But in almost all US States, sex is legal with 16, or ? But when you film it or even yourself, if you are a minor, you produce "childporn". But 16 and 17 year old Teenagers arent children. This law is idiotic ! hollywood woody wroteIn every group, SOME arent understanding anything at all. You cant make a general law, because SOME dont understand this or that. How many 30-year old men cant drive a car, but have a drivers license ? How many US citizens are prepared to take care of weapons and use these weapons with responsibility ? I am NOT defending pedophiles, not at all, but 16 or 17 year old Teenagers arent small kids. Even some anti-childporn experts demand moderate law changes. Just re-read Philipp Jenkins: " Beyond Tolerance " again. Because the topic is moving away from Traci Lords, you should continue it in the "Danish Teen Porn Controversy" thread.Everyday English may be true, but its scientifically incorrect. Scientist shoulndt use everyday english or rely on hearsay, but some do this, because they are on the payroll of the US ( or the new conservative dutch ) government. These arent scientists, but spokesmen for the government. Edited by - Caroline-NL on 7/25/2008 4:49:51 PM
Many also have a clause stating that you have to be under 18 or 18 or under, I can't remember the way it is written to have sex with a 16 or 17 year old so if you are 21 that is against the law. Since you have to be 18 to 21 depending on the state to buy porn the people who could watch can't so therefore it is illegal. You have made it clear that you are in favor of having child porn be legal, which is something I can't agree with. I don't feel that there is any reason why porn featuring 16 or 17 year olds is necessary. Let people grow up and make mistakes that aren't going to follow them for their lives and make the choice when they are, hopefully, making less mistakes.
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conquistador Deactivated User
Hellhamster. 2947 Posts 10/03
Posted - Jul 25 2008 : 4:55PM
I want to point out to caroline that the sex laws in some states are kind of tricky. For instance in Pennsylvania when I was 18 I could have legally had sex with a 16 year old given the close difference in our ages. But at the same time if her parents didn't approve they could get me arrested for "corruption of minors" because she is still 16 and under their supervision. I can only speak about Pennsylvania but I have reason to believe other states have similar laws in place. In the us if you are under 18 you are not considered an adult in the eyes of the law no matter how mature you behave. Your parents are responsible for you till you are a grown up.
Death is caused by swallowing small amounts of saliva over a long period of time. George Carlin 1567 Posts 2/07
Posted - Jul 25 2008 : 4:57PM
The legal age is different in each state. here is the chart. AGE OF CONSENT CHART Understanding the Age of Conset: Current as of August 2001
Country
USA by State:
Alabama Heterosexual M/M Homosexual F/FHomosexual 16 illegal illegal Alaska 16 16 16 Arizona 18 illegal illegal Arkansas 16 illegal illegal California 18 18 18 Colorado 17 17 17 Connecticut 15 (pc) 16 (npc) no current law no current law D.C. 16 no current law no current law Delaware 16 (pc) 18 (npc) no current law no current law Florida 18 illegal illegal Georgia 16 (under challenge) 16 16 Hawaii 14 no current law no current law Idaho 16 (pc) 18 (npc) illegal illegal Illinois 17 17 17 Indiana 16 16 16 Iowa 14(pc) 18(npc) no current law no current law Kansas 16 illegal illegal Kentucky 16 no current law no current law Louisiana 17 illegal (under appeal) illegal (under appeal) Maine 16 16 16 Maryland 16 no current law no current law Massachusetts 16 (pc) 18 (npc) illegal illegal Michigan 16 illegal illegal Minnesota 16 illegal illegal Mississippi 16 illegal illegal Missouri 17 illegal illegal Montana 16 (pc) 18 (npc) 18 18 Nebraska 17 no current law no current law Nevada 16 18 18 New Hampshire 16 18 18 New Jersey 16 16 16 New Mexico 17 13 (under appeal) 13 (under appeal) New York 17 17 17 North Carolina 16 illegal illegal North Dakota 18 18 18 Ohio 16 no current law no current law Oklahoma 16 illegal illegal Oregon 18 18 18 Pennsylvania 16 16 16 Rhode Island 16 no current law no current law South Carolina 14 (pc) 16 (npc) illegal illegal South Dakota 16 no current law no current law Tennessee 18 no current law no current law Texas 17 illegal illegal Utah 16 (pc) 18 (npc) illegal illegal Vermont 16 no current law no current law Virginia 18 illegal illegal Washington 16 16 16 West Virginia 16 no current law no current law Wisconsin 18 18 18 Wyoming 16 (pc) 18 (npc) no current law no current law Members - US Military 16 "don't ask, don't tell" "don't ask, don't tell" USA Citizen Outside USA 18 no current law no current law
Yes it is and it is practiced as well. I have read numerous stories in the newspaper over the years I've been alive about 2 men caught having sex in public where they are also charged with having homosexual sex as well. This country is extremely homophobic for some reason. If you need proof of that look no further than how many states have outlawed same sex marriage. The age part is also prosecuted and is a serious charge. If a parent catches you having sex with their child in a state where you can't legally for one reason or another and reports it, you get brought up on statutory rape charges. If you are found guilty there is jail time and you get to tell your neighbors and employers for the rest of your life what you did. This is irregardless of whether both couples were consenting.
