that it isn't a necessary one (and could have unintended negative side effects like awards consideration). [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 3:20PM ^ They propose that IR be expanded to be more accurate by including all interracial scenes. I didn't see anyone propose that in this thread, just a bunch of IR apologists and dismissals that there was any issue to begin with. Edited by - BlackSix on 6/23/2020 3:20:44 PM [Link]
whatsatelephonebill Senior Member 2935 Posts 10/11	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 3:25PM BlackSix wrote: ^ They propose that IR be expanded to be more accurate by including all interracial scenes. I didn't see anyone propose that in this thread, just a bunch of IR apologists and dismissals that there was any issue to begin with. Edited by - BlackSix on 6/23/2020 3:20:44 PM Click to expand I proposed that in this thread. [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 3:29PM ^ I missed that then. I agree that it makes sense and is a simple solution. It is notable on the Tube sites since they are tagged by amateurs IR often does get used more loosely than the industry term. [Link]
whatsatelephonebill Senior Member 2935 Posts 10/11	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 3:32PM BlackSix wrote: ^ I missed that then. I agree that it makes sense and is a simple solution. It is notable on the Tube sites since they are tagged by amateurs IR often does get used more loosely than the industry term. Click to expand Yeah, my general solution has been "tag them all" and I've been explicitly against the use of IR to mean BM/WF (or generally speaking, non-black female), but I haven't been very loud/active in the thread, so I can see how it got missed. My first post, if anyone wanted proof: whatsatelephonebill wrote: I've generally been of the opinion that the problem with the "interracial" tag is that it almost explicitly only referred to BM/WF pairings and not anything else. Which is part of the reason I'm not sad to see it disappear. But I don't think that simply labeling that a scene has a black male performer in it should be seen as controversial if you do it with other races as well. And to the idea that the the data is "still there", it is technically, but you've removed the data from the main page for actresses and made it harder to get to, which isn't necessarily remedied by making it "richer information". I'm just not sure that making it harder to see scenes with performers that look like me is an absolute step towards progress. Click to expand [Link]
booted bandit Deactivated User 44 Posts 6/20	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 4:10PM ^ interestingly, this guy https://bananafever.com/ already tags his stuff as AM/WF or AM/BF etc. which isn't too difficult to decode. it may be the way forward. Edited by - booted bandit on 6/23/2020 4:10:28 PM [Link]
suavehuman Deactivated User 301 Posts 1/20	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 5:19PM Thanks, BIPOC. Glad that BIPOC understand the issue with full clarity and aren't racial discrimination hustlers like Mr.DickDrainerXXX [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 6:16PM ^ Or maybe black people aren't a monolith and Dickdrainersxxx has a sincere difference of opinion, even if you disagree with it? [Link]

suavehuman Deactivated User 301 Posts 1/20	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 7:23PM ^ who claimed black people are a "monolith"? [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 7:28PM You're irresponsible use of 'race discrimination hustler' to describe someone who dares to hold a different opinion is very telling. [Link]
suavehuman Deactivated User 301 Posts 1/20	Posted - Jun 23 2020 : 7:34PM ^ project. [Link]
Slavaboo Member 55 Posts 7/19	Posted - Jun 24 2020 : 9:55PM RelentlessOnanism wrote: I think this is going to be a big thing in the industry from now on. I suspect the days of sites like Blacked for instance may be numbered. A few years from now you are almost certainly not going to get scenes that are described as interracial. There will just be porn, and the racial identity of the performers won't be highlighted in any way. Click to expand Strong doubt. Where there exists people willing to pay for such content, there will exist people who make content that caters to them. Interracial as a category will always exist in the same way that foot fetish or BBW will always exist. The industry having a kneejerk snowflake reaction will not change this. Jeff @ IAFD wrote: It wasn't a decision we made lightly. We're not keen on removing functionality from the site and, whether or not we like it, we've alienated a segment of our visitors. Click to expand You've made it more difficult for many to find the content they enjoy. I hope a newer better porn database is started. Jeff @ IAFD wrote: A black performer did fuck a white performer; we can't delete that info - but we can stop categorizing it as noteworthy. Click to expand Except to many, it IS noteworthy because that's their kink. This shit reeks of kinkshaming. Jeff @ IAFD wrote: Instead of clicking the IR filter and then click thru to each title to see who her scene partner was; you can just click on her "scene pairings" and start scrolling - you'll see a lot of black faces... but you'll also see white faces and all other colors of the rainbow. That's what I mean when I say "richer information" - you see the whole pie. Click to expand Literal 1984 tier doublespeak. Less features are more features! All you've done is made it more difficult and are pretending it's a good thing. If the term "interracial" bothers you that much, then replace it with something more accurate. A much better site that I frequent tags every scene with "white.female.black.male" "asian.female.white.male" "black.female.white.male" etc. Would that have been so hard? But no, you just want to pretend race doesn't exist and think that people with raceplay fetishes should go away. [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:07AM Slavaboo wrote: .. Literal 1984 tier doublespeak... Click to expand Oh yeah comparing this to Stalinist Russia levels of oppression. That's balanced and not at all a huge over-reaction. Orwell was really talking about tags in porn databases not real and profound political oppression. [Link]
maturelover Member 216 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 10:03AM Slavaboo wrote: Jeff @ IAFD wrote: A black performer did fuck a white performer; we can't delete that info - but we can stop categorizing it as noteworthy. Click to expand Except to many, it IS noteworthy because that's their kink. This shit reeks of kinkshaming. Click to expand it's not just that. It's also reeks of just opportunistic move if we have to be honest. A lot of things are controversial in porn. How strange that now it's just that particular thing that is changing. Everything else? Is ok as before. [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14603 Posts 3/02	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 10:06AM maturelover wrote: It's also reeks of just opportunistic move if we have to be honest. Click to expand What opportunity is being sought? [Link]
maturelover Member 216 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 10:34AM Hardware wrote: maturelover wrote: It's also reeks of just opportunistic move if we have to be honest. Click to expand What opportunity is being sought? Click to expand the opportunity to be seen as sensitive to a problem, so that nobody could point at finger at IAFD for promoting racism. Which is not a bad thing. But strangely all the other controversial aspects will remain there. Not that I'm like asking to remove other things: it's a database and its function is make things accessible (basically the opposite of what is happening with this move). But it says a lot about their concern is not to have a higher degree of morality or something like that, but just to avoid the controversies of this particular period. [Link]
booted bandit Deactivated User 44 Posts 6/20	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 2:08PM maturelover wrote: the opportunity to be seen as sensitive to a problem, so that nobody could point at finger at IAFD for promoting racism. Which is not a bad thing. But strangely all the other controversial aspects will remain there. Not that I'm like asking to remove other things: it's a database and its function is make things accessible (basically the opposite of what is happening with this move). But it says a lot about their concern is not to have a higher degree of morality or something like that, but just to avoid the controversies of this particular period. Click to expand they can willingly do their part in the industry without having been petitioned/coerced. if events in the world have raised their awareness to something they thought was benign, they're free to address it. and why should other issues be linked to this? what other "other controversial aspects" exist? your conclusion (last sentence) is conjecture. Edited by - booted bandit on 6/25/2020 2:11:35 PM [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 2:45PM Jeff: I hope this post does not come off as too confrontational, but I am beginning to question your organization's priorities and I feel that the time has come to broach an issue which has bothered me privately for many years. The removal of the "IR" tag is admirable, yet I cannot help but notice that IAFD continues to list films which depict clearly illegal content, including films that include Linda Lovelace fucking dogs (quite possibly against her will) and [link deactivated:Server error]a 15 year old girl engaging in full sexual intercourse[/url]. Since IAFD has already demonstrated that it is willing to sacrifice both the usability and completeness of the database in service of adopting a clear stance on political and moral issues, I wonder why these films are allowed to remain, why the "IR" tag was perceived as more offensive, and why this illegal content was ever added to the database in the first place. Perhaps you can outline IAFD's rationalization of these practices. Edit: TIL about the existence of what I can only assume is an algorithm used by ADT to deactivate links which indicate the presence of underage content. While admirable, I wanted that link to work in order to make my point here. The URL led to Traci Lords' filmography on IAFD, which is available in full despite the fact that every single pornographic film she ever made, with one sole exception, depicts her as an underage model. I chose her filmography to include as an example quite deliberately, as I am aware of the notoriety her misadventures in the porn industry has afforded her. The moral imperative to remove that filmography from the database in spite of its notoriety is self-evident, as far as I am concerned, which is precisely my point. However, hers is not the only example of an underage model being featured on IAFD. Edited by - evilpineapples on 6/25/2020 3:22:04 PM [Link]

