Hardware wroteI never cited any independent studies, as I am not aware of any person, group, or institution that performs studies on drug use in porn. I suspect this may be due to lack of social or academic relevance. Instead, I was basing my assertion on what is often referred to as "common knowledge." There have been mainstream (and independent) films, documentaries, and books done about the porn industry, and pretty much all of them address this issue. For example, the issue of rampant drug use in porn has been portrayed in films such as "Boogie Nights," "The Pornographer," "Wonderland," etc. It was also discussed in a book entitled "The Other Hollywood: The Uncensored Oral History of the Porn Film Industry," as well as others. Thus, this widespread occurrence in porn should be no secret to anyone. I have even read interviews from porn stars themselves when they discuss how prevalent the problem is. Although it doesn't imply that every single person in porn is a junkie or a drunk, it's no secret that it is rampant and widespread in porn.I have seen interviews with Tera Patrick, as well Jenna Jameson. Tera Patrick, as I recall, was on one of those entertainment shows talking about a lawsuit she had against people advertising her as an "escort." I saw Jenna on some other cable show doing a TV interview with the annoying radio personality Wendi Williams (which I found to be ironic for certain reasons, but I won't go into that here). But anyway, from what I saw of them, they just spoke normally. There wasn't really anything about them that I noticed that would stick out as "intelligent." What did people expect them to sound like? Are they supposed to mispronounce and stutter over their words? To me, they just sounded like ordinary women, no smarter or dumber than anybody else. After all, they were only talking about themselves and their jobs, which is pretty easy to do. It's not as if they went on TV and started reciting the Gettysburg Address. I am not saying that these women may indeed not be "intelligent" in certain respects. But if we are judging a woman's intelligence by her choice of career, then I would not be led to think favorably of her "intelligence" in this case.
Additionally, I remember seeing Jasmin St. Claire on the Jerry Springer show (yes, I shamefully admit I used to watch that show in my younger high school/college days). I remember she was on there defending her decision to break the gangbang record by doing 300 guys (I still can't believe someone actually keeps a record about that). But anyway, even in a crazy environment like the Springer show, she maintained her composure and spoke well. Even so, despite the fact that she behaved and spoke well, I still cannot see how deciding to have sex with 300 men at the same time (or even 300 men not at the same time) can be considered an intelligent decision.
[Link]
Mojo Deactivated User
1223 Posts 9/03
Posted - Jan 4 2006 : 6:53AM
With all the hassle (a.k.a. flaming) I received the other day concerning my "Dumb Girl" thread, I felt compelled to ask this question today. Now, why is it, if there are NO bimbos in porn, that we even have to ask who are intelligent girls in porn? If none of the girls are bimbos, then there's absolutely NO reason to ask who's intelligent. You might say by flaming me the other day and by saying that none of them are bimbos, then this thread is cancelled out as well!
Your statement that I questioned was not that drug use was rampant or widespread in porn, but that it was 'much more so' than in other industries.
Without knowing the rate of drug use in other lines of work your statement is unsupportable. Citing anecdotal sources and "common knowledge" without similar references from other lines of work is useless in suggesting, much less proving, comparative degrees of usage.
realtip wrote:This thread isn't entitled "Is Porn An Intelligent Career Choice for a Girl?" -- so you may be the only who's one "judging" porn performers according to those terms.
"Intelligence" obviously has several meanings. You're using the word in this context as a synonym for "good judgment." Unless you're saying that someone who (in your opinion) uses bad judgment cannot have an agile mind, the point you're trying to make is not relevant to this discussion. But if you ARE suggesting that, then your position is patently absurd.
I also think all this "judging" of porn performers' mental capabilities (as opposed to, say, the relative merits of their on-camera skills), smacks of terrible hubris.
[Link]
Mojo Deactivated User
1223 Posts 9/03
Posted - Jan 4 2006 : 2:15PM
And as I said, the question also implies that you all think that at least some of the girls are "lacking intelligence", something that was categorically denied in my old thread. So, if they're all intelligent there's little use in the question in this thread.
[Link]
DenverDon Benevolent
Firmly Embedded in Depravity 5914 Posts 7/02
Posted - Jan 4 2006 : 2:29PM
realtip,
Your "common knowledge" and "portrayed in films" is not very substantial.
