Haha amazing fail retard, i love these "ignore" people..
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HollywoodBilderbergGroup Deactivated User
Undiscovered Genius 361 Posts 7/11
Posted - Dec 11 2011 : 4:22PM
why do u keep spilling estrogen out agitating shit like we're supposed to fall for your bullshit. truthfully, you're the only 1 who believes in your own hype right now. i can see behind your screen. i can reach out and get u at any moment i want to. clearly you're trolling and it's not working. but whatever tho, don't let me interfere with your boredom. truly your life must suck. and i'm not just saying that becuz you're coming across as super iggy right now, that's okay Edited by - HollywoodBilderbergGroup on 12/11/2011 4:23:18 PM
+1 That's undiscovered genius right there for sure.
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Mr_Heatmiser Deactivated User
56 Posts 5/10
Posted - Dec 11 2011 : 6:29PM
???? My responses have nothing to do with why I like white women (I like all type of women) and I'm not trying to dodge anything. I'm responding to the questions/comments made by another person. Do I think there's racism in porn? There might be incidents I suppose but if there are I'm not hearing about them but then again I don't follow porn that closely. If anyone has some real stories from people who actually work in porn they can offer up in quotes and can show it's an regular ongoing problem then I'll change my stance. But if people are just going to talk about Wendy Whitebread not wanting to fuck Big Black Johnson as some sort of evidence that there's a racial problem in porn that shouldn't go on I don't accept that as a legit "racial" problem that's so horrible it needs "fixing". Is porn equal across the board for blacks and whites and other minorties? No. Some don't want to hear this but there's a simple reason why. Blacks are a minority. That means there aren't as many black people in the US. Which means there are fewer black porn viewers than white. It also means there will be fewer black performers than white. And some white people are funny in that they are like some black people and are more comfortable watching people like them have sex on film. So there will be more "white on white" content made and it will usually sell the best. "Black" porn can be profitable but overall it will never be ovemall as profitable as "white" porn. Because of the blacks smaller numbers it means blacks have less power and less presence compared to whites. And it would seem Latinos have even less and Asians probably less than that. Porn reflects the rest of the nation it that regard. The same is true in Hollywood. Far fewer black actors and black films because there are fewr blacks in front of the cameras and behind the scenes. It reflects the book publishing world. Fewer black people, fewer black writers, fewer books about blacks, smaller audience. Other minorities are in the same boat. Is porn degrading to blacks? Yes and no. I see no evidence of black being treated in a degrading way but there are movies that have degrading black themes. But I have no problem with this because it's porn and porn is about fetish and fantasies. Some people like MONSTER BLACK DICKS 5, BLAZILLA 15, CUCKOLD 8, BLACK GANGSTER DICK 2, etc...If the performers making those movies weren't forced to do them and no one is forcing anyone who has a problem with it to buy it I don't see any problem with those types of movies. No one should be able to say my fetish is okay but the ones I don't like shouldn't exist. There's tons of porn that degrades women but like the black degradation, if the women do it willingly and it doesn't break the law or hurt the performers let the people who enjoy that stuff have it if the audience is big enough to sopport it. White women getting paid more to have sex with a black guy or anyone they don't want to? Great! If Jules Jordan wants to pay Amy Reid a big payday to get her to do IR that's between Jules and Amy. Jules has been a very successful film maker for years so I'll tend to think he know his business better than a fan on a messageboad that never made a movie. Amy and other girls who cut deals are no different than actors in Hollywood who cut deals to star in movies they probably don't want to do and athletes who take big paydays to play for teams they might not want to. It's business and free enterprise. Jules didn't make you pay more to see the movie so why worry about how much he paid Amy? If a girl chooses not to do IR because she has people around her that wouldn't like it, has a career plan laid out, is holding out for a big payday, or just doesn't want to have sex with black men, that's her choice. She's not a slave to do what fans demand or request. She's free to do whatever she wants...even if it's a bad idea. Doing porn doesn't take away the girl's rights to have sex with whoever she wants for whatever reason she may have. When a girl says she's not "attracted" to black guys she's basically saying she doesn't want to have sex with them not that she somehow finds all her white co-stars handsome and blacks are uglier. She doesn't want to have sex with that/those black men. Which is fine because it's her choice. So no, the world of porn isn't equally fair and not every white girl wants to fuck black guys and some people aren't going to like every porn movie put out. This is true about all forms of entertainment (except for the fucking). For me personally this isn't worth people they don't know "racist" based on who they have sex with. This isn't worth the resentment and anger. If this were about unfair wages for blacks across the boards and bad threatment on sets because of color or black being treated different based on race I'd totally understand. But getting this worked up about not seeing some random white girl not fuck a black guy...you've got to be kidding.