maturelover Member 216 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 3:25PM booted bandit wrote: maturelover wrote: the opportunity to be seen as sensitive to a problem, so that nobody could point at finger at IAFD for promoting racism. Which is not a bad thing. But strangely all the other controversial aspects will remain there. Not that I'm like asking to remove other things: it's a database and its function is make things accessible (basically the opposite of what is happening with this move). But it says a lot about their concern is not to have a higher degree of morality or something like that, but just to avoid the controversies of this particular period. Click to expand they can willingly do their part in the industry without having been petitioned/coerced. if events in the world have raised their awareness to something they thought was benign, they're free to address it. and why should other issues be linked to this? what other "other controversial aspects" exist? Click to expand What about the movies of Traci Lords who started when she was 16? What about abusive male performers? What about studios or directors that are known for the stories of actresses that say they were abused? What about scenes with real incest? And I'm not saying that the content related to those studios or those things should be removed, because the scope of a database is to make easy to research things. But those are aspects that are as if not more controversial as the tag interracial, and if IAFD wants to be consistent with this (to me, absolutely stupid) attitude of simple removal and censorship, they should go that way. Edited by - maturelover on 6/25/2020 3:29:58 PM [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 3:28PM ^ Are you a mind reader or was that purely coincidental? LOL. [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:01PM The inclusion of such movies in the database is an acknowledgement that they existed in the market at one time or another, not that we endorse them. This is not comparable to the removal of the IR tag as the IR movies themselves are still in the system. [Link]
booted bandit Deactivated User 44 Posts 6/20	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:15PM maturelover wrote: booted bandit wrote: maturelover wrote: the opportunity to be seen as sensitive to a problem, so that nobody could point at finger at IAFD for promoting racism. Which is not a bad thing. But strangely all the other controversial aspects will remain there. Not that I'm like asking to remove other things: it's a database and its function is make things accessible (basically the opposite of what is happening with this move). But it says a lot about their concern is not to have a higher degree of morality or something like that, but just to avoid the controversies of this particular period. Click to expand they can willingly do their part in the industry without having been petitioned/coerced. if events in the world have raised their awareness to something they thought was benign, they're free to address it. and why should other issues be linked to this? what other "other controversial aspects" exist? Click to expand What about the movies of Traci Lords who started when she was 16? What about abusive male performers? What about studios or directors that are known for the stories of actresses that say they were abused? What about scenes with real incest? And I'm not saying that the content related to those studios or those things should be removed, because the scope of a database is to make easy to research things. But those are aspects that are as if not more controversial as the tag interracial, and if IAFD wants to be consistent with this (to me, absolutely stupid) attitude of simple removal and censorship, they should go that way. Edited by - maturelover on 6/25/2020 3:29:58 PM Click to expand life isn't all or nothing. they can choose which hill they want to die on. it's nonsensical to suggest otherwise under the guise of 'consistency.' if you wish for them to explain why they haven't taken action on those separate issues, you should ask them directly, but those issues aren't tied to this one in any way and doesn't limit its impact. [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:22PM morbidthoughts wrote: The inclusion of such movies in the database is an acknowledgement that they existed in the market at one time or another, not that we endorse them. This is not comparable to the removal of the IR tag as the IR movies themselves are still in the system. Click to expand I never said the two things are comparable. The point is that you are taking a stronger moral stance against the concept of IR (and just in the nick of time too!) than you are against illegal content. I