I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Feb 17 2015 : 10:12PM
In response to the high degree of whining by posters on the "Lex Steele new Evil Angel Director" thread, Kevin Moore wrote a very informative comment explaining some of the bts politics that Lex has to deal with. A lot of the points he made were very interesting, but one in particular stood out to me:What are your thoughts on this development? Will it have a positive, negative, or negligible effect on the state of IR porn in the American industry? Is it a step backwards, forward, or just more of the same? What effect, if any, will it have on black male performers? How do you as a viewer feel about all of this? I'd like to read your opinions.
This has been a thing for as long as I remember. Top contract girls always paced their career. Boy/Girl Boy/Boy/Girl Multiple Partners Interracial or similar... Honestly, if a female talent has that much business sense to pace her career so that fans have to wait to see her do certain things, then good for her. These days, 18 year old girls in the biz are doing 10 man gang bangs their first week in porn and are shot out within a few months. Great for us... but terrible for them. - Jimmy Hooligan The Official Jimmy Hooligan
Well I guess it can be seen a positive sign if performers have enough confidence in the health/stability of the porn business, that they are making long-range future plans.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Feb 18 2015 : 1:05AM
I see that I forgot to say what I think about the issue. I guess my knee jerk reaction is that the trend Mr. Moore describes ensures that the act of IR will be perceived as extreme as, or more extreme than, anal, dp, and even gangbangs. I think that's nuts. Personally I think the entire concept of "first IR" is socially backwards, but I'm well aware that if it ceased to exist that would mean pornstars would lose the opportunity to get that payday. I've never been against pornstars asking for more money to shoot first IR or even to shoot IR in general. Maybe the opportunity for a big payday will ensure that a greater number of pornstars will shoot IR? If so I suppose that's a good thing, but I still think that on a basic level the trend is negative in that, as I wrote, it places IR in the same category as things like double penetration.
^^^ Except that I can actually make a case right now that pacing your career is actually a bad thing from a monetary perspective. In other words, by not doing things you're willing to do that actually pay more, you can end up costing yourself money in the long run. Edited by - whatsatelephonebill on 2/18/2015 1:57:48 AM
The porn landscape definitely changed and I do agree that, in most cases, holding back certain types of performances can hurt your career more than help... - Jimmy Hooligan
There's another face of that coin though some pornstars who do IR from the beginning may end "niched" and almost only offered those scenes Abbey Rain and Alice Green for example they don't seem to have a preference , Alice's boyfriend is white for example yet she's booked for almost only IR , same fo Abbey who only has IR out and a lez scene at least so far and AFAIK. I suggested them both to some directors here and even IR sites but apparently they aren't considered a "hit" it's much better to pay higher those who are firsts. Which is why it's not just a matter of extreme acts , it's an act valued more than others which also sells more than others. Another point might be that Directors, Distributors and sellers will earn more if they hire a "first" in their movies so why a star shouldn't ask more money it wouldn't be fair if she'd be the only one who doesn't earn more. as for IR showcases well it's a new trend and doesn't work for every star, also the amount for 4 or 5 scenes is huge by itself even for non IR showcases , actually a full IR showcase may be cheaper than 4 or 5 separate scenes
There's no simple answer to this. I think it's a mistake for a girl to wait for that big payday but if they don't hold off too long it's okay. There are some girls who will hold off doing it and their big payday will never come because there's no demand to see them do it and could care less. I like the idea of some girls doing it becomes an "event" like Nikki Benz at JULES JORDAN but most girls aren't worthy of that sort of treatment. Ir really shouldn't be this big a deal in porn but fans have made it that way. I don't blame a girl for trying to make as much money as they can because porn is the type of career that might be short lived but this move simply won't be a good move for everyone. But then again, as I've always said fans shouldn't get so hung up on a girl's pay. If the director/studio feels the girl is worth the extra money and it doesn't affect what fans are paying for porn, whatever they get paid is okay with me.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Feb 19 2015 : 11:53AM
^^At least according to data18, not even half of Alice Green's scenes have been IR. Only about 27% of her scenes have been interracial. Do you have a scene list for Abbey Rain?
