Pressuring women into doing IR is akin to rape... (page 2)

Author	Post
Everett Senior Member 2088 Posts 6/05	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 10:28AM SunShowers wrote: Good for you for addressing this! Here's my opinion because I want to express it and in case anyone cares what a 22 year old white girl thinks: I am not attracted to black men. I work with black men and I take classes with them. In fact, I am taking an acting class and my scene partner is a black man. The ones that I talk to on a regular basis, I really enjoy them. They are nice and laid back. I have absolutely nothing against them and in fact, I enjoy their company. I had a black female friend for a while until she stabbed me in the back. This being said, I find it appalling the vitriol that is spat at women who don't want to perform with black men. As much as we want to call it racist or feel it's prejudiced, people generally have preferences based on their own ethnicity. It's how our species, our particular gene combinations, continue to thrive and grow. I think it's digusting the men who get on here and attack pornstars for not working with black men. There are physical differences between races. If a woman is not attracted to black men or finds them a turn off, in whatever way, she is entitled to that feeling. Period. There's nothing racist about that, at least not in the way that most people think. And if you do think it's prejudiced, then you are simply blinding yourself. Black men don't look like white or asian or indian men. If a woman isn't interested in working with a black man, that's her decision. There are black people who would never dream of coupling with a white person. It's based on personal preference. And honestly, as unpopular as this might make me, there are differences between races. I'm not saying it has anything to do with mental ability or so forth, but there are differences. It doesn't make one or the other better or more important. But a woman has a right to decide and not be blacklisted or constantly attacked. So get over it. As I said here months ago, concentrate on the performers who will work with black men and ignore the ones who won't. You, as well as the performer, are entilted to your preference. Click to expand why do I get the feeling that this is a WHITE guy writing this? ...I could be wrong though [Link]
Everett Senior Member 2088 Posts 6/05	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 10:44AM too many of the posts are starting to look like responses to the continuing IR thread "she wont do black guys". In keeping on topic with the original post. Most porn , gals & guys, sign some sort of agreement/contract etc. to perform in a scene. They are of free sound, mind & body to sign or not sign. They may even 'flake'(refuse to do scene) later on before the scene, which would set them in bad stance for future scene or they may be sued by the offended party. Pressuring somebody is not forcing them to perform as they have a choice. [Link]
Tobias Deactivated User 475 Posts 1/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 12:35PM Royal Tee wrote: The anti IR debate crowd is starting to act like the pro IR debate crowd. Click to expand And what if the "anti-IR crowd" and the "pro-IR crowd" merge into one "respect the female talent crowd?" Imagine that a young woman puts her well being on the line to venture into the world of porn. Perhaps she does it because she just needs to pay the rent. Every day, she questions herself. "What am I doing? What if I get sick?" She imagines a simpler, safer future. Imagine a guy on the sidelines critisizing her for not doing more - a Monday morning pimp of sorts. Now, imagine that instead of being that guy, you are that young woman. However racist the world most certainly is, and might always be - since we as humans seem to have an insatiable need to discriminate - you do not improve the situation by taking on the persona of a misogynist. In that case, all you have accomplished is to display an extreme degree of hypocrisy. You have crossed the line from being the oppressed to being the oppressor - even if only through your words. My suggestion? Lay off the women and go to the source of your anger. Put in other words - Pick on someone your own size. [Link]
NewRomancer Deactivated User under THEIR avatar 738 Posts 7/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 1:12PM SunShowers wrote: there are differences between races. Click to expand No, there aren't... There is only ONE race of humans... and we come in a wide variety of sizes, shapes, colours, smells... And at least 2 genders (With something of a grey area occasionally between them) Does a woman have a 'right' to have preferences who she will and will not have sex with? (on camera or off, for pay or not) Abso-fucking-lootly... and her reasons for those preferences are immaterial! But if her preferences are based only on skin colour, then she's most likley chosen to be an ignorant bigot. What would you call a guy who wouldn't fuck brunettes? Who only wouldn't fuck them because they were brunettes??? I'd call him a blithering idiot... [Link]

duefuss Member Not a shred of evidence exists in favor of the idea that life is serious - Brendan Gill 723 Posts 4/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 1:30PM Racism exists everywhere, against African Americans, Latinos, Arabs -- you name it -- even against whites. It's not particularly shocking to learn that some girls in porn are racist, any more than it is to see treatment of women here that is sexist and misogynist. So there ARE racists in porn. And? What would you have done about it? Fire the girls? If they are good porn actors that make money for producers, that ain't gonna happen. Require sensitivity training or something? Get serious! This industry doesn't even provide benefits to its employees, much less give a shit about the opinions of its performers. Porn is simply not a venue where racism is or is going to be considered a problem. Except for the anecdotal evidence cited above (in which, BTW, no civil rights laws were broken, and no 'corporate' racism was even alleged) porn has for decades pretty much ignored race issues, and I expect it will continue to do so. [Link]
lack100 Deactivated User 139 Posts 8/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 2:56PM Nimrod wrote: Click to expand Let's not forget that those same girls refused to worked with Jake Steed who is biracial but looks more white than black. If Jake had lied about his ethnicity and claimed he was latino, they wouldn't have had problems working with him. Lots of girls have worked with Ramon but they still say they havent done IR yet, including Rachel Roxx. Max hardcore is at least better looking and in better looking than Ron Jeremy. Click to expand yep this is very true, he would have been just like that ramon guy . No girl has a problem doing a scene with that guy, jake is virtually the same color as him. So all he would have had to do is put on a spanish accent and jake would have been good to go. jenna jameson is even with a light mexican. Also a bunch of dodgers have done scenes with that asian guy @ she loves asian cock such as morgan dayne ,gracie glam, jessica valeino, and the swastika girl stephanie kane. All these women would say they have never done i.r. becuase black is the only color they see,they b racist. [Link]
CharlotteVale Member where ultra-feminine meets ultra-anal ;) 78 Posts 7/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 3:36PM It doesn't really bother me when I see a girl who won't do IR. It's not up to me to judge her choices. What bothers me is when I see a woman charging more to do IR. If she's not going to fuck black men because she's been told they're too big, or she doesn't get turned on by black men, fine. But if she's decided she will fuck them but she's going to charge more?! That seems racist to me. But there's also a good degree of ignorance that abounds and while it sucks to see someone not being able to figure things out for themselves we can't exactly blame the girls who haven't had time to learn better. I heard an 18 year old that I was on set with saying that she won't do black guys because they're all too big. Sure, that might be a stereotype but if you look at the black male performers these days, most of them ARE really big and a girl who's looking through porn, seeing huge black dick after huge black dick might be a little intimidated. I know I can't get fucked by a huge dick day after day. I'm just not built for it. To address the OP more closely though, I don't see getting down on someone for not doing IR as rape. reprehensible perhaps but not rape. Besides it's not just IR that girls get flack for not performing. Anal is something that everyone wants to see these days, and then extreme anal, and even things like foot fetishes etc. Porn consumers all have their own fetishes and things that get them off and it's hard for them to accept that a girl they like may not like the same things. I find that to be a bit degrading as I think the most important thing should be that the people on set are enjoying themselves and sharing that enjoyment with the viewer. When I see someone getting off on watching a girl do a certain act, even if she doesn't enjoy it, it makes me wonder if he's just seeing her as a piece of meat to amuse him. But I suppose that's it's own topic. :P [Link]
SunShowers Member 333 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 3:54PM "No, there aren't... There is only ONE race of humans... and we come in a wide variety of sizes, shapes, colours, smells... And at least 2 genders (With something of a grey area occasionally between them)" First you contradict me, then you say exactly what I was trying to communicate in my original post. Physical characteristics. There are differences between races and if you'd paid more attention, you would have noticed that I made a point of saying that there weren't any differences beyond the superficial. Black people tend to have hair of a certain texture, dark skin, and oftentimes distinctive noses. Asian people tend to have slanted eyes. White people have all sorts of different features, but lighter skin. I said that the differences I was pointing out had nothing to do with cognitive ability, et cetera. But there are physical differences and that would go along with my point that attraction probably plays a big role in SOME cases. I'm not saying that hate or prejudice never plays a role, according to some of the posters, it plays a major one. I was simply offering an alternative viewpoint. But regardless of the reason, it doesn't matter. You can definitely hold it against a performer and avoid her videos, but there's absolutely no reason why she should work with any performer unless she wants to. Case closed. And to the other poster, you are very wrong about me being a white guy. [Link]
BYOB_Kenobi Senior Member “Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:00PM duefuss, I could not agree with your post more. I'm going to jump into the soup. Tobias, Trying to equate 'pressuring female performers' to rape is completely asinine, both technically and functionally. Like others have said, this is an irresponsible and inappropriate use of rape; if you do not know the difference, then any serious discussion is futile. Moreover, the deceptive logical steps you adopt to demonstrate your argument is laughable, unconvincing, and nonsensical. [Link]
BYOB_Kenobi Senior Member “Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:08PM ma meeshka wrote: Click to expand Very true! [Link]
Nimrod Member 624 Posts 7/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:36PM Everett wrote: SunShowers wrote: Click to expand why do I get the feeling that this is a WHITE guy writing this? ...I could be wrong though Click to expand I feel the same way too. That stuff happens all the time online. [Link]
SunShowers Member 333 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:38PM Why? [Link]
killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:03PM the unknown pervert wrote: killbillvol69 wrote: There are posts all over ADT of porn girls talking about how they did a scene recently with a guy they weren't attracted to. Click to expand But how many of these scenes end up being hot and how many are obvious go through the motions? Are you looking for any IR scene with starlet XYZ that won't do IR or do you want a hot scene with the same performer? If you want the latter than attraction is going to have something to do with it. Click to expand Immaterial. It was not my point that I want to see a good scene or a bad scene. It was not my point that I even want to see any given white girl (or white girls in general) doing scenes with black guys. My point was that if girls perform with guys they are not attracted to all the time, and then say (or people on this board say) they won't perform with black guys because they aren't attracted to them, I have to call bullshit, because if the decision to perform with someone was really based on attraction, then they wouldn't do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. But they do do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. Ergo, the reason given for not working with black guys, that being that they aren't attracted to them, must not be true. I really don't see how this is confounding anyone. It seems pretty simple to me. [Link]
BYOB_Kenobi Senior Member “Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:15PM tritone wrote: This is the bitter pill we must swallow. Race is not separate from attraction. It is a component thrown into the mix, often consciously. So it is possible that to certain performers, being black is so unattractive that it can never rise above the UGLIEST person of ANY OTHER RACE. As a black person, it is truly difficult to fathom this, but we are asked to respect that decision. I mean, it is baffling why if given only the choice of sex with Max Hardcore, or Taye Diggs, a starlet would choose Max Hardcore. But I suppose it is her choice. Since we are black, we are kind of blind to how others view us externally. Maybe having black skin and kinky/curly hair really does make us ugly. Even blacks with more "european" features like narrow noses and delicate faces can't make the cut because they are .. well black. WE just can't see what that means to other people who are NOT black. It is very frustrating. Click to expand Tritone, I say this with all due respect and hopefully you won't perceive this as condescending. I just wanted to hear your opinion. As a fellow member of a minority here in the US, I too have experienced gross, overt racism and many racial biases, resulting in a lot of frustrations based solely on race. However, I have found that people/groups/races who behave and practice resentment stemming from negative racial experience, tend to be held back by their attitude and behavior (rightfully or unrightfully so), in many areas of their lives due to its corrupting nature and propensity for inappropriate attribution. IMHO, I have found groups/races minimize the impact on their behavior and relationships, fare much better socially, economically, romantically, etc. etc. In many ways, I find this intangible strength in character not only admirable, but beneficial in life. For example, I worked with an African-American/Native-American guy who grew up way back in the days of segregation (I think he was born in the 1930s). The stories he told of the environments he lived through makes me cringe. Yet he somehow didn't let it affect his behavior or condemn the inappropriate. I was one of the few close coworkers who was aware of some of his extensive history and even negative racial attitudes he held that many acquaintances and familiar coworkers were totally oblivious to, due to his attitude and conduct. I think this is partially why he was so successful at everything he did (was in 101st Airborne, fought in wars, promoted to a manager-level position back when it was more rare, entrusted with rare responsibilities [i.e., surgical], etc. etc.). He was partially responsible for training me during my first job out of college and became a real positive role-model for me. I am not saying you do this. I just wanted to know what you think, after reading your 1st post. [Link]

killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:15PM CharlotteVale wrote: Besides it's not just IR that girls get flack for not performing. Anal is something that everyone wants to see these days, and then extreme anal, and even things like foot fetishes etc. Porn consumers all have their own fetishes... Click to expand Charlotte I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and assume that you weren't implying this (especially since the rest of your post, which I didn't bother copying, went in a different direction), but I cringe every time I feel that someone is comparing working with a black man to some kind of fetish. Excluding someone from your potential work partners based on their race/ethnicity/colour of their skin/whatever doesn't have to do with a girl's unwillingness to participate in some kind of fetish. It's not like saying "I don't want to do fem-dom scenes" or "I don't want to do DP's". If a guy who likes fem-dom stuff really wants to work with a girl, she can say "hey I'll work with you, but no fem-dom stuff", and he can say "ok we'll just do a normal scene", and then they'll work together. If a guy who really likes to shoot anal wants to work with a particular girl, she can say "hey I don't do anal", and if he really wants her badly, he can say "OK I'll shoot you in one of my rare non-anal scenes", and then they can work together. If a black guy wants to work with a girl, and she says hey "I don't do black guys", there's no compromise to be made. He can't say "hey ok well I'll just magically transform myself into a white guy, and then we can work together". It simply won't happen. I'm not saying "oh boohoo, poor black performer". I'm saying that "I won't do anal" or "I won't do foot fetish" or "I won't do fem-dom" or "I won't do gangbangs" have nothing in common with saying "I won't do black guys". [Link]
Dr. Nasty Senior Member Asa Akira.....Damn! 3797 Posts 9/05	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:18PM ^Its a very simple statement. Not everyone graduated high school though. That last remark wasn't aimed at anyone.....well unless you didn't finish high school. lol ***The Dr. of Nasty*** [Link]
NewRomancer Deactivated User under THEIR avatar 738 Posts 7/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:20PM SunShowers wrote: There are differences between races Click to expand It you who's missing the point... There cannot be differences between the races, because there are no different races.... Humans, no matter their colour, shape, size, whatever are all the same race. There is no such thing as racisim... There is only bigotry. (And in this case, pedantry) [Link]
killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:24PM SunShowers wrote: physical differences and that would go along with my point that attraction probably plays a big role in SOME cases. Click to expand And I'm saying it doesn't, because all girls perform with people they aren't attracted to all the time. If you really think a girl looks at the minion and Sean Michaels and says "Hey the Minion is way sexier", then I think you must be living in an alternate universe. And it's not just the Minion. I mentioned Dirty Harry & Dick Nasty as two other examples; also Max Hardcore, Ron Jeremy... I could go on. Think about how many girls do "fuck a fan" or "fuck team five" or other sites like that, where they just show up and fuck whatever random amateur dude is thrown at them (as long as he's tested), but won't touch a black guy. I mean these girls are literally ready to fuck ANYONE, and they do; so long as he's not black. PLEASE tell me you don't really think it's a case of attraction. Unless you can honestly say that, given the choice, you would choose ANY WHITE MAN ON THE PLANET over some fairly handsome and nice black dude, then I think you must concede that the situation in porn isn't the same thing as what you're talking about, being more into white guys than black guys. [Link]
BYOB_Kenobi Senior Member “Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:39PM RandomPrecision wrote: Now it's only a matter of time before somebody gets shot in the ass with an arrow. Click to expand RP, hopefully there won't be too many decapitations. Wow, lots of IR action ---> all top 3 threads currently in TPP are IR titled threads. [Link]
Everett Senior Member 2088 Posts 6/05	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:12PM SunShowers wrote: And to the other poster, you are very wrong about me being a white guy. Click to expand my bad then. All my best [Link]
Everett Senior Member 2088 Posts 6/05	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:17PM NewRomancer wrote: SunShowers wrote: There are differences between races Click to expand It you who's missing the point... There cannot be differences between the races, because there are no different races.... Humans, no matter their colour, shape, size, whatever are all the same race. There is no such thing as racisim... There is only bigotry. (And in this case, pedantry) Click to expand I think the word missing _______is "Ethnicity". Yes we are all of the human race which is why I don't see, and a lot of other people throughout the centuries never learned, why there is a problem. [Link]
Tobias Deactivated User 475 Posts 1/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:56PM killbillvol69 wrote: My point was that if girls perform with guys they are not attracted to all the time, and then say (or people on this board say) they won't perform with black guys because they aren't attracted to them, I have to call bullshit, because if the decision to perform with someone was really based on attraction, then they wouldn't do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. But they do do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. Ergo, the reason given for not working with black guys, that being that they aren't attracted to them, must not be true. I really don't see how this is confounding anyone. It seems pretty simple to me. Click to expand It is because you are over-simplifying the situation that you don't understand where the majority of posters to this thread are coming from. Attraction is not limited solely to appearance. A man's personality, hygiene, sense of humor and certainly the manner in which he treats a woman can all make him highly attractive to the opposite sex. The parallel of course is that a critical, demanding and misogynistic man may - despite being Adonis himself - be deemed highly repulsive. To think otherwise is to give women very little credit for being able to make informed and insightful decisions as to their partners. [Link]
the unknown pervert Deactivated User I'd like to stay but I've got a plane to catch. 3243 Posts 5/06	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:59PM Nimrod wrote: Opinions on racism in porn is split along racial lines on this board and that is self explanatory. Blacks are saying it's there and whites are saying there is none. Click to expand Oh, it's there but it is not everywhere you look like some people think. Many people here believe that a woman who agrees to be in a Lex Steele movie but does not do IR is racist. I say that if she was really racist she would never agree to be in a movie directed by Lex Steele in the first place. There is also a difference between being a racist and having pressure put on you from people close to you who may be racist. [Link]
MrLongStiff Deactivated User 87 Posts 7/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:02PM To Tobias, Please tell me when since porn has ever been classy?? ^^ When has a pornstarlet being cummed on in the face was ever deemed classy??. Tobias, you are tripping up in your own thread. Why would a girl do a scene with rough guys like Max Hardcore and refuse smooth guys Mr Marcus or Sean Michaels, huh? Your response to Killbillvol69 is totally weak and has more holes than Swiss cheese. Edited by - mrlongstiff on 10/6/2009 7:08:59 PM [Link]