would counter-argue that the pornographic filmography of a 15 year old girl has no place in a database dedicated to adult content, unless you're planning to expand into the sordid depths of the Color Climax back catalogue. The notoriety of the content is of no consequence. I am saying that it has no place in a database of legal adult content, period. Maybe that's just me. To be abundantly clear, I am insinuating directly that your motivations for removing the IR tag were political, not moral, as evidenced by the inclusion of content which is far more inappropriate than the IR tag ever was. Your continued inaction to remove the database listings for that content resonates more loudly than the cheap words of any blog post ever could. You have an opportunity to prove me wrong. EDIT: Clearer illustration of my point. Edited by - evilpineapples on 6/25/2020 4:39:27 PM [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:35PM I actually don't have to prove anything to you about what went on behind the scenes about how or why we came to that decision. Like I said, we do not endorse any movies that are listed in the database. We no longer tag scenes as interracial just like we never had an underage or bestiality tag from your examples if you want to argue consistency of actions. [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:37PM Again, I am not making an apples-to-apples comparison. I am demonstrating the basis for my belief that you have elected to take a stronger stance against racial justice than you have against child pornography. Your responses have only strengthened that belief, so from this point forward, I will no longer be utilizing your database. [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:44PM Bye Felicia. [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:52PM Bye. Just to be 100% clear for posterity, you just gave every indication that you will continue to list bestality and child pornography titles in your database after being confronted directly on the subject, and you defended that choice. Edited by - evilpineapples on 6/25/2020 4:52:52 PM [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 4:59PM No promises. Consensus can always change. [Link]

evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 5:05PM I'll extend an olive branch and say that I am not accusing you of endorsing or condoning illegal content, but let's be honest, you're being a bit daft if you don't understand why that content has no place in a public database dedicated to adult content, and you have to acknowledge that you have been more proactive about the racial justice stuff (as demonstrated by that passionate and elucidative blog post on the subject) than you have on this issue. I understand the "notoriety" and "historical relevance" arguments for listing that content. I am counter-arguing that they are not justifiable. Edited by - evilpineapples on 6/25/2020 5:06:47 PM [Link]
maturelover Member 216 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 5:20PM morbidthoughts wrote: The inclusion of such movies in the database is an acknowledgement that they existed in the market at one time or another, not that we endorse them. This is not comparable to the removal of the IR tag as the IR movies themselves are still in the system. Click to expand actually the fact that the tag "IR has" been removed instead of being changed says exactly "we don't endorse the fetish of seeing people of different colors having sex" with the non sequitur "because it's normal" (if it's normal why it's been removed). And a lot of those things I've mentioned (just the first few I thought in the moment) are not a part of the past but things of the present. Edited by - maturelover on 6/25/2020 5:35:37 PM [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 6:24PM I do not endorse the fetishisation of people by race, especially with how it is consistently labeled in porn to mean BM/XF versus how the public understands interracial relations. That to me is not normal. I have consistently held and applied these opinions with my interactions with the industry long before there was any uproar over this. Tagging or segregating people in such a matter is something I did not want to contribute to, and I am glad that the industry is starting to turn on this even if it seems politically motivated to you. [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 7:06PM That's all well and good, and I agree with your stance on racial justice regardless of the motivations I have abscribed to you, but why is that issue so important to you when the other issue seemingly is not? I submit that one is demonstratively more clear-cut than the other. [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 7:31PM IAFD is staffed by a group of volunteers with different interests and opinions. We generally make decisions by consensus, and I cannot speak for my colleagues about their motivations or opinions nor do I feel the need to second guess previous decisions in a public forum. [Link]