Click to expand
Everything you say is a gigantic fucking excuse. Let me make this simple for you and try to spend some time excusing your way out of this: the only 'race' girls are being actively steered away from are 'blacks'. Most of these girls are ADVISED to do so, and everybody knows it. Second, when you're willing to fuck Ron Jeremy, every other 'race' but 'blacks', a guy who's 55, and gangbanged by a group of idiots who's faces you will never remember, then 'preference' doesn't count. Oh, and LMAO @ " I see no evidence of black being treated in a degrading way" Of course you don't because you're so disconnected (or rather connected) to your idea that things are fine the way they are. There are 15 excuses for racism in your paragraph while pretending that there is no racism. YOU'VE got to be kidding. Please don't write anything as goofy as this again. You ARE the problem.
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Solar4 Deactivated User
183 Posts 10/10
Posted - Dec 11 2011 : 9:32PM
So to you racism would only be equated with using racial epithets correct? Also my position was that it was an issue of non-Black performers discriminating against Blacks, not Wendy Whitebread. In fact the industry is so poisoned with racial discriminatory behavior that there are even some Black female performers who think it's a good idea to not work with Black men. Of course you can bet how that works out for them. Work is scarce for them and they eventually do Black scenes.
No Draxxx it's not great. It's despicable. A non-Black female performer getting more money to work with someone who is Black as if it is an extreme scene like Anal or DP is fundamentally wrong. Would you think it acceptable for waitresses in a restaurant to be paid more to wait on Black customers because they don't really want to serve Blacks? Obviously not. And it's the same principle. Now I will agree with you on the fact that many of these girls aren't explicitly bigoted, but racially biased thought is the deciding factor behind their decisions to not work with Blacks and as has already been stated, the excuse of attraction is a lie for the credulous based on the fact that most of the people they work with they concede they're not attracted to.
I think we've established that it's their choice to be as financially ignorant as they wish to be and cost themselves money. What is being said however is the reasoning behind their choice is racially motivated based on the racial history of the USA. Which is why it was stated that a good solution for the industry is to bring women from other countries who aren't racially backwards in their thinking towards Blacks.
It's funny you say that because Black performers, and you can ask them, get paid less than their non-Black counterparts in the industry. I assume you think that's ok too. Edited by - Solar4 on 12/11/2011 9:33:44 PM
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HollywoodBilderbergGroup Deactivated User
Undiscovered Genius 361 Posts 7/11
Posted - Dec 11 2011 : 10:11PM
I say we SHOULD get paid more. I also say that the prejudice needs to stop.
Yes, that still happens but not as much as it used to. And for the contract girls and certain studios those studios are geared toward a mostly white audience who probably won't mind an occasional IR scene but it isn't something they want to see on a regular basis. So they certainly don't encourage or want much IR in their product. With most Gonzo girls it would be hard to belive that their management would advise them to never do IR because the main thing their management cares about is making the most money from them. It's been proven time and time again doing IR doesn't hurt or kill a career so what they probably tell the girl is build up her career by pacing ceratin sex acts and IR out a bit. The girls who never do IR don't because they don't want to or because other people around them do want them to...not likely their management.
