Sinn and Serene together will be FIRE!!! And Sinn is an amazing person. She don't run any team/service, she loves her supporters, and when you talk with her it's literally as if you are talking to a friend. I've gotten the pleasure of talking with Sinn a ton over the years. When you do purchase content from her on OF it's really through Dropbox she sends you so you can download and keep it. If not she does put her content on MV and C4S too but you can get it cheaper on her OF. Again she is a great reason to get OF. I can't wait for this to come out especially seeing them both trib.
I think that the lack of sales must be the case, as it explains why so many G/G projects just stopped dead in their tracks these past couple of years. Projects like Girls Gone Wild, Dyke4K, and Lesbiansexuality all stopped within a couple of months of launching, not to mention the fact that Slayed, which has deep pockets is only releasing a scene every two weeks.
Despite what some hardcore fans on here are saying, I agree with you that G/G as a genre is struggling right now. We need someone to revitalize the genre the same way that Vixen did for Blacked (not saying it should be Vixen, just comparing the effect).
P.S. I too am not a fan of desks, squirting, chairs, and screaming.
Same here. Although I must admit that closeups have made a bit of a resurgence. At least compared to how it was a few years back.
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Lezzyist Deactivated User
Make Porn Erotic Again 1736 Posts 9/19
Posted - Feb 6 2024 : 7:46PM
D, did you support either of those three projects? I ended up more or less getting what I wanted Girls Gone Wild to be in Excogigirls.
What would revitalization look like? I have found I don't care that much about differences in aesthetics from studio to studio. I can take the glamor of Vixen or the stripped down honesty of Queercrush. The only thing I'm looking for really comes down to the performers. Revitalized to me would just mean a site found a BUNCH of beautiful women who feel comfortable and excited to have nasty fluid-exchange sex with women and recording them with a pretty decent camera. Nothing a site producer can do in that regard honestly besides getting a good feel for who they are casting and, more in their control: CONTRACTING some great GG performers.
Actually, if a site producer came to me and said, Lilly Bell, Freya Parker, Alex Coal, and Lacy Lennon are going to take turns training new girls, I'd be pretty danged excited, because that would be more or less what I just described.
Really? I just don't see it. There are so many studios I know that don't show any closeups and/or have bad angles that I won't even watch them nowadays. InTheCrack very rarely shoots lesbian, but even some of those haven't been the best with action sadly. I am just all by my lonesome bitching on here I guess. Sorry all lol.
Yep, I supported all three projects at one time or another.
As for what revitalization would look like, that would be a bit tricky, but I would start with more regular updates (2-3x a week) with top-end cameras and a (much) higher price tag. I think porn producers have trained the consumer to view porn as a cheap interchangeable commodity, rather than introducing them to the possibility of a far more refined and potentially satisfying product. Wouldn't you pay more if you knew the product was always going to be great, and that you wouldn't have to spend hours searching for something passable to watch? Given how much people are shelling out for mediocre crap on various platforms, it's clear that people have the money, you just have to present a clear case for WHY they should spend more.
I would also go about finding the right person to direct and bring the vision and aesthetic to life, which would either mean bringing someone established back into the business (KMG, Lansky, Holly Randall, etc..), or finding a couple of really talented young directors who would be willing to work together under a unified style or aesthetic. This would extend to figuring out the right color grading and lighting that show that things are high-end, but that also flatters most skin tones and helps capture every visual detail of the action (with plenty of close-ups). With the way that cameras have progressed (see the production for "The Creator"), that wouldn't be too expensive.
For talent, there are many ways you can go, but I would consider a few different approaches, including (1) established performers "training" or working with newbies, you could even leverage that as a separate sister site similar to Excogigirls, (2) hiring girls who have an established G/G presence on Onlyfans, etc.. and (3) working with scouts who make it a priority to find girls who genuinely like other girls, and might even have a history of it in their private lives. The work of the director would then be to do their best to "capture" the action as it unfolds, and do their best to make the set as "performer friendly" as possible.