^ First off I'm glad to know that, secondly some scenes aren't labelled at all for example I scream Girl is an IR site , there's the cover above the scenes , plus she's also the latest update at Brothalovers and has another IR scene for CastingCouch-HD which is another IR site all these 3 aren't even listed it's a total of 9 IR scenes over. But that was her start almost IR only , I'm really glad she's not relegated to a niche market she's great. As for Abbey/Abby Rain I only know about 8 scenes 7 IR and one lesbo scene 4 of those where for CastingCouch-HD as Pen/Penelope ,one for Lethal with Jovan Jordan yet to be issued , one for Devil's I Like Black Boys 13 as Liz and one again for Devil's in My New Black Stepdaddy 18 as Abby Rain with Sean Michaels I'm not aware of any other scene from her so far And Abby is even greater than many other , she seems to be a natural born performer Edited by - LCF on 2/19/2015 1:46:01 PM
^ Abby works with a white guy in I Wanna Buttfuck Your Daughter 18. I think the effect you're speaking of is short-lived. Because so many new girls aren't available for IR, the ones that are are booked up pretty quickly by all the studios that shoot it. But once they've all shot her once, she'll be booked by everyone else. It has happened many times before. A girl shoots the majority of her first month's scenes for IR productions, but then by the second month or so the proportion of IR scenes she shoots drops way down.
I hope so, really, but it takes months it'ld be easy for those who discourage the girls from doing IR to use this I may add names to those though, but your point is clear and I agree, but I was and still am afraid that some new starlets may quit too early if they think they're confined to niche roles. I personally don't even care whether a star does or doesn't IR or even if she only does IR for that matter, but I don't want to see talented girls (or so I think they are) quitting early with basically no reason
I think it's just porn business as usual. I do think it's funny that as soon as a great new IR studio comes along and all of a sudden there's a premium on first IR scenes.
Realistically, there's not that many girls out there today worthy of an IR showcase and only a few studios/directors that can make it an actual event. Ava Adams could pull it off even though she's done IR for her site. Not that many people have seen her do IR and she's a strong enough performer that she can do multiple scenes and make them all differet enough to all be strong since she does anal, DPs, and gangbangs. Jesse Jane doing an IR showcase would be very big for several obvious reasons. I don't know if there's anyone else who's a big enough draw and willing to do IR who hasn't yet to make it worth devoting an entire movie/DVD to that would make it worth a big payday and move a lot of product. Even though she's done lots of IR I think Riley Reed has enough star power to get people worked up enough if she did a IR showcase. But the other half of all these equasions is the only studios with enough clout and presence out there right now would be JULES JORDAN and EVIL ANGEL. If anyone else did it it wouldn't be as big a deal. In the end I think the most we'll get from this is a bunch of girls will get hit with the reality that they aren't worth they money they may ask or hold out for. They can ask for the moon but most of the time the studio won't think they're worth the money or simply can't afford to give them what they think they're worth. A few girls might land a big payday but most will see a small increase at best.
^ I think there's a good chance that Carter Cruise will get one if she wants it. The question is whether she'd rather do an all-IR showcase, or do 1 IR scene inside a multi-faceted one. Especially since she doesn't have any more firsts left to put into a showcase. Edit: And as far as studios go, Blacked has shown that they can put out an IR showcase to big fanfare (they're technically distributed by Jules, but that doesn't really count). And I think that ArchAngel/Mimefreak could do one to a good deal of fanfare, but he hasn't so far. Edited by - whatsatelephonebill on 2/19/2015 8:50:55 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Feb 19 2015 : 10:20PM
Thanks for the info. If she's doing that amount of IR she's definitely a performer I'll keep an eye on.No reason indeed. As long as they're getting work I don't see why they would retire. Edited by - misspornUSA on 2/19/2015 11:34:28 PM
Meanwhile Abbey Rain (she spells her stage name exactly so) did another 4 IR scenes one of which with Mandingo already out (Mandingo Wrecked my Pussy 2) two with dogfart yet to be released , presumably in May a BBG and a Glory Hole both with creampies can't remember what the fourth was right now she's doing so many of them it's becoming difficult to remember them all EDIT Found it! the fourth is with Nat Turnher in Babysitters Taking On Black Cock also already out Considering the preview and the picture I'm betting you'd like it Edited by - LCF on 4/12/2015 12:09:20 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Apr 12 2015 : 2:32PM
^She's really doing excellent work. It's easy for IR fans to focus their attention on performers who refuse to shoot IR. Meanwhile there are performers like Abbey who shoot IR back to back yet don't get the attention they deserve.
Truthfully, as soon as she mentioned Blacked in her post on her Tumblr about racism, I knew she'd do one if they asked. And as soon as they announced they were doing one, I knew she'd be the person they chose.
