pornography wasn't sex but fantasies of an impossibly hospitable world 12377 Posts 9/07
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 6:02AM
I don't know the actual rates, just saying what I've read by some performers, directors, etc. It is a truism but would be good to hear confirmation from an actual Euro performer. Edited by - BlackSix on 10/14/2015 6:03:05 AM
Everyone, no matter how refined, had a stash of porn. 175 Posts 9/11
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 8:19AM
I think one site that can compare maybe even top legal porno in hardcore action is Perverx. They make US porno look like playboy content.
[Link]
Randy03 Deactivated User
121 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 8:34AM
Is Perverx still producing new scenes/updates for its site?
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 10:20AM
LP is still releasing Piss scenes. They released one with Olivia Divine in August 2015.
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 10:30AM
No one is outright accusing LP of this. the larger point I tried to make earlier, is that LP's scenes are depressing, because the women look to be anything ranging from exhausted and worn out, to absolutely terrified and begging for it to end asap. Sure, there are a few girls who lap it all up with a smile and seem to be enjoying themselves in LP's scenes (much emphasis on seem to be). But they are not the norm. They are the exception. and that is a big red flag for anyone with functioning eyes and a conscience. Edited by - foobachi on 10/16/2015 4:53:10 PM
Using your logic, so must the U.S. adult entertainment industry, so I hope that you are just as critical of their movies as well. Which leads me to wonder why you are at a site for adult entertainment since there is obviously none that you can watch based on your logic.
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 4:20PM
organized crime rings have much larger expansion and control of the "vice" industries in Europe, especially Eastern Bloc countries, than anywhere else in the industrialized world. The sex industry is actually fairly well regulated and monitored in the US. Sure, there is prostitution and exploitation here too. But the forced/slavery component is nearly non-existent, and it's nowhere near as rampant.
There have been many links between the U.S. adult film industry and the mob over time, most very well proven. There have also been claims of acting at gun point (see Linda Lovelace for instance). If the mob must, as you say, cause sex trafficing to be in Legal Porno, then the mob must also then have sex trafficking in U.S. adult films too. Then again, you could just be arguing an unsubstantiated opinion based on no proven facts trying to pass it off as fact.
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 5:00PM
The mod in the US is almost non-existent in 2015. If we were talking 1975, sure. The Italian and Irish "mobs" have all but become extinct. The small pockets of Organized crime in the US now are mostly illegal foreign nationals from European and Asian Countries. Small pockets in some of the bigger cities. In eastern Europe, however - it's out of control. Especially in Russia, Hungary, Ukraine, Slovakia, Czech republic. They aren't even comparable. Some of those countries are 100% controlled by mob.
[Link]
ultimate_sperminator Deactivated User
837 Posts 12/12
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 5:15PM
Flash I think it´s now up to you. I tried to start a controversial discussion and now this guy comes up with his odd views that are more political issues where nobody here is interested in. I´m also European and somehow I feel kind of discriminated by the guys comments.
[Link]
ultimate_sperminator Deactivated User
837 Posts 12/12
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 5:41PM
It deepends. I know some up to date rates from a European agent who also works with LP. Rates at LP are appr. 25% lower than in US but you have to keep in mind that I am not talking bout DAP or TAP. Here the difference is even bigger. LP shot TAP already for EUR 2000 and that´s about 2100 dollar. It can go up 10 - 20% if the company really want to shoot somebody specific. And you also have to keep in mind that a big part of payment is always the performer itself. I don´t wanna know what Riley Reid charged for her first anal but as already mentioned by myself earlier this strategy is a total turn off for me. To me porn needs excitment like it had from 2004 - 2009 where various performers surprised the fans with super nasty stuff you wouldn´t thougth they ever would do.
MOD: Okay Foobachi, since you are now alienating members because of their nationality this line of discussion can cease. Please go back to the OPs original topic from this point out.
[Link]
Jedi Master Bates Deactivated User
383 Posts 9/11
Posted - Oct 15 2015 : 12:52AM
back logs. Also...august was two months ago. That site releases scenes daily, so lets not say "they're still releasing piss scenes.".
[Link]
Jedi Master Bates Deactivated User
383 Posts 9/11
Posted - Oct 15 2015 : 12:56AM
So when something is possible, we should just put it into words on a forum. Its possible you keep a bunch of homeless people in your basement in order to make a "woman suit" out of them. That doesn't mean its cool for me to just passive aggressively suggest that its true, but then play a game of semantics when someone calls out my foul behavior.
I come from northern europe, and I would beg to differ perhaps it's different in southern /eastern europe. But atleast northern european women are i general quite conservative and anal sex is something generally considered weird and degrading for all girls and the men who likes it a bit perverted :P
Well that's kinda different, I don't think that there are any shortage what so ever of males who would consider doing porn absolutely for free and would just consider it a bonus to get paid for it :P Same with brothels, men line up and want to pay for sex but that means that there must be a supply of female prostitutes that are there for different reasons. So in a sexual context one can be there by their free will and the other not. Comparing it to facial abuse may be relevant, but my picture of KINK is that it's all very professional, the performers have a safe word/words if thing become a bit too much, and on the degredation/domination part in BDSM is part of role play, in gonzo the degrading aspects is hopefully mostly un-intentional. I haven't watched that scene you made a reference to, but if the girl sign up for a bdsm/domination scene all the roughness does not come as a surprise whilst a girl who may think that she's doing a normal b/g anal scene might end up doing a much more rough scene eg. getting slapped in her face, have her hair pulled and other things she hadn't intentionally signed up for.