Finally, to counteract the rampant piracy, there would unfortunately have to be a lot of safeguards including geolocation, and other security requirements, and most controversially - no downloads. This might be unpopular to some, but would likely have to be necessary. I think there would also have to be some additional streaming safeguards, like running the stream on a type of blockchain to trace its potential appearance on other tube sites, etc...
Anyway, as you can tell, I have given this a fair bit of thought, which was why I launched my thread a few years ago. I do think there is a market for something high-end, but it would take a genuine desire and some dedicated effort to get there.
It's a relative statement, meaning that we are seeing places like Girlsway, Sweetheart Video, and Addicted 2 Girls (especially "Yoga Girls 5") show more closeups than they did a few years ago. It's still not nearly enough in my opinion (and nowhere close to InTheCrack levels), but it's more than it was a few years ago when every shoot seemed like it was filmed across the room.
To revitalize G/G it's simple. Get people who care about the genre. Those who care about it would cater to the real audience and that's lesbians not men.
Now I say that bc I know most men will complain if the genre was catered to real lesbians. Real lesbians use toys. I see men not liking the use of toys. Real lesbians sometimes don't always orgasm. They love pleasure and foreplay giving pleasure and just being playful. It's not always about a girl orgasming. Men have this fascination where the girl must always orgasm. Real lesbians don't think like that. If an orgasm happen then great. If not then still great as long as the pleasure was there.
Case in point, Alison Rey and Casey Calvert Queer Crush scene. Did you know Alison didn't orgasm in that scene? She said she couldn't orgasm for a specific reason which she stated. She did give Casey orgasms and she did get pleasure throughout the scene despite not going over the edge. Now most men would find that to be lame bc toy was used and Alison didn't actually orgasm. But in theory real lesbians would find that scene to be hot and real.
I also had a conversation with Sinn and she told me it's not all about having an orgasm. She educated me on lesbian sex between two real lesbians. So again if we want to have a real conversation about G/G we have to take a deep look into what will make for a real G/G scene and go from there. It's deeper than just finding the right girls and the right directors.
Not only that but how it looks. No real lesbians care about angles and close ups. They don't care about being well dressed with the perfect makeup and hairstyle etc. If you want the most real G/G scene then it's something that can't be seen bc in order to actually get a girl to orgasm there isn't an amount of close up, angle, position that are done for the viewers to see. Just let two great women like Freya and Lacy go at it with the camera on and enjoy them truly make love to each other even though we can't completely see all that's going on. Just know though that what we are seeing is real. It's what they would be doing with the camera off. And let's not complain about it not being good bc we couldn't see it well. That's just my opinion.
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Lezzyist Deactivated User
Make Porn Erotic Again 1736 Posts 9/19
Posted - Feb 7 2024 : 1:21AM
I am with you in that I would pay more for a consistently high-quality product. I think there is technology that can place a unique line of pixels in a video to tie it to a specific user. I think that will become a big thing in the future. It might be expensive or technically difficult to do now or something, but I have seen such a thing advertised, and it will probably get easier to do over time. I think it is called digital fingerprinting. If such tech becomes more available, companies (lawyers) could potentially trace videos that appear online via a unique visual identifier that would be hard to spot with the naked eye and maybe hard to identify even with some kind of algorithm.
As far as the cast, I definitely think more time needs to be spent watching the women before casting them, but as a certain producer has told us, sometimes the ladies don't show and you gotta use whoever. Of course, a higher-priced site would presumably mean better pay (better incentive) for the women working in it.
The real flaw in ideas like this is that most people do not care about details in GG porn, so the task would be engaging a small and high-paying audience that might be hard to assemble, even if they are individually willing to pay. So I think the pathos ends up like this:
It's porn. Just have two - but preferably 4 and wishfully more - women sitting next to each other hardly touching each other while ahegaoing, saying mommy, and doing wounded cat noises and that's an 'amazing passionate scene' that will keep the site members entertained just fine.