[Link]
Eric381 Deactivated User
What are you looking at? It 2452 Posts 3/05
Posted - Jan 4 2006 : 3:27PM
Who are you kidding? If that's the case, it's "rampant" in everyday life!
It seems an awful lot to me as though your definition of "intelligent" is one who uses big, classy, elaborate vocabulary & never did drugs or drank? To contradict that line of thought, I know plenty of people who are exactly the opposite of that, but the smartest people I've ever been associated with.
Experience itself is the spice of life, and one of the best educations you can get, as far as I'm concerned.
~E
Edited by - eric381 on 1/4/2006 3:30:07 PM
[Link]
realtip Deactivated User
2301 Posts 6/04
Posted - Jan 5 2006 : 3:29PM
Eric381 wroteYour words, not mine, and they seem to be based on alot of presumption.
Hardware wrote
If it is empirical evidence you are looking for, you are more than welcome to try to find any research you can to contradict my "anectodal stuff." I also would be very interested in seeing this, especially since I cannot think of any legitimate industry (outside the limited area of entertainment) that has such a notorious and widespread reputation for drug use as porn does. Not everything requires an expert team of researchers to tell us what is already plain to see.
DenverDon wrote
Substantial as compared to what? I mentioned three specific films, a specific book, as well as other forms of media that address this, and even the fact that some porn performers themselves have attested to rampant drug use in the industry. Unless all these people, and the many others who confirm these occurrences, have some reason to lie about it, it's substantial enough to me.
Bob wrote
That's pretty much a repitition of what I wrote in my original post on this thread."Good judgement," as you term it, is a manifestation of intelligence. Intelligent people do not tend to make unintelligent choices. Thus, if you are implying that a person with an "agile mind" practices in making bad decisions, which is something that intelligent people do not knowingly do, then it is your position, if anything, that reeks of absurdity.
Intelligent and nymphomaniac pornstars. Rarity in porn.
[Link]
Mojo Deactivated User
1223 Posts 9/03
Posted - Jan 6 2006 : 5:58AM
Maybe, but I know that the aforementioned Nici Sterling is both intelligent and a 100% nymph.
[Link]
Eric381 Deactivated User
What are you looking at? It 2452 Posts 3/05
Posted - Jan 10 2006 : 6:45AM
Take a closer look at mainstream film stars (non-porn) as a whole, as you'll see ALL KINDS of drug abuse, drinking, etc. to satisfy yourself.
As for books & other media depicting porn as a self-serving shithole of an industry...it does the same to my industry (the railroad). "Dey make da choo-choo twains wook big & scarwee"...and when someone gets hit by one, it's always the railroads fault, what can we do to blame the industry rather than the stupid people who ran the crossing? The only reason I (or 99.9% of my coworkers) don't smoke pot is because we get federally drug-tested RANDOMLY.
Good judgement is nothing more than a manifestation of society & what everyone else thinks. None of your comments cite a specific source, only opinion. Apparently, you seem to think you're intelligent, since you have such good judgement of porn stars, correct?
Eric
[Link]
Eric381 Deactivated User
What are you looking at? It 2452 Posts 3/05
Posted - Jan 10 2006 : 6:47AM
That THAT, just goes to show how intelligent you are! :)
I am new here so first hello to all. I have always had strong issues with this topic. It seems to me that almost all female porn stars are intelligent (yes there will always be a few exceptions as with everything in life). First, all porn chicks are a part of a multi billion dollar industry. This means that at least they had the common sense to understand that, maybe, just maybe, if i play my cards right i can get rich. You see all women have this trap, it is a beautiful body and a pussy; its just that porn chicks know a man when desperate enough will pay almost anything to get it. now, the average "Joe" probably works 30-40 years before they can retire and enjoy life. I don't know of any porn chicks that have worked 30 straight years. For each star retirement probably comes at different times and for different reasons, but they are on "easy street" and rich $$$ way before average "Joe". Does it matter if you cant have an intellectual conversation with a porn chick, no! It doesn't even matter if they could spell their name. we (mostly men and a few women) are really the dummies, we are willing to pay for porn, and in the billions of dollars I might add! Yes I am just as guilty as all the dummies. So before anyone questions another's intelligence think again. I bet most porn chicks are laughing all the way to the bank! They are also doing a job they enjoy; now do you enjoy your job? [I am not saying stop paying for it. God no! I love porn and all the hotties that strive to please and probably will support the industry in some way till I die.] It's hard to pick a smartest porn chick, but Kami Andrews gets my vote! Sorry ladies.