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Mass Facialties Deactivated User
"Facialized Vol. 7" 2021 AVN Awards Winner: Best Oral Movie 9308 Posts 9/13
Posted - Apr 13 2015 : 12:03AM
^ Of course, the IR watchdogs will continue to hold it against her that she waited to "cash in" on IR.
I mean, they aren't wrong in the purest sense of the phrase, but the truth of the matter is they're also fighting the wrong fight. The argument shouldn't really be about girls like Carter (or as another recent example, Nikki Benz) who can actually pull of getting that huge ass paycheck from doing a feature. It made/makes sense for them. The argument is/should be about the dozens of girls that the argument doesn't make sense for. Because it doesn't make sense for the vast majority of women in the industry.
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Mass Facialties Deactivated User
"Facialized Vol. 7" 2021 AVN Awards Winner: Best Oral Movie 9308 Posts 9/13
Posted - Apr 13 2015 : 1:33AM
^ Well, I imagine that most girls enter the biz with a genuine belief that they are destined for stardom, or at least that's what their agent tells 'em. I'm just tryin' to figure out what the "unwritten rules" of IR are, like, just how long do you have to be in the biz without having done it before you're branded an "IR dodger?" When a girl is labeled this, are those who do so also implying that the girl is racist? If a supposed IR dodger eventually does do IR, do the IR watchdogs still consider her a dodger?
I think it's something like 6 months and people start to question you, a year and people start to think about it, and about 3 years and you're officially a "dodger". And only the can't comprehend nuance would think a girl is racist solely for the fact that she doesn't shoot IR with no other supporting evidence (then again, there are a lot of stupid people out there). And once you become a "dodger" you stay one until you start consistently shooting it (i.e. doing one or two scenes or one feature and an extra scene or two doesn't count, you have to do it multiple times over multiple releases). In all honesty, my personal opinion is that if unless you're getting booked constantly/as much as you want, you should be doing everything you're willing to do (the more things you're available for, the more movies people can shoot you for, and theoretically the more bookings you should get). So complaining about not getting shoots and/or begging for shoots and you don't do IR (or anal or anything else you're willing to do)? That's either on you, or on your agent for giving you shitty advice on how to manage your career. A good agent should be able to tell how their talent's career is going, and should be able to see if that big paycheck really is coming down the line or not and judge accordingly. And even if you are getting booked as much as you want, not doing shoots you're willing to do that pay more for the hope of some huge payday down the road is leaving money on the table for no good reason except some vague sense of career management/pacing that went out of style years ago, except that most agents haven't really caught on yet. Edited by - whatsatelephonebill on 4/13/2015 2:43:43 AM Edited by - whatsatelephonebill on 4/13/2015 2:45:06 AM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Apr 13 2015 : 1:38PM
For me personally, if I notice that a pornstar is shooting a lot of hard, crazy stuff early on and/or quickly burning through "firsts," I begin to wonder why she hasn't shot IR. Or at least that was true in the past. Now I have a tendency to more or less ignore pornstars until they shoot IR, but I was never one to harass pornstars about being "dodgers" anyway. Adriana Chechik is a case in point. She did everything and more seemingly right out the gate, so I began to question why hadn't shot IR. Of course, she turned out to be unique in that she decided to publicly pretend to be a racist in order to drive up her IR asking price. Her strategy turned out to be unsuccessful, but I digress. Another example would be Bonnie Rotten. Once she had shot so many wild scenes I began to wonder what the issue was. I haven't closely followed Carter Cruise (though I have seen some of her work), but I was aware that she was shooting a lot of crazy stuff and wondered when/if she would shoot IR and why she hadn't already. Unlike some other IR fans, I don't automatically assume that a pornstar is racist if they haven't shot IR, but neither do I dismiss the possibility as outrageous. To my mind the automatic assumption that a "dodger" is racist is no more ridiculous than the equally foolish assumption that "of course she's not racist." There's a growing tendency in this country to view America as a post-racist society and I think that absurd tendency rares its head in some IR debates. For my part, unless a pornstar says or does something that explicitly or subtly implies racism I don't conclude that she is racist. At the same time, I'm not inclined to give "dodgers" the benefit of the doubt when they give an unlikely excuse for not shooting IR, such as "IR scenes are racist." Leaving aside the question of whether or not it's rational for a pornstar to interpret IR scenes so literally, especially if that same pornstar films rough scenes that could just as easily be identified as misogynist if taken at face value, it strains credulity to believe that those who use the increasingly popular "racism" excuse are unaware of the existence of multiple directors who do not shoot DogFart style IR. LCF has listed these directors multiple times. There is also the "I'm not attracted to black people" excuse. Nica Noelle called bullshit on this excuse back in 2012 on this forum, writing: "But of course some performers refuse to perform interracial strictly for personal reasons. 'I'm just not attracted,' they explain (suggesting that they're 'always' attracted to their white costars -- highly unlikely!!!)." Edited by - misspornUSA on 4/13/2015 2:04:26 PM