Hello. I am looking for scene recommendations. I'm looking for threesome scenes where 2 girls are working on a third woman, preferably with a strapon being used. This scene from party of three 17 where Mercedes Lynn is fucking Stella Banxx with the strapon while Staci Silverstone is playing with her tits is the ideal. It's really hot and I'm looking for scenes that are similar.
I think we differ in who the "real audience" is, as my writeup was based on catering to those who have historically paid money for porn, and that is men, not lesbians. While I would love to see what you describe on occasion, I wouldn't pay a significant premium for it.
(QueerCrush and other things like it, are always going to be more niche.)
Hopefully "ahegaoing" is at least a temporary phase (never in all my years of anime, did I EVER think that would become a "mainstream" thing, haha).
As for the audience, I think whoever launches it would have to go in with the expectation that it would take time to get a dedicated fanbase together and should plan accordingly. I also think that having 8-12 updates a month would be a strong draw, since the only other two studios that are that active are GFF and GW.
The thing is, the real audience should not be for men. It should be for real lesbians or at least females that are curious. Men who are interested should just accept it. Thats like in real life if you see a real lesbian couple and you are a man to tell them how they should have real lesbian sex based on your preferences. Even if you paid them to have sex in front of you, if you want the real lesbian way you let them have sex that that they only know how and comfortable with.
Ive heard real lesbian women say they hate to watch lesbian content bc the scenes arent what real lesbians do. So this idea of trying to get G/G to be a certain way to be great I think is impossible unless its done to cater real lesbians and females in general not cater men. And its ok if you or any other man wouldnt pay much to see real true lesbian sex bc it wouldnt appeal to what we want. I think porn in general doesnt give the viewer the real perspective of how sex really is. I think in order to give the real perspective of how sex really is performers must do it on their own platform like OF where they have sex to show this is how that particular female have sex in real life. Not to put on a show for the viewers. And if the viewer thinks its boring or not good then so be it but its more realistic than watching a mainstream scene full of theatrics to fit what we want to see.
I couldn't disagree more. G/G porn exists because someone is willing to pay for it. That someone is predominately men. All porn is made to fulfill a person's fantasy. It's a show for us.
^ I get what you are saying. People will shoot porn to make money and fullfill others fantasies. Im strictly talking about the discussion of revitalizing G/G. I have no real issues with how G/G is right now but I see alot of you complaining about the state its in. Well Im saying how to fix it. Of course no matter what is done to it someone if not more will still complain either way about something. As much as we say the golden era of G/G back in the day during that period there were people still complaining about something.
So yeah if we are just specifically talking about who is paying for what and fullfilling fantasies then Im right there with you. If we are talking about how to fix G/G to make it legit G/G then what Im saying need to happen bc G/G is never meant for guys. Guys love it bc who dont love two beautiful women having sex? So now studios have to tailor to what guys want to see. When a studio try to tailor to what real lesbians and females want to see the average guy might say that studio isnt good. Idk I just think its a slippery slope.
I totally get your point, but the reality is that men are the ones paying for porn. There should unquestionably be way more porn for lesbians and made by lesbians, but to say that the main consumer base should just "deal with it" and completely change their preferences to satisfy a statistical minority is wishful thinking.
It's part of why I often use the term G/G to differentiate between the two. What you want to watch is always going to differ from most customers because guys are way more visual (just look at B/G). If I don't get enough visuals, I don't bother, and no amount of rhetoric is going to change that (I am guessing the same would go for you and your preferences). I am under no illusion that porn is what real sex looks like, and for me, that's the point. If I want real sex, I go out and have real sex. Porn is adult entertainment, which can sometimes approximate real sex. That doesn't mean that I am happy with what passes for G/G porn these days, but it does mean that I am not focusing solely on the realism of the acts.
Ultimately, I am of the mind that there should be way more G/G across the board, and the financially viable example I outlined was one that I think would appeal to a sophisticated portion of the main consumer base (men).