Nimrod Member 624 Posts 7/09	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:12PM killbillvol69 wrote: SunShowers wrote: physical differences and that would go along with my point that attraction probably plays a big role in SOME cases. Unless you can honestly say that, given the choice, you would choose ANY WHITE MAN ON THE PLANET over some fairly handsome and nice black dude, then I think you must concede that the situation in porn isn't the same thing as what you're talking about, being more into white guys than black guys. Click to expand It's not like these women are told to fuck these guys for the re3st of their life or to marry them. I can see why these girls will refuse to fuck people they find very physcially repulsive, but if someone is ok or a little below average, I don't see why they will refuse them. That line"I'm not attracted to so and so" should be more "I find so and so so ugly and repulsive that I won't fuck him" The standard that applies to Ron Jeremy sounds more realistic to me...he isn't attractive but not "super ugly" so girls have no problem working with him. [Link]
Slaughtersun Deactivated User 825 Posts 8/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:12PM ^ Edited by - Slaughtersun on 10/6/2009 7:13:13 PM [Link]
Twizted6 Senior Member Good & Evil is merely a matter of perspective, I perfer to call myself... Determined 1229 Posts 7/05	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:36PM killbillvol69 wrote: ...yet there are lots of girls who have worked with Max (many of them more than once), but not any black guys. Click to expand Those bitches are just plain crazy. [Link]
SunShowers Member 333 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 10:42PM "It you who's missing the point... There cannot be differences between the races, because there are no different races.... Humans, no matter their colour, shape, size, whatever are all the same race." Perhaps I missed it because it's not pertinent to my original point? You're splitting hairs and nitpicking about something completely unrelated. I don't care how many times you draw the distinction, I am still going to tell you that there are physical differences between, I don't know what word you'll accept, ETHNICITIES? Black men (or asian, white, et cetera)have certain physical characteristics and until every ETHNICITY on this planet melds and becomes one, with the same coloring and physical characteristics, that will be so. And yet, even after my efforts to admit that racism probably plays a card in some performers choosing not to work with black men, somebody pops up and hammers at me as if I didn't allow the distinction. It figures. This will be the last thing I'll say about it: you can't make people do what you want. You will never have that power and the best thing to do is get over it because frankly, it's only going to cause you grief. People will feel the way they do and have their prejudices, despite how closely it may hit home for you, and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it. Short of rape. I mean, what the hell are you all getting at? You've known for most of your lives that a good many people harbor racist ideas. Are you saying female performers should be forced into scenes with black men? What exactly are you wanting to achieve with all this yammering? I'm honestly curious. What's the solution to this? [Link]
Dr. Nasty Senior Member Asa Akira.....Damn! 3797 Posts 9/05	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:25AM Affirmative Action ***The Dr. of Nasty*** [Link]
killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 1:07AM Tobias wrote: killbillvol69 wrote: My point was that if girls perform with guys they are not attracted to all the time, and then say (or people on this board say) they won't perform with black guys because they aren't attracted to them, I have to call bullshit, because if the decision to perform with someone was really based on attraction, then they wouldn't do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. But they do do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. Ergo, the reason given for not working with black guys, that being that they aren't attracted to them, must not be true. I really don't see how this is confounding anyone. It seems pretty simple to me. Click to expand It is because you are over-simplifying the situation that you don't understand where the majority of posters to this thread are coming from. Attraction is not limited solely to appearance. A man's personality, hygiene, sense of humor and certainly the manner in which he treats a woman can all make him highly attractive to the opposite sex. The parallel of course is that a critical, demanding and misogynistic man may - despite being Adonis himself - be deemed highly repulsive. To think otherwise is to give women very little credit for being able to make informed and insightful decisions as to their partners. Click to expand How exactly am I oversimplifying this? As I mentioned in my other post, so many of these girls work for sites like "fuck a fan" and "fuck team five" and "midnight prowl" and "can he score" and on and on, where they'll fuck any amateur guy the director throws at them, who they've never met before (so long as he's tested). ANY guy will be acceptable to the girls, SO LONG AS he's not black. Are you really going to tell me that they know in advance that literally any guy on the street is someone they'll be attracted to, be it appearance or personality or hygiene or whatever else? They've never met them. Yet they fuck them anyway. Unless they're black. Please, someone tell me I'm not speaking in a different language here. These girls are literally saying they'll fuck ANYONE but a black guy. And this is simply a question of attraction and nothing else? These girls just happen to know that they're attracted to every White, Latino, South Asian, South East Asian, Native American, Pacific Islander, Inuit and Yupik man much more than they are to any black man? How could they possibly know this? Are they prescient? ** One more thing Tobias*: you refuted my post by claiming that maybe the girl could be attracted - or not attracted - to a guy for any number of reasons, only some of which are physical. I agree with you completely. That's why when a girl posts that she wasn't attracted to a guy in any way, didn't like his look, his personality, or anything else, and she still worked with him, then I assume that she wasn't attracted to him yet still worked with him. Because that's what she said, in her own words.* But then, the girl will say "I don't work with Black guys because I'm not attracted to them." In other words, it is because I'm not attracted to black guys that I won't work with them. In other words, if I'm not attracted to someone, I won't (or can't) work with them. (Be it physical, emotional, whatever - we'll give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she could mean any or all of those things.) But she's said on several occasions that she does work with guys she's not attracted to (physical, emotional, the whole deal). Two statements: 1. I work with guys I'm not attracted to all the time. 2. I don't want to work with them because I'm not attracted to them. Please tell me you see the problem here. Why am I saying all this? (and Sun Showers this might answer your most recent question as well) It's not because I want to pressure women to work with black guys. As I've said in many posts over the past year and a half, I don't care if you have this reason or that reason for not working with black guys, I don't even care much if you don't give me a reason. But if you do choose to give me a reason, I expect it to be one that makes sense. That's all. [Link]
Tobias Deactivated User 475 Posts 1/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 2:13AM killbillvol69 wrote: As I've said in many posts over the past year and a half, I don't care if you have this reason or that reason for not working with black guys, I don't even care much if you don't give me a reason. But if you do choose to give me a reason, I expect it to be one that makes sense. Click to expand But, who is to judge what "makes sense?" What is perfectly logical for one person might be the height of fallacy to another. The entire point of this thread is that when a woman says "no," it means "no." An explanation is not required, regardless of how troubling or frustrating that is to any man. If she draws a line regarding a particular ethnic group, then that line must be respected. If she draws a line regarding a particular sex act, then that line must be respected. If she draws any line, then that line is not to be crossed. To impose otherwise on her is to strip her of an essential right to privacy over her own body. And, of all places, in the realm of adult entertainment, this right should be respected. It is the recognized right to privacy embodied in forty plus years of caselaw that allows porn to be created, distributed and viewed as freely as it is in the United States. Enjoying this right without affording it to another is as discriminatory and thereby harmful as any underlying claim of racism. [Link]
killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 2:46AM ^ I'm pretty sure we're in agreement here. As I've posted, I don't want to insist she does or doesn't do anything. I don't expect her to give or not give me a reason for it. I don't care whether the reason she does give is something I agree or don't agree with, or find respectable or not respectable. But I don't want it to not make sense. If someone looks at me and says "I don't like rain. I like rain" I will say "hey man, that doesn't make sense". I'm not going to force them to go outside or stay inside, but I am going to point out that what they're saying sounds kind of off. Similarly, when a porn girl says that she will work with guys she's not attracted to in any way, and then says that she won't work with guys she's not attracted to, I have no problem saying "You know what? That doesn't make sense." And that's all I'm saying here. [Link]
Zaer Deactivated User 249 Posts 10/07	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:13AM killbillvol69 wrote: This is going to get ugly. Click to expand There's no reason for it to given that the OP is self-evidently wrong, thus there's no need to even put forward a response to dispute his argument. [Link]
Tobias Deactivated User 475 Posts 1/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:17AM killbillvol69 wrote: ^ I'm pretty sure we're in agreement here. Click to expand Judging by the number of reads and posts to this thread in only 36 odd hours, it appears that many of us are in agreement on a number of things - including the fact that interracial threads invariably devolve into claims of racism. Presumably, such claims are counterproductive to one of the goals of this site - that is to bring producers, actors and fans together so that they can discuss adult content - not argue and berate one another. Divisive discussion only leads to hurt feelings, burnt bridges and missed opportunities. Given this fact, the suggestion offered by a number of posters - to create a separate forum dedicated solely to interracial issues - might be appropriate. In this way, flame wars and the distractions they create could be insulated from the rest of the site - so that the majority of posters could continue to enjoy AdultDVDTalk. [Link]