Since they are "unwritten rules" most people who worry about this stuff simply apply their own rules and tend to think of them as the offical rules. I've said it before...there are diffrent types of pornstars and what works for one might not work for another. Sara Jay is a different type of pornstar than Nikki Benz. Kelly Wells was a different type of pornstar than Jenna Jameson. Janet Mason is a different type of pornstar than Jodi West. In a lot of cases if a girl is mostly shooting for certain studios there just won't be that many (if any) oppurtunities to do IR. If a girl is mostly shooting for NAUGHTY AMERICA or BRAZZERS it will probably be a longer time before she shoots IR even if she wants to. Even if a girls puts down on her profile that she's available for IR she still has to wait for someone to call and actually offer her that type of work. If a girl is a bigger name the smaller studios might not be willing or able to pay her rate. There are so many behind the scenes variables going on you can't put a time frame on this type of thing...even though there are those that are all too glad to.
^ I get what you're trying to say, but I disagree. Generally speaking, if a girl wants to shoot IR, she can/will, barring asking for too much money for her first. At least for the first couple times. A first IR of even a moderately popular performer drives enough traffic that sites that shoot IR but don't do it very frequently (like your examples of Brazzers and Naughty America) would easily be willing to do it unless the performer asked for a crazy amount of money for it. And if she puts it on her profile, companies like Blacked and/or Dogfart will jump at the chance to shoot it. I would never in my life call any performer a "dodger', but outside of the more extreme acts (i.e. something harder than a DP) and scenes that are super-expensive to shoot (i.e. gangbangs), if a girl says she wants to shoot a certain type of scene but isn't, it's either because she's asking for more money than people are willing to pay her, or she doesn't really want to do it and is placating whoever is asking her. Edited by - whatsatelephonebill on 4/13/2015 9:46:28 PM
^ And I get what you're saying and mostly agree but I was talking more of a timeline of how soon she soots IR rather than if she does it at all or not. The poster I was responding to was asking how soon before a girl should shoot IR before fans start in on her. Which I think fans shouldn't judge or label a girl in general if she doesn't do IR. Some girls career path may keep them away from IR longer than some others.
First off I agree with MisspornUSA for the most part , but let's put some examples Capri Cavanni shot her first IR at her very beginning then went with Brazzers , no more IR scenes for 4 years she's been mentioned among the dodgers many times until someone mentioned her first scene , but then the rule changed even if you do IR you must be doing that consistently otherwise you're a dodger , lucky her she came back with a bang and a number of IR scenes each one better than the previous. Diana Prince had a black boyfriend , as strange at it seems, it was him who didn't want her to perform with black, she begun to perform IR as soon as they split yet she stayed "dodging" for years Leya Falcon had a similar story with her black husband, she avoided to shoot IR until they divorced Penny Pax shot a glory hole for dogfart then nothing for a year , she was literally begging for more on their thread , and in some other places , we helped requesting her, yet nothing for a year despite her will. Samantha Bentley was talking about it for the whole time she was in the USA , she meant it, she really did , yet she didn't any while in America, she did in Europe as soon as possible. her agent (former agent better to say) prevented her from being booked for IR , even though she really wanted to she couldn't. the IR watchdogs pestered her on social networks and forums so much she defined that time as horrible on this very board. Yet it wasn't her. Kristina Rose was a regular here until some of those went to IAFD and other databases and begun to take note about when the stars did their first IR after their debut and then begun to call her racist because she waited a year and did anal first thus implying that doing IR was nastier than anal and more extreme. She said she had IR in her profile since her second month but nobody booked her for that. They insisted she was a liar and a racist. I may continue but my point is clear. I'm perfectly certain there are racists in porn among the performers who don't perform IR solely on this reason, but there are those who aren't and don't do IR for different reasons , I may suspect some may be racist but I wouldn't tag anybody that way until I'm certain because some "dodgers" actually aren't.