"Preference" does count because everyone is free to make up ther own rules of preference. It doesn't matter if you don't agree. If her preferece is to fuck the ugliest white guy ever and not want to fuck any black man regarless of their looks it's her preference...and her right.
Actually I'm repeatedly saying I understand why things are the way they are that's not the same as saying I think it's fine. The only thing I'm saying I'm fine with is adult women being able to have sex with whoever they choose to and handling their career the way they choose.
And I suppose calling girls none of you know personally racist because they done have sex with black men or do it when any of think they should is the solution.
Mistreated? Like say...paid less than their non-Black counterparts? I suppose you would excuse that by saying well no one is forcing them to stay in porn. They can leave and get a real job right? Anything to continue the status quo I guess.
I see. So women being paid more to work with Blacks like it's equivalent to an anal or dp scene is fine according to you because the women are "independent contractors." Interesting. As for Plumbers and Mechanics, they have to have business licenses to stay around, so varying the price they charge their customers based on race would get them sued.
Preferences are fine. The crux of the issue though is that the excuses they use to justify their "preference" are nothing but lies for the gullible to accept. And rather than waiting for the industry and performers to become less racially discriminatory it's far better to just bring in performers from other countries who aren't racially backwards in their views about Blacks and hire them to do scenes with studios that are also racially progressive.
It's quite easy to prove that Black performers are paid less. You can ask them on twitter. As for the bigger names, that likely isn't an issue for them. Edited by - Solar4 on 12/12/2011 1:05:24 PM
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Mr_Heatmiser Deactivated User
56 Posts 5/10
Posted - Dec 12 2011 : 6:11PM
You know this how? My guess is that you're making it up so that your point has some validity.
'I acknowledge that certain studios steer away from blacks in scenes, however I would like you to believe it's strictly economic. The Asian girl and Hispanic guy in the scene won't upset anyone because they aren't actually another race. I will also make up facts about management that I have no way of knowing.' So transparent.
So now it's 'preference' instead of 'attracted to', nice redirect. So you've acknowledged that it could be the 'ugliest white guy' and preference means you would pick someone you're not attracted to over someone else you're not attracted to. You're almost there, what feature differentiates these 2 people? LOL, you're trying so hard not to acknowledge it.
I'm sure you understand the way things are, and for someone who doesn't think it's fine you sure defend it with your life. I'm trying to get to a semblance of normalcy. Has the 'attracted' word or the 'preference' word EVER been used against any other group in porn? Lol, wait. I'm sure you'll make up an instance where that actually happened....once. Really, how stupid do you think people are? My goal is that we don't have stupid-ass conversations about how having sex with a black person in a scene is a special circumstance, that requires getting rid of a system designed specifically to point them out when it points nobody else out.
I haven't called anybody anything but the system is racist, and some girls and guys like you feed it with your attitudes. The status quo is good enough, even if the status quo marginalizes only one group of people. Yea, I know, it's economics right? Like I said, you are the problem. Thanks for showing the problem in detail.
just cause women enter porn doesnt mean they shouldnt have a choice about who they fuck end of story.. move on
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nirado Deactivated User
7 Posts 12/11
Posted - Dec 24 2011 : 9:03AM
For practically every Black girl who enters porn and expect to be successful they must realize that the best they can obtain is a place in purgatory. You know, some place between heaven and hell--never really at the top but not at the bottom, either. Jada Fire status. No matter how good or how attractive she may be, race trumps everything. Even in the big boob genre where some Black women have established a name for themselves, their popularity is nothing compared to the really big name white performers there. For someone like Bethany Benz who thought that her minor celebrity would have elevated her into the top of the porn business, she's had her eyes opened to the fact that they only give out those nonstop tickets to the porn penthouse to white girls, preferably blonde and blue eyed. I can't say that I'm disappointed for any Black women trying to break in to the porn "elite" I think black girls are more likely to be a video vixen or hip hop model not like one won't do what the other will just one will do it on camera and is seen as more respectable. Race is a BIG part of it. That's why black girls don't get contracts or don't become equally popular/successful to white girls. Porn execs always say black girls don't sell as well, even the hot ones like Bethany Benz
^^ Do that depend on racism or maybe that happens because the vast majority of porn consumers is white? Even the IR porn consumers are mostly white, As for me I don't mind at all I rent or buy any DVD with any star I like this includes Misty Stone, Leeanni Leeanne, Marie Luv, Evanni Solei , Melody Nakai, the gorgeous Skin Diamond, a new (at least for me) called Tila Flame.