No it's not. The US supreme court ruled states cannot enforce these laws. See Lawrence v. Texas Now nothing forces states to remove these laws from there books. But they can't be enforce. If they try states will have to pay legal fees, court cost and damages. Now if your caught having sex in a public rest room. You will be charged for having sex with another man, but not for the homosexual act. And you will have too provide details to your employer.
I think it shows how people believe adequately since the state laws are voted on by the people who live in each state in private. Also some of the states with strong homosexual movements in them may have not put same sex marriage on the ballot yet.No, because they would first have to prove that they are having sex before they could arrest them. On the porn that's a good question. I checked and neither DVD Empire nor TLA Video maintain separate no ship lists for gay or straight material for the US. I honestly don't know how that works.I believe that a city in Florida has a law against quacking like a duck while crossing the street.
I think the porn sellers use an all-encompassing "community standards" assessment and don't make distinctions based on the specific porn product being shipped. For example JBvideo's product line is at least 75% softcore, and the rest is very mild hardcore, but they will not ship to me regardless of what titles I want to buy.
According to Wikipedia Pedophilia has three definitions Pedophilia range of definitions as found in psychology, law enforcement, and popular vernacular. 1) psychology-As a medical diagnosis, it is defined as a psychological disorder in which an adult experiences a sexual preference for prepubescent children 2) Law enforcement - the term "pedophile" is generally used to describe those accused or convicted of the sexual abuse of a minor (including both prepubescent children and adolescent minors younger than the local age of consent) 3)In common usage - the term refers to any adult who is sexually attracted to children or who sexually abuses a child. Law enforcement chose this term so the images of a "baby fucker" sprang into the jury's mind guaranteeing a conviction.
Shagdog, not everything written on wikis site is correct. At least in northern Europe, nobody at the police uses the term "pedophile" for somebody who has sex with a 14 or 15-year old partner. And I am only writing about consensual sex here. If I look at european wiki definitions, many are only translated directly from the US site. Regarding teen porn, especially the "facts" about Color Climax, most wiki entries are wrong, but some admins want to keep these incorrect "facts". But there are sites like the "trewthe" blog, that correct this nonsense. The WHO defined "pedophilia" as "sexual interest under 12" ( this was the dutch definition too ), now they raised it to 13. Edited by - Caroline-NL on 7/27/2008 11:35:54 AM
Of course it doesn't make it right. There was a movement by some feminist to get age of consent laws changed to 18. After the courts over turned the laws on sex in the seventies. Right wing Christians join with this small group of feminist in raising the age of consent to 18. Then they set about passing as many laws on sex as they could.
I am not living in the USA. And the USA is also a member of the World Health Organisation, or not ? So US scientists have to accept the international definition of pedophilia. You can only work with scientific terms, if they are used uniformly. But to be fair, some of the most important US scientists in this field criticized this "US definition". I can recommend Taylors/Quayle book "Child Pornography", also the long term studies they had done, they divide between the US law definition and the international scientific definition of pedophilia.
