I know Dion owns both companies so he can do whatever he wants but thank god we consumers can do the same!

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First of all, the reason you always see the same actors is because of the problem of getting wood and keeping it. There are just not that many men around who can perform in front of a camera. Many feel the calling to bone pretty girls in front of the camera, few are able to follow through.

Secondly, there is probably a certain demand for certain types of male actors at certain times. Hence, the overexposure of cocksmen like Jack Napier, Mandingo, Lex Steele, etc. It seems that every vid company is trying to find a black man with a 12 inch dick.

Thirdly (and related to the second point): I suspect that there is little demand for Japanese actors screwing Caucasian girls. You already mentioned one important obstacle: Asian men tend to be underendowed. Keep in mind also that porn has to tap into our collective desires, fears, obsessions, etc. The black man/white woman combination attracts and repels Americans. We want to see it but we are also disgusted by it - that is what makes it successful. Asian men just don't figure prominently in our collective (sexual) imagination (unlike Asian females).

2Big

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See the link to "How to be a Porn Star" in the free/Guest's area of my www.davecummings.com.

Believe me, we very much wish we had additional guys, preferably new ones who don't need certain prescription pills that sometimes make it difficult and/or time-consuming for them to cum; or guys doing the injections into their penis, which sometimes pose other risks/problems.

Dave Cummings

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This drive is rare, few and far between. All guys say let me at them, then can't do shit. It's a skill to do what the top male performers do in this biz. 1 out of 200 wanna bees can pull it off. Every guy says yes but when push comes to shove the dick says no.

Bottom line, there's your reason.

Cal444
Somewhere

Edited by - cal444 on 10/26/2003 7:50:16 PM

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Ramsey, I know you watch the movies for the guys,I try to watch them for the Girls,but there is a pretty good list above of guys we use,but once again Rld can't please you Ramsey.

Dion Giarrusso
President
Red Light District.

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Chillin..

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There's a reason you are seeing Dez aka Slim Shady in so many of the SocalCoeds videos, the customers want young dudes with young 'coeds'.

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Let us cut to the chase on this topic, shall we?

There is no question fucking in front of the camera defeats most would-be studs. We have documented that. But the problem is not quite so monumental as most producers would have you believe. There are no agents scouring LA looking for male talent now, are there? Nobody is hustling nude male models for video work in hetro hardcore, are they? Nobody is exactly asking for audition tapes, or putting ads in the industry media, are they?

Fact is, the straight hardcore industry (which prides itself on knowing a whole lot more about these subjects than its customers), has never wasted its time worrying about the male talent. Never. Give them 2-3 guys who show up sober every day on time, fuck on cue, cum on cue, help the directors get all the usual shots they need, keep the action level up, keep the girls (who are always brand new from week to week) relaxed and reassured from beginning to end--and oh my God, they will stick with them till the studs are old and gray (and have many times, as we know). It may seem a ridiculous system, but most directors have enough headaches worrying about the female talent without having to sweat the guys as well. And that creates the "buddy" system between producers, directors, and male talent we see, and have ALWAYS seen, in the hardcore business. Most directors use the same studs over and over because they know them, they trust them, and its easier. How else would Ron Jeremy have gotten work all these years?

From the very beginning of the hardcore scene till today, fans have complained about the lack of male talent--and it was much worse in the old days, where you had to watch the same 4-5 blokes in every feature role, for year after year after year . . . today, there are actually record numbers of male performers working in porn, but the key studios stay with the same guys. Fans still complain, and women, who are watching porn more than ever today, are some of the toughest critics of the old "buddy" system. Meanwhile, the industry still points to the performance quotient as the main reason for the small male talent pool. Despite the fact that the gay hardcore industry finds new talent every day (and many women watch gay porn because the men are more attractive, younger, and better presented in the videos--and who I might add, are paid much better than straight male performers). Despite the fact that, when interracial porn suddenly got popular a few years ago, the straight porn industry magically found a whole bunch of guys to appear in the videos. Interesting, isn't it?