Zaer Deactivated User 249 Posts 10/07	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:22AM Tobias wrote: killbillvol69 wrote: ^ I'm pretty sure we're in agreement here. Click to expand Judging by the number of reads and posts to this thread in only 36 odd hours, it appears that many of us are in agreement on a number of things - including the fact that interracial threads invariably devolve into claims of racism. Presumably, such claims are counterproductive to one of the goals of this site - that is to bring producers, actors and fans together so that they can discuss adult content - not argue and berate one another. Divisive discussion only leads to hurt feelings, burnt bridges and missed opportunities. Given this fact, the suggestion offered by a number of posters - to create a separate forum dedicated solely to interracial issues - might be appropriate. In this way, flame wars and the distractions they create could be insulated from the rest of the site - so that the majority of posters could continue to enjoy AdultDVDTalk. Click to expand It's ironic that segregation is being put foward as a possible way of dealing with disagreements about a racial issue. [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14595 Posts 3/02	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:24AM killbillvol69 wrote: ...so many of these girls work for sites like "fuck a fan" and "fuck team five" and "midnight prowl" and "can he score" and on and on, where they'll fuck any amateur guy the director throws at them, who they've never met before (so long as he's tested). Click to expand How do you know this is true, as opposed to the fantasy they're selling? I don't follow these sites, I don't know the guys shooting for them, so I really have no idea. However, I think it is safe to say that reality in porn is the exception, not the rule. [Link]
Tobias Deactivated User 475 Posts 1/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:33AM Zaer wrote: It's ironic that segregation is being put foward as a possible way of dealing with disagreements about a racial issue. Click to expand I agree it is ironic. It is also antithetical to the notion of free and unfettered speech. However, where a handful of posters persist in showing absolutely no restraint or respect towards the majority of posters (some of whom are the performers who star in the content that is the subject of this site), then this may be a necessary recourse. Politely asking this handful of posters to stop clearly hasn't worked, since both the prevalence and aggressive nature of interracial threads has only increased in recent months. [Link]
killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:51AM Hardware wrote: ...However, I think it is safe to say that reality in porn is the exception, not the rule. Click to expand Well, you're right, porn has a long history of showing us planned events and portraying them as random. But something is changing, and much of this new 'genre' of stars fucking regular dudes is very much what it claims to be. An increasing number of stars are offering to fuck any member of their site, so long as he is willing to have his face shown on camera. In other words the fan chooses the girl, and not the other way around. She's willing, and has promised, to do anyone, so long as he's willing to show his face. The only restriction for some of these girls being that he's not a black guy. The "fuck team five" site chooses the guys in a slightly less random fashion than what is demonstrated, but (and I know this from speaking to a guy who was on the site) still without the stars knowing about the selection. The stars are similarly out of the loop on "fuck a fan" where, for example, a video recorded by Tara Lynn Foxx shows her arriving at set and meeting some men, asking "so who am I fucking?" and finding that some were the random fans, one was a production assistant, still another was in charge of lighting - in other words showing up ready to fuck any guy they threw at her. Etc. What we're seeing in porn these days is a much more 'real' version of reality than what we have been presented with in the past. [Link]
Hardware All-Star Member Your other left 14595 Posts 3/02	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 4:04AM killbillvol69 wrote: ...in other words showing up ready to fuck any guy they threw at her. Click to expand Wow, that's either fearless or stupid, and I tend to lean toward the latter. [Link]
BYOB_Kenobi Senior Member “Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard 2684 Posts 8/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 4:13AM KB, I don't wanna derail the focus, but I haven't come across much talk about the new business model you speak of. Although I see this emerging model as an effective way to increase customers/paying fans for website, I imaging this is/will be a nightmare for infectious disease (ID) perspective for female performers. Essentially this model introduces large amounts of male 'free agents' into the porn pool, who, excuse any ignorance for the specific practices, might go thru required AIM screening (- results), but it still increases the exposures and multiplies ID risks for females. 'Free agents' attitude of 'once in a life-time experience' is not exactly the regular male talent attitudes (a job, so safe-sex practices are desirable offset). [Link]
Zaer Deactivated User 249 Posts 10/07	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 5:11AM Tobias wrote: Zaer wrote: It's ironic that segregation is being put foward as a possible way of dealing with disagreements about a racial issue. Click to expand I agree it is ironic. It is also antithetical to the notion of free and unfettered speech. However, where a handful of posters persist in showing absolutely no restraint or respect towards the majority of posters (some of whom are the performers who star in the content that is the subject of this site), then this may be a necessary recourse. Politely asking this handful of posters to stop clearly hasn't worked, since both the prevalence and aggressive nature of interracial threads has only increased in recent months. Click to expand Actually respect and restraint are demonstrated with the discussions on this topic. What you likely disagree with though is the legitimate criticism of those female performers who refuse to work with Blacks yet work with performers of every other race and justify it by stating that it's because of attraction issues, which has already been shown to be a demonstrably false argument. [Link]
pokerman Member J lo booty 404 Posts 4/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 6:22AM Tobias wrote: killbillvol69 wrote: ^ I'm pretty sure we're in agreement here. Click to expand Judging by the number of reads and posts to this thread in only 36 odd hours, it appears that many of us are in agreement on a number of things - including the fact that interracial threads invariably devolve into claims of racism. Presumably, such claims are counterproductive to one of the goals of this site - that is to bring producers, actors and fans together so that they can discuss adult content - not argue and berate one another. Divisive discussion only leads to hurt feelings, burnt bridges and missed opportunities. Given this fact, the suggestion offered by a number of posters - to create a separate forum dedicated solely to interracial issues - might be appropriate. In this way, flame wars and the distractions they create could be insulated from the rest of the site - so that the majority of posters could continue to enjoy AdultDVDTalk. Click to expand Great post Tobias! I think a sub forum is a great idea. It is an important issue this topic but it is constant threads about the same subject. Calling people racist all over the place is libelous for a start. Edited by - pokerman on 10/7/2009 6:26:07 AM [Link]
NerdGod Member Using a 2 inch cock like it was 12 480 Posts 7/06	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 11:50AM IR threads are anal. But the main heading to this thread is wrong. They have a right to thier opionon wether or not a talent is influenced by it is another matter entirly. Its just stupid when you spend you entire day whinning like a b_____ over it. my point of view differs from spamrod and the other alleged "posters". my problem is the way "they" go about it. notice my IR thread was locked. must be because im white. [Link]
SunShowers Member 333 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:12PM Ok. If I'm understanding this correctly, you want every performer who won't work with black men to publically admit to being a racist. Or barring that, demonstrate that she is someone who won't work with people she isn't attracted to? I guess that's fair. There's nothing wrong with expecting honesty, but keep in mind the types of people that largely dominate the industry. [Link]
Tobias Deactivated User 475 Posts 1/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:23PM Zaer wrote: What you likely disagree with though is the legitimate criticism of those female performers who refuse to work with Blacks yet work with performers of every other race and justify it by stating that it's because of attraction issues, which has already been shown to be a demonstrably false argument. Click to expand What I disagree with is the destruction of the entire fantasy that is porn by a handful of consumers who think it is their duty to "out" various performers. "X must be homosexual since he works with transsexuals." "Y must be racist since she hasn't worked with any black men." "Z must be bulimic or on drugs since she's lost a lot of weight recently." What a performer is or is not in their personal lives is and should remain private. This is why performers use stage names. Aside from being a basic human right, privacy maintains boundaries, ensures safety and allows the continued existence of the fantasy. It is when a consumer feels a sense of entitlement to personal knowledge of a performer or when he wants to dictate the conduct of a performer or when he attempts to cross the boundary between fantasy and reality that we have a problem. "I want to know whether X is a racist. In fact, I want X to admit she is a racist. I refuse to watch X otherwise. Others should do the same." What are the motivations behind such expressions? More pressingly, do these words add or detract from the entertainment derived by the rest of the viewing audience? If the goal is to force the performer to do something she does not want to do, then the goal is to oppress another human being. If the goal is to leave other viewers not wanting to watch the performer, then the goal is to destroy her career. Along the way though, the very essence of porn is also destroyed. Gone is the fantasy of a beautiful woman - whose name you need not even know - extending sexual gratification to you. Maybe congratulations are in order for the person who makes it his goal to show the rest of us what lies within the heart of a woman. With words alone he makes us forget the primal instinct to desire her so that we can focus on her secrets - despite the fact that we will still never know her. Edited by - tobias on 10/7/2009 12:25:50 PM [Link]
Nimrod Member 624 Posts 7/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:51PM KillBill is making some great points in his posts. Most of these girls who do IR today, if you had asked them 50 years ago (if they were of that generation) they will say "Hell No". As racial relations improve over the years, there will be more girls willing to do IR. 100 years from now, there will still be girls refusing to do IR but it will be a minority. I don't think there will ever be true racial harmony in this country, but some improvements will be made in the future. Edited by - Nimrod on 10/7/2009 1:26:19 PM [Link]
Nimrod Member 624 Posts 7/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 1:25PM The goal of these kind of discussions isn't to convince the stars to do IR. It's just a great topic of discussion and the responses that these kind od threads get confirms that. To the people who are asking what is being accomplished with these kind of discussions, I will suggest you go read some books or try to make a breakthrough discovery in the field of your interest. You come to a porn forum for entertainment purposes, not for accomplishements .One thing I'm very positive about is that you can never change a "true" bigot...you will have as much success as trying to make a gay person straight. They can pretend to change but it's always there. My favorites pornstars (Johnni Black, Ryan Conner, Shanna McCullough, Phoenix Marie, Lauren Phoenix,Velicity Von, Jr Carrington*) did IR...and a Over 75% of the time, I only watch those girls and big booty black chicks.Jr only did one but I know she doesn't have any problems with brothas in real life. Edited by - Nimrod on 10/7/2009 1:40:14 PM [Link]
Aplus Senior Member 1431 Posts 5/05	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 1:49PM SunShowers wrote: I'm honestly curious. What's the solution to this? Click to expand Eliminate the IR tag from every female performers do/don't list. I find that, by far, to be the most blatantly insulting, racist, and discriminatory thing in porn. Not only does it characterize black males with sub sexual catagories, but it also separates them from every other damn male ethnicity on the planet when it applies to porn. What if it isn't an "IR film" black males can't be hired? Too many women and companies hide behind it. It starts there IMO! [Link]
Tobias Deactivated User 475 Posts 1/09	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 2:30PM Aplus wrote: SunShowers wrote: I'm honestly curious. What's the solution to this? Click to expand Eliminate the IR tag from every female performers do/don't list. I find that, by far, to be the most blatantly insulting, racist, and discriminatory thing in porn. Not only does it characterize black males with sub sexual catagories, but it also separates them from every other damn male ethnicity on the planet when it applies to porn. Click to expand Good idea. If a producer/director is interested in a girl, let him or her inquire whether she does interracial scenes. In this way, performers (both male and female) are not labeled. [Link]
killbillvol69 All-Star Member ^Lucy Pinder 18634 Posts 4/08	Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:15PM ^ I'll go you one better; instead of inquiring if she does "IR scenes", why not just inquire if she wants to work with male talent X? Thus whether he's white or black or any other colour doesn't come into it. She just says whether she wants to work with that guy or not. If a particular woman always says yes to white guys and no to black guys, then fine, that's her right; but it's not set up so that you're asking if she "always works with blacks" or "never works with blacks" or whatever else. It's just yay or nay for a particular dude. ** @Hardware & BYOB_Kenobi**: I didn't say that those changes to porn are positive; just that they're more common. [Link]