^ Good thing you're not a mod then. Honestly, I wouldn't disagree too much with banning discussion of the topic outside of asking and getting a response inside of the threads of an individual performer, but banning the topic outright makes no sense. ^^ I think we're having two different arguments here. The first is about "dodgers" and whether girls that don't do IR are racists. I don't think there's very many reasonable people, especially on this board, that think that. Girls have tons of reasons for not doing it, not all under their control, and whether they do or don't do it isn't anywhere near enough evidence to make that decision one way or the other. The second seems to be about the idea of career pacing, and when you should do what scene, and how this should or does apply to IR. I'm of the opinion that career pacing solely for the sake of it doesn't make any sense in today's porn industry, and you should make yourself available for everything you're willing to do instead of waiting a while to do it because you think you'll get some big payday or because that's just what girls do.
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Rosco Fuji Deactivated User
On the licking stick, Mr. Magic Dick! 3309 Posts 2/09
Posted - Apr 14 2015 : 10:56PM
The can't wait too long though or their shelf life while expire, no matter who they are. If the girl does the same old same old for 50 scenes, is anyone really gong to care at that point? Case in point would be Dillion Harper. She was a "next big thing" a year or so ago, but she didn't change up her repetoire and now where is she?
I am sorry to hear that Leya has divorced. If I recall correctly she has a kid to support (and find care for when she is working), too. I wish her the best and hope she finds Mr. Right soon (I hear Matt Williams at Intersec is single although he does have two girlfriends and is about ten years older than Leya, I think Steve Orenstein at Wicked is also single). As for IR dodging, I feel for the black guys that have a harder time getting a scene because of this issue. Yes, there are few black guys performing regularly nowadays but if he isn't a Lex Steele, a Prince Yashua or (before the Syphilis scandal) a Mr. Marcus he won't get very many scenes in the industry right now. I have to think there are a few more large dicked reasonably attractive black guys that would be willing to enter the industry if they could actually get work in it. However, I also feel for the white girls too who almost have to forgo IR because their families would disown them if they fucked a black guy. Not all of the girls have enough of a support system outside of family, a family that can live with their girl doing IR or the attitude that they don't give a fuck what people think to pull off doing IR scenes. Not all people are as strong-willed as Leya (who has been very vocal about this issue) and don't care what people think about them fucking black guys. I don't think girls in general wait to do IR just for the extra cash, I think they either have highly racist families or are highly racist themselves (I know, we are all racist -- it is just a matter of degree of racism), more likely the former. That is not necessarily a bad thing in general but here it does affect the livelihood of performers. In the end both the girls and the black guys get screwed out of the deal.
^ I think the IR offers aren't always there the way some people think they are. I was kinda surprised to find out that Alexis Ford, Kagney Lynn Carter, Courtney Cumms, Jessie Palmer, mostly dated black guys in their private lives and yet all things considered really didn't do that much IR during their porn careers. You would figure much of their work would be IR. That tells you that companies that shoot IR wasn't giving them that many offers for whatever reason. Didn't Janet Mason leave pro-porn for awhile because she wasn't shooting as much IR as she wanted? Didn't Kristina Rose mention that she simply didn't get that many offers to do IR? I think some girls if they want to do IR have to go out of their way to get it. There have been girls on this site who've had to tell fans to mention their names to directors to try and get IR work. I think a lot of times what happens is a girl gets into porn and starts working with guys and directors they like and feel comfortable with and get as much work as they want and don't feel the need to venture into IR or working with IR studios or directors. Other than some fans who keep bringing it up it isn't something they think much about. Besides, with most girls who finally do it, other than to applease those few vocal IR fans it has no real impact on their career. Stoya wanted to do an IR scene for DP. Once the scene was finally shown did Stoya suddenly gain a legion of new fans? Was that movie a big money maker for DP? Nikki Benz finally did a whole movie dedicated to her doing IR for the first time on film. Did that suddenly shoot her to the top of the porn girl list? I'm a big fan of the movie and even think it's the best work I've seen from her. I'm glad for her if she got a big payday from it and glad she made the movie but she could've easily went her whole career without doing IR and been just fine. Nikki is the kind of pornstar who seems particular about the kinds of things she'll do. I don't think Nikki really does the lower grade porn (meaning small studio stuff).
