Traci Lords: illegal to view online or not?

Author	Post
jack33139 Member 85 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 26 2008 : 9:01PM I know everything about Traci Lords has been debated to death in the porn industry, but I'm still unclear on the exact status and legality of the stuff she did while underage. Before people start flaming me, Traci Lords is about 5 years older than me and the whole issue of her being underage blew up several years before I saw my first porn vid in my early teens. I know her stuff was pulled from the shelves and the whole thing was a huge affair, with legal consequences, etc., but I'm starting to see more and more of her pictures and videos online. I hadn't even thought of Traci Lords in years, but I was recently reading a thread on another site and before I knew it, I had a naked Traci Lords on my screen (a few screen caps had been uploaded as attachments in a thread I was reading). I've also seen huge collections of Traci Lords scenes available as downloads at RapidShare, etc. Anyway, what is the exact status of her stuff? Is it illegal, across the board, to own, possess, view, etc., her stuff, or is it simply illegal to sell the stuff? Are there differences between the laws in the U.S. and foreign countries (e.g., illegal to own/view in U.S., but okay in some other countries)? It's no big deal -- I'm not building any Traci Lords collections -- but I was wondering if I'm technically a collector of child porn since there's likely a couple naked pictures of Lords in my browser's cache right now. I noticed a lawyer posts here; perhaps he knows the exact status. Thanks. [Link]
Harri Patel Senior Member #SDNY he's all yours. -- Michael Steele 5110 Posts 3/03	Posted - Jan 26 2008 : 9:12PM She made one movie after she turned eighteen. Other than that, it's all illegal in the US. [Link]
nietzsche Deactivated User 5470 Posts 8/03	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 12:24AM but I was wondering if I'm technically a collector of child porn since there's likely a couple naked pictures of Lords in my browser's cache right now. I noticed a lawyer posts here; perhaps he knows the exact status. Thanks. Click to expand I believe if the police really want to go after you, yes you are in possession of illegal pornography. If that were your only offense, they'd probably let you off with a listing on the national child molester database, you'd have to notify authorities every time you move, and finding employment would become exponentially more difficult. [Link]
Shagdog Member Houston 626 Posts 1/07	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 12:53AM When all that went down I had some of her tapes. I burned them. I watch porn for entertainment I don't need jail because of it. When in doubt I error on the side that is for sure legal. Now that being said. She looked 15 and as it turns out she was. But her saying she didn't enjoy doing porn is lie. Anyone who saw her knew it was real excitement not fake. Edited by - Shagdog on 1/27/2008 1:12:27 AM Edited by - Shagdog on 1/27/2008 7:12:19 PM [Link]
Flash Golden Age Classic 11018 Posts 5/01	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 6:14PM With the exception of the title Traci I Love You all of her titles are illegal to view, download, etc in the USA. [Link]

blowfish Member 874 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 6:33PM Probably would not get convicted but I wouldn't risk it. Definitely a parole violation though. Edited by - blowfish on 1/27/2008 7:12:39 PM [Link]
Shagdog Member Houston 626 Posts 1/07	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:11PM Edited by - Shagdog on 1/27/2008 7:11:56 PM [Link]
Myload Senior Member A rose is what you are to me 2069 Posts 6/03	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:26PM The only Traci Lords film I ever got to see was "Traci I Love You". Even though I was watching porn when her other movies were still available, by the time I discovered her the truth came out and all of those movies were gone. [Link]
backdoorman Senior Member Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman ! 2776 Posts 10/07	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:50PM Her movies sell like hot cakes on ebay. She is always either non credited or listed as Nora Kay with no link to IAFD in the descriptions and "no" I don't have any of them. Just saying. "Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed [Link]
Harri Patel Senior Member #SDNY he's all yours. -- Michael Steele 5110 Posts 3/03	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:57PM Myload wrote: The only Traci Lords film I ever got to see was "Traci I Love You". Click to expand She looked the same in that one as she did in the other ones. I disagree with the comment above about her looking 15 -- she looked about the same as the other big-hair, heavily made up performers who were working at that time. I don't know why anyone would want to put themselves at any legal risk, however small, to obtain illegal movies or pictures of a minor who actually appears to be an adult. Edited by - Harri Patel on 1/27/2008 7:58:43 PM [Link]
Myload Senior Member A rose is what you are to me 2069 Posts 6/03	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:11PM Harri Patel wrote: She looked the same in that one as she did in the other ones. I disagree with the comment above about her looking 15 -- she looked about the same as the other big-hair, heavily made up performers who were working at that time. Click to expand I agree with that. I thought she was hot-looking at the time. I even named one of my cats after her. But I didn't think she looked underage. I don't know why anyone would want to put themselves at any legal risk, however small, to obtain illegal movies or pictures of a minor who actually appears to be an adult. Click to expand It's probably because they're major collectors items. Obviously I don't know for sure, but that would be my guess. Edited to correct a serious typo. Edited by - Myload on 1/28/2008 12:26:53 AM [Link]
Cammy Sutra Member 41 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:18PM When you masturbate think of the government in the room. [Link]
backdoorman Senior Member Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman ! 2776 Posts 10/07	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:25PM I never saw the movie but did the preview. It was a Lolita type movie with her and Ginger Lynn. It might of been her first movie. She did not look old enough to be out of middle school let alone in a porn film. Her tits weren't even formed and she had a lot of baby fat. It kind of freaked me out even before I knew she was illegal. "Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed [Link]
backdoorman Senior Member Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman ! 2776 Posts 10/07	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:31PM Those young girls is the movie I was referring too. Not her first but maybe second. Her first was What gets me hot. "Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:40PM I never understood the obsession with her or the fuss. I wasn't watching porn when all of that happened and never really bothered to look into it. But it makes little sense to me that anyone would even want to risk going anywhere near it since almost everyone knows most of what she did was when she was underage. Particularly in today's climate, this kind of stuff is the equivalent of playing with fire. And I mean that in the worst kind of way. Stay away from it if you know what's good for you. Don't go near it, don't look for it and especially don't download it. Edited by - randomprecision on 1/27/2008 8:45:32 PM [Link]