Yes, it was Dortchen Leidholdt, she formed an alliance between exploited (?) ex-pornstars, like Linda Lovelace, feminists and right wingers. This group wasnt soo small at all, right wing christians were in the minority, most were right republicans. Many later surfaced in the Meese commission. Dortchen Leidholdt was a fanatic porn-hater, but she was intelligent too. " We cant win a war against porn at the moment, the society is pro porn - but we can convince the majority, that an age of consent of 16 is too low. Raising the age to 18 will be the first step to ban porn in total. " Looks like this strategy will win - in the long run.
Death is caused by swallowing small amounts of saliva over a long period of time. George Carlin 1567 Posts 2/07
Posted - Jul 28 2008 : 3:24PM
that would be correct.
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Clam Digger Deactivated User
Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05
Posted - Jul 28 2008 : 8:22PM
On know this probably seems convoluted, even to US citizens. There may still be states were sodomy/homosexual sex is illegal, but those laws have been rendered un-enforceable by the US Supreme Court.
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Clam Digger Deactivated User
Many a man fails as an original thinker simply because his memory is too good. 2268 Posts 1/05
Because many still doubt, that the former legal age for porn in the USA was 16, please read this: -------------------------------------------- The Economist June 18, 1977 Section: The World; American Survey; Pg. 51, Copyright 1977 Pornography: Kid's Stuff American pornographers have seen better days. Within the past year, three men prominent in the ''skin trade" have been convicted on obscenity charges and now, to make matters worse, a few pornographers have earned enough ugly publicity to assure a continued assault on the porno business. They are the publishers of two Los Angeles-based magazines, Lollitots and Nudist Moppets, which specialize in photographs of naked children. The magazines are so patently offensive that even the Adult Film Association of America, which represents almost all of the X-rated theatres, has condemned them, perhaps in the hope of throwing the anti- porn pack off its own tracks. But a select subcommittee of the house of representatives has recently spent two weeks in Los Angeles holding hearings on the need to control pornography and a bill to outlaw the interstate traffic in pornography involving children under the age of 16. Some, however, have questioned the need and legal rationale for the proposed bill. State laws already prescribe criminal penalties for adults who abuse children sexually. It is argued that these laws should be better enforced and used against pornographers who depict sexual encounters between adults and children. But actual sexual encounters are rarely depicted in the bulk of kiddie porn; more common are scenes of naked children. Although there is a chance that the bill will run afoul of the first amendment to the constitution, whose guarantees of free expression have traditionally protected adult pornographers. Hollywood is worried. At the hearings in Los Angeles, congressmen heard the actor Richard Dreyfuss say that the bill could result in the imprisonment of the makers of films like "The Exorcist'', in which a child actor, Linda Blair, simulates masturbation in one scene. While child pornography attracted most attention during the subcommittee's hearings, the congressmen probed a deeper problem: general sexual abuse of children by adults. The legislators heard horror stories about mothers who permitted their daughters to be used by pornographers but, more astoundingly, they heard estimates that 25% of American women had been sexually abused - and not by pornographers - during their childhood. The most startling testimony, however, helped to puncture the myth that child molesters are strangers to their victims: one study showed that nearly 60% of the molesters were close friends of the victim's family or were actual members of the family. The subcommittee was also told that child abuse, and incest in particular, was linked to other juvenile problems: sexual abuse is one of three main reasons why children run away from home, many of them, paradoxically, to become prostitutes. After hearing this lurid testimony, members of the subcommittee were confident that they could persuade their colleagues to extend a law authorizing federal financing of child abuse treatment centres. Under existing legislation which expires at the end of this month, more than $25m has already been spent. Now there is talk of spending much more. ------------------------------------------- Copyright 1977/2008 The Economist