Author

Post

Everett
Senior Member

2088 Posts
6/05

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 10:28AM

SunShowers wrote:
Good for you for addressing this!
Here's my opinion because I want to express it and in case anyone cares what a 22 year old white girl thinks:
I am not attracted to black men. I work with black men and I take classes with them. In fact, I am taking an acting class and my scene partner is a black man. The ones that I talk to on a regular basis, I really enjoy them. They are nice and laid back. I have absolutely nothing against them and in fact, I enjoy their company. I had a black female friend for a while until she stabbed me in the back.
This being said, I find it appalling the vitriol that is spat at women who don't want to perform with black men. As much as we want to call it racist or feel it's prejudiced, people generally have preferences based on their own ethnicity. It's how our species, our particular gene combinations, continue to thrive and grow. I think it's digusting the men who get on here and attack pornstars for not working with black men.
There are physical differences between races. If a woman is not attracted to black men or finds them a turn off, in whatever way, she is entitled to that feeling. Period. There's nothing racist about that, at least not in the way that most people think. And if you do think it's prejudiced, then you are simply blinding yourself. Black men don't look like white or asian or indian men. If a woman isn't interested in working with a black man, that's her decision. There are black people who would never dream of coupling with a white person. It's based on personal preference.
And honestly, as unpopular as this might make me, there are differences between races. I'm not saying it has anything to do with mental ability or so forth, but there are differences. It doesn't make one or the other better or more important. But a woman has a right to decide and not be blacklisted or constantly attacked.
So get over it. As I said here months ago, concentrate on the performers who will work with black men and ignore the ones who won't. You, as well as the performer, are entilted to your preference.
Click to expand

why do I get the feeling that this is a WHITE guy writing this?

...I could be wrong though

[Link]

Everett
Senior Member

2088 Posts
6/05

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 10:44AM

too many of the posts are starting to look like responses to the continuing IR thread "she wont do black guys".
In keeping on topic with the original post. Most porn , gals & guys, sign some sort of agreement/contract etc. to perform in a scene. They are of free sound, mind & body to sign or not sign. They may even 'flake'(refuse to do scene) later on before the scene, which would set them in bad stance for future scene or they may be sued by the offended party. Pressuring somebody is not forcing them to perform as they have a choice.

[Link]

Tobias
Deactivated User

475 Posts
1/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 12:35PM

And what if the "anti-IR crowd" and the "pro-IR crowd" merge into one "respect the female talent crowd?"
Imagine that a young woman puts her well being on the line to venture into the world of porn. Perhaps she does it because she just needs to pay the rent. Every day, she questions herself. "What am I doing? What if I get sick?" She imagines a simpler, safer future. Imagine a guy on the sidelines critisizing her for not doing more - a Monday morning pimp of sorts. Now, imagine that instead of being that guy, you are that young woman.
However racist the world most certainly is, and might always be - since we as humans seem to have an insatiable need to discriminate - you do not improve the situation by taking on the persona of a misogynist. In that case, all you have accomplished is to display an extreme degree of hypocrisy. You have crossed the line from being the oppressed to being the oppressor - even if only through your words. My suggestion? Lay off the women and go to the source of your anger. Put in other words - Pick on someone your own size.

[Link]

NewRomancer
Deactivated User

under THEIR avatar
738 Posts
7/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 1:12PM

No, there aren't... There is only ONE race of humans... and we come in a wide variety of sizes, shapes, colours, smells... And at least 2 genders (With something of a grey area occasionally between them)
Does a woman have a 'right' to have preferences who she will and will not have sex with? (on camera or off, for pay or not)
Abso-fucking-lootly... and her reasons for those preferences are immaterial!
But if her preferences are based only on skin colour, then she's most likley chosen to be an ignorant bigot.
What would you call a guy who wouldn't fuck brunettes? Who only wouldn't fuck them because they were brunettes??? I'd call him a blithering idiot...

[Link]

duefuss
Member

Not a shred of evidence exists in favor of the idea that life is serious - Brendan Gill
723 Posts
4/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 1:30PM

Racism exists everywhere, against African Americans, Latinos, Arabs -- you name it -- even against whites.
It's not particularly shocking to learn that some girls in porn are racist, any more than it is to see treatment of women here that is sexist and misogynist.
So there ARE racists in porn. And?
What would you have done about it? Fire the girls? If they are good porn actors that make money for producers, that ain't gonna happen. Require sensitivity training or something? Get serious! This industry doesn't even provide benefits to its employees, much less give a shit about the opinions of its performers.
Porn is simply not a venue where racism is or is going to be considered a problem. Except for the anecdotal evidence cited above (in which, BTW, no civil rights laws were broken, and no 'corporate' racism was even alleged) porn has for decades pretty much ignored race issues, and I expect it will continue to do so.

[Link]

lack100
Deactivated User

139 Posts
8/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 2:56PM

yep this is very true, he would have been just like that ramon guy . No girl has a problem doing a scene with that guy, jake is virtually the same color as him.
So all he would have had to do is put on a spanish accent and jake would have been good to go. jenna jameson is even with a light mexican. Also a bunch of dodgers have done scenes with that asian guy @ she loves asian cock such as morgan dayne ,gracie glam, jessica valeino, and the swastika girl stephanie kane. All these women would say they have never done i.r. becuase black is the only color they see,they b racist.

[Link]

CharlotteVale
Member

where ultra-feminine meets ultra-anal ;)
78 Posts
7/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 3:36PM

It doesn't really bother me when I see a girl who won't do IR. It's not up to me to judge her choices. What bothers me is when I see a woman charging more to do IR. If she's not going to fuck black men because she's been told they're too big, or she doesn't get turned on by black men, fine. But if she's decided she will fuck them but she's going to charge more?! That seems racist to me.
But there's also a good degree of ignorance that abounds and while it sucks to see someone not being able to figure things out for themselves we can't exactly blame the girls who haven't had time to learn better. I heard an 18 year old that I was on set with saying that she won't do black guys because they're all too big. Sure, that might be a stereotype but if you look at the black male performers these days, most of them ARE really big and a girl who's looking through porn, seeing huge black dick after huge black dick might be a little intimidated. I know I can't get fucked by a huge dick day after day. I'm just not built for it.
To address the OP more closely though, I don't see getting down on someone for not doing IR as rape. reprehensible perhaps but not rape. Besides it's not just IR that girls get flack for not performing. Anal is something that everyone wants to see these days, and then extreme anal, and even things like foot fetishes etc. Porn consumers all have their own fetishes and things that get them off and it's hard for them to accept that a girl they like may not like the same things. I find that to be a bit degrading as I think the most important thing should be that the people on set are enjoying themselves and sharing that enjoyment with the viewer. When I see someone getting off on watching a girl do a certain act, even if she doesn't enjoy it, it makes me wonder if he's just seeing her as a piece of meat to amuse him. But I suppose that's it's own topic. :P

[Link]

SunShowers
Member

333 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 3:54PM

"No, there aren't... There is only ONE race of humans... and we come in a wide variety of sizes, shapes, colours, smells... And at least 2 genders (With something of a grey area occasionally between them)"
First you contradict me, then you say exactly what I was trying to communicate in my original post. Physical characteristics. There are differences between races and if you'd paid more attention, you would have noticed that I made a point of saying that there weren't any differences beyond the superficial. Black people tend to have hair of a certain texture, dark skin, and oftentimes distinctive noses. Asian people tend to have slanted eyes. White people have all sorts of different features, but lighter skin.
I said that the differences I was pointing out had nothing to do with cognitive ability, et cetera. But there are physical differences and that would go along with my point that attraction probably plays a big role in SOME cases.
I'm not saying that hate or prejudice never plays a role, according to some of the posters, it plays a major one. I was simply offering an alternative viewpoint.
But regardless of the reason, it doesn't matter. You can definitely hold it against a performer and avoid her videos, but there's absolutely no reason why she should work with any performer unless she wants to. Case closed.
And to the other poster, you are very wrong about me being a white guy.