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nirado Deactivated User
7 Posts 12/11
Posted - Dec 24 2011 : 10:47AM
Okay, I elaborate: When women think (or are expected to think) that someone or a group is "beneath" her, they're unlikely to have sex with them. The same doesn't apply to men - in fact, if they perceive a group as being inferior, a woman of that group is more likely to be seen as fair game by them - while at the same time, they go to great lengths to prevent woman of their race to do the same. That doesn't just apply to blacks in the US (where male slave owners could have black mistresses right from the start while black males would have gotten lynched for it), but to plenty of other societies throughout histories as well. So, if some guy supportive of interracial porn (not of the ghetto thug-type that is still perpetuating the same old clichés), then I wouldn't label him as a racist, whether he himselves does IR or not (however, I guess it's safe to assume that WM porn actors who won't do BFs themselves are more likely to be against IR in general as well). Sean Michaels in the same category as those white men who don't do scenes with black women, dude goes out his way to dodge black women in his career unless he has to work with them. Can't fault the white men cuz it seems as if a lot black male performers would dodge them to if they had the large pool of white women to work with. I guess its due to the fact not a lot of hot black women around.
Let me elaborate myself 90% of porn consumers are male , I answered to your previous post about how is that no black girl reaches the same status (and earnings) of a white superstar, I'm guessing because the most part of porn consumers are white and of course they prefer white girls , when I say of course I mean because of natural conservation instincts who push men to the similar to save the tribe, if in a group (any group, human or not human) all the members will mix with other groups then the original group will disappear , we ,as a sentient species , can give a fuck to this through our cultural comprehension that it's not the genetic group what is important but the cultural one (a black is no less American than a white and is no less willing to fight and possibly give his life to save his nation) , but our instinct aren't so evolved, not yet, so we are mostly attracted to those who are similar to us (with exceptions of course). If a black mostly likes a black typed woman is only natural same for whites, our hormones aren't controlled they react to a potential partner on their own. So since whites are the most part of porn consumers this is the reason why white performers reach a much higher status than black performers , the latter sell less. I'm not saying this is right or wrong , it is the reality . You on the other hand replied with some statement regarding white females which is a percentage of consumers even lower than that of black males you're also putting in some racist considerations about them going with "beneath" guys , but this has nothing to do with the market or the black female stars status So what is your main point? What are you talking about exactly? a political thread? or Or a Porn thread?
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nirado Deactivated User
7 Posts 12/11
Posted - Dec 24 2011 : 11:59AM
^^ I see your point but the sad fact is that a black (or mixed) woman, no matter how fine, just won't make the superstar cash that a white chick can make. When a black male star has a white female star refuse to work with him because of his race, or an unquestionably gorgeous black woman seeing every plain looking white girl getting paid more than her simply because they are white and she isn't.
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Hodel Deactivated User
462 Posts 12/11
Posted - Dec 24 2011 : 12:16PM
If gorgeous black women don't excite me, is that racist? If chubby white redheads excite me, is that racist? It's all supply and demand, not racism.