All of these 18 yr old age of consent law's are relatively new. When I was in Junior High and High School in the sixties graduated in 1970 all the prettiest girls had boyfriends in their 20's and 30's with the knowledge of parents. It was not against the law. The age of consent was 13 here in Texas. "The subcommittee was also told that child abuse, and incest in particular, was linked to other juvenile problems: sexual abuse is one of three main reasons why children run away from home, many of them, paradoxically, to become prostitutes. After hearing this lurid testimony, members of the subcommittee were confident that they could persuade their colleagues to extend a law authorizing federal financing of child abuse treatment centres. Under existing legislation which expires at the end of this month, more than $25m has already been spent. Now there is talk of spending much more." This is particularly interesting. Teens had alway run away from restrictive repressive homes, poverty or just to be adventurous. In the 60's teens had more time on their hands than ever before and a collective place at school to exchange idea and form groups. They started questioning the foundations of America's religions, military and government. America was very authoritarian at the time. All authority was question. They never mention that up to this time parents were expected to beat bad behavior out of their kids. Men had the right to beat their wifes. School administrators had the right to beat students, the police beat people, the military beat recruits, priest abused little boys. Another thing the experts won't talk about it a lot of teenage runaway were thrown out of the house for being gay. A popular notion of the day was if you beat a gay boy enough, it would toughen him up and he wouldn't be gay. The authorities looking for reason for this rebellion, publicly blamed it on child sexual abuse. But quietly the institutions changed, today none are the same, as they were in the 60's Now today all bad behavior in kids, is blamed on sex abuse. And remember the people got a lot of money to fix the problem, that is not fixed yet. Edited by - Shagdog on 8/9/2008 4:05:28 PM
Now before the hater chime in. I'm not promoting child sexual abuse. Examining this further. "The subcommittee was also told that child abuse, and incest in particular, was linked to other juvenile problems: sexual abuse is one of three main reasons why children run away from home, many of them, paradoxically, to become prostitutes." The experts cited "sexual abuse" "incest in particular" as one of three main reason for other juvenile problems, the other 2 are not mentioned. What are the other 2 "main reasons", no one knows. This has always confused me. "run away from home, many of them, paradoxically, to become prostitutes." They are offended by sex or don't like sex so they run away to become prostitutes. This doesn't make sense to me and never has. How come we have never been told told what the other 2 "main reason" are. How come we don't discuss the other 2 "main reason" Again I'm not promoting child sexual abuse But why don't we vilify Alcohol, drug abuse, menial abuse, and physical abuse like we do child sexual abuse. And why don't we address poverty and homeless children.
This is an ancient post but what do you do with her issues of Hustler if you come across them in a large lot of Hustler's you just bought at an auction.
^You have two choices. The first one is that you should destroy them because they are by law child pornography. Your other option is to keep them and never show them to anyone because they are by law child pornography. I used to own Tracy Lord movies because I bought them when she was doing porn and everyone(I mean everyone) thought she was at least 18 years old. I no longer own that collection because at some point I threw it out.
^ I can remember reading a porn magazine interview where Traci's age was listed as 22 /23 (something like that). I never thought twice about it. The girl I thought might be underage was Nikki Charm. She looked about 16. Apparently, she was legal. Years later I rented a compilation tape and an underage Traci scene was on it. It must have slipped thru the purge.
^I'm old enough to have seen Tracy when she first came into the industry and she never looked like or acted like a 15 years old so I'm not surprised if she looked at least 18 in magazines.
Coincidentally I recently watched a video on YouTube titled 'X Rated Ambition: The Traci Lords Story.' It was a UK production from 2003. Because it was a UK production where nudity is permitted at 16 there were a lot of explicit shots from before Traci turned 18. I checked just now and I can't find it on YouTube any longer. It was really a fascinating look at Traci's meteoric rise in the business and how her scandal almost brought the entire industry to it's knees. I wasn't aware of this but the documentary states that the reason the prosecutions against several people failed is because the US government gave Traci a passport based on the same fake ID that she used to get into the business. One other thing to note - Ginger Lynn looks INCREDIBLE!