[Link]

BYOB_Kenobi
Senior Member

“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard
2684 Posts
8/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:00PM

duefuss, I could not agree with your post more.
I'm going to jump into the soup.
Tobias,
Trying to equate 'pressuring female performers' to rape is completely asinine, both technically and functionally. Like others have said, this is an irresponsible and inappropriate use of rape; if you do not know the difference, then any serious discussion is futile. Moreover, the deceptive logical steps you adopt to demonstrate your argument is laughable, unconvincing, and nonsensical.

[Link]

BYOB_Kenobi
Senior Member

“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard
2684 Posts
8/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:08PM

Very true!

[Link]

Nimrod
Member

624 Posts
7/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:36PM

I feel the same way too. That stuff happens all the time online.

[Link]

SunShowers
Member

333 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 4:38PM

Why?

[Link]

killbillvol69

All-Star Member

^Lucy Pinder
18634 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:03PM

Immaterial. It was not my point that I want to see a good scene or a bad scene. It was not my point that I even want to see any given white girl (or white girls in general) doing scenes with black guys. My point was that if girls perform with guys they are not attracted to all the time, and then say (or people on this board say) they won't perform with black guys because they aren't attracted to them, I have to call bullshit, because if the decision to perform with someone was really based on attraction, then they wouldn't do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. But they do do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. Ergo, the reason given for not working with black guys, that being that they aren't attracted to them, must not be true.
I really don't see how this is confounding anyone. It seems pretty simple to me.

[Link]

BYOB_Kenobi
Senior Member

“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard
2684 Posts
8/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:15PM

tritone wrote:
This is the bitter pill we must swallow. Race is not separate from attraction. It is a component thrown into the mix, often consciously. So it is possible that to certain performers, being black is so unattractive that it can never rise above the UGLIEST person of ANY OTHER RACE. As a black person, it is truly difficult to fathom this, but we are asked to respect that decision.
I mean, it is baffling why if given only the choice of sex with Max Hardcore, or Taye Diggs, a starlet would choose Max Hardcore. But I suppose it is her choice.
Since we are black, we are kind of blind to how others view us externally. Maybe having black skin and kinky/curly hair really does make us ugly. Even blacks with more "european" features like narrow noses and delicate faces can't make the cut because they are .. well black. WE just can't see what that means to other people who are NOT black. It is very frustrating.
Click to expand

Tritone, I say this with all due respect and hopefully you won't perceive this as condescending. I just wanted to hear your opinion.
As a fellow member of a minority here in the US, I too have experienced gross, overt racism and many racial biases, resulting in a lot of frustrations based solely on race.
However, I have found that people/groups/races who behave and practice resentment stemming from negative racial experience, tend to be held back by their attitude and behavior (rightfully or unrightfully so), in many areas of their lives due to its corrupting nature and propensity for inappropriate attribution. IMHO, I have found groups/races minimize the impact on their behavior and relationships, fare much better socially, economically, romantically, etc. etc. In many ways, I find this intangible strength in character not only admirable, but beneficial in life.
For example, I worked with an African-American/Native-American guy who grew up way back in the days of segregation (I think he was born in the 1930s). The stories he told of the environments he lived through makes me cringe. Yet he somehow didn't let it affect his behavior or condemn the inappropriate. I was one of the few close coworkers who was aware of some of his extensive history and even negative racial attitudes he held that many acquaintances and familiar coworkers were totally oblivious to, due to his attitude and conduct. I think this is partially why he was so successful at everything he did (was in 101st Airborne, fought in wars, promoted to a manager-level position back when it was more rare, entrusted with rare responsibilities [i.e., surgical], etc. etc.). He was partially responsible for training me during my first job out of college and became a real positive role-model for me.
I am not saying you do this. I just wanted to know what you think, after reading your 1st post.

[Link]

killbillvol69

All-Star Member

^Lucy Pinder
18634 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:15PM

Charlotte I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and assume that you weren't implying this (especially since the rest of your post, which I didn't bother copying, went in a different direction), but I cringe every time I feel that someone is comparing working with a black man to some kind of fetish.
Excluding someone from your potential work partners based on their race/ethnicity/colour of their skin/whatever doesn't have to do with a girl's unwillingness to participate in some kind of fetish. It's not like saying "I don't want to do fem-dom scenes" or "I don't want to do DP's".
If a guy who likes fem-dom stuff really wants to work with a girl, she can say "hey I'll work with you, but no fem-dom stuff", and he can say "ok we'll just do a normal scene", and then they'll work together. If a guy who really likes to shoot anal wants to work with a particular girl, she can say "hey I don't do anal", and if he really wants her badly, he can say "OK I'll shoot you in one of my rare non-anal scenes", and then they can work together.
If a black guy wants to work with a girl, and she says hey "I don't do black guys", there's no compromise to be made. He can't say "hey ok well I'll just magically transform myself into a white guy, and then we can work together". It simply won't happen.
I'm not saying "oh boohoo, poor black performer". I'm saying that "I won't do anal" or "I won't do foot fetish" or "I won't do fem-dom" or "I won't do gangbangs" have nothing in common with saying "I won't do black guys".

[Link]

Dr. Nasty
Senior Member

Asa Akira.....Damn!
3797 Posts
9/05

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:18PM

^Its a very simple statement. Not everyone graduated high school though.

That last remark wasn't aimed at anyone.....well unless you didn't finish high school. lol
*****The Dr. of Nasty*****

[Link]

NewRomancer
Deactivated User

under THEIR avatar
738 Posts
7/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:20PM

It you who's missing the point... There cannot be differences between the races, because there are no different races.... Humans, no matter their colour, shape, size, whatever are all the same race.
There is no such thing as racisim... There is only bigotry. (And in this case, pedantry)

[Link]

killbillvol69

All-Star Member

^Lucy Pinder
18634 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:24PM

And I'm saying it doesn't, because all girls perform with people they aren't attracted to all the time. If you really think a girl looks at the minion and Sean Michaels and says "Hey the Minion is way sexier", then I think you must be living in an alternate universe. And it's not just the Minion. I mentioned Dirty Harry & Dick Nasty as two other examples; also Max Hardcore, Ron Jeremy... I could go on.
Think about how many girls do "fuck a fan" or "fuck team five" or other sites like that, where they just show up and fuck whatever random amateur dude is thrown at them (as long as he's tested), but won't touch a black guy. I mean these girls are literally ready to fuck ANYONE, and they do; so long as he's not black.
PLEASE tell me you don't really think it's a case of attraction.
Unless you can honestly say that, given the choice, you would choose ANY WHITE MAN ON THE PLANET over some fairly handsome and nice black dude, then I think you must concede that the situation in porn isn't the same thing as what you're talking about, being more into white guys than black guys.

[Link]

BYOB_Kenobi
Senior Member

“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard
2684 Posts
8/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 5:39PM

RP, hopefully there won't be too many decapitations.
Wow, lots of IR action ---> all top 3 threads currently in TPP are IR titled threads.

[Link]

Everett
Senior Member

2088 Posts
6/05

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:12PM

my bad then. All my best

[Link]

Everett
Senior Member

2088 Posts
6/05

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:17PM

I think the word missing _______is "Ethnicity". Yes we are all of the human race which is why I don't see, and a lot of other people throughout the centuries never learned, why there is a problem.

[Link]

Tobias
Deactivated User

475 Posts
1/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:56PM

It is because you are over-simplifying the situation that you don't understand where the majority of posters to this thread are coming from. Attraction is not limited solely to appearance. A man's personality, hygiene, sense of humor and certainly the manner in which he treats a woman can all make him highly attractive to the opposite sex. The parallel of course is that a critical, demanding and misogynistic man may - despite being Adonis himself - be deemed highly repulsive. To think otherwise is to give women very little credit for being able to make informed and insightful decisions as to their partners.

[Link]

the unknown pervert
Deactivated User

I'd like to stay but I've got a plane to catch.
3243 Posts
5/06

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 6:59PM

Oh, it's there but it is not everywhere you look like some people think. Many people here believe that a woman who agrees to be in a Lex Steele movie but does not do IR is racist. I say that if she was really racist she would never agree to be in a movie directed by Lex Steele in the first place.
There is also a difference between being a racist and having pressure put on you from people close to you who may be racist.

[Link]

MrLongStiff
Deactivated User

87 Posts
7/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:02PM

To Tobias,
Please tell me when since porn has ever been classy?? ^^
When has a pornstarlet being cummed on in the face was ever deemed classy??.
Tobias, you are tripping up in your own thread.
Why would a girl do a scene with rough guys like Max Hardcore and refuse smooth guys Mr Marcus or Sean Michaels, huh?
Your response to Killbillvol69 is totally weak and has more holes than Swiss cheese.
Edited by - mrlongstiff on 10/6/2009 7:08:59 PM

[Link]

Nimrod
Member

624 Posts
7/09

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:12PM

killbillvol69 wrote:
SunShowers wrote:
physical differences and that would go along with my point that attraction probably plays a big role in SOME cases.