Cammy Sutra Member 41 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 10:17PM RandomPrecision wrote: I never understood the obsession with her or the fuss. I wasn't watching porn when all of that happened and never really bothered to look into it. But it makes little sense to me that anyone would even want to risk going anywhere near it since almost everyone knows most of what she did was when she was underage. Particularly in today's climate, this kind of stuff is the equivalent of playing with fire. And I mean that in the worst kind of way. Stay away from it if you know what's good for you. Don't go near it, don't look for it and especially don't download it. Edited by - randomprecision on 1/27/2008 8:45:32 PM Click to expand worked for prohibition! [Link]
jack33139 Member 85 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 11:58PM Thanks for the replies. About what I expected, although the idea -- as stated by 'nietzsche' -- that law enforcement might force me to register as a sex offender because I happened to read a "1980s Women of Porn" thread on the 'net strikes me as a huge reach. Anyway, are these videos legal in places outside the U.S.? As I mentioned in the OP, I see RapidShare links for entire Traci Lords collections all the time lately. Are these people just nutcases for posting illegal material for public download, or are they likely posting from somewhere those videos are legal? Also, are Lords' underage videos considered "child porn" or "illegal porn"? Clearly, the 17-year-old Lords wasn't a "child," but I'm not sure if there's a distinction or if everything underage is lumped into the "child porn" category. Thanks again for the replies. Very interesting. It's kind of amazing Traci Lords is still such a hot topic. Can you imagine if that whole affair had happened in the Internet age instead of the '80s? [Link]
kataboom master blaster ad astra per aspera 995 Posts 6/03	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:39AM i would avoid having any of traci's stuff in america. you could go to jail for mandatory sentences if a cop(with a casual knowledge of porn history) had a grudge towards you. imagine being labeled a pederast! fuck that...no thx [Link]
kataboom master blaster ad astra per aspera 995 Posts 6/03	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:50AM jack33139 wrote: Anyway, are these videos legal in places outside the U.S.? As I mentioned in the OP, I see RapidShare links for entire Traci Lords collections all the time lately. Are these people just nutcases for posting illegal material for public download, or are they likely posting from somewhere those videos are legal? Click to expand traci's vids are pretty much no big deal outside the u.s. its technically illegal but the enforcement is lax because hell, she does look over 18! they only slam the pervs with the "real" child stuff. i wouldn't mention rapidshare because thats implying file-sharing which is a no no here on adt. jack33139 wrote: Also, are Lords' underage videos considered "child porn" or "illegal porn"? Clearly, the 17-year-old Lords wasn't a "child," but I'm not sure if there's a distinction or if everything underage is lumped into the "child porn" category. Click to expand yes they are considered both illegal & child porn. it was mainstream news so you can expect any district attorney to charge you because of all the documented history in this instance. [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:57AM jack33139 wrote: Thanks for the replies. About what I expected, although the idea -- as stated by 'nietzsche' -- that law enforcement might force me to register as a sex offender because I happened to read a "1980s Women of Porn" thread on the 'net strikes me as a huge reach. Click to expand Think so? If a 19 year old can be put on the list for having a 17 year old GF, you'd better believe they'd go after you for this if they caught you with it. Again, why? There's plenty of legal porn. Who needs the trouble? What's the point? Thanks again for the replies. Very interesting. It's kind of amazing Traci Lords is still such a hot topic. Click to expand Yes. I don't understand it. You'd think nobody would even want to discuss it. But again. I'd leave it be. Why take the risk? [Link]
Cammy Sutra Member 41 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:59AM kataboom wrote: i would avoid having any of traci's stuff in america. you could go to jail for mandatory sentences if a cop(with a casual knowledge of porn history) had a grudge towards you. imagine being labeled a pederast! fuck that...no thx Click to expand eventually everyone will be labeled a pederast. [Link]
BSD Senior Member San Diego, CA 2508 Posts 11/03	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:30AM Friends - I saw Traci Lord's work before and after the revelation, and the resulting controversy didn't up the titillation factor for me. She looked and acted like the standard era 80's porn girl to me, and the later knowledge that she was underaged didn't particularly add anything to it. The one that HAS given me pause and regret after all these years, is the Alexandria Quinn scene with Rocco and Sunny McKay that Stagliano had to cut out of *"Buttman's Ultimate Workout". Not because Alexandria's* underage status made it more noteworthy, but because it was my all time favorite scene of hers, and I didn't get to own it. I saw it a couple of times as a rental, loved it, and then when I finally got around to wanting to own it, the shit had hit the fan and it was cut from the movie. She was magnificent in that scene. To see what we later learned was a 17 year old girl handling Rocco like a champ, giving as good as she got, was truly beautiful. She rocked his world. And I never saw it again. Tricia, if you're listening... Never mind, I didn't say that. BSD [Link]
jizzlobber Member 21 Posts 11/07	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:34AM RandomPrecision wrote: Thanks again for the replies. Very interesting. It's kind of amazing Traci Lords is still such a hot topic. Click to expand Yes. I don't understand it. You'd think nobody would even want to discuss it. But again. I'd leave it be. Why take the risk? Click to expand Coz we all want what we can't have ;) Maybe because Traci was at the beginning of mass-market porn success (like Elvis fans lol)? But for me she was hot with a sexy mouth and amazing nipples and to this day she still made the best orgasm noises at the end of the scene to cum too. Anyone know the movie she did with John Leslie dressed as a knight in armor? [Link]
Dean Wormer Senior Member Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son. 1048 Posts 7/04	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:10AM In about 1993 I bought a vhs tape at my local porn store because it offered several Christy Canyon scenes in it. Lo and behold towards the end of the tape who should appear on my t.v. screen? It was Traci doing Herschel Savage and some other chick. I have to assume that on compilation tapes of that era there could be other Traci scenes that would be available. At least until tape started dying. Needless to say I watched that scene quite often until it wore out about ten years ago. Also about 1988 a guy I worked with would bring in tapes for me that he had made copies of over the years. One of them was "Those Young Girls" (as previously mentioned in this thread). He had so much porn that he didn't even realize he had a Traci tape. [Link]
Cerebral Jedi Senior Member I don't trust men who don't like big tits. 1067 Posts 12/04	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:48AM Dude I don't know how much clearer it can be made. IT'S ILLEGAL! No matter what kind of media it is, whether it's on tape, disc, COMPUTER FILE, hologram, retinal implant etc...It's illegal. [Link]