Aunt Sunset tells me @ AEE that she is working in real estate since she left the business. Considering the ever-rising price of land in LA (and so many other urbanite areas of the country), I'd indeed say that was a smart move.
I believe good judgment is partly a function of intelligence, partly a function of emotional stability, partly a function of self-awareness, partly a function of broad experience.
Good judgment comes from experience, and often experience comes from bad judgment. ~ Rita Mae Brown
You're just restating your original premise; you haven't added anything to defend it.No one knowingly makes bad decisions, unless they intend (in some way or other) to destroy themselves. Self-destructive tendencies are hardly the monopoly of the unintelligent; quite the contrary -- history gives us innumerable examples of self-destructive geniuses. Do you read much history, realtip?"Reeks of absurdity" is a clunky metaphor, given that "reeking" relates to the sense of smell. Someone's poor use of metaphors is not necessarily an indication of their lack of intelligence, but it certainly doesn't weigh in on the plus side of the scale.
Rather than having a poll about which porn performers are intelligent, let's have a poll about which ADT posters are intelligent, and which ones show good judgment, and which ones exhibit both qualities.
Porn girls are smart they spread for money and people like you support the industry that's a billion dollar and counting business so how stupid are us porn goddesses really??? It depends on what you do with your money after taking it in the ass is what marks you as smart or stupid I suppose.
[Link]
realtip Deactivated User
2301 Posts 6/04
Posted - Jan 17 2006 : 8:09PM
Since when is how much money a person has a mark of intelligence? This must be a new concept. It's not how much money you have, but how you gained it, that marks you as intelligent. It doesn't take alot of intelligence to fuck. Anybody can do that. So you have alot of money? OK. But you got it by letting guys fuck you. And again, I do not find that as intelligent. Basically, if it is just the amount of money a person has determines his/her intelligence, then someone like Paris Hilton, for example, must be a genius.
[Link]
DenverDon Benevolent
Firmly Embedded in Depravity 5914 Posts 7/02
Posted - Jan 17 2006 : 8:17PM
realtip, read the statement again, the whole statement. She said what you do with the money after you make is probably what marks you as smart or not.
It's smart to fuck for money because you understand the value of pussy... It's stupid to get fucked for free and a drink that some guy bought you at a club
katja nailed that one ... fact in vegas some hooker was all pissed when von swine gave her a card she was like porn is sick and lame i was liek your a whore and porn is lame you have your ideas really crossed girl one is a job a industry the other is all a risk and crap shoot
dan
[Link]
realtip Deactivated User
2301 Posts 6/04
Posted - Jan 22 2006 : 6:01AM
How is one any smarter than the other? With the girl in the club, she makes the decision to fuck because she actually likes the guy, as opposed to the porn chick who fucks just about anybody who she is paid to, regardless of whether she actually likes him or not. There is a good line that I not too long ago heard on an episode of "Law & Order: SVU." While interrogating a highly-paid sex worker who was bragging about how much money she makes, the detectives referred to her as nothing but "a sex machine with a cash register between her legs." When someone talks about "the value of pussy," that's exactly what it reminds me of; that a pussy can somehow function as a cash register. If we cannot judge porn stars on their intelligence (or lack thereof) based on their sexual choices, then how we can judge the intelligence of anyone else based on their sexual choices? I don't think it's unintelligent to have sex, but I do find it unintelligent to make a career out of it. Thus, I would disagree that the girl in the bar who does it for free and because she likes the guy is any more stupid than another girl who does it because she is paid to do it.It depends on how you look at it. For one thing, in Vegas, the profession of the prostitute is perfectly legal. Thus, since what she is doing is legal in the state where she lives, she may not see herself as a "whore," just like many porn chicks refuse to see themselves as "whores" because what they do is legal. Plus, although I don't watch as much TV as what I let on, I happened to have been watching another show on Comedy Central once called "Wanda Does It." On one episode, the comedienne and host, Wanda Sykes, goes to Vegas to see about becoming a prostitute. It was so funny. She actually had to go through an official application process with a brothel, file forms with a local police department, and go through disease testing before she could get a job as a hooker (which she didn't actually do). Apparently, the prostitution business in Nevada is not only legal, but also seems to be regulated. Therefore, it seems reasonable that the Vegas hooker would see her job as being just as "respectable" as the porn star. Personally, the way I see it, if you're going to put one in the category of being a "whore," then why not all?