^^ Well it is the market not racism , if a White Female (WF) sells 10,000 DVDs and earn say 10% she will get $ 1,000 if a Black Female (BF) sells say 3,000 DVDs her 10% will be $ 300 (I'm not putting actual figures it's just an example) If you pick up the raw numbers you may say that a WF has been paid $ 1,000 whereas a BF has been paid three times less $ 300 , nobody could say it isn't the truth , but actually they have been paid the same 10% in consideration of the sales they can get. anything must be taken with all related numbers , if two stars sell the same for example if a WS sells 10,000 DVD,s getting paid $ 1,000 and a BF equally sells 10,000 DVDs but got only $ 300 then you can say there's discrimination between them , but if there's a difference in sales, then what really DOES MATTER in a market is how much money you will ensure to your producer. In the NBA for example the Black players are paid way more than whites , is that racism? Or they give a show so good that everyone come just to see them? I think it is the latter , a Michael Jordan could guarantee hundreds of millions in a season from tickets , to merchandising,to technical equipment , to books or even selling his match to foreign TVs so to pay him 60 to 80 million dollars for a season is only fair , he was the one allowing to make all that money. same thing in porn white stars sell much more than black stars and this is the reason why they are paid more (but I'm sure that Skin Diamond will broke this). The same was with fashion models until Naomi Campbell stole the scene and changed everything forever since then the public looked not only the clothes but also who was wearing them so they bought only clothes worn by whites thus considered meant for whites were able to sell , Naomi changed everything now what is considered important is HOW a model wears some clothes an thus how she can give them valor , no matter the race. In porn this revolution has yet to be made
Edited by - Laurie Cameron Fan on 12/24/2011 12:47:07 PM
AFAIK there is no "10%". They just get a flat fee based on the type of scene and extenuating factors (i.e. a gangbang scene pays more than a BJ-only scene; an anal holdout's first anal scene might be negotiated higher than the standard anal rate, etc.). So whether a movie sells 10K copies or 1K copies doesn't affect the performers' paychecks at all.
Man I put that as a very simple example but it doesn't change anything , the true meaning is that since a white performer will sell more than a black performer she is paid more the the second one , I put percentages just to make it clear but also I could say a proportion say 10:1 in terms of sells and paycheck it is the same. any production cost , not only in porn but for anything must be proportioned to the expected sales if say 100.000 white customers buy 70.000 dvds with white performers and a mix of White and Blacks buy 30.000 dvds with black females , how can you produce those DVDs at the same cost? If you do this the profit with black girls would be so thin that nobody will produce them at all The only way in order to change this would be to have a black star so great and gorgeous and with a distinct charisma to the point that anybody seeing her will be hooked and don't pay attention at all to her skin thus pushing everyone to take into consideration how a star performs , that way both white and blacks will sell the same and thus will be paid the same, just like Naomi Campbell did in Fashion modeling Edited by - Laurie Cameron Fan on 12/24/2011 1:38:12 PM
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nirado Deactivated User
7 Posts 12/11
Posted - Dec 24 2011 : 7:56PM
We can take all the moral stands we want but it won't change a damn thing. Black men are the third rail in porn. There is nothing we can do about this. It must be very frustrating for the guys that are into teens because those girls are more likely to never do IR. The girls that are in their prime or MILFs are more likely to cash-in on big IR paydays. Whether it's right or wrong doesn't matter it's just the way it is. It is the world we live in when barely functional non-Black males can work with any girl in the industry at the big porn studios like Brazzers, Vivid, Wicked, and DP and burgeoning internet production houses in a slew of forgettable scenes. At the same time, the most a capable Black man can aspire to is to hope and pray that he gets noticed by Jules Jordan who will be willing to overpay some girls to clock in for a brief dip in the interracial pool.
It is unclear what is your actual point , first you said that female black performers are paid less , this is true but it is caused by the market non racism. The you're saying that a black man (users performers?)into teen can't get enough of this. I might say , you need information about this , many stars and even superstars did IR in they first year in porn there are entire lines and websites especially related to teens (or teen looking girls) in both sides black teens and white teens: Little White Chicks , Big Black Monster Dicks series has 19 issues from 2000 to 2003 So Fresh so Teen has two issues There is a site of dogfart network Watching My Daughter Go Black especially aimed for those into teens , also Interracial Pickups a POV IR site has plenty of teen related scenes although not exclusive My new black Stepdaddy of Devil's has 9 issues so far Tiffany Star did 6 scenes in her first year and was 18 Zoe Voss' very first shoot was with Shorty Mac, she was 19 Tori Black was 19 when entered in porn and did 3 IR scenes seriously what are you talking about?