Unless you can honestly say that, given the choice, you would choose ANY WHITE MAN ON THE PLANET over some fairly handsome and nice black dude, then I think you must concede that the situation in porn isn't the same thing as what you're talking about, being more into white guys than black guys.
Click to expand
It's not like these women are told to fuck these guys for the re3st of their life or to marry them. I can see why these girls will refuse to fuck people they find very physcially repulsive, but if someone is ok or a little below average, I don't see why they will refuse them. That line"I'm not attracted to so and so" should be more "I find so and so so ugly and repulsive that I won't fuck him" The standard that applies to Ron Jeremy sounds more realistic to me...he isn't attractive but not "super ugly" so girls have no problem working with him.

[Link]

Slaughtersun
Deactivated User

825 Posts
8/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:12PM

Edited by - Slaughtersun on 10/6/2009 7:13:13 PM

[Link]

Twizted6
Senior Member

Good & Evil is merely a matter of perspective, I perfer to call myself... Determined
1229 Posts
7/05

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 7:36PM

Those bitches are just plain crazy.

[Link]

SunShowers
Member

333 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 6 2009 : 10:42PM

"It you who's missing the point... There cannot be differences between the races, because there are no different races.... Humans, no matter their colour, shape, size, whatever are all the same race."
Perhaps I missed it because it's not pertinent to my original point? You're splitting hairs and nitpicking about something completely unrelated. I don't care how many times you draw the distinction, I am still going to tell you that there are physical differences between, I don't know what word you'll accept, ETHNICITIES? Black men (or asian, white, et cetera)have certain physical characteristics and until every ETHNICITY on this planet melds and becomes one, with the same coloring and physical characteristics, that will be so.
And yet, even after my efforts to admit that racism probably plays a card in some performers choosing not to work with black men, somebody pops up and hammers at me as if I didn't allow the distinction. It figures.
This will be the last thing I'll say about it: you can't make people do what you want. You will never have that power and the best thing to do is get over it because frankly, it's only going to cause you grief. People will feel the way they do and have their prejudices, despite how closely it may hit home for you, and there's absolutely nothing you can do about it. Short of rape. I mean, what the hell are you all getting at? You've known for most of your lives that a good many people harbor racist ideas. Are you saying female performers should be forced into scenes with black men? What exactly are you wanting to achieve with all this yammering?
I'm honestly curious. What's the solution to this?

[Link]

Dr. Nasty
Senior Member

Asa Akira.....Damn!
3797 Posts
9/05

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:25AM

Affirmative Action
*****The Dr. of Nasty*****

[Link]

killbillvol69

All-Star Member

^Lucy Pinder
18634 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 1:07AM

Tobias wrote:
killbillvol69 wrote:
My point was that if girls perform with guys they are not attracted to all the time, and then say (or people on this board say) they won't perform with black guys because they aren't attracted to them, I have to call bullshit, because if the decision to perform with someone was really based on attraction, then they wouldn't do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. But they do do scenes with people they aren't attracted to. Ergo, the reason given for not working with black guys, that being that they aren't attracted to them, must not be true.
I really don't see how this is confounding anyone. It seems pretty simple to me.
Click to expand
It is because you are over-simplifying the situation that you don't understand where the majority of posters to this thread are coming from. Attraction is not limited solely to appearance. A man's personality, hygiene, sense of humor and certainly the manner in which he treats a woman can all make him highly attractive to the opposite sex. The parallel of course is that a critical, demanding and misogynistic man may - despite being Adonis himself - be deemed highly repulsive. To think otherwise is to give women very little credit for being able to make informed and insightful decisions as to their partners.
Click to expand

How exactly am I oversimplifying this? As I mentioned in my other post, so many of these girls work for sites like "fuck a fan" and "fuck team five" and "midnight prowl" and "can he score" and on and on, where they'll fuck any amateur guy the director throws at them, who they've never met before (so long as he's tested). ANY guy will be acceptable to the girls, SO LONG AS he's not black.
Are you really going to tell me that they know in advance that literally any guy on the street is someone they'll be attracted to, be it appearance or personality or hygiene or whatever else? They've never met them. Yet they fuck them anyway. Unless they're black.
Please, someone tell me I'm not speaking in a different language here. These girls are literally saying they'll fuck ANYONE but a black guy.
And this is simply a question of attraction and nothing else? These girls just happen to know that they're attracted to every White, Latino, South Asian, South East Asian, Native American, Pacific Islander, Inuit and Yupik man much more than they are to any black man? How could they possibly know this? Are they prescient?
****
One more thing Tobias: you refuted my post by claiming that maybe the girl could be attracted - or not attracted - to a guy for any number of reasons, only some of which are physical. I agree with you completely. That's why when a girl posts that she wasn't attracted to a guy in any way, didn't like his look, his personality, or anything else, and she still worked with him, then I assume that she wasn't attracted to him yet still worked with him. Because that's what she said, in her own words.
But then, the girl will say "I don't work with Black guys because I'm not attracted to them." In other words, it is because I'm not attracted to black guys that I won't work with them. In other words, if I'm not attracted to someone, I won't (or can't) work with them. (Be it physical, emotional, whatever - we'll give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she could mean any or all of those things.)
But she's said on several occasions that she does work with guys she's not attracted to (physical, emotional, the whole deal).
Two statements: 1. I work with guys I'm not attracted to all the time. 2. I don't want to work with them because I'm not attracted to them.
Please tell me you see the problem here.
Why am I saying all this? (and Sun Showers this might answer your most recent question as well)
It's not because I want to pressure women to work with black guys.
As I've said in many posts over the past year and a half, I don't care if you have this reason or that reason for not working with black guys, I don't even care much if you don't give me a reason. But if you do choose to give me a reason, I expect it to be one that makes sense.
That's all.

[Link]

Tobias
Deactivated User

475 Posts
1/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 2:13AM

But, who is to judge what "makes sense?" What is perfectly logical for one person might be the height of fallacy to another. The entire point of this thread is that when a woman says "no," it means "no." An explanation is not required, regardless of how troubling or frustrating that is to any man. If she draws a line regarding a particular ethnic group, then that line must be respected. If she draws a line regarding a particular sex act, then that line must be respected. If she draws any line, then that line is not to be crossed. To impose otherwise on her is to strip her of an essential right to privacy over her own body. And, of all places, in the realm of adult entertainment, this right should be respected. It is the recognized right to privacy embodied in forty plus years of caselaw that allows porn to be created, distributed and viewed as freely as it is in the United States. Enjoying this right without affording it to another is as discriminatory and thereby harmful as any underlying claim of racism.

[Link]

killbillvol69

All-Star Member

^Lucy Pinder
18634 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 2:46AM

^ I'm pretty sure we're in agreement here. As I've posted, I don't want to insist she does or doesn't do anything. I don't expect her to give or not give me a reason for it. I don't care whether the reason she does give is something I agree or don't agree with, or find respectable or not respectable.
But I don't want it to not make sense.
If someone looks at me and says "I don't like rain. I like rain" I will say "hey man, that doesn't make sense". I'm not going to force them to go outside or stay inside, but I am going to point out that what they're saying sounds kind of off.
Similarly, when a porn girl says that she will work with guys she's not attracted to in any way, and then says that she won't work with guys she's not attracted to, I have no problem saying "You know what? That doesn't make sense."
And that's all I'm saying here.

[Link]

Zaer
Deactivated User

249 Posts
10/07

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:13AM

There's no reason for it to given that the OP is self-evidently wrong, thus there's no need to even put forward a response to dispute his argument.

[Link]

Tobias
Deactivated User

475 Posts
1/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:17AM

Judging by the number of reads and posts to this thread in only 36 odd hours, it appears that many of us are in agreement on a number of things - including the fact that interracial threads invariably devolve into claims of racism. Presumably, such claims are counterproductive to one of the goals of this site - that is to bring producers, actors and fans together so that they can discuss adult content - not argue and berate one another. Divisive discussion only leads to hurt feelings, burnt bridges and missed opportunities. Given this fact, the suggestion offered by a number of posters - to create a separate forum dedicated solely to interracial issues - might be appropriate. In this way, flame wars and the distractions they create could be insulated from the rest of the site - so that the majority of posters could continue to enjoy AdultDVDTalk.

[Link]

Zaer
Deactivated User

249 Posts
10/07

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:22AM

Tobias wrote:
killbillvol69 wrote:
^ I'm pretty sure we're in agreement here.
Click to expand
Judging by the number of reads and posts to this thread in only 36 odd hours, it appears that many of us are in agreement on a number of things - including the fact that interracial threads invariably devolve into claims of racism. Presumably, such claims are counterproductive to one of the goals of this site - that is to bring producers, actors and fans together so that they can discuss adult content - not argue and berate one another. Divisive discussion only leads to hurt feelings, burnt bridges and missed opportunities. Given this fact, the suggestion offered by a number of posters - to create a separate forum dedicated solely to interracial issues - might be appropriate. In this way, flame wars and the distractions they create could be insulated from the rest of the site - so that the majority of posters could continue to enjoy AdultDVDTalk.
Click to expand

It's ironic that segregation is being put foward as a possible way of dealing with disagreements about a racial issue.