backdoorman Senior Member Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman ! 2776 Posts 10/07	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 9:46AM yes it's illegal but there's a lot of it out there I assure you. I don't have any interest in it and I was never here. "Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed [Link]
absynth Member absynth makes the heart grow fonder 434 Posts 8/06	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 11:15AM Would seem to me that the FBI's Cyber Crimes Division would have a Hell of a lot more on its plate than dealing with 80's flicks of Traci Lords (like perhaps bringing those who exploit children online to justice TODAY.) That being said, with all the porn that's out there, it shouldn't be difficult to NOT purchase/download/view porn that is technically illegal. [Link]
Asmodeus Lord of Lust az-mo-day-us 6338 Posts 10/01	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 11:16AM Traci Lords is all hype as far as I'm concerned. I've been around porn long enough to have seen many of her movies and she never really did anything for me. She just wasn't a very good preformer in my humble opinion and there were plenty of other hotter babes at that time who blew her out of the water. As for her stuff being called child porn, I think that's a little ridiculous considering she was only about 2 years shy of the age of consent. There's plenty of real kiddie porn on the Net that the Feds should be after instead of worrying about borderline stuff from over 20 years ago. Edited by - Asmodeus on 1/28/2008 11:17:37 AM [Link]
bigfoot Senior Member 1295 Posts 7/06	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:06PM Here's my take on the whole TL situation. Traci was in with the first group of starlets that made it big on the first wave of home video rentals and sales (Can you imagine paying $99.95 for a porn VHS tape? That's what they charged you if you lost your rental!). Ginger, Traci, and Christy topped that class and everyone into porn collected tapes featuring those women. I know I did - including Traci's. Fast forward 22 years - Having seen her tapes and more than 1,000 other porn titles since then, there are only a handful of the Traci tapes that stand out...BUT NOT BECAUSE OF TRACI!!! For example, "New Wave Hookers" was all about Ginger Lynn and Kristara Barrington. Tracy was in one scene and it barely registered (b/g with Rick Cassidy?!?). She couldn't act, even by porn standards and the only thing she was good for was the sex, but come on people! There are hundred's of viable porn actresses out there doing gonzo and features that are so much better looking than Traci, perform MUCH nastier sex acts than Traci, have real life EXPERIENCE that shows on camera (Traci, for all her "confidence" had nothing on actresses like Sandra Romain), have bodies that are actually women's bodies (where, for example, their tits have dropped), and are available legally anytime, anywhere so long as you are at least 18 years old. If you are looking for women who appear to be young, go search for a Leah Luv or Kitty DVD. Leah looks about 16 and Kitty looks about 13. If that is your thing, more power to you (just please stay away from my kids!). I've long since destroyed any TL tapes I owned because, well, I enjoy my freedom. Also, whatever it is that turns you on to TL, there are many, MANY options available in the world of porn that will be a better use of your time. IT IS TIME TO LET TRACI LORDS, PORNSTAR, REST IN PEACE. It is time to embrace what modern porn, in it's superior formats has to offer because if you are unable to let go of the need to possess TL material, you deserve to be busted...if that is what happens. If not, you need psychiatric help. My suggestion, let it go people, just let it go. Move on with your lives... [Link]
caroline-NL Member 543 Posts 3/07	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:05PM Traci didnt looked like 15, when she started. She looked much older. All estimated her age as 18. Technically, because she was under 18 in all her old movies except the last, at least under US/CAN laws, this is childporn. ( In my opinion, total nonsense ). So even possession is illegal. But Ive often heard, that some canadian and even some US shops had these videos. And that the police wasnt interested to confiscate them. One of the best known FBI child porn investigator, Mr. Lanning, said in an interview: " Traci Lords was underage, but the customers who watched, collected or bought her movies, werent interested in cp at all. If somebody talks like a duck, walks like a duck, looks like a duck, it is a duck. But we have to treat her movies like illegal material. " [Link]
caroline-NL Member 543 Posts 3/07	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:14PM @jack33139: Traci Lords Material isnt illegal in all countries, it is still legal to sale/buy/view/own in Germany. ( They still have a low 14 years minimum age for porn, but want to change this in the next weeks ). It is still legal to watch and possess it in Japan. It is de jure illegal in almost all european countries now, because we adapted the US laws, even in the Netherlands and Denmark, but I dont know one single case, where OLD material with actors 15 years of age and older was confiscated in these countries. [Link]
Smiler Grogan All-Star Member the war cry 14790 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 3:51PM Also, are Lords' underage videos considered "child porn" or "illegal porn"? Clearly, the 17-year-old Lords wasn't a "child," but I'm not sure if there's a distinction or if everything underage is lumped into the "child porn" category. Click to expand Yes, Yes, YES. As of 1996's Child Pornography Prevention Act. Anything (pictures, video) that features anyone under 18 in a sexual situation is potentially - potentially being the key word here - CHILD PORN. If the participants are 17 years and 364 days old, it's child porn. If two under-18 participants are having sex and film it, it's child porn. Display a nude picture of someone under-18 on a website, (even if a family website and the picture in question is a 3 year old) it's child porn. See the 2257 Laws. Films that display simulated sex featuring performers who are portraying under 18's could also be banned. (See controversy over the movie The Tin Drum ) There have been cases, at the state and local levels, where the above circumstances have all been prosecuted. It's really best to just STAY AWAY. [Link]
Narcissus Deactivated User Love Thyself 418 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:16PM with all this talk about Traci, it just make people more curious to see her vids. like me. i am more curious now. i am not in the United States, thankfully. so, someone please put up some links where we outside the US can see the vids. [Link]
Drew Black broken crankshaft 8011 Posts 9/99	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:49PM Do not put up links to her pre-adult movies from here. It's a huge no-no to link to child pornography. I'll delete your post and deactivate your account immediately. There's plenty of other places in the world you can search for this stuff. We simply cannot tolerate that kind of activity here. [Link]
Myload Senior Member A rose is what you are to me 2069 Posts 6/03	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 6:54PM Traci will always be a big part of porn history. She will always be one of porn's biggest names. Regardless of her being underage when most of her movies were made, she has made her mark in the industry, and that will never go away. I personally don't understand why the government would even care about movies that are over twenty years old. Like other people have pointed out, there are more important things out there to deal with. If I had been able to have bought some of her movies, I definitely wouldn't tell anyone. But like I said, I never got that chance. [Link]