[Link]
Eric381 Deactivated User
What are you looking at? It 2452 Posts 3/05
Posted - Jan 22 2006 : 7:05AM
Or she's just lookin' to get laid...shows how much you know. The only thing the casual barfly likes about him is his face and the "what if's". Otherwise, what does she really know about him, hmmm? :) Lemme guess, you've been put into this situation far more than we realize, oh great body of sound judgment?
Simply put...intelligence shouldn't have a goddam thing to do with sexual choice, preference, etc. It's just some fantasy you've dreamt up to appease yourself when stroking your carrot in the men's room. "Ewwww, da purdy porn star is just a dumb whore who fucks for money...duh-huh-huh-huh!"
I'd call a "legal prostitute" about as much of a whore as one can possibly be, not a porn star. They...are actresses, which doesn't mean they don't have feelings (on or off set). You'll find that part of the "intelligence" in being a porn+star also entails much of the same procedures (for what little I know), and these girls are also tested & required to prove such at most sets which they work on.
And the question of the night is...what do you do for a living, eh realtip? Was an intelligent decision, since you see yourself with enough cohunes to come upon this list and attack the intelligence of the ladies who participate on it?
Eric
[Link]
realtip Deactivated User
2301 Posts 6/04
Posted - Jan 22 2006 : 7:55AM
Eric381 wroteI guess where you draw the line on who is and who is not a "whore" is up to you. I am not even going to argue with you about it. As for the rest of your message, Eric381, I am not going to bother arguing with you about those asinine comments either. I'll just refer you to the several other times on other threads where I had to point out to you your ridiculous presumption, and how foolish it makes you look.
[Link]
DenverDon Benevolent
Firmly Embedded in Depravity 5914 Posts 7/02
Posted - Jan 22 2006 : 8:53AM
Cut the name calling, now, if you want to continue 'discussing' this.
The last time I checked, prostitution was not legal in Nevada, but was in certain counties in Nevada. Clark County, which is where Las Vegas is, is not one of those counties. (However there is much 'looking in the other direction' there.) There are no brothels in Vegas, but outside in 'other counties'.
Just to satisfy my own curiosity Realtip, do you regard porn as a career choice for men on the same level of stupidity you regard it for women?
[Link]
realtip Deactivated User
2301 Posts 6/04
Posted - Jan 22 2006 : 9:23AM
DenverDon wroteI stand corrected. After thinking that prostitution was legal under the state law of Nevada, I looked into it and found that you are right. In Nevada, prostitution is only legal in counties with a population smaller than 400,000, which rules out large cities such as Vegas, Reno, Lake Tahoe, etc. But where it is legal, it is regulated.I was under the impression that the Bunny Ranch was in Las Vegas, but it is not. It is in a town called Mound House. But for some reason, it is always associated with Vegas.
[Link]
realtip Deactivated User
2301 Posts 6/04
Posted - Jan 22 2006 : 9:36AM
saratoga120 wroteFirst of all, I don't recall ever saying that a choice of a porn career is "stupid." What I said is that it is unintelligent, and I do not find the two to necessarily have the same meaning. But to answer your question, No I do not regard on the same level of unintelligence for men as for women. But having said that, even as a man, I would not be putting porn star on the list of most intelligent professions.
Why not? Sex on camera is sex on camera. What difference does it make, from an "intelligent" choice of job, whether you're being nailed or you're the one doing the nailing?
Introducing Brandi Swan
Posted - Jan 3 2006 : 10:45PM
I am new here so first hello to all. I have always had strong issues with this topic. It seems to me that almost all female porn stars are intelligent (yes there will always be a few exceptions as with everything in life). First, all porn chicks are a part of a multi billion dollar industry. This means that at least they had the common sense to understand that, maybe, just maybe, if i play my cards right i can get rich. You see all women have this trap, it is a beautiful body and a pussy; its just that porn chicks know a man when desperate enough will pay almost anything to get it. now, the average "Joe" probably works 30-40 years before they can retire and enjoy life. I don't know of any porn chicks that have worked 30 straight years. For each star retirement probably comes at different times and for different reasons, but they are on "easy street" and rich $$$ way before average "Joe". Does it matter if you cant have an intellectual conversation with a porn chick, no! It doesn't even matter if they could spell their name. 