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Interracial4Life Deactivated User
329 Posts 3/15
Posted - Apr 17 2015 : 11:07PM
From Nikki Benz on TwitterNot every girls isn't going to get an bigger fat pay day for her 1st IR scene, some directors or companies aren't willing to give any girl a big demand for her 1st IR. Lisa Ann discussed this from an interview she did two week after her retirement from porn. Edited by - Interracial4Life on 4/17/2015 11:08:29 PM
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Apr 17 2015 : 11:41PM
^How many pornstars have actually admitted to getting paid a higher rate for their first IR? Adriana Chechik mentioned in an interview that she was initially set to get paid a higher rate by HardX when she shot with Lex, but they changed their minds at the last minute. That's the closest example I can think of. If Nikki Benz got paid "a grip" for Jungle Fever, I doubt that she'd tell us.
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Interracial4Life Deactivated User
329 Posts 3/15
Posted - Apr 17 2015 : 11:56PM
A few things to correct 1. Capri Cavalli started in 2008, and did her 1st IR in the Tiger Woods parody with Tyler Knight. She was never a contract performer for Brazzers ,she stop doing B/G scenes because of her boyfriend at the time until late 2012 when she started back again. She didn't do IR again until her scene with Lexington Steele last year for his movie and did more before she retire. 2. Penny Pax started in 2012 and did IR from the started 3. Diana Prince wrote on her blog a few years ago just after her 1st IR scene said that her agent advised her not to do IR. 4. Kristina Rose started in 2007 and never did IR until 2010. Now I know both Leya Falcon and Samantha Bentley had there reason for but both are shooting IR now. Edited by - Interracial4Life on 4/18/2015 12:00:58 AM
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Mass Facialties Deactivated User
"Facialized Vol. 7" 2021 AVN Awards Winner: Best Oral Movie 9308 Posts 9/13
Posted - Apr 18 2015 : 4:20AM
So that's what happened, huh? I remember a couple posts here on ADT mentioning some "behind-the-scenes drama" with that shoot; none of 'em specified what it was about.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Apr 18 2015 : 11:13AM
^Yeah, she briefly discussed it here. As to why HardX didn't consider Adriana's scene with Lex to be her first IR:Edited by - misspornUSA on 4/18/2015 11:13:46 AM
I'd have to guess she certainly made more money than usual for her IR movie but probably not as much some people are thinking she did or perhaps as some girls have gotten in the past when there was simply more money being made in porn. But her situation is a bit unique since she did an entire movie dedicated to her instead of a big payday for one scene. Perhaps if you break it down per scene it wasn't the huge payday some have gotten before but she did 6 (or however many) scenes probably at an inflated price. Besides, pay wouldn't be the only consideration...it was a high profile project that would've/could've given her career a boost overall.
Some clarification are needed here 1) I didn't say Capri was on contract , my wording may have misled you, I meant she worked with them and the likes (Bangbros or Naughty America) and none of them booked her for IR even though she had no problem with it and actually already did from the very beginning 2) For Penny , yes I said exactly so, she did a Glory Hole for Dogfart but nothing more for a year, she was asking for more but nobody listened 3) I didn't read her blog , but the story I put is going for some time now , I first read it here in one of the numerous IR threads , it was brought by an IR watchdog when it was said she was a dodger for years, he said no , she wasn't racist it was her black BF preventing her from doing IR. Actually this is the very first time I hear it was her agent. 4) Kristina Rose did a Monster of Cock scene in 2008 , it was issued on DVD in 2009 and it was tagged IR and sold as IR. So it was correct she shot her first IR one year after her debut. We may argue that Ramon played different races during his career , back then he found convenient to be black , today he prefers to be considered a Latino. Bottom line is back then that scene was considered, tagged and shot as IR , furthermore , even if it wasn't still she had IR in her card but nobody was hiring her for that , Jenna Haze did in 2010 and she did it consistently since until she kept doing BG. Anyway my point was that that some stars weren't avoiding IR by their own choice.
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Interracial4Life Deactivated User
329 Posts 3/15
Posted - Apr 19 2015 : 2:26PM
^ Where did you get that information from because is all of is all wrong dude.
I ♥ the male gaze (and Palestine). 8737 Posts 11/13
Posted - Apr 19 2015 : 3:53PM
One of the reasons why many assume that Nikki received a large paycheck for Jungle Fever is Jules Jordan's longstanding reputation as someone who is willing to a pay pornstars big for their first IR. I wonder if he's ever talked about this?