The hardcore business has always been a men's club, made by men, made for men, and shot from a relentlessly male point of view. The idea that anyone even cares who the stunt cocks are in scenes puzzles many male producers. I had a conversation many years ago with a director, who told me that guys like Ron Jeremy were what male viewers really preferred to see, "you know, a grizzled middle-aged smuck who the average Joe could relate to, the sort of guy who would make any stroker believe that he, too, could somehow score with these beautiful women." I don't know who this director had less regard for, Jeremy or the men he describes as watching these videos!

The industry is quick to find whatever it needs to sooth demand. But it is very slow to change its system of doing business. There are plenty of young studs out there waiting to be found, but can you imagine the straight hardcore business trying to talk some guy into doing porno? Can you see them putting in the considerable effort it would take to procure, train, and pay top male talent? Can you see casting sessions Woodman style for male studs? The losers will always come to you, and every once in awhile you'll get a diamond in the rough like Everhard--but the industry would actually have to TRY--actually go out and search--to find the sort of improved pool of guys many viewers are suggesting. For me at least, the idea boggles the mind.

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I don't mind seeing the same guys, as long as they look like they care about what they are doing. There is a certain Italian porn star, that I have seen in 20+ scenes, and I'm still not tired of him. I've got 3 more of his films on my must-see list .

There are some men, that I get tired of after 5 minutes. These are the ones who looks totally disinterested in what is going on. They have that 'just tell me when to cum so I can go home' expression on the whole time . No matter how good-looking they are, or how well-endowed, or what the quality of their cum shot is, it doesn't make up for the lack of enthusiasm.

And then there is Mark Davis. I've read post after post by male fans on this board that they never want to see this actor on film, ever. BUT, there was a thread here a few weeks ago, in which some porn actresses said they love working with him. That was enough for me, now I'm hooked on watching him, too . When he performs on film, he comes across as showing special attention to the actresses, and that's what I really want to see.

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I can't find anything in Lazerus post that I disagree with. I'm genuinely happy that you've found a couple of male performers who please you, however. I'm still happy with John Leslie's appearances in the classics; hopefully I'll continue to feel that way after I've seen him three dozen times instead of a half dozen.

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A young and inexperienced girl with a top male performer makes a good scene. An inexperienced guy kills the scene to 99%. That is not affordable.

Steve Holmes

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My comments regarding the dissatisfaction with the male talent pool do not relate to ADT postings at all. They arise from many years of talking to fans and buyers. And this topic is very old; it was complained about 20 years ago, 10 years ago, and still today: the studs suck, not enough top studs to go around, the same guys in every movie, and so on. The problem is endemic to porn because, although producers will try out girls who fail--and it is possible, as Steve suggests, for a top male performer to cover for a problem girl in a scene to some extent--they will not spend the money or time trying out studs that are much more likely to falter in the same circumstances. The next Rocco or John Holmes will stumble into somebody's office or set by chance; nobody is going to go out looking for him. And that may be a mistake, because the top studs sell the sex more often than the girls do--and not just to the ladies in the audience either. (Never mind the movies Siffredi or Holmes in the bygone era made with their presence--consider Jack Napier, who WCP has marketed into a lot of tape sales. He may fit into Johnny or Rocco's jock--and then some--but he isn't fit to wear it.)

Renee's comments reminded my of a woman who once told me she watched the Rocco-Flame scene in Casanova so many times that the tape snapped. I hope she has since picked up the DVD. (Her friend with her, on the other hand, told me Rocco was sweaty, gross and disgusting.)

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Lazerus, just so you know, even I find some of Rocco's outrageous antics disgusting , but he has enough other qualities that compensate me for this, so I'll take the good with the bad. I think that women, when they see him on film, either immediately like him or can't stand him, and nothing will ever change their minds.

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Now granted, I don't shoot a sex scene every week, let alone every day. But over the last 12 or so year I've shot enough scene to have something resembling a representative sample and the plain and simple fact is I've never had a guy either fail to get hard, or fail to get off. Not once.

I few guys have taken longer to spurt than they thought was appropriate, but all we had to do was let them know we weren't in a hurry and that they could take their time and actually enjoy the fucking. In all cases these guys got up and got off without any frenzied meat beating at the finish.

-T.C.

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In fact, I can name you any number of porn productions with buff athletic guys, who're hung like hamsters and cum less than Randy West (and that's saying something).

It's all about the tool, the penis; to what kind of body that penis is attached to is of no concern to me.
2Big

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Also most female porn stars don't want to work with new guys, because the expect trouble.