Personally I have never claimed that all girls are trafficking victims, there are a lot of big names as you mentioned who have been pornstars for a long time and has build a career. A lot of girls do it 100% out of their own will, and I have no trouble with that then I think it's all well and that any types of act in a scene is OK since when all those in it agree to it. My problem is those girl's who don't do it because they want to, it feels a bit red flag when one of those "mystery" new girls show up that has never ever done a porn scene and goes straight to doing a gangbang with double anal and look totally miserable and in agony doing it. Dunno but the rates that LP and other european studious pay the female performers, but out of a financial standpoint using trafficking victims is the biggest way to maximize profit since the girls have no choice but to do whatever typ of scene the director can think up without her getting a penny and then the director giving a bit of money to her pimp.
[Link]
Jedi Master Bates Deactivated User
383 Posts 9/11
Posted - Oct 15 2015 : 11:11AM
You can download bts footage on LP. There you'll see certain instances where the girl might call a time out "because she feels pain" or because "she feels shit coming", etc. European girls do not sound like they're having the greatest orgasm ever during the entire sex scene, so naturally, americans figure "she's probably a sex slave.". Its mindsets like this that would have me wonder if i'm speaking to a virgin. Its perfectly fine if I am, but understand that during sex in the real world, girls are not constantly hollering at the top of their lungs. Personally, that shit annoys the fuck outta me. Ashley fires is one of my favorite pornstars ever. My only real gripe with her is that she makes too much fucking noise. It kills the fantasy for me when its like that in every single scene for the entire scene. You look at some of the old euro angels hardball scenes and it was the same thing. The girl breathed heavy and grunted throughout the scene, while raising her voice for the real extreme stuff. That is far more sexy to me, than just bellowing for 50 mins straight. To each's own, but its pretty small minded to just assume that the girl is being forced to shoot this scene because she's not doing it "american style".
The harder your action is the the greater the likely-hood you're going to have girls looking like they're not enjoying themselves on camera. Kink is an American company, and it's not unusual to see girls who look like they're not having a good time at certain points in their scenes. Stopping the camera, editing, and being selective about the kinds of girls you subject to these scenes can alleviate it, but when you push the boundaries, it's inevitable that some girls aren't going to enjoy themselves, and show it on camera. Personally, I get the feeling Legal Porno doesn't care about that. Most of the people who watch their stuff will overlook it. I find myself being very choosy about what I watch on that website, because so many girls are willing to subject themselves to that simply for the money. That goes for everyone, not just Legal Porno.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 15 2015 : 1:32PM
^Most of the LP scenes that I have seen are not as rough as Kink scenes. Actually, many of them are not even in the same ballpark. It really depends on who the performers are, but the kind of mandhandling that is routine in Kink's gangbangs doesn't seem to me to be that common in LP's scenes. Yes, the sex acts are extreme (DAP, etc.), but the style of the sex itself doesn't tend to be that rough, at least from most of what I've seen as a heavy user of the website. When I first encountered LP I expected to find lots of scenes similar to the very rough, Euro content that PerfectGonzo.com used to offer. Though I've since become a big fan, I was actually disappointed at first that it was not what I was expecting. Edited by - misspornUSA on 10/15/2015 1:32:52 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 15 2015 : 2:07PM
If you ever get the opportunity to visit a dungeon and watch a few BDSM scenes play out up close, you'll realize very quickly that it's not at all easy to tell as an observer whether or not the subs are enjoying themselves or having a good time.
^ All I can rely on is what my eyes tell me. That's probably why Kink has those stupid interviews before and after their scenes. To try and reassure us that everything was hunky-dory.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 15 2015 : 3:09PM
That's the problem. Just because a sub or a pornstar appears to be in distress does not mean that they are not enjoying themselves. To be sure, it does not mean that we should assume instead that they are enjoying themselves. What we should do is realize is that it's just not very obvious either way. Here's a case in point: Nacho Vidal has gone too far!. I recommend reading the OP, and then reading Kara Price's response on page 3.
A post interview isn't going to give me back an erection I lost after seeing some of that rough stuff. I know some girls like it, but that doesn't mean I will. To each his own. Edited by - Moebius22 on 10/15/2015 3:31:02 PM
I could really do without those interviews (not just talking about Kink here) - in fact, I rarely ever watch them. They're clearly only there as a way of saying "Hey, look what a great bunch of guys we are really! What sane woman wouldn't wanna hang with us??" A lot of my enjoyment of rough scenes comes from the fact that it might be real. I choose to suspend my disbelief while watching. Not really interested in seeing the girl(s) having a laugh and a playful punch on the shoulder with 'the guys' afterwards.