maturelover Member 216 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 7:40PM morbidthoughts wrote: I do not endorse the fetishisation of people by race, especially with how it is consistently labeled in porn to mean BM/XF versus how the public understands interracial relations. That to me is not normal. Click to expand so I could like a blonde woman, a mature woman or a teenager, a curvy woman, but if I like a black woman as a white man and I like to see that in a movie that's not normal. Interesting. Edited by - maturelover on 6/25/2020 7:46:09 PM [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 7:54PM That is race fetishisation. It may be widely practiced by others and accepted by you, but that does not make it acceptable or normal to me. [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 8:06PM Well, that is not what you said before. That is different. I don't see how a mere preference for black women is racist. It all depends on how that content is marketed. Now, I agree that the historical marketing of that content (and the labels that came along with it) was racist and fetishized, so we agree about that, but simply being into black women is neither. Frankly, I don't know how you can even believe that. Being into something does not necessarily fetishize that thing. Edited by - evilpineapples on 6/25/2020 8:16:51 PM [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 8:26PM I'm not here to hand hold and tell people it's normal or okay to look for someone primarily based on their race to jerk off to. [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 8:39PM If that's what gets you off, then why is it wrong? Who is being hurt? Sexual attraction to black women is a visual thing. It only becomes fetishized if it's fetishized... which is a totally different thing from having a sexual preference. Edited by - evilpineapples on 6/25/2020 8:41:11 PM [Link]
maturelover Member 216 Posts 7/12	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 8:56PM morbidthoughts wrote: That is race fetishisation. It may be widely practiced by others and accepted by you, but that does not make it acceptable or normal to me. Click to expand race doesn't even exist. And even if people see that way I don't really see a problem. A fantasy is a fantasy. What happens in sex doesn't necessarily reflects our ability to use our brain. I don't think that those who are into rough sex or bdsm have to be violent or dangerous persons in reality. The desire to watch horror movies or to listen extreme metal does not make a person a psychopath. Likewise people into raceplay are not necessarily racists. The fact is that porn is often about transgression. It's about our dark side, that does not make us unable to use our reason too. Edited by - maturelover on 6/25/2020 8:57:05 PM [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 9:17PM evilpineapples wrote: If that's what gets you off, then why is it wrong? Who is being hurt? Click to expand You can rationalise or minimise it down to preference, but you don't get to decide the threshold of acceptable racism for others. Demi Sutra explains this better than I can: [Tweet is no longer available] [Tweet is no longer available] [Tweet is no longer available] [Tweet is no longer available] Fantasy be damned. [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 9:37PM You're so obsessed with race. [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 9:39PM Says the person that started this thread of conversation [Link]
evilpineapples Member ONE TWO THREE, KUUUCKMAAAL! 706 Posts 6/13	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 10:00PM I actually derailed the five-page discussion about race to highlight the fact that IAFD has done more about racism (with pitch-perfect timing, again!) than it has to address the presence of bestiality and child pornography entries, which is demonstrably true. Those items has been a part of the database for nearly twenty-five fucking years. You cannot refute that. Acknowledging these films legitimizes them, and I won't support that. Hell, why stop there? Your stated reason for including the underage appearances of Traci Lords is to acknowledge the fact that they were once available on the market. Well, alright... So were these titles. They were even legal at the time they were produced in their country of origin, whereas Traci Lords' appearances were decidedly not. Explain to me why you make a distinction to exclude those titles. I dare you to add a title like Sucking Daddy and watch how quickly your domain gets seized. I fucking dare you. The larger point, and the reason I brought up this subject in this particular thread, is that IAFD has no business dictating what's racist and what's not racist to the rest of us while it continues to maintain (and defend, as you have done multiple times in this thread) a morally indefensible position on issues that are way worse, and easily more clear-cut, than the stupid fucking "IR" label. I neither put much stock in, nor afford much respect to, what you think about racism in the porn industry when you list scenes in your database that had little girls in them. Edited by - evilpineapples on 6/25/2020 10:35:28 PM [Link]
morbidthoughts All-Star Member Big cats scare me but... 3635 Posts 1/03	Posted - Jun 25 2020 : 10:36PM TLDR: So you decided to hijack your own thread about IR with red herrings and strawmen about child porn and bestiality and now you're quibbling about gaps in other content you find repugnant. Got it. [Link]