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nirado Deactivated User
7 Posts 12/11
Posted - Dec 25 2011 : 11:48PM
^^ I see your point Edited by - nirado on 12/26/2011 2:02:31 AM
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nirado Deactivated User
7 Posts 12/11
Posted - Dec 26 2011 : 12:16AM
Even though he worked with 2 black girls early in his career, Scott Nails is stronlgy opposed to working with black girls. Same goes for Max Hardcore and Julian. Max said that he just isn't attracted to black girls and because he doesn't use Viagra, he didn't feel like going the extra mile to get his dick hard. Those were his words. I think most non-black males say they don't like black chicks for a couple of reasons: The first being that they don't ecounter many pretty black females on a regular basis either because of where they live and/or they just don't travel much (we are still only 13% of the US population). Second, I think when many non-black males even think about black girls, they immdediately conjure up the image of some loud, ghetto talkin, hoodrat who resembles Gabby Sidibe, Monique, or Whoopi Goldberg rather than Beyonce or Ciara. I believe this is because girls who look like Beyonce are percieved as highly inaccesible to the average white dude. Plus they are more likely to encounter black girls who look like Gabby or Whoopi if they live in or near a significant black population.
^ Racism exists in the real world and so is in porn, in both sides the industry and its consumers, I'm not denying this , I'm not delusional nor blind, we're debating the actual extent of this and its effects in the industry , if there is any. ^^ I don't know why Scott Nails won't perform with black girls but his actual girlfriend Chastity Lynn did plenty if it, throughout the whole time they were together he only prevented her to perform anals with anyone but him, the first guy taking her ass after they parted has been Sean Michaels.Anyway he can hardly be accused to be racist if he allowed his girl to fuck with blacks with no restrictions (she fucked Mandingo and worked for Dogfart), even if he doesn't. As for Max , I'm not really into him so I don't know who he fucked or who he didn't , but I have to say something , I have personally fucked two black girls only in my life , one was a one night fuck (a quickie actually) in the bathroom of a dancing club , I never knew her name, the other was sister of the boyfriend of a female friend of mine which is an African guy from Senegal (they are still together and have two babies) , this too turned out as a one night fuck because she lives and works in Germany and was here for a week just to meet her brother's new girl and had to back to work , but I didn't know this. The most beautiful girl I ever met is black , she works for a casting agency for televisions, I'd like to fuck her very much but there's no chance the guys she usually dates are the deity looking type and I'm not even close to that.All three are slim So said I have to add something I don't like at all the 80% and maybe more of the black girls I see , I mean in a sexual way , the usual black girl (at least here in Europe) has a big ass , big tits ,a big flat nose and too big lips , this package do nothing for me , although I must say that I don't like that kind of female even if she's white.My hormones won't react , I can get a wood if needed but it'll be forced and not completely hard , not pleasurable at all I know it first hand (with white girls) I very much prefer slim girls with tiny tits or at least proportioned if she's tall with very few exceptions. So I can see the reason why Max won't work with black girls in general he need to be able to perform especially because he's short dicked and can't fake a wood using a soft very big dick like some black performers do(I'm not putting any name but this is apparent in many scenes),this doesn't exclude racism though still his explanation may be the truth EDIT BTW when replying remember this; to avoid an unnecessary quote you have to use this arrow:^. A single arrow (^) means "related to the post just above mine" two arrows (^^ or ^ ^) mean "related to the second post above mine" Three arrows ( ^^^ or ^ ^ ^) mean "related to the third post above mine" and so on , though over the third if the argument is the same you may quote the post to avoid confusion , you also may partly remove what is in your quote and leave what is of interest. this for general use , in this particular case there's no confusion at all. Edited by - Laurie Cameron Fan on 12/26/2011 4:22:22 AM
^^ I'm sure you all know who Scott Nails is, if you watch Brazzers. Anyway, I recently ran across a claim that he was a racist and told girls not to do IR. Does anyone know if this is true? Flower Tucci mentioning that Nails is the only person in the industry she's heard make racist comments. She didn't mention what he exactly said. I think Nails has done a couple of scenes with Black girls, whatever that's worth. Flower also mentioned Mick Blue in that interview with Vanessa Blue.