Dither Persona non grata I love America 650 Posts 8/05	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 7:19PM absynth wrote: Would seem to me that the FBI's Cyber Crimes Division would have a Hell of a lot more on its plate than dealing with 80's flicks of Traci Lords (like perhaps bringing those who exploit children online to justice TODAY.) That being said, with all the porn that's out there, it shouldn't be difficult to NOT purchase/download/view porn that is technically illegal. Click to expand Agreed. It's only child porn de jure and if resources are spent targeting people who happen to own one or two questionable videos it's completely out of line. I queried in a net-meeting with the director of the national (not US) cyber-crime and child porn police unit recently and was somewhat reassured on that point. About the risk of getting stuck by accident that is. He said they targeted people who produced or participated in networks distributing large quantities of illegal material, and the risk of having the police bust your door for visiting the wrong website by accident was very small. Still, I wouldn't go digging for pre-legal Traci Lords material without a proxy. Actually I wouldn't go digging for it at all. [Link]
Shagdog Member Houston 626 Posts 1/07	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 7:25PM Myload wrote: Traci will always be a big part of porn history. She will always be one of porn's biggest names. Regardless of her being underage when most of her movies were made, she has made her mark in the industry, and that will never go away. I personally don't understand why the government would even care about movies that are over twenty years old. Like other people have pointed out, there are more important things out there to deal with. If I had been able to have bought some of her movies, I definitely wouldn't tell anyone. But like I said, I never got that chance. Click to expand They care because of one word. ELECTION. District Attorneys love to wave child porn convictions at the voters. With Traci's videos the case is so easy the facts are there. [Link]
jack33139 Member 85 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 11:03PM Thanks for all of the additional replies. As I tried to make clear, I'm not building a Traci Lords collection, etc., etc. I simply saw one or two naked pictures of her that were embedded in a thread at another site (a very well-known site, actually, which made it all the more surprising), and then a couple days later I saw a list of about 30 links to her various porn scenes. That got me wondering about the legality of the stuff, both within the U.S. and abroad. I was 99% sure it was across-the-board illegal, but wasn't sure if the sudden reemergence of the stuff online was because of a change in the laws or law enforcement, or because the government has other people to target, or because the stuff is legal outside the U.S. and people post it at will without caring at all about legal issues. My main question was hypothetical and really remains unanswered: Do you have to SEEK OUT child porn to be eligible for prosecution, or could someone get trapped simply be reading the wrong internet thread? It seems like one thing to have DVDs shipped to your front door but quite another to click a link hoping to see Barbara Dare and Cheri Taylor naked (e.g., in the "Women of the 1980s" thread I mentioned above) and suddenly have a naked Traci Lords looking back at you. Thanks again for the replies. [Link]
Shagdog Member Houston 626 Posts 1/07	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:08AM jack33139 wrote: My main question was hypothetical and really remains unanswered: Do you have to SEEK OUT child porn to be eligible for prosecution, or could someone get trapped simply be reading the wrong internet thread? Click to expand Yes you will be prosecuted. The prosecutor will leave it up to you and your attorney to convince a jury of your innocence. And the government will also entrap you. In case you've been living under a rock. Theres a witch hunt going on for pedophiles in this country. 17 yr olds are going to prison for sex with 15 yr olds. In Dallas they want to charge 2 14 yr old girls with making child porn for taking naked pictures of each other. The only porn I watch is American made porn by American porn company's. The big companies that operate under the 2257 laws. I also don't trade or open email with porn in them any more. I will open links on this board because the Mods do their job. Edited by - Shagdog on 1/29/2008 12:14:48 AM [Link]
nietzsche Deactivated User 5470 Posts 8/03	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:12AM Shagdog wrote: And the government will also entrap you. In case you've been living under a rock. Theres a witch hunt going on for pedophiles in this country. Click to expand +1. I was trying to be light on the guy but he doesn't seem to keep up with what's going on. [Link]
Shagdog Member Houston 626 Posts 1/07	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:41AM Dither wrote: absynth wrote: Would seem to me that the FBI's Cyber Crimes Division would have a Hell of a lot more on its plate than dealing with 80's flicks of Traci Lords (like perhaps bringing those who exploit children online to justice TODAY.) That being said, with all the porn that's out there, it shouldn't be difficult to NOT purchase/download/view porn that is technically illegal. Click to expand Agreed. It's only child porn de jure and if resources are spent targeting people who happen to own one or two questionable videos it's completely out of line. I queried in a net-meeting with the director of the national (not US) cyber-crime and child porn police unit recently and was somewhat reassured on that point. About the risk of getting stuck by accident that is. He said they targeted people who produced or participated in networks distributing large quantities of illegal material, and the risk of having the police bust your door for visiting the wrong website by accident was very small. Still, I wouldn't go digging for pre-legal Traci Lords material without a proxy. Actually I wouldn't go digging for it at all. Click to expand Thats the Feds but You also have District Attorneys. Go though a divorce or have them on a work computer, show them to a buddy these are all way people get caught with them. I just stay legal and sleep good at night. [Link]
BlackSix All-Star Member pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 4:50AM Shagdog wrote: In case you've been living under a rock. Theres a witch hunt going on for pedophiles in this country. Click to expand Yeah, those poor pedophiles, you gotta feel for them. [Link]
caroline-NL Member 543 Posts 3/07	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 8:39AM jack33139 wrote: My main question was hypothetical and really remains unanswered: Do you have to SEEK OUT child porn to be eligible for prosecution, or could someone get trapped simply be reading the wrong internet thread? Thanks again for the replies. Click to expand "Reading the wrong internet thread" isnt illegal. But if you click on a link, then you have visited the page. Even if it was only for a second. On X-Mas, german authorities made public, that 12 000 (!) people clicked or even downloaded something on a mysterious teen porn site. ( Police called it : "Operation Sky", but for most it was "Hell on earth" ) Even the ones who only clicked this link ( described as young teen porn, which isnt illegal in Germany, porn with > 14 is still legal here ), were drawn into this case. Some girls may be 13 - or not. In the background, investigators claimed, that real cp (<14 under german law) was exchanged. So you even can get in trouble, if you search for "normal teen porn" or " cartoons for children ", because you cant know, what really is behind this link. Chance is 0,0001%, but it is possible. Back to Traci: To seek for her old movies in the USA/CAN is illegal. After the Traci scandal "bombed", police/justice confiscated the videos. But today they set preferences. These movies had a very wide distribution and many, many people still have these movies. Usually, they dont waste manpower on this. BUT if someone makes a complaint, e.g. a father telling the police: " My son has these videos ", then they have to follow the law. I wouldnt search for it, if I would be living in the USA or CAN. ( Porn with at least 15+ up has nothing in common with cp, but thats another thing..) [Link]
maltedecker All-Star Member 369 Posts 5/07	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 10:14AM i didn't know that the german laws were like that when it comes to porn. i thought it would be 18 too. that's pretty weird but explains why i still find some traci stuff here in the shops somtimes (i always wondered about that). thanks for the info! [Link]
Shagdog Member Houston 626 Posts 1/07	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 10:50AM BlackSix wrote: Shagdog wrote: In case you've been living under a rock. Theres a witch hunt going on for pedophiles in this country. Click to expand Yeah, those poor pedophiles, you gotta feel for them. Click to expand Real pedophiles no. But victims of this witch hunt yes The problem is most sane peoples vision of a pedophile does not match with who the government is prosecuting. The majority of those convicted and labeled as pedophiles are not pedophiles at all. A lot of them are minors themselves that were declared adults by the state and convicted as adults. There is a witch hunt going on. And I make sure I stay well with in the law. I really doubt that the average porn viewer of today would find the quality and angles of those old tapes that appealing. We're watching the best porn and prettiest ladies fucking right now. Edited by - Shagdog on 1/29/2008 10:58:22 AM [Link]
Myload Senior Member A rose is what you are to me 2069 Posts 6/03	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 11:59AM In ways I can see why someone would want Traci's movies. Yes, they're illegal to own, but they still are collectors items because they are completely irreplaceable. I know there are people who still have her movies, and I can be sure they're keeping them for that reason. I personally don't know anyone who has any of her movies. [Link]
caroline-NL Member 543 Posts 3/07	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:20PM maltedecker wrote: i didn't know that the german laws were like that when it comes to porn. i thought it would be 18 too. that's pretty weird but explains why i still find some traci stuff here in the shops somtimes (i always wondered about that). thanks for the info! Click to expand Dear Malte Decker, you can check the actual laws at the bka.de site. ( Bundeskriminalamt, the german equivalent of the FBI ) For all no german speaking readers: § 184(b) german law: child porn is defined as porn with children. Children are, according to german law, kids under 14 years of age. ( In words: Fourteen ) In the next weeks, they want to adapt the US laws. And raise the minimum age to 18. You can read more infos here: http://schutzalter.twoday.net To the administrators/moderators: This website has no illegal content, even under US/CAN laws. No pictures, but text explaining the recent german laws and the new EU laws, that really arent EU laws at all, but a word by word translation of the US "porn" laws. Whole Europe seems to be a single state of the "United States of America". Didnt knew that before......... [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 4:25PM Myload wrote: In ways I can see why someone would want Traci's movies. Yes, they're illegal to own, but they still are collectors items because they are completely irreplaceable. I know there are people who still have her movies, and I can be sure they're keeping them for that reason. I personally don't know anyone who has any of her movies. Click to expand Look. It doesn't matter why someone has them or why they would want to keep them. They'd have to be completely nuts to do so in America these days. It's like playing Russian roulette. Literally. It does not matter how old the tapes are or that Traci duped the people in the industry. She was 15 and it's illegal. Simple as that. If you have it and are discovered, you could potentially be treated like the worst murderer or rapist. Is that even remotely worth it? If you end up on a sex offender list, people aren't going to care why. You'll have a great big red P stamped on your forehead wherever you go. That's reality. I'm sure people still have them but they're playing games with their lives and their reputations. [Link]
kataboom master blaster ad astra per aspera 995 Posts 6/03	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 7:02PM Cammy Sutra wrote: eventually everyone will be labeled a pederast. Click to expand what do you mean? [Link]
jack33139 Member 85 Posts 1/08	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 8:00PM Thanks for the additional replies. With all due respect, it seems a couple people here have a reading comprehension problem. I explained the situation quite clearly and people continue to insist that I am, or was, seeking out underage Traci Lords material. That is not the case, and couldn't be further from the truth. I simply clicked a link -- entitled "Women of 1980s Porn" -- at a very well-known site, and was surprised when a couple of pictures of a naked Traci Lords popped up on my screen (on maybe page 5 of a very, very long thread). That got me to thinking about legal technicalities -- e.g., am I a collector of child porn because I have two Traci Lords pics in my browser cache? I understand 100% that Traci Lords material is 100% illegal in the U.S. I'm not arguing that fact. My only point, in my post yesterday or the day before, is that it seems unlikely that a person who was looking for Picture #1 but instead was served Picture #2, is somehow a collector of child porn, or would need to register, etc., etc. I just went back and checked, and over 135,000 people have viewed the thread in question. (Again, it's at a VERY well-known site.) The idea that the federal government would like to add 135,000 people to a federal registry because they saw two pictures of Traci Lords -- in a thread that had NOTHING TO DO with Traci Lords -- strikes me as absurd. Again, thanks for the replies. Still an interesting subject some 20 years later. [Link]
RandomPrecision Senior Member Enjoy! 8175 Posts 3/06	Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 8:26PM kataboom wrote: Cammy Sutra wrote: eventually everyone will be labeled a pederast. Click to expand what do you mean? Click to expand Just a guess but I think he was implying that in the future, everyone will be called footstools. [Link]