When I started it took me 9 month to get my first scene. But as soon as they saw that I can do the job, I was booked out. Words spread fast in this industry.

Steve Holmes

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I'm sure there are A LOT of black guys out there big as Mandingo ready to do the job but they're not allowed into this 'old boys network' called the adult-industry.

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So, there are at least two new guys that are making porn films; somehow they are making it through the obstacle course.

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Erik Everhard

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Bearing in mind all the comments about how tough it is on a porn set ( distractions , people wandering around , disinterested female talent ) isn't the thing to do to try and solve this problem . As TonyC has alluded to , with the proper care and attention most guys could probably turn out a scene . I'm not saying that directors should be wrapping their talent in cotton wool or spending all their time worrying about them . But even some minor changes could make a difference in the ability of the stud to come up with the goods . Doesn't Jules Jordan shoot some scenes with only the performers and himself as the camera man in the room ? That would seem to be a good way to go . Of course it's entirely possible that this is the way all Gonzo is shot these days so feel free to correct me .

PS - Sweet Cheeks was great , any chance of a new series like this at your new home ( especially bring back Gia - yum ) .

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I know it may come as a surprise to some people, but porn actors are actual flesh and blood human beings -- that's what makes watching them fuck so interesting. And like any other human beings, a little care, respect, and sensitivity goes a long way to getting the best from them.

T.C.

Edited by - TonyC on 10/30/2003 8:56:00 AM

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I can't find a picture of Benjamin Brat, maybe someone else can post one. Just for everyone's info, this porn actor is not the TV actor Benjamin Bratt, who was on one of the cop shows a few years back. Both of these men look alike, probably 'cause they are both hispanic.

Speaking of hockey players, don't these guys start playing when they are 5 years old, up on the frozen north? Maybe that's what the porn world needs to solve the supply problem, to develop talent at an early age.

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Is it possible that part of the ' trial by fire ' method for recruiting and employing new male talent has something to do with jealousy . In the medical profession many new doctors are made to work excessively long hours by their superiors , in spite of the negative effects this practice has on their performance or their health . The reason most often put forward for continuing this practice is that ," we ( senior doctors ) had to put up with it so why should it be any easier for the new ones ". Maybe some of this is also present in the Adult industry ?

To get back on topic , I'd also like to see some new and younger male talent in porn but I also enjoy scenes with Mark Davis providing the loving . He does have a way with his partners that ensures a fun scene , even if he could perhaps stand to loose a pound or two . Bringing in fresh guys isn't just about new young faces it can also be a whole new attitude to performing . After all they aren't likely to be jaded yet now are they . Variety is the spice of life , why not mix it up a little more .

And Renee - you wouldn't be offering these guys a finishing school would you !
I mean the hockey players of course .

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As I've mentioned before, my ex-husband had a beautiful above-average dick. He fucked me well at home, with nice cumshots. When I begged a director friend of mine to give my ex (while we were still pseudo-together a shot in a scene (a multiple-guy with a couple of girls scene, so if my ex-husband failed, it wouldn't be a lost day), my ex COMPLETELY failed. Couldn't get his dick hard for anything.

When I used to feature, I'd have guys come up to me all the time telling me they knew they'd be perfect as a performer in adult videos. I told them - cool. Just stand on that stage there and jerk off in front of everyone, but don't cum until I say so, but when I say to cum, you better cum within 30 seconds. Of course it was theoretical, but some of them got the point.

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Lee O, what you had to say about young doctors is true for my profession, too (industrial chemists). There is plenty of the "I had it tough when I was new, so you have to pay your dues, sucker" school of management training that can make mincemeat out of a new chemist . Maybe this is going on in the porn world?

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Trish , I'm not trying to argue here ( what the hell do I know ! ) but some of what you say doesn't necessarily make sense to me . Taking forward Erik's hockey analogy isn't the man who fucks his wife and sends the tape to a studio effectively in the same kind of training as a young player in the minors . You mention pressure , surely that is what is lacking in both instances . And facing up to the pressure is something that no amount of preparation can prepare you for , some freeze others bring forth the hateplow ! I'd not thought about live sex shows as a possible training ground for new guys , didn't Mr Stagliano do some of this for a very short while - seem to remember reading something to that effect in Rog's interview .