^Not only from Woodman, also from others on the eurobabeindex forum. Take it for what it's worth to you. To me, the studios with seemingly the best reputations have no such bad rumors and they have plenty of competitors.
[Link]
Jedi Master Bates Deactivated User
383 Posts 9/11
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 3:18AM
You do realize pierre woodman has an on going feud with LP. Naturally he's gonna talk shit about them.
^Of course I'm aware, and I guess by that logic Woodman's track record is also clean because most of his haters are from LP. But again, LP's rumors do not come from the Woodman side only.
"Facialized Vol. 7" 2021 AVN Awards Winner: Best Oral Movie 9308 Posts 9/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 10:41AM
I've got no problem with the opinion of the original poster, ultimate_sperminator, and those who agree with him, but I do find it a bit annoying when guys like him decide to state this opinion as fact in the threads of other studios, directors and stars here on ADT. If you don't like certain American studios because you think they're too "soft" or you feel a certain performer isn't hardcore enough, there's no need to make a snarky post on their threads to state your claims. How 'bout just stickin' to what you like? I do seem to notice that those who claim that Euro porn and Euro girls are the best and that American porn and its girls are lame in comparison, tend to post quite frequently in threads pertaining to American studios and pornstars.
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 2:35PM
The difference being - with LP we have literally thousands of hours of video evidence of the girls in their videos looking sickly and extremely disturbed by what is happening to them. Whereas you have no basis at all to make claims you used as an example, in any way, shape or form.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 2:38PM
How do you know that?
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 2:41PM
the claim was made that they stopped a year ago. but they were still releasing them less than 2 months ago. still releasing the backlog scenes for nearly a year defeats the purpose of announcing you're not going to do that kind of porn anymore.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 2:50PM
^You watched thousands of hours of footage? Did you watch hundreds of hours and estimate from there?
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 2:51PM
It's not any more small minded than assuming everything is fine and the girl is really enjoying it, just because you prefer this kind of content where the women are overpowered and treated like ragdolls. (despite the constant tears streaming down their face, ruining their make up, and horrified pained expressions on their face for most of the scene) and the expression is "To each, his own" not, to each's own. But I do appreciate the fact that you tried to say I was a "virgin" for not enjoying LP's rape-like content, while you're using a Star Wars themed username. LOL.
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 2:56PM
So you're saying it's ok if only "some" of the content is forced/rape? What ratio is acceptable?
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 3:01PM
^You have every right to avoid my question, but I'm just going to ask it again anyway.How do you know that?
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 3:17PM
We already know LP has thousands of hours of video available. We also know that several members of this forum, besides my own personal experience, have noted their dislike or concern for the well being of the girls in many of their videos, because of how they look in the videos. I'm not saying EVERY girl in ALL their videos looks this way. In fact, I've already stated numerous times in this thread that there are some girls who seem to be having a grand old time in some of LP's videos. but in my personal experience, and that of a few other forum members who have also attested here as well, the sad, scared, sick looking girls tend to be the norm, rather than the exception. Edited by - foobachi on 10/16/2015 4:51:16 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 3:29PM
^So, do you no longer believe that "with LP we have literally thousands of hours of video evidence" (emphasis mine)? Or, perhaps you are saying that you never meant that those thousands of hours of video evidence are evidence of your claim, but then what exactly are they evidence of and why did you mention them in the first place? Just 'cause?
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 3:46PM
you can argue semantics with the wall all you want. you know what I said, and you know exactly what was meant by it. I'm not going to try and tabulate exactly how many of those thousands of hours of video LP has produced fall into the "questionable" category, because it's subjective, and you're never going to agree, no matter how specific I get. the only point was that Jedi Master Bates tried to compare LP's output (which can actually be watched because thousands of hours of their video is available for public consumption) to a hypothetical scenario about my personal life (which can't be viewed) and that was both a bad analogy, and a lazy personal attack. Edited by - foobachi on 10/16/2015 4:52:03 PM
MOD: I thought I was clear. Maybe not. The forced sex claims are to stop. Unless you have definitive proof you can share there are to be no more libelous statements made in this thread.
[Link]
Foobachi Deactivated User
251 Posts 4/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 4:49PM
I understand. If I hadn't already made it abundantly clear, I'm not outright accusing LP of anything illegal. feel free to delete any posts I made that might put this board or it's membership in a compromising legal position.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Oct 16 2015 : 4:51PM
^^^It's not a question of semantics, but rather of you making multiple, outrageous, unsubstantiated claims on this thread. There are either thousands of hours of evidence on LP, which is what you claimed, or there are not. Yes, it matters that you initially used the word "evidence" and are now claiming that you merely meant that "LP has thousands of hours of video available" which may or may not be evidence. That's more than a semantic difference, those are two distinct claims. Edited by - misspornUSA on 10/16/2015 4:52:16 PM
Tiny Khloe: 2026 Exxxotica Interview
Posted - Oct 14 2015 : 5:36AM