Author

Post

jack33139
Member

85 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 26 2008 : 9:01PM

I know everything about Traci Lords has been debated to death in the porn industry, but I'm still unclear on the *exact* status and legality of the stuff she did while underage.
Before people start flaming me, Traci Lords is about 5 years older than me and the whole issue of her being underage blew up several years before I saw my first porn vid in my early teens. I know her stuff was pulled from the shelves and the whole thing was a huge affair, with legal consequences, etc., but I'm starting to see more and more of her pictures and videos online.
I hadn't even thought of Traci Lords in years, but I was recently reading a thread on another site and before I knew it, I had a naked Traci Lords on my screen (a few screen caps had been uploaded as attachments in a thread I was reading). I've also seen huge collections of Traci Lords scenes available as downloads at RapidShare, etc.
Anyway, what is the exact status of her stuff? Is it illegal, across the board, to own, possess, view, etc., her stuff, or is it simply illegal to sell the stuff? Are there differences between the laws in the U.S. and foreign countries (e.g., illegal to own/view in U.S., but okay in some other countries)?
It's no big deal -- I'm not building any Traci Lords collections -- but I was wondering if I'm technically a collector of child porn since there's likely a couple naked pictures of Lords in my browser's cache right now. I noticed a lawyer posts here; perhaps he knows the exact status. Thanks.

[Link]

Harri Patel
Senior Member

#SDNY he's all yours. -- Michael Steele
5110 Posts
3/03

Posted - Jan 26 2008 : 9:12PM

She made one movie after she turned eighteen. Other than that, it's all illegal in the US.

[Link]

nietzsche
Deactivated User

5470 Posts
8/03

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 12:24AM

I believe if the police really want to go after you, yes you are in possession of illegal pornography. If that were your only offense, they'd probably let you off with a listing on the national child molester database, you'd have to notify authorities every time you move, and finding employment would become exponentially more difficult.

[Link]

Shagdog
Member

Houston
626 Posts
1/07

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 12:53AM

When all that went down I had some of her tapes. I burned them. I watch porn for entertainment I don't need jail because of it.
When in doubt I error on the side that is for sure legal.
Now that being said. She looked 15 and as it turns out she was.
But her saying she didn't enjoy doing porn is lie. Anyone who saw her knew it was real excitement not fake.
Edited by - Shagdog on 1/27/2008 1:12:27 AM
Edited by - Shagdog on 1/27/2008 7:12:19 PM

[Link]

Flash

Golden Age Classic

11018 Posts
5/01

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 6:14PM

With the exception of the title Traci I Love You all of her titles are illegal to view, download, etc in the USA.

[Link]

blowfish
Member

874 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 6:33PM

Probably would not get convicted but I wouldn't risk it. Definitely a parole violation though.
Edited by - blowfish on 1/27/2008 7:12:39 PM

[Link]

Shagdog
Member

Houston
626 Posts
1/07

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:11PM

Edited by - Shagdog on 1/27/2008 7:11:56 PM

[Link]

Myload
Senior Member

A rose is what you are to me
2069 Posts
6/03

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:26PM

The only Traci Lords film I ever got to see was "Traci I Love You". Even though I was watching porn when her other movies were still available, by the time I discovered her the truth came out and all of those movies were gone.

[Link]

backdoorman
Senior Member

Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman !
2776 Posts
10/07

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:50PM

Her movies sell like hot cakes on ebay. She is always either non credited or listed as Nora Kay with no link to IAFD in the descriptions and "no" I don't have any of them. Just saying.
"Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed

[Link]

Harri Patel
Senior Member

#SDNY he's all yours. -- Michael Steele
5110 Posts
3/03

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 7:57PM

She looked the same in that one as she did in the other ones. I disagree with the comment above about her looking 15 -- she looked about the same as the other big-hair, heavily made up performers who were working at that time. I don't know why anyone would want to put themselves at any legal risk, however small, to obtain illegal movies or pictures of a minor who actually appears to be an adult.
Edited by - Harri Patel on 1/27/2008 7:58:43 PM

[Link]

Myload
Senior Member

A rose is what you are to me
2069 Posts
6/03

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:11PM

I agree with that. I thought she was hot-looking at the time. I even named one of my cats after her. But I didn't think she looked underage.

It's probably because they're major collectors items. Obviously I don't know for sure, but that would be my guess.
Edited to correct a serious typo.
Edited by - Myload on 1/28/2008 12:26:53 AM

[Link]

Cammy Sutra
Member

41 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:18PM

When you masturbate think of the government in the room.