This may be a bit too personal a question to ask but ( since you brought it up ) do you think your ex would have fared better in a JJ kind of situation ? You know one camera guy , two performers , closed set .

BTW could someone please explain the importance of coming on cue . Sure this must expose the limits of my ignorance but it confuses me . If you're shooting on tape does it truly matter if the man takes 30 seconds or 10 minutes to come ?

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1) again, how many male performers are you aware of: I have this feeling that there are many more male performers out there, then most of us have within their radar; if you tend to watch the same type of porn (becaue you happen to like that kind of porn), it can be hardly surprising to see the same performers again and again. IOW, maybe there are plenty of male performers out there, past and present.

2) I am having lots of trouble each week to find another candidate for the male performer of the week. In part, the reason for this is that I can't find decent pictures of guys I would like to introduce. But, another part is certainly a lack of choice. So maybe there is indeed a serious lack of new male performers.

For what it is worth, let's take a look at my database. I have entered information on 5171 titles. There are 5891 female performers in my database against 2147 male performers. Is anybody surprised by these numbers? I know I am. I didn't expect I would have that many male performers.

Dammit, I am confusing myself right now. Did I have a point I wanted to make?



skronker said:
"Didn't make any blackout babies, even though there were plenty of 'blackout babes.'"

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I have tons of respect for porn stars (both male and female) and have realized long ago that we should be happy for the men/women who can perform in this business. Watch a 'shanes world' and notice how ridiculous the guys who aren't tried and true look and act when they are in scenes with porn girls. If I was a porn producer, I would never risk ruining a shoot with a newbie. I would at least hope they worked through a few gangbang scenes before trying a guy on hot talent. I am interested to hear the males point o view on how they worked through their first scenes and if it was easy?

Erik? Byron? Steve Holmes?

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From your list of male performers, I have seen 7 of them in films, and have heard of, but not seen, another 8 of them, for a total of 15 out of 36. Nearly all of what I watch is either American gonzo companies shooting in Los Angeles, or the same companies shooting in Eastern Europe. And, being that I'm female, I pay way more attention to the male performers than the female ones. Does that help you out?

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I'm less enthusiastic about him (too rough for my tastes plus he could use some hair styling), but he doesn't seem to have any wood problems.

I'll try to post Bratt's pic later on, but there is another new stud in ZT's Wet Dreams Cum True named Rick Patrick.
Yay or nay, Renee?

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Walter's thread on men in porn is proof of the variety out there being completely unknown to many of us. Certainly, the more obscure entries in his database shouldn't count; however, with well over 2,000 male entries, there are a lot of men who have made a lot of porn some where and some when. Therefore, the problem is exaggerated and the solution is merely juggling the gene pool a bit - getting established performers to rotate among studios and with the female talent.

Just my $0.02 worth....

~ GaySatyr

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Does anybody know why Zero Tolerance has all these new guys? Are they risk takers?

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Dave
www.davecummings.com

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With regard to couples' features, I believe I might enjoy repeat performances by male talent perhaps as frequently as once per season. Otherwise, the actors start to lose credibility in their roles when I see them too often. I think, "Oh there's Evan Stone again, or there's Joel Lawrence, or there's Randy Spears." These three, IMHO, are among the better actors in the industry. I genuinely like them, but I've now watched them enough times that I have to work a bit at believing their characters.

Once per season means four times per year. During the two years I've been actively viewing adult movies, I have seen the following actors a minimum of eight times (in most cases, more).

Chris Cannon
Cheyne Collins
Dale DaBone
Ian Daniels
Mark Davis
Dillon Day
John Decker
Mickey G.
Billy Glide
Steve Hatcher
Joel Lawrence
Alec Metro
Steven St. Croix (some nonsex roles)
Herschel Savage
Randy Spears
Evan Stone
Kyle Stone
Lee Stone
Tony Tedeschi
Voodoo

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Erik Everhard

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Wrong males is the reason why I mostly buy movies from WCP and JSP, at least they use all the right guys as in Jack Napier, Sledgehammer, Mark Anthony, Mandingo, Box, J.Monty and Justin Slayer.

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T.C.

Edited by - TonyC on 10/31/2003 9:23:07 AM

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