[Link]

Hardware

All-Star Member

Your other left
14595 Posts
3/02

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:24AM

How do you know this is true, as opposed to the fantasy they're selling? I don't follow these sites, I don't know the guys shooting for them, so I really have no idea. However, I think it is safe to say that reality in porn is the exception, not the rule.

[Link]

Tobias
Deactivated User

475 Posts
1/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:33AM

I agree it is ironic. It is also antithetical to the notion of free and unfettered speech. However, where a handful of posters persist in showing absolutely no restraint or respect towards the majority of posters (some of whom are the performers who star in the content that is the subject of this site), then this may be a necessary recourse. Politely asking this handful of posters to stop clearly hasn't worked, since both the prevalence and aggressive nature of interracial threads has only increased in recent months.

[Link]

killbillvol69

All-Star Member

^Lucy Pinder
18634 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:51AM

Well, you're right, porn has a long history of showing us planned events and portraying them as random.
But something is changing, and much of this new 'genre' of stars fucking regular dudes is very much what it claims to be.
An increasing number of stars are offering to fuck any member of their site, so long as he is willing to have his face shown on camera. In other words the fan chooses the girl, and not the other way around. She's willing, and has promised, to do anyone, so long as he's willing to show his face. The only restriction for some of these girls being that he's not a black guy.
The "fuck team five" site chooses the guys in a slightly less random fashion than what is demonstrated, but (and I know this from speaking to a guy who was on the site) still without the stars knowing about the selection. The stars are similarly out of the loop on "fuck a fan" where, for example, a video recorded by Tara Lynn Foxx shows her arriving at set and meeting some men, asking "so who am I fucking?" and finding that some were the random fans, one was a production assistant, still another was in charge of lighting - in other words showing up ready to fuck any guy they threw at her.
Etc.
What we're seeing in porn these days is a much more 'real' version of reality than what we have been presented with in the past.

[Link]

Hardware

All-Star Member

Your other left
14595 Posts
3/02

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 4:04AM

Wow, that's either fearless or stupid, and I tend to lean toward the latter.

[Link]

BYOB_Kenobi
Senior Member

“Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards.” - Kierkegaard
2684 Posts
8/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 4:13AM

KB, I don't wanna derail the focus, but I haven't come across much talk about the new business model you speak of.
Although I see this emerging model as an effective way to increase customers/paying fans for website, I imaging this is/will be a nightmare for infectious disease (ID) perspective for female performers.
Essentially this model introduces large amounts of male 'free agents' into the porn pool, who, excuse any ignorance for the specific practices, might go thru required AIM screening (- results), but it still increases the exposures and multiplies ID risks for females. 'Free agents' attitude of 'once in a life-time experience' is not exactly the regular male talent attitudes (a job, so safe-sex practices are desirable offset).

[Link]

Zaer
Deactivated User

249 Posts
10/07

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 5:11AM

Actually respect and restraint are demonstrated with the discussions on this topic.
What you likely disagree with though is the legitimate criticism of those female performers who refuse to work with Blacks yet work with performers of every other race and justify it by stating that it's because of attraction issues, which has already been shown to be a demonstrably false argument.

[Link]

pokerman
Member

J lo booty
404 Posts
4/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 6:22AM

Tobias wrote:
killbillvol69 wrote:
^ I'm pretty sure we're in agreement here.
Click to expand
Judging by the number of reads and posts to this thread in only 36 odd hours, it appears that many of us are in agreement on a number of things - including the fact that interracial threads invariably devolve into claims of racism. Presumably, such claims are counterproductive to one of the goals of this site - that is to bring producers, actors and fans together so that they can discuss adult content - not argue and berate one another. Divisive discussion only leads to hurt feelings, burnt bridges and missed opportunities. Given this fact, the suggestion offered by a number of posters - to create a separate forum dedicated solely to interracial issues - might be appropriate. In this way, flame wars and the distractions they create could be insulated from the rest of the site - so that the majority of posters could continue to enjoy AdultDVDTalk.
Click to expand

Great post Tobias!
I think a sub forum is a great idea.
It is an important issue this topic but it is constant threads about the same subject.
Calling people racist all over the place is libelous for a start.
Edited by - pokerman on 10/7/2009 6:26:07 AM

[Link]

NerdGod
Member

Using a 2 inch cock like it was 12
480 Posts
7/06

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 11:50AM

IR threads are anal.
But the main heading to this thread is wrong.
They have a right to thier opionon wether or not a talent is influenced by it is another matter entirly. Its just stupid when you spend you entire day whinning like a b_____ over it.
my point of view differs from spamrod and the other alleged "posters".
my problem is the way "they" go about it.
notice my IR thread was locked. must be because im white.

[Link]

SunShowers
Member

333 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:12PM

Ok. If I'm understanding this correctly, you want every performer who won't work with black men to publically admit to being a racist. Or barring that, demonstrate that she is someone who won't work with people she isn't attracted to?
I guess that's fair. There's nothing wrong with expecting honesty, but keep in mind the types of people that largely dominate the industry.

[Link]

Tobias
Deactivated User

475 Posts
1/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:23PM

What I disagree with is the destruction of the entire fantasy that is porn by a handful of consumers who think it is their duty to "out" various performers. "X must be homosexual since he works with transsexuals." "Y must be racist since she hasn't worked with any black men." "Z must be bulimic or on drugs since she's lost a lot of weight recently." What a performer is or is not in their personal lives is and should remain private. This is why performers use stage names. Aside from being a basic human right, privacy maintains boundaries, ensures safety and allows the continued existence of the fantasy.
It is when a consumer feels a sense of entitlement to personal knowledge of a performer or when he wants to dictate the conduct of a performer or when he attempts to cross the boundary between fantasy and reality that we have a problem. "I want to know whether X is a racist. In fact, I want X to admit she is a racist. I refuse to watch X otherwise. Others should do the same." What are the motivations behind such expressions? More pressingly, do these words add or detract from the entertainment derived by the rest of the viewing audience?
If the goal is to force the performer to do something she does not want to do, then the goal is to oppress another human being. If the goal is to leave other viewers not wanting to watch the performer, then the goal is to destroy her career. Along the way though, the very essence of porn is also destroyed. Gone is the fantasy of a beautiful woman - whose name you need not even know - extending sexual gratification to you. Maybe congratulations are in order for the person who makes it his goal to show the rest of us what lies within the heart of a woman. With words alone he makes us forget the primal instinct to desire her so that we can focus on her secrets - despite the fact that we will still never know her.
Edited by - tobias on 10/7/2009 12:25:50 PM

[Link]

Nimrod
Member

624 Posts
7/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 12:51PM

KillBill is making some great points in his posts. Most of these girls who do IR today, if you had asked them 50 years ago (if they were of that generation) they will say "Hell No". As racial relations improve over the years, there will be more girls willing to do IR. 100 years from now, there will still be girls refusing to do IR but it will be a minority. I don't think there will ever be true racial harmony in this country, but some improvements will be made in the future.

Edited by - Nimrod on 10/7/2009 1:26:19 PM

[Link]

Nimrod
Member

624 Posts
7/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 1:25PM

The goal of these kind of discussions isn't to convince the stars to do IR. It's just a great topic of discussion and the responses that these kind od threads get confirms that. To the people who are asking what is being accomplished with these kind of discussions, I will suggest you go read some books or try to make a breakthrough discovery in the field of your interest. You come to a porn forum for entertainment purposes, not for accomplishements .One thing I'm very positive about is that you can never change a "true" bigot...you will have as much success as trying to make a gay person straight. They can pretend to change but it's always there. My favorites pornstars (Johnni Black, Ryan Conner, Shanna McCullough, Phoenix Marie, Lauren Phoenix,Velicity Von, Jr Carrington*) did IR...and a Over 75% of the time, I only watch those girls and big booty black chicks.Jr only did one but I know she doesn't have any problems with brothas in real life.
Edited by - Nimrod on 10/7/2009 1:40:14 PM

[Link]

Aplus
Senior Member

1431 Posts
5/05

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 1:49PM

Eliminate the IR tag from every female performers do/don't list. I find that, by far, to be the most blatantly insulting, racist, and discriminatory thing in porn. Not only does it characterize black males with sub sexual catagories, but it also separates them from every other damn male ethnicity on the planet when it applies to porn. What if it isn't an "IR film" black males can't be hired? Too many women and companies hide behind it. It starts there IMO!

[Link]

Tobias
Deactivated User

475 Posts
1/09

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 2:30PM

Good idea. If a producer/director is interested in a girl, let him or her inquire whether she does interracial scenes. In this way, performers (both male and female) are not labeled.

[Link]

killbillvol69

All-Star Member

^Lucy Pinder
18634 Posts
4/08

Posted - Oct 7 2009 : 3:15PM

^ I'll go you one better; instead of inquiring if she does "IR scenes", why not just inquire if she wants to work with male talent X? Thus whether he's white or black or any other colour doesn't come into it. She just says whether she wants to work with that guy or not.
If a particular woman always says yes to white guys and no to black guys, then fine, that's her right; but it's not set up so that you're asking if she "always works with blacks" or "never works with blacks" or whatever else. It's just yay or nay for a particular dude.
****
@Hardware & BYOB_Kenobi: I didn't say that those changes to porn are positive; just that they're more common.

[Link]