[Link]

backdoorman
Senior Member

Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman !
2776 Posts
10/07

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:25PM

I never saw the movie but did the preview. It was a Lolita type movie with her and Ginger Lynn. It might of been her first movie. She did not look old enough to be out of middle school let alone in a porn film. Her tits weren't even formed and she had a lot of baby fat. It kind of freaked me out even before I knew she was illegal.
"Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed

[Link]

backdoorman
Senior Member

Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman !
2776 Posts
10/07

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:31PM

Those young girls is the movie I was referring too. Not her first but maybe second. Her first was What gets me hot.
"Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed

[Link]

RandomPrecision
Senior Member

Enjoy!
8175 Posts
3/06

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 8:40PM

I never understood the obsession with her or the fuss. I wasn't watching porn when all of that happened and never really bothered to look into it. But it makes little sense to me that anyone would even want to risk going anywhere near it since almost everyone knows most of what she did was when she was underage. Particularly in today's climate, this kind of stuff is the equivalent of playing with fire. And I mean that in the worst kind of way. Stay away from it if you know what's good for you. Don't go near it, don't look for it and especially don't download it.
Edited by - randomprecision on 1/27/2008 8:45:32 PM

[Link]

Cammy Sutra
Member

41 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 10:17PM

worked for prohibition!

[Link]

jack33139
Member

85 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 27 2008 : 11:58PM

Thanks for the replies. About what I expected, although the idea -- as stated by 'nietzsche' -- that law enforcement might force me to register as a sex offender because I happened to read a "1980s Women of Porn" thread on the 'net strikes me as a huge reach.
Anyway, are these videos legal in places outside the U.S.? As I mentioned in the OP, I see RapidShare links for entire Traci Lords collections all the time lately. Are these people just nutcases for posting illegal material for public download, or are they likely posting from somewhere those videos are legal?
Also, are Lords' underage videos considered "child porn" or "illegal porn"? Clearly, the 17-year-old Lords wasn't a "child," but I'm not sure if there's a distinction or if everything underage is lumped into the "child porn" category.
Thanks again for the replies. Very interesting. It's kind of amazing Traci Lords is still such a hot topic. Can you imagine if that whole affair had happened in the Internet age instead of the '80s?

[Link]

kataboom
master blaster

ad astra per aspera
995 Posts
6/03

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:39AM

i would avoid having any of traci's stuff in america. you could go to jail for mandatory sentences if a cop(with a casual knowledge of porn history) had a grudge towards you. imagine being labeled a pederast! fuck that...no thx

[Link]

kataboom
master blaster

ad astra per aspera
995 Posts
6/03

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:50AM

traci's vids are pretty much no big deal outside the u.s. its technically illegal but the enforcement is lax because hell, she does look over 18! they only slam the pervs with the "real" child stuff. i wouldn't mention rapidshare because thats implying file-sharing which is a no no here on adt.

yes they are considered both illegal & child porn. it was mainstream news so you can expect any district attorney to charge you because of all the documented history in this instance.

[Link]

RandomPrecision
Senior Member

Enjoy!
8175 Posts
3/06

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:57AM

Think so? If a 19 year old can be put on the list for having a 17 year old GF, you'd better believe they'd go after you for this if they caught you with it. Again, why? There's plenty of legal porn. Who needs the trouble? What's the point?

Yes. I don't understand it. You'd think nobody would even want to discuss it. But again. I'd leave it be. Why take the risk?

[Link]

Cammy Sutra
Member

41 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:59AM

eventually everyone will be labeled a pederast.

[Link]

BSD
Senior Member

San Diego, CA
2508 Posts
11/03

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:30AM

Friends -
I saw Traci Lord's work before and after the revelation, and the resulting controversy didn't up the titillation factor for me. She looked and acted like the standard era 80's porn girl to me, and the later knowledge that she was underaged didn't particularly add anything to it.
The one that HAS given me pause and regret after all these years, is the Alexandria Quinn scene with Rocco and Sunny McKay that Stagliano had to cut out of "Buttman's Ultimate Workout". Not because Alexandria's underage status made it more noteworthy, but because it was my all time favorite scene of hers, and I didn't get to own it. I saw it a couple of times as a rental, loved it, and then when I finally got around to wanting to own it, the shit had hit the fan and it was cut from the movie. She was magnificent in that scene. To see what we later learned was a 17 year old girl handling Rocco like a champ, giving as good as she got, was truly beautiful. She rocked his world. And I never saw it again.
Tricia, if you're listening...
Never mind, I didn't say that.
BSD

[Link]

jizzlobber
Member

21 Posts
11/07

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:34AM

Coz we all want what we can't have ;)
Maybe because Traci was at the beginning of mass-market porn success (like Elvis fans lol)? But for me she was hot with a sexy mouth and amazing nipples and to this day she still made the best orgasm noises at the end of the scene to cum too.
Anyone know the movie she did with John Leslie dressed as a knight in armor?

[Link]

Dean Wormer
Senior Member

Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.
1048 Posts
7/04

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:10AM

In about 1993 I bought a vhs tape at my local porn store because it offered several Christy Canyon scenes in it. Lo and behold towards the end of the tape who should appear on my t.v. screen? It was Traci doing Herschel Savage and some other chick. I have to assume that on compilation tapes of that era there could be other Traci scenes that would be available. At least until tape started dying. Needless to say I watched that scene quite often until it wore out about ten years ago.
Also about 1988 a guy I worked with would bring in tapes for me that he had made copies of over the years. One of them was "Those Young Girls" (as previously mentioned in this thread). He had so much porn that he didn't even realize he had a Traci tape.

[Link]

Cerebral Jedi
Senior Member

I don't trust men who don't like big tits.
1067 Posts
12/04

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:48AM

Dude I don't know how much clearer it can be made. IT'S ILLEGAL! No matter what kind of media it is, whether it's on tape, disc, COMPUTER FILE, hologram, retinal implant etc...It's illegal.

[Link]

backdoorman
Senior Member

Shake for me girl... I wanna be your backdoorman !
2776 Posts
10/07

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 9:46AM

yes it's illegal but there's a lot of it out there I assure you. I don't have any interest in it and I was never here.
"Censorship is the first step towards dictatorship !" Honest Ed

[Link]

absynth
Member

absynth makes the heart grow fonder
434 Posts
8/06

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 11:15AM

Would seem to me that the FBI's Cyber Crimes Division would have a Hell of a lot more on its plate than dealing with 80's flicks of Traci Lords (like perhaps bringing those who exploit children online to justice TODAY.) That being said, with all the porn that's out there, it shouldn't be difficult to NOT purchase/download/view porn that is technically illegal.

[Link]

Asmodeus
Lord of Lust

az-mo-day-us
6338 Posts
10/01

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 11:16AM

Traci Lords is all hype as far as I'm concerned. I've been around porn long enough to have seen many of her movies and she never really did anything for me. She just wasn't a very good preformer in my humble opinion and there were plenty of other hotter babes at that time who blew her out of the water. As for her stuff being called child porn, I think that's a little ridiculous considering she was only about 2 years shy of the age of consent. There's plenty of real kiddie porn on the Net that the Feds should be after instead of worrying about borderline stuff from over 20 years ago.
Edited by - Asmodeus on 1/28/2008 11:17:37 AM