^^^ Now I got it, I was wrong it wasn't Scott Nails the one I meant I mixed up him with Scott Lyons who is/was Chastity Lynn's real life boyfriend.
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ServerZ Deactivated User
25 Posts 12/11
Posted - Jan 4 2012 : 3:42AM
You may not have been aware, but stars like Marie Luv and others who are more popular than many of their white counterparts are still paid less. So it's not the "market," which by the way is an easy way to hand off responsibility, but the result of consciously made decisions by producers and directors in the industry to underpay one race of performers.
^ being popular has nothing to do with sales , the latest Brandon Iron's installment has been printed in 10,000 copies but according to him sold only 200. He is very popular and so were the starlets in there BTW Marie Luv is one of my favourite ever anyway could you put here some figures if you have any? So that I can discuss informed
Edited by - Laurie Cameron Fan on 1/4/2012 8:56:06 AM
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ServerZ Deactivated User
25 Posts 12/11
Posted - Jan 4 2012 : 7:33PM
You can check with Marie Luv on twitter, she recently talked about the pay issue and also Nyomi Banxxx talked about the lower pay she's offered for scenes on her twitter page as well.
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the traveler Deactivated User
309 Posts 8/11
Posted - Jan 4 2012 : 7:52PM
porn is definetly the thing that has racism in it more than any other thing I can think of. Just go on those porn video hosted sites and read through the comments on interracial videos.. black men with white women. It brings out the worst in people. I honestly don't care. I like interracial, black/black, white/white.
First off I don't have a twitter account nor I intend to get any , secondly I didn't say in my posts here that they aren't paid less than other performers I said that it depends more on sales rather than race , you didn't opposed sales rates or any kind of economics to that , you opposed popularity , I demonstrated that popularity has nothing to do with sales , a praised director such as Brandon Iron with top starlets sold only 200 copies of a movie expected to sold at least 10,000 (his words here on ADT). Since you're a twitter follower consider to follow Kristina Rose's Twitter account, according to what is on her thread here, she also has issues with payment and she's not alone with that, producers are trying to drop the rates for performances for any pornstars ,this might be the issue for some black performers. Also there are companies owned by blacks and there are black directors and producers as well(Diana and Alexander De Voe , Justin Slayer , Brian Pumper,John E, Depth, WCP productions , Black Market) Do they pay the same as white producers? If this is the case , surely they aren't racists. are they?