^ Perfect example is the whole dark or poor lighting in scenes. From a perspective of a female having the lights dim with maybe candles lit its a romance thing. Men will complain about not being able to see whats going on. I have no issue with scenes with little light. Again to me Im watching a lesbian scene not a B/G hardcore pound the girl brains out. The more comfortable and relax the girl is the better she will receive pleasure and even have an orgasm. So dim lights in a scene isnt a bad thing for the sexual partners themselves. Sure from a man perspective its hard to see so many dismiss it as a good scene. But for me personally Id rather know or at least believe the woman is really enjoying the sex than being able to really see every lick, finger, kiss, etc.. thats going on. Bc even if I see everything and the woman isnt really enjoying it then whats the purpose of that G/G scene being good? Well outside of my own brain telling me its really good bc I can see everything. And for some if not most thats true but Ive been watching G/G for decades and over the years especially following performers closely and then getting with OF and watching content outside of mainstream, it makes me seek for authentic and real content no matter how it looks. Like Ill pay for a dim light scene where both girls are passionately going at it for real than a bright clearly to be seen scene where I even have the slightest of notion that one or both girls are just going through the motions.
And Ill give you a perfect example, go look at a scene Sinn Sage shot with Jay Taylor. They shot for their own platform on a couch dark at night with one lamp on. Hot scene but not fully lit and you couldnt see everything also too due to not having a camera person if I can recall. Ill take that scene over many scenes you can throw my way no matter how well its shot or how well you can see the action.
I totally get it. For you, there is a significant benefit in authenticity being paramount, and mood, atmosphere, and romance (and likely story) contribute to that.
I am, and always will be on the opposite end of the spectrum, while watching porn for around 2+ decades, my preferred content came during the time of Bellezza, WLT, KMGE, etc... All of which were visually strong. For me, authenticity is a bonus that comes after visuals.
So a dim scene very, very rarely does anything for me. That being said, that content is a niche, and barring any massive changes - always will be.
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Lezzyist Deactivated User
Make Porn Erotic Again 1736 Posts 9/19
Posted - Feb 7 2024 : 2:16PM
For me, there has to be an intelligent and fully-aware middle ground...or more like a 65-35 ground, leaning more toward realism but still getting some nice views thrown in. I don't want totally none-showing angles the entire video, but if the women aren't even trying to *actually physically engage each other deeply, just doing a soundboard with common porn phrases (all SLAYED and Girlsway are, for the most part) or sucking dildos and talking to the camera, it's just too stupid for me to handle lol. It's gotta look like sex.
I would say the closest to how revitalizing G/G porn look like was the golden era for Abbywinters. Amateur looking all natural girls that you wouldnt call looking like models or pornstars having real life looking sex in a more realistic environment (not some crazy sex on a desk) with one or two cameras in the room that are mainly women.
I mostly agree, and also dislike all of the things you listed ("fingers and mouths only"). The main difference is that I think the compromise looks more like Kiss Me Girl Explicit, or prime We Live Together, as opposed to AbbyWinters (which is also niche...).
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Lezzyist Deactivated User
Make Porn Erotic Again 1736 Posts 9/19
Posted - Feb 7 2024 : 7:10PM
The thing about that is I'd like to have sites for both of those visions. We used to not all that long ago. Pornhub and other piracy are a part of that loss, as are the various disparate "talk to the pornstar" platforms, but maybe the audience itself changed too.
And yep, I am a big proponent of the "Fingers and Mouths Only" Club here too. Really, I think a lot of what is missing is *raunch*, as many women simply can't bring themselves to be like that with other chicks (maybe the same could be said of today's BG; I wouldn't know lol). People like Malena Morgan, Jessie Andrews, Georgia Jones, Dani Daniels, Elle Alexandra would make it look as if they LOOOVED pussy. They were some of the greatest at making GG look overtly physically intimate and nasty and they worked with A LOT of women. They were getting INSIDE those girls lmao. Veruca James routinely looked like she would let women use her. That big-tittied Kat Dennings-looking performer (Taylor Vixen, remembered right after I posted) seemed to be all about some vagina. Today, if you find a woman who looks particularly interested in GG, you kinda have to wait months at a time between her sessions with other women, and there's a significant chance the other woman who gets cast can't engage with her fully anyway.