[Link]

bigfoot
Senior Member

1295 Posts
7/06

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 12:06PM

Here's my take on the whole TL situation. Traci was in with the first group of starlets that made it big on the first wave of home video rentals and sales (Can you imagine paying $99.95 for a porn VHS tape? That's what they charged you if you lost your rental!). Ginger, Traci, and Christy topped that class and everyone into porn collected tapes featuring those women. I know I did - including Traci's.
Fast forward 22 years - Having seen her tapes and more than 1,000 other porn titles since then, there are only a handful of the Traci tapes that stand out...BUT NOT BECAUSE OF TRACI!!! For example, "New Wave Hookers" was all about Ginger Lynn and Kristara Barrington. Tracy was in one scene and it barely registered (b/g with Rick Cassidy?!?). She couldn't act, even by porn standards and the only thing she was good for was the sex, but come on people! There are hundred's of viable porn actresses out there doing gonzo and features that are so much better looking than Traci, perform MUCH nastier sex acts than Traci, have real life EXPERIENCE that shows on camera (Traci, for all her "confidence" had nothing on actresses like Sandra Romain), have bodies that are actually women's bodies (where, for example, their tits have dropped), and are available legally anytime, anywhere so long as you are at least 18 years old. If you are looking for women who appear to be young, go search for a Leah Luv or Kitty DVD. Leah looks about 16 and Kitty looks about 13. If that is your thing, more power to you (just please stay away from my kids!).
I've long since destroyed any TL tapes I owned because, well, I enjoy my freedom. Also, whatever it is that turns you on to TL, there are many, MANY options available in the world of porn that will be a better use of your time. IT IS TIME TO LET TRACI LORDS, PORNSTAR, REST IN PEACE. It is time to embrace what modern porn, in it's superior formats has to offer because if you are unable to let go of the need to possess TL material, you deserve to be busted...if that is what happens. If not, you need psychiatric help.
My suggestion, let it go people, just let it go. Move on with your lives...

[Link]

caroline-NL
Member

543 Posts
3/07

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:05PM

Traci didnt looked like 15, when she started. She looked much older. All estimated her age as 18. Technically, because she was under 18 in all her old movies except the last, at least under US/CAN laws, this is childporn.
( In my opinion, total nonsense ).
So even possession is illegal.
But Ive often heard, that some canadian and even some US shops had these videos. And that the police wasnt interested to confiscate them. One of the best known FBI child porn investigator, Mr. Lanning, said in an interview: " Traci Lords was underage, but the customers who watched, collected or bought her movies, werent interested in cp at all. If somebody talks like a duck, walks like a duck, looks like a duck, it is a duck. But we have to treat her movies like illegal material. "

[Link]

caroline-NL
Member

543 Posts
3/07

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 1:14PM

@jack33139:
Traci Lords Material isnt illegal in all countries, it is still legal to sale/buy/view/own in Germany.
( They still have a low 14 years minimum age for porn, but want to change this in the next weeks ).
It is still legal to watch and possess it in Japan. It is de jure illegal in almost all european countries now, because we adapted the US laws, even in the Netherlands and Denmark, but I dont know one single case, where OLD material with actors 15 years of age and older was confiscated in these countries.

[Link]

Smiler Grogan

All-Star Member

the war cry
14790 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 3:51PM

Yes, Yes, YES. As of 1996's Child Pornography Prevention Act. Anything (pictures, video) that features anyone under 18 in a sexual situation is potentially - potentially being the key word here - CHILD PORN.
If the participants are 17 years and 364 days old, it's child porn.
If two under-18 participants are having sex and film it, it's child porn.
Display a nude picture of someone under-18 on a website, (even if a family website and the picture in question is a 3 year old) it's child porn. See the 2257 Laws.
Films that display simulated sex featuring performers who are portraying under 18's could also be banned.
(See controversy over the movie The Tin Drum )
There have been cases, at the state and local levels, where the above circumstances have all been prosecuted.
It's really best to just STAY AWAY.

[Link]

Narcissus
Deactivated User

Love Thyself
418 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:16PM

with all this talk about Traci, it just make people more curious to see her vids. like me. i am more curious now. i am not in the United States, thankfully. so, someone please put up some links where we outside the US can see the vids.

[Link]

Drew Black
broken crankshaft

8011 Posts
9/99

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 4:49PM

Do not put up links to her pre-adult movies from here. It's a huge no-no to link to child pornography. I'll delete your post and deactivate your account immediately. There's plenty of other places in the world you can search for this stuff. We simply cannot tolerate that kind of activity here.

[Link]

Myload
Senior Member

A rose is what you are to me
2069 Posts
6/03

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 6:54PM

Traci will always be a big part of porn history. She will always be one of porn's biggest names. Regardless of her being underage when most of her movies were made, she has made her mark in the industry, and that will never go away.
I personally don't understand why the government would even care about movies that are over twenty years old. Like other people have pointed out, there are more important things out there to deal with. If I had been able to have bought some of her movies, I definitely wouldn't tell anyone. But like I said, I never got that chance.

[Link]

Dither
Persona non grata

I love America
650 Posts
8/05

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 7:19PM

Agreed. It's only child porn de jure and if resources are spent targeting people who happen to own one or two questionable videos it's completely out of line. I queried in a net-meeting with the director of the national (not US) cyber-crime and child porn police unit recently and was somewhat reassured on that point. About the risk of getting stuck by accident that is. He said they targeted people who produced or participated in networks distributing large quantities of illegal material, and the risk of having the police bust your door for visiting the wrong website by accident was very small.
Still, I wouldn't go digging for pre-legal Traci Lords material without a proxy. Actually I wouldn't go digging for it at all.

[Link]

Shagdog
Member

Houston
626 Posts
1/07

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 7:25PM

They care because of one word. ELECTION. District Attorneys love to wave child porn convictions at the voters.
With Traci's videos the case is so easy the facts are there.

[Link]

jack33139
Member

85 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 28 2008 : 11:03PM

Thanks for all of the additional replies.
As I tried to make clear, I'm not building a Traci Lords collection, etc., etc. I simply saw one or two naked pictures of her that were embedded in a thread at another site (a very well-known site, actually, which made it all the more surprising), and then a couple days later I saw a list of about 30 links to her various porn scenes. That got me wondering about the legality of the stuff, both within the U.S. and abroad. I was 99% sure it was across-the-board illegal, but wasn't sure if the sudden reemergence of the stuff online was because of a change in the laws or law enforcement, or because the government has other people to target, or because the stuff is legal outside the U.S. and people post it at will without caring at all about legal issues.
My main question was hypothetical and really remains unanswered: Do you have to SEEK OUT child porn to be eligible for prosecution, or could someone get trapped simply be reading the wrong internet thread? It seems like one thing to have DVDs shipped to your front door but quite another to click a link hoping to see Barbara Dare and Cheri Taylor naked (e.g., in the "Women of the 1980s" thread I mentioned above) and suddenly have a naked Traci Lords looking back at you.
Thanks again for the replies.

[Link]

Shagdog
Member

Houston
626 Posts
1/07

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:08AM

Yes you will be prosecuted. The prosecutor will leave it up to you and your attorney to convince a jury of your innocence.
And the government will also entrap you.
In case you've been living under a rock. Theres a witch hunt going on for pedophiles in this country.
17 yr olds are going to prison for sex with 15 yr olds. In Dallas they want to charge 2 14 yr old girls with making child porn for taking naked pictures of each other.
The only porn I watch is American made porn by American porn company's. The big companies that operate under the 2257 laws.
I also don't trade or open email with porn in them any more. I will open links on this board because the Mods do their job.