I believe with the other person you were in fact arguing that racism doesn't exist anymore it's all just the invisible hand of the free market that determines pay rates. Well while that's an interesting comment, the "free market" so called, is composed of people loaded with a number of biases, opinions, and beliefs on certain issues which determines pay rates not the abstract free market. Now perhaps if humans were androids devoid of any emotion then they could follow the theoretical free market perfectly and that would explain unequal pay rates, but that's not the way the world works. On the subject of Kristina, she spoke on twitter about pay offers which were below her pay rate. Now while that's an interesting aside to this issue, with her it's the result of the contraction of pay across the board for all performers due to the recession and the resulting fewer scenes that are being shot nowadays. Pre-Recession though pay rates were still different depending on race even after controlling for popularity of the girl and how well they sell. As for Black studios, I don't know how much they pay their actresses, but if they varied pay depending on race that would be racism, just as one has racism in the prevailing policy of underpaying Blacks by white directors and studios. Edited by - ServerZ on 1/5/2012 4:31:19 PM
^ I never said that racism doesn't exist anymore , far from this , actually it is racism who controls the market for example all those whites who don't buy any movie with a black inside thus lowering its commercial value , for example it can't be sold to those cable company who air porn in areas where racism is strong. Here on ADT I had arguments with a racist who was lamenting that there were no site he could buy from because they all were advertising IR or had IR in their catalogs and that he and many other were avoiding to buy from all that sites who even had a black in a single movie. I already explained that the porn consumers are mostly white and that an all blacks movie sells a lot less than a white only movie , it is not a coincidence the all the major companies (Wicked , Vivid, Digital Playground for example) shoot very few IR scenes in their movies and sell more than all the others especially for cable TVs So said , it is obvious that if a White only movie sells 10,000 copies of a DVD an IR movie sells 5,000 and Blacks only sells 3,000 you can't pay the performers at the same rates, in some cases you might not get enough revenues to earn anything if you do. That's why the majority of black performers are paid less , maybe even when the movie is produced by a black owned company , they have to consider their revenues. It's hardly racism racism could be on customer part they are those not buying such movies , IR porn actually is raising but still can't compete with white only porn also the IR who is selling is BM WF porn. Also all of this is not always racism for example i don't find attractive maybe the 80% of the black women I see , yet the most beautiful woman I ever met in my life is black. Also there are many black starlets that I like , today I picked up WCP's Hitchhikers 2 an all black movie, but there are Skin Diamond, Imani Rose and Bella Moretti in there any of them is worth at least a rental
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ServerZ Deactivated User
25 Posts 12/11
Posted - Jan 15 2012 : 12:10PM
You state in your first sentence that racism does exist then proceed in every paragraph afterward to say that it doesn't and that all inequality in pay is based on the "free market." Chalking it up to "well hey Black movies don't sell as well and Black women aren't as popular so what can you do." Now according to your reasoning (namely that popularity and sales determines pay) women like Nyomi Banxxx or Marie Luv, who are more popular than many girls, should be paid at an equal rate to their white counterparts of similar popularity, yet they aren't. This is clearly a violation of the free market is it not? Yet it exists. It's therefore reasonable to conclude that racial discrimination has a hand in this issue.
No the reasoning I see being used isn't the popularity of the star but number of sales of the release. Look at it this way, if one store sells a volume of $200,000 a month and another sells $25,000 a month and has the same number of employees, chances are the store selling $200,000 a month will pay more than the store selling $25,000 a month. If one release will sell 10,000 units chances are the top name star(s) will get paid more than a release that will only see 3,000 units sell.
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ServerZ Deactivated User
25 Posts 12/11
Posted - Jan 15 2012 : 6:53PM
Popularity and the number of sales of a release were mentioned by the other poster to justify pay disparity, but even when those two are comparable to white performers the pay disparity continues to exist.
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David Cop-a-feel Deactivated User
Trust me, honey, it gets better 323 Posts 10/10
Posted - Jan 15 2012 : 7:11PM
Agree with server z and I think Laurie Cameron Fan is getting tied up in knots trying to minimise the effect of racism in porn. Naomi Banxxx and Marie Luv wouldn't be getting as much work if they weren't very popular and sold well, so "the market" has decided it likes these lovely ladies. The industry,however, has decided that these girls aren't worth the same pay rates as non-Black performers despite the fact that there is demand for their work.
Just a question there are all blacks companies , owned by blacks , with black directors and black performers Are they paying more than the whites owned companies?
I said that popularity has nothing to do with sales , as for sales you said comparable well any titles? take also into consideration that I am a black porn consumer , I have no problem at all in watching blacks on whites or blacks on blacks , I'm focused on women if I like a black star i simply watch her no matter the stud she's working with Among those I like are Marie Luv , Skin Diamond , Leeanni Leeanne, Misty Stone , Melody Nakai, Tila Flame, Evanni Solei among those of today and many others I can't remember right now