^ I also think it is because she's considered a racist thus she must have been paid a shitload to do such a movie , plus it contains an anal a mild bondage , threesomes and a couple of really big guys (Lex and Flash). I already said this once , she has obviously been paid well , but considering it scene by scene she probably could have earned more doing them separately. Actually I think she intended to mark a new path in her career , a change, she changed her hair color and, apparently also doing IR regularly there's a Monster of Cock scene with Prince. Anyway I own Jungle Fever , it's good ,very good and she clearly has chemistry with Flash even more than that with Sean the one she chose for her anal scene ^^ are you really trying to tell me what I meant? And what really is the purpose of this ' I said that Capri did an IR scene then worked for companies who didn't book her for that for years and then that she did again after her return doing B/G Is that wrong? As for Penny as it happens I'm a fan from her very beginning and she didn't do any IR for almost a year after her first Glory Hole for Dogfart , she was complaining about this on her very thread , I was personally asking for her everywhere, she was offering for more in dogfart thread but nothing happened for almost a year until a scene with Sean MIchaels for Daddy Know Best , she shot and something else before that at Dogfart , I never said she didn't any after that. as for Diana as I said this is the first time I hear about her agent , I always heard the other story, when did she said that exactly? it's a question , I just don't know. For Kristina again i used the very link YOU provided that of IAFD and when you define "interracial" as a parameter there is an IR movie , a Monster of Cock issued in 2009 still tagged as IR , a flick shot in 2008 that YOU decided to ignore. In any case this doesn't change the fact that she had IR on her card but nobody booked her for that
Edited by - LCF on 4/19/2015 4:12:54 PM
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fredgee Deactivated User
350 Posts 12/13
Posted - Apr 19 2015 : 4:22PM
Wf/Bm might be a niche in America but the internet is global. Thinking nationally is small minded and a dead end because whites are only 8-9% of the world population. If porn doesn't appeal to a global audience it is dead. That means getting Black on Black back on the market. Jade Aspen, Jezabel Vessir, and other black women have to work on a regular basis or else. Edited by - fredgee on 4/19/2015 4:24:45 PM
^ 8 or 9% are white? you maybe mean Aryans , because the European Union alone has half billion inhabitants already and at least one third of Europe is still out of it Plus , Latino, Jews , Armenians , Turkish , Persians and Arabians are considered whites too
I posted comments about first time IR scenes strategy couple years ago. You should read it ... First time interracial
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fredgee Deactivated User
350 Posts 12/13
Posted - Apr 19 2015 : 5:04PM
^^ Whites are about 8-9 percent of the world population..if you count Latinos and Turks as white that supports my point these people are tired of being defined and categorized. The market is just not there for all white or wf/bm only. When you factor in white males in America who want to see Black women the market for all white and wf/bm gets even smaller.
If you know so much then were is the proof at, or were did they say it at. Or better yet why don't you go ask then yourself since most of these girls come on here, or maybe go ask then on Twitter because you can find a real answer. I looked up both Penny and Capri threads , and find nothing on what you said. You are not going to find it on a forum, you got to look at somewhere else.
Edited by - Interracial4Life on 4/19/2015 5:15:01 PM
Your theory has major flaws. First of all yes you are right that whites make up small percentage of world population but they also control majority of the wealth. Especially if you factor in billions of poor people in India and China. Now with that in mind ... how many people in the world can afford to spend money on porn DVDs or internet streaming? Who are the customers that U.S. porn producers make most of their money from? That is obviously white males in the U.S. and secondary market would be white euro males. You are also assuming foreign markets don't have their domestic producers of porn (e.g. JAVs produced for Japanese market) for U.S. companies to compete with. So we can safely assume that majority of porn produced by U.S. companies is marketed to white males. So if you see a ton of IR scenes being produced with wf/bm combos that is because that is more popular among white male consumers. For example, almost every IR cuckold scene features white cuckold watching wf/bm. Supply and demand at work. Companies would not continue to market that kind of product if it did not sell. Yes there will always be smaller niches to target like bf/wm IR scenes but those companies are trying to carve out a niche in a crowded market fighting for the same dollars. Kinda funny to think there are so many white males fantasizing about wf/bm sex but it makes sense. They see black guys more like props or animals. Sounds racist and it is but think about it .. what term do white cuckolds use to describe black guys fucking their white women? Bulls. They refer to them as "black bulls".
Posted - Feb 17 2015 : 10:12PM