Edited by - Shagdog on 1/29/2008 12:14:48 AM

[Link]

nietzsche
Deactivated User

5470 Posts
8/03

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:12AM

+1. I was trying to be light on the guy but he doesn't seem to keep up with what's going on.

[Link]

Shagdog
Member

Houston
626 Posts
1/07

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:41AM

Dither wrote:
absynth wrote:
Would seem to me that the FBI's Cyber Crimes Division would have a Hell of a lot more on its plate than dealing with 80's flicks of Traci Lords (like perhaps bringing those who exploit children online to justice TODAY.) That being said, with all the porn that's out there, it shouldn't be difficult to NOT purchase/download/view porn that is technically illegal.
Click to expand
Agreed. It's only child porn de jure and if resources are spent targeting people who happen to own one or two questionable videos it's completely out of line. I queried in a net-meeting with the director of the national (not US) cyber-crime and child porn police unit recently and was somewhat reassured on that point. About the risk of getting stuck by accident that is. He said they targeted people who produced or participated in networks distributing large quantities of illegal material, and the risk of having the police bust your door for visiting the wrong website by accident was very small.
Still, I wouldn't go digging for pre-legal Traci Lords material without a proxy. Actually I wouldn't go digging for it at all.
Click to expand

Thats the Feds but You also have District Attorneys. Go though a divorce or have them on a work computer, show them to a buddy these are all way people get caught with them.
I just stay legal and sleep good at night.

[Link]

BlackSix

All-Star Member

pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world
12377 Posts
9/07

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 4:50AM

Yeah, those poor pedophiles, you gotta feel for them.

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caroline-NL
Member

543 Posts
3/07

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 8:39AM

"Reading the wrong internet thread" isnt illegal. But if you click on a link, then you have visited the page. Even if it was only for a second. On X-Mas, german authorities made public, that 12 000 (!) people clicked or even downloaded something on a mysterious teen porn site. ( Police called it : "Operation Sky", but for most it was "Hell on earth" ) Even the ones who only clicked this link ( described as young teen porn, which isnt illegal in Germany, porn with > 14 is still legal here ), were drawn into this case. Some girls may be 13 - or not. In the background, investigators claimed, that real cp (<14 under german law) was exchanged. So you even can get in trouble, if you search for "normal teen porn" or " cartoons for children ", because you cant know, what really is behind this link. Chance is 0,0001%, but it is possible.
Back to Traci: To seek for her old movies in the USA/CAN is illegal. After the Traci scandal "bombed", police/justice confiscated the videos. But today they set preferences. These movies had a very wide distribution and many, many people still have these movies. Usually, they dont waste manpower on this. BUT if someone makes a complaint, e.g. a father telling the police: " My son has these videos ", then they have to follow the law.
I wouldnt search for it, if I would be living in the USA or CAN.
( Porn with at least 15+ up has nothing in common with cp, but thats another thing..)

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maltedecker

All-Star Member

369 Posts
5/07

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 10:14AM

i didn't know that the german laws were like that when it comes to porn. i thought it would be 18 too. that's pretty weird but explains why i still find some traci stuff here in the shops somtimes (i always wondered about that). thanks for the info!

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Shagdog
Member

Houston
626 Posts
1/07

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 10:50AM

Real pedophiles no. But victims of this witch hunt yes
The problem is most sane peoples vision of a pedophile does not match with who the government is prosecuting.
The majority of those convicted and labeled as pedophiles are not pedophiles at all. A lot of them are minors themselves that were declared adults by the state and convicted as adults.
There is a witch hunt going on.
And I make sure I stay well with in the law.
I really doubt that the average porn viewer of today would find the quality and angles of those old tapes that appealing.
We're watching the best porn and prettiest ladies fucking right now.
Edited by - Shagdog on 1/29/2008 10:58:22 AM

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Myload
Senior Member

A rose is what you are to me
2069 Posts
6/03

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 11:59AM

In ways I can see why someone would want Traci's movies. Yes, they're illegal to own, but they still are collectors items because they are completely irreplaceable. I know there are people who still have her movies, and I can be sure they're keeping them for that reason. I personally don't know anyone who has any of her movies.

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caroline-NL
Member

543 Posts
3/07

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 12:20PM

Dear Malte Decker,
you can check the actual laws at the bka.de site.
( Bundeskriminalamt, the german equivalent of the FBI )
For all no german speaking readers:
§ 184(b) german law: child porn is defined as porn with children. Children are, according to german law, kids under 14 years of age.
( In words: Fourteen )
In the next weeks, they want to adapt the US laws. And raise the minimum age to 18.
You can read more infos here:
http://schutzalter.twoday.net
To the administrators/moderators:
This website has no illegal content, even under US/CAN laws. No pictures, but text explaining the recent german laws and the new
EU laws, that really arent EU laws at all, but a word by word translation of the US "porn" laws. Whole Europe seems to be a single state of the "United States of America". Didnt knew that before.........

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RandomPrecision
Senior Member

Enjoy!
8175 Posts
3/06

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 4:25PM

Look. It doesn't matter why someone has them or why they would want to keep them. They'd have to be completely nuts to do so in America these days. It's like playing Russian roulette. Literally. It does not matter how old the tapes are or that Traci duped the people in the industry. She was 15 and it's illegal. Simple as that. If you have it and are discovered, you could potentially be treated like the worst murderer or rapist. Is that even remotely worth it? If you end up on a sex offender list, people aren't going to care why. You'll have a great big red P stamped on your forehead wherever you go. That's reality.
I'm sure people still have them but they're playing games with their lives and their reputations.

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kataboom
master blaster

ad astra per aspera
995 Posts
6/03

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 7:02PM

what do you mean?

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jack33139
Member

85 Posts
1/08

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 8:00PM

Thanks for the additional replies.
With all due respect, it seems a couple people here have a reading comprehension problem. I explained the situation quite clearly and people continue to insist that I am, or was, seeking out underage Traci Lords material. That is not the case, and couldn't be further from the truth.
I simply clicked a link -- entitled "Women of 1980s Porn" -- at a very well-known site, and was surprised when a couple of pictures of a naked Traci Lords popped up on my screen (on maybe page 5 of a very, very long thread).
That got me to thinking about legal technicalities -- e.g., am I a collector of child porn because I have two Traci Lords pics in my browser cache?
I understand 100% that Traci Lords material is 100% illegal in the U.S. I'm not arguing that fact. My only point, in my post yesterday or the day before, is that it seems unlikely that a person who was looking for Picture #1 but instead was served Picture #2, is somehow a collector of child porn, or would need to register, etc., etc.
I just went back and checked, and over 135,000 people have viewed the thread in question. (Again, it's at a VERY well-known site.) The idea that the federal government would like to add 135,000 people to a federal registry because they saw two pictures of Traci Lords -- in a thread that had NOTHING TO DO with Traci Lords -- strikes me as absurd.
Again, thanks for the replies. Still an interesting subject some 20 years later.

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RandomPrecision
Senior Member

Enjoy!
8175 Posts
3/06

Posted - Jan 29 2008 : 8:26PM

Just a guess but I think he was implying that in the future, everyone will be called footstools.

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