"Many's the person missed the opportunity to say nothing, and lost much because of it." 1935 Posts 8/22
Posted - Feb 7 2024 : 9:05PM
A new scene coming to agirlknows.com with Sonny McKinley, Summer Col and Mona Azar on 15th Feb. People who aren't fans of toys need not watch, looks like there's a lot of strap-on action in this one. Fortunately I don't give a fuck, I see Sonny, I watch. I remember someone saying a few weeks ago that Lilly Bell was the closest to being a genuine crush of theirs, well Sonny is that to me. I simp SO hard for this girl.
Edited by - whyalwaysbilly on 2/7/2024 9:08:14 PM
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Lezzyist Deactivated User
Make Porn Erotic Again 1736 Posts 9/19
Posted - Feb 7 2024 : 10:28PM
Oh, Sonny is on my list, too. You might be sad to hear that the two of them had a near-miss for GFF. Lilly apparently forgot her ID:
[Tweet is no longer available]
Edit: Or as the great Carlin once opined, a near-hit.
Agreed. As you pointed out, the bigger issue is that the genre is on life support. Both visions should be able to exist. The word "Raunch" perfectly summarizes what's missing these days. That's not to say that it doesn't exist; it's just that there was far more of it done by far more producers back in the day. The girls used to spend way more time "inside" which you don't see as much of these days...
In addition to those G/G HOFs, we used to have a solid "B-Cast" that could at least keep up with them, which made for pretty solid scenes.
I say a combination of classic Girlfriends and/or We Live Together style scenes in terms of direction, performers, scene length, and action, coupled with Slayed Production values would work well.
Japanese porn, in all of its absurdity, is the only region/type of porn that really delves into homoerotic/gay aspects of lesbian-ism in porn. American/Euro porn focuses way too much on masculine tropes within lesbian porn, too many roles being played vs Japanese porn, where all parties are seeking gay pleasure by any means. No one in American/Euro porn(especially American porn)really ogles/wants another womans body, and thats always been the problem.
The moment never feels horny enough, someone has to be the man, and then someone has to be the woman. The word "lesbian" has too much masculine meaning in porn now, and it results in the kinda porn we get from the genre. Japanese lesbian/gay porn, doesn't always look for one woman to be the alpha, cause both women are gay, their both weak, wanting to be touched in a way that a man can't touch them, cause their not a female. No sensuality/sensitivity in alot of this stuff either, just a woman playing a man in most lesbian porn stateside.
Japan gets it in my opinion, women letting out deep desires between one another, showing weakness and sensuality that has to stay between them both.
"Many's the person missed the opportunity to say nothing, and lost much because of it." 1935 Posts 8/22
Posted - Feb 9 2024 : 8:29PM
A while ago people were complaining about Brazzers GG scenes being shit now because they always have guys in them (and the stupid storylines) well looks like Twistys might be going the same way. Out of 4 of the proper scenes this year 3 of them have featured men of varying degrees, not a good sign. This latest scene with Lily Lou & Kay Lovely is weird. There's a minute or so of them on the bed kissing and touching each other before the story kicks off, why? The story starts off with Lily pretty much breaking and entering and then asking to be asked inside. I'd be like "You're already in my house", what the fuck? They have this guy standing there silently as a server, they move to the couch and what, the guy is meant to just stand there while they fuck off to the bedroom? Why have him there at all for fuck sake? The sex itself is pretty hot (apart from the choking with hands and dildos, not my thing) but all that bullshit really put me off.
^These sites love to troll their viewers at this point. These porn directors/producers really don't give a fuck about making a good product. Its porn, they think if they shit out anything, the audience will eat it, and their almost right.
Another thing, women directors in porn (in general) is the biggest sham ever, cause at the end of the day, their still in the porn industry. Why does it matter that their women, if your still an Adulttime employee, your gonna make what they think is suitable for their website. Theres some good women directors out there honestly, but the branding of "women directed porn" doesn't mean much.
At the end of the day, your still a porn director working for a production company.
"Many's the person missed the opportunity to say nothing, and lost much because of it." 1935 Posts 8/22
Posted - Feb 9 2024 : 9:06PM
Charlotte Stokely has said on Twitter that she is looking to film her first ever lesbian anal scene this year, as you would expect there has been a lot of replies. Quite interesting that a performer as prolific as her has never done it before. Should be interesting.
Honestly, modern American porn (and some Euro stuff) is purposely carny. Japanese porn is actually making strides to be real erotica, American porn laughs in your face for complaining about the product damn near. I feel like complaining is asinine, but its good to let it out and put it out there, cause I know im not the only one thinking this.
The American porn industry and how its stagnated/stuck on stereotypes and anti-eroticism is what keeps movie/softcore scenes still interesting I guess.
Twistys has always been a bit odd in how they do lesbian scenes. I remember seeing one of Holly Randall's interviews last year where she talked about how Twistys always insisted on making each scene completely "unique" as to scene setting and not to ever repeat a set or a scene idea. Like Brazzers, Twistys has always managed to get A-List talent for most of their scenes, and also like ZZ, they are beginning to feature more of the same lousy elements in their scenes that ZZ does. Another once really good lesbian content provider is going down the drain it would seem. It's really disappointing to see.
If done right I don't mind a guy being in a G/G scene. Back in the day GFF used to show a man in some of their G/G scenes. It was part of their storyline and it had no effect on the sex itself. The scene was still hot. Also Girlsway used to have men in some of their scenes too. Especially their "almost caught" scenes. Again if done right those scenes were hot imo.
Twistys always featured B/G scenes until a couple of years ago, when the site was acquired by the same brand as Brazzers. Their new owners probably decided to turn it into an all G/G site, but it looks like the same stupidity from Brazzers is infecting the page with ridiculous stories, accelerated sex, guys appearing out of nowhere, sex toys and sloppy faces. The good old days with Taylor Vixen, Jelena Jensen, Angela Sommers, Celeste Star, Elle Alexandra, Vanessa Veracruz, Emily Addison, Bree Daniels, Spencer Scott, Brett Rossi or Malena Morgan are unfortunately gone.
Edited by - Bistahieversor on 2/10/2024 11:03:59 AM
"Many's the person missed the opportunity to say nothing, and lost much because of it." 1935 Posts 8/22
Posted - Feb 10 2024 : 12:10PM
^^Yeah, she's retired from mainstream but she does stuff on OF. I looked at the post again and she said "if I were to" do a scene, going by porn promises it might not happen but I pray it does.
Charlotte Stokely has done gg anal in the past, now granted it has been a long, long time since she did it.
One of the instances was here: https://www.hotmovies.com/1192468/charlotte-stokelys-all-girl-violation-porn-video.html
And another one here: https://www.hotmovies.com/3341064/lip-stick-girls-porn-video.html?partner_id=94387233&utm_source=IAFD&utm_medium=portal&utm_campaign=iafd_buyVOD_dl
So, technically, it's the first anal of the year 2024 with a girl for her. I am looking forward to this. :) I am really curious who she picks.
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Lezzyist Deactivated User
Make Porn Erotic Again 1736 Posts 9/19
Posted - Feb 10 2024 : 4:49PM
Admittedly, I have not watched a ton of it, but when I think of Japanese porn, all I can picture is the absurd wailing. Not erotic at all.
"Many's the person missed the opportunity to say nothing, and lost much because of it." 1935 Posts 8/22
Posted - Feb 10 2024 : 7:10PM
There is a user on Twitter (I'll never get used to calling it X) called GoodLesbianPorn that I'm pretty sure is a user on here, just wanted to know if anyone knows who it is.
I second this request, it's always much more of a better encounter when it's setup this way. Just look at classic Girlfriends Films scenes if you need confirmation of it.
^Unfortunately, it's kind of difficult to see a scene where a girl seduce the other one with some hesitation nowadays. And it's even more difficult to see that in older/younger scenario...and it's almost impossible to see that in a taboo scene...