^I'm pretty sure she had a Government issued drivers licence showing that she was 18 and that's why producers had no problem hiring her to do porn. I don't care how hot or how amazing a performer she had the potential to be. I know that not a single producer would have hired her before she was truly 18. That said people still went to jail for hiring her. Exactly how the Government got away with that still boggles the mind.
Better to be pissed on, than to be pissed off. 248 Posts 1/15
Posted - Oct 5 2018 : 4:45PM
Is this hypothetical? Anyways, even if I collected Hustlers and wanted to have them all, I would get rid of those issues and accept the collection as incomplete. Maybe if I really wanted those issues, I would cut out her photos, destroy them, and save the rest of the magazine. It's not worth going to jail over. Also, if you did get busted, your whole Hustler collection would probably be destroyed, although you would have bigger issues to deal with.
I started to watch the same YouTube video you did, but at the first glance of nudity, I stopped- not because I was personally offended, but out of fear. My strongest erotic memory of her is watching "Traci, I Love You" on a big screen at a Times Square strip club. Years later, I rented "Traci, I love you" on VHS or DVD, and it didn't live up to my memory. Long story short: I don't think "Traci, I love you" is worth your time, and nothing else is even remotely worth the potential trouble.
You are being dramatic. Nobody's going to jail. First of all who is going to find out he has it? Its a hustler mag so theres no record of the purchase other than the auction he bought it at. Unlike online purchases theres no paper trail so nobody has to know. But even if someone did find out, it was supposed to be taken out of circulation so the seller should be held liable. And besides that this is assuming everyone knows who traci lords is and that she was involved in an underage scandal 30 or 40 some odd years ago... surely there are people that bought something with traci lords in it and weren't aware of this. Keep it or get rid of it. Doesn't really matter. Edited by - Chessmaster on 10/7/2018 6:36:08 PM
I'm not terribly interested in the legal aspects of Traci Lords status, but I'm fascinated by the woman's story and adventuresome spirit. From all accounts I've read, she was both promiscuous (off screen) as well as wise beyond her years. Based on her enthusiastic performances I think it's readily apparent she wasn't some exploited naive child forced into the tawdry world of porn. Personally I find her high pitched voice annoying to the point of distraction. That said, she has the most unusual pair of natural tits I've ever seen. Their shape is hard to describe, almost torpedo like. And her massive nipples, they're like "Puffies" on steroids.
I know exactly what the story is. You're saying this arbitrary distinction makes a difference somehow? It's kind of amazing to see the exceptions people make when discussing this story. But by all means go back to talking about an underage girl's tits.
Edited by - Gore Gore Girl on 12/3/2020 7:55:41 AM
^ I don't get it either. Even if the familial link was quoted inaccurately, it is patently irrelevant to the fact that most of Lords scenes were shot when she was a minor regardless of having government issue ID certifying otherwise. I don't get the discussion of a minor's breasts by adults in sexual context. If it was anyone else, you'd get some unenviable labels and names...
^ But she looked like she was really enjoying it! She was a deceptive little minx! These are the tried and true justifications for rape and child molestation since time immemorial. Even though she did deceive people to get out of a shithole of a life, even though she managed to carve out a space for herself and eventually game the system, can you blame her? I feel bad for those who produced her movies/performed on camera with her without knowing and then had to live with that knowledge/outside speculation, but her dubious methods for advancing her life are not an excuse for a bunch of adult men to sit around talking about how much she, a deeply troubled underage girl in an undeniably exploitative situation, loved it.
You were wrong, just admit it.If you knew exactly what the story is, why would you write something else? Please tell me where I referenced Traci's tits because I never did. Nice try though.
^ Correct.Haha what? It was her stepfather. Or if you prefer, her mother's ex boyfriend who lived in the family home and then housed Traci herself, serving as a guardian figure. Not sure exactly what you're driving at. The precise legal boundaries of what constitutes a step parent? I have read, listened to, and watched everything there is out there about Traci Lords, wrote and presented a paper about her at a national conference, and taught about 2257 and Traci in two different college classes. I know the story.
Rilato report did a 10 part podcast about Traci Lords, they presented both sides of the story and left it up to each person to decide which was true ( or